The vast range of Greys between Black and White

[Mike Waters]

I do that sometimes!

Mostly what I mean is in a metaphorical sense. My attention is so fixed on God nothing else matters. Whatever comes up is in the context of my Heavenly Father here with me, loving me, caring for me, wanting me to be with Him.

And not infrequently, I call to mind that Jesus' presence with me here is more real than this desk I'm sitting at typing to you. As I sit here now Jesus is with me, watching, speaking, guiding.

How many of us have trained our minds to recognize His constant presence in the same way we recognize everything else in our lives?

Do we think of Him as "watching from above"? Do we think of Him "inside my heart", bot not at my side?

Psalm 41
11 By this I know that thou favourest me, because mine enemy doth not triumph over me.
12 And as for me, thou upholdest me in mine integrity, and settest me before thy face for ever.
13 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel from everlasting, and to everlasting. Amen, and Amen.

This is what I desire, and this is what I believe God wants also, that we spend forever gazing into His face.

When the single most important fact in my life is that Jesus is here, and all that means.


Much love!

It's what I refer to as "constantly abiding" ..... just about the highest, and hardest, aim of my life.

 

[mjrhealth]

It's what I refer to as "constantly abiding" ..... just about the highest, and hardest, aim of my life.

As long as He is a part of your day, one cannot go wrong. But when you realize He is always with you, you cant find something that is not Lost and Christ isnt lost. Yo u speak He listens, that is the simpleness of Christ.

 

[marks]

It's what I refer to as "constantly abiding" ..... just about the highest, and hardest, aim of my life.

Of any life, I think.

But I find that it's pretty much the automatic response of my spirit to God as I focus on our justification by faith. That's the heart of the matter.

God in Christ has made us right with Him. Having peace with God, there is nothing nothing nothing that can ever prevent my having unbroken intimacy with God. All that remains is that I hold this thought in mind, getting used the idea of God's constant love and presence and work.

As I get used to the idea that I can enjoy Him always not because of anything I've done, it's what He did, life is a wonderful place!

So much love!

 

[Enoch111]

What does "being hot" or "being cold" mean to you?

Christ says that He would rather see men either genuinely saved and fully surrendered to God or not saved and not pretending to be Christians (so that they might hear the Gospel and be converted).

The *lukewarm* are the ones who are self-deceived. They believe they are Christians (either through the accident of birth, or because they were baptized as infants, or members of a certain denomination, or whatever). But they really are not.

And here is the evidence:
wretched = without the hope of eternal life
miserable = without joy, which is a fruit of the Spirit
poor = without Christ, who is our salvation
blind = without the Holy Spirit, who removes spiritual blindness
naked = without the robe of Christ's righteousness

As far as God is concerned there are only two groups on earth -- the saved and the lost (John 3:36)

 

[Mike Waters]

Christ says that He would rather see men either genuinely saved and fully surrendered to God or not saved and not pretending to be Christians (so that they might hear the Gospel and be converted).

The *lukewarm* are the ones who are self-deceived. They believe they are Christians (either through the accident of birth, or because they were baptized as infants, or members of a certain denomination, or whatever). But they really are not.

And here is the evidence:
wretched = without the hope of eternal life
miserable = without joy, which is a fruit of the Spirit
poor = without Christ, who is our salvation
blind = without the Holy Spirit, who removes spiritual blindness
naked = without the robe of Christ's righteousness

As far as God is concerned there are only two groups on earth -- the saved and the lost (John 3:36)

With provisos we may well be in agreement.
As an Annihilationist I believe that 'lost' simply means to 'perish' and be no more, as per John 3:16, and to do so in the 'second death' (as distinct from being tormented day and night in a 'second life') as per Revelation 21:8 (where "having their part" means as distinct from the part intended solely for the Devil, the Beast, and the False Prophet).
Further to that I believe that few, if any, Christians will pass the Judgement with no works of "wood, hay, or stubble", and therefore will be saved to eternal life "yet so as through fire"

What think you?

