It seems to me that the scriptures teach that the sacrifice of Christ on the Cross is a sacrifice for sins (Hebrews 10:12).
There Remains No Sacrifice For Sins
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Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
And if you bothered with grammar and taking the whole counsel of Scripture you would know that the gfrace that saves is a once for all time endowmant and grace for righteous living requires daily dying to self.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
But yet you believe Jesus will no longer be your righteousness if you have a season of loss of fatih. This is not true.
Jesus will NEVER leave us or forsake us. that is not a license for loose living, but a license to live as we were designed. It also is confidence knowing that if I sin 70 X 7 in a day and acknowledge it 70 X 7 I am forgiven 70 X 7 in a day. Being saved is not about sin, but becoming a child of God and once a child of God we are a child forever! We do not bounce from being born again to being un-born again to being born again to being un-born again ad infinitum ad- nauseum.
It is true.
For we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand (Romans 5:1-2).
And therefore, if we lose or throw away faith, we no longer have access to grace.
And also, the righteousness of Christ within us is by faith from beginning to end and all the way through (Romans 1:17, Galatians 3:1-3, Colossians 2:6).
Hebrews 12:1-2 KJV
1) Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,
2) Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
Or, looking to yourself, the author and finisher of your faith?
How exactly do you go about losing or throwing away your faith, if in Fact it is Jesus Who both originates and completes/perfects your faith?
Much love!
There are those who "believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away" (Luke 8:13).
If it's the way you say, then Jesus didn't do a very good job, did He? Or maybe that's not the faith that Jesus originates and perfects?
How to you throw away something that Jesus starts, and Jesus finishes?
Much love!
Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
Jesus Christ came to do this:
Hebrews 9:26
...to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
He finished that work on the cross.
He puts away the sins of the believer.
But if that same believer begins sinning again, then THE SINNER is the one responsible for the lost of his salvation, not Jesus.
Hebrews 10:26
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins
Jesus did not sacrifice himself on the cross to allow men to continue in sin.
Thank you! That brings us back to topic.
Again, that dichotomy presents itself.
After all, we want to take seriously, to believe completely, what we read in the Bible, is that not so?
If we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remains no more sacrifice for sins.
If this means that if person commits a sin that they know about, that they could have stopped, but instead went ahead and did it, after they've been reborn, in Christ, then Jesus' sacrifice is no longer for them, who is saved?
One sin after being born again, and you are forever cut off from God. One sin, which you knew about as you were doing it, and you will NEVER receive forgiveness.
That is, IF "received the knowledge of the truth" is the same thing as "born of God".
God gives birth to the one who believes. Then that believer commits a sin. God then casts them out of Christ, out of new life, they return to being the fleshy child of Adam, with no future hope of salvation or grace.
If this is what you say, that it's talking about the born again person being cut out of Christ's sacrifice, and we are just believe what it says, that's what it says.
However, if receiving the knowledge of the truth is actually receiving knowledge, that knowledge being of the truth, then, there's nothing there about faith or rebirth. It's about learning, but not about being born of God.
Addressed to those Hebrews who did not yet have faith, and were concerned over whether they should just abandon the temple sacrifices which had been their life-blood, and trust in Jesus' offering of His body - we've grown up with the idea of Jesus dying for us, whether we believed it or not, it was always part of the package of "Christianity". They hadn't. They had grown up with animal sacrifices.
I don't believe that Jesus offered a sacrifice of His Own body that was less effective than animals.
If you wanted redemption under the Levitical system, you could offer your offering, and if you sinned afterward, you could come back and offer another offering. That was under the Law.
Grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
Much love!
It seems to me that your argument is not with me but with the scripture in question (Luke 8:13).
Specifically, the passage in question (Hebrews 10:26-31) is speaking of willful sins; not just any sin.
Can someone be born of God apart from receiving the knowledge of the truth?
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Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
It is the same, for the scripture is clear that the willful sinner was sanctified by the blood of Christ:
Hebrews 10:29
[29] Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Balony!
The writer included himself in the warning of having no more sacrifice for willful sins committed by the offender who was washed with the blood of the Lamb.
Listen to the scriptures! For God’s sake!!!
There it is!
For He has promised, I will never leave you, nor forsake you.
Plainly stated, unambiguous, God's promise to us. And He does not change! He will NEVER leave us, NEVER forsake us. NEVER!
Much love!
This has to do with the fact that those who are truly God's children have been sealed by the Holy Spirit (Ephesians 1:13-14, Ephesians 4:30, 2 Corinthians 1:22, 2 Corinthians 5:5) and therefore they will not leave Him or depart from Him. He places His fear within His true children so that they will not depart (Jeremiah 32:38-40 (kjv), Psalms 19:9 (kv)).
It should be clear that He will depart from those who depart from Him; for He has said so in His word (2 Chronicles 15:2).
Those who are truly God's children have a heart faith that is unto righteousness (Romans 10:10) and enduring to the end (Matthew 10:22, Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 3:14).
Their faith is not mere mental assent to the tenets of the gospel, a lukewarm, shallow, or nominal faith; for such a faith will not always last; the person can fall away (Luke 8:13) or be "cut off" (Romans 11:20-22).
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
I pity you.
Twisating the scriptures to promote false doctrine is a dangerous thing. But then again because you have declared you don't need to go tro teh original languages, you can remain ignorant.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Once people learn this truth, it sets them free from worrying abvout sinh and concentrate on looking to HIM who removed our sins from us!
And rejoicing just seems to come bubbling up!
It's what we were made for. God created us so that we would have the joy of knowing Him. And self-condemnation destroys that.
Let's not hold guilty the one whom God has made innocent!
Much love!
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
What is really sad is that the folks who are so worried about sin seem to think we pooh pooh sin! When that is just a plain lie! I hate sin, but no that because I live in a body of sin and death I fail from time to time. But I know according to His Word I can boldly approach my Father knowing I am secure in His love, just like my kids could freely approach me if they screwed up knowing they were secure in my love! How much more can we be secure in the Fathers love knowing that Jesus blood removed ALL (not most) of our sins from Gods sight.
I don't know about others, but I can safely say I'm pretty messed up! Life is no picnic, and the internal battles I fight are fierce sometimes! And then I remember, all is forgiven, God is with me, this doesn't separate me from Him, and then, the War is Over.
Much love!
Calling faithful and true doctrine false is also a dangerous thing.
What was it in my post that you deem to be false doctrine?
Give a biblical reason as to why you believe that it is false.
Because you have made an accusation; so the burden of proof is on you.
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