 

[Willie T]

Christ says that He would rather see men either genuinely saved and fully surrendered to God or not saved and not pretending to be Christians (so that they might hear the Gospel and be converted).

The *lukewarm* are the ones who are self-deceived. They believe they are Christians (either through the accident of birth, or because they were baptized as infants, or members of a certain denomination, or whatever). But they really are not.

And here is the evidence:
wretched = without the hope of eternal life
miserable = without joy, which is a fruit of the Spirit
poor = without Christ, who is our salvation
blind = without the Holy Spirit, who removes spiritual blindness
naked = without the robe of Christ's righteousness

As far as God is concerned there are only two groups on earth -- the saved and the lost (John 3:36)

This idea seems to meet with resistance when the Bible states that God wants ALL men to be saved. Your view seems to say He would just as soon they not be saved, as saved.

 

[Willie T]

With provisos we may well be in agreement.
As an Annihilationist I believe that 'lost' simply means to 'perish' and be no more, as per John 3:16, and to do so in the 'second death' (as distinct from being tormented day and night in a 'second life') as per Revelation 21:8 (where "having their part" means as distinct from the part intended solely for the Devil, the Beast, and the False Prophet).
Further to that I believe that few, if any, Christians will pass the Judgement with no works of "wood, hay, or stubble", and therefore will be saved to eternal life "yet so as through fire"

What think you?

If Annihilation is correct, why should anyone give a hoot if they live or die? Supposedly, they will never know anything happened anyway. Just "BLINK", and.... Oblivion. No memory, no future, no feeling, no awareness of anything.

 

[Mike Waters]

If Annihilation is correct, why should anyone give a hoot if they live or die? Supposedly, they will never know anything happened anyway. Just "BLINK", and.... Oblivion. No memory, no future, no feeling, no awareness of anything.

Much the same is said about Universal Reconciliationists, but surely it all hinges on whether one loves Christ for what one gets out of it, or out of sheer devotion for what He did for us.
In any case surely those blessed with Eternal Life as a 'Gift' of faith will be so overwhelmed by the light of Christ's presence that they too will be blinded, albeit to all except thankful praise.

 

[charity]

I am thinking of the range between the extremes of ‘disbelief’ and ‘faith’.

On the side of disbelief you have the range between those who are proactive atheists, through to those who, whilst not being ‘anti’, simply have never given a single thought to involving in any form of religion.

On the side of faith you have those who choose to ‘go to church’ on the occasional Sundays, and that’s it, through to those who devote every minute of their lives trying to deepen and expand their faith.

So what might be the ultimate ‘after life’ destiny of each person within that vast range?

1) Will that 'destiny' likewise range from being eternally tormented day and night in hell fire, through to spending an eternal life of utmost ‘paradise’ (to coin the word) in the presence of God?

If so, then where might the crossover point lay in the range from proactive atheistic disbelief, through to total devotion of Faith?
Or
2) Will the whole thing be resolved in an ‘Ultimate Reconciliation’?
Or
3) Will there be another ‘range’ between ‘1’ and ‘2’?

Hello there, @Mike Waters,

In the day when God will judge the secrets of men's hearts (Romans 2:16) he will be able to judge justly. However the believer in the Lord Jesus Christ will not come into condemnation (Romans 8:1).

The Bible does not speak of eternal conscious punishment, the choice is life or death. The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord (Romans 6:23). Also the soul that sinneth it shall surely die (Ezekiel 18:20): and as all have sinned and come short of the glory of God (Romans 3:23), then all die. The difference between the believer in the Lord Jesus Christ and the unbeliever is that the believer has the hope of resurrection life (John 11:25) . The unbeliever has not life (1 John 5:10-12), only an expectation of judgement and death (Hebrews 9:27-28) .

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Enoch111]

Your view seems to say He would just as soon they not be saved, as saved.

No. The teaching here is that merely assuming that one is a Christian (without the New Birth) when there is no reality is very dangerous. Paul says the same thing: Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates? (2 Cor 13:5).