Todd Akin

[soupy]

Of course mentaly ill, substance addicted, and people who are down and out need my help. I give it to them cheerfully.

I'm surprised you give to the addicted, how do you feel you are helping them, do you give food or money? I now we all, have different views on giving to other people, I'm curious how you make your decisions.
What do you give the mentally ill? Food or money.

 

[Strat]

The bible does not say anything about addiction

 

[aspen]

Aspen2, I think the bigger question for you to ask yourself is, are you really helping these people?
I don't know the details of what you do (nor do I want to), but I do know many try to help, want to help, but their giving is not helping the taker, just enabling them, helping them stay where they are.
Some I see do something good, to make themselves feel good, sometimes doing the best thing is much harder work. Sometimes it is easier to do the easy thing? You needn't answer me, only yourself.

IT sounds like you are associating homeless people with wild animals that try to beg food from people in our National Parks. Yes, it is damaging to people and wild animals to feed animals that are supposed to be living off the land.

Homeless people are not wild animals - they are not naturally adapted to living off their environment. They need to learn skills, receive medical and often, psychiatric medication in order to survive. They also need Christ, hope, and community - just like all people do.

I guess it depends on what you mean by 'helping' them - if you believe that they only assistance that they receive should be based on performance and outcome - that they must eventually become acceptable, self sufficient citizens - good luck. I believe they are just as valuable as we are, no matter how much they succeed as Americans. Spiritual health and community are the most important needs - not money.

 

[Brother James]

I'm surprised you give to the addicted, how do you feel you are helping them, do you give food or money? I now we all, have different views on giving to other people, I'm curious how you make your decisions.
What do you give the mentally ill? Food or money.

One of the organizations in my community is the CITA Mission (CITA = Christ is the Answer). They provide services to homeless people who suffer from addiction. I give to them. But I will also help an addicted person. I do not cross the street to avoid coming into contact with addicts. Almighty God graciously delivered me from horrible addiction at one point in my life. Can I laugh in his face by turning my back on someone still in that state?

I've also done other things for people who suffer from addiction that I don't need to go into details about. There are different ways of meeting a person's need without enabling them to buy drugs or alcohol. However, I was once going into a gas station convenience store near the expressway overpass where homeless people would sleep. A man approached me and he was shaking. He was suffering from the DT's. He said, "Mister, I'm not going to bulls*** you. I need a beer." I looked at him and saw the condition he was in. I believed in that moment that he needed a beer. People who detox from that level of alchoholism without medical supervision often die. It was the middle of the night and there was nothing I could do for him but pray for him, and I did give him a little money so he could go buy a couple of beers.

I'm sure my actions will not withstand the judgements of men. That's okay.

I also support government programs to help rehabilitate people suffering from addicitons. It makes far more sense than the "war on drugs" that calls for locking up millions of addicts. What I don't support are the agressive government efforts to sign more and more and more people up for foodstamps, the vast majority of whom would eat just fine without them.

 

[Strat]

IT sounds like you are associating homeless people with wild animals that try to beg food from people in our National Parks. Yes, it is damaging to people and wild animals to feed animals that are supposed to be living off the land.

Homeless people are not wild animals - they are not naturally adapted to living off their environment. They need to learn skills, receive medical and often, psychiatric medication in order to survive. They also need Christ, hope, and community - just like all people do.

I guess it depends on what you mean by 'helping' them - if you believe that they only assistance that they receive should be based on performance and outcome - that they must eventually become acceptable, self sufficient citizens - good luck. I believe they are just as valuable as we are, no matter how much they succeed as Americans. Spiritual health and community are the most important needs - not money.

Well Aspen you had better be glad money matters to somebody because you and your crowd would certainly be in bad shape without them....and their money....one would think you would have a better attitude towards them.

 

[soupy]

IT sounds like you are associating homeless people with wild animals that try to beg food from people in our National Parks. Yes, it is damaging to people and wild animals to feed animals that are supposed to be living off the land.

Homeless people are not wild animals - they are not naturally adapted to living off their environment. They need to learn skills, receive medical and often, psychiatric medication in order to survive. They also need Christ, hope, and community - just like all people do.

I guess it depends on what you mean by 'helping' them - if you believe that they only assistance that they receive should be based on performance and outcome - that they must eventually become acceptable, self sufficient citizens - good luck. I believe they are just as valuable as we are, no matter how much they succeed as Americans. Spiritual health and community are the most important needs - not money.

Strawman, turning my sincere question into a discussion of wild animals...
I asked about helping people, I did not mention anything abut their value or other criteria.
Why the defensiveness? Why attack me?
Doesn't appear we can have a sincere honest discussion about this important issue.
Think about your attitude.

 

[aspen]

Strawman, turning my sincere question into a discussion of wild animals...
I asked about helping people, I did not mention anything abut their value or other criteria.
Why the defensiveness? Why attack me?
Doesn't appear we can have a sincere honest discussion about this important issue.
Think about your attitude.

I am not intending to attack you. I am trying to illustrate my point. I am not reducing people to the level of wild animals, either - I was just comparing the way we help people compared to how people believe they are helping wild animals by giving them hand outs.

Well Aspen you had better be glad money matters to somebody because you and your crowd would certainly be in bad shape without them....and their money....one would think you would have a better attitude towards them.

Money is not the problem. Using money to determine a person's character or worth to society is the problem

 

[Strat]

I am not intending to attack you. I am trying to illustrate my point. I am not reducing people to the level of wild animals, either - I was just comparing the way we help people compared to how people believe they are helping wild animals by giving them hand outs.



Money is not the problem. Using money to determine a person's character or worth to society is the problem

No,money is not the problem,you and your crowd not having as much of it as you want without earning it is the problem....you display only contempt and resentment towards those who earn what you want

 

[Brother James]

I was just comparing the way we help people compared to how people believe they are helping wild animals by giving them hand outs.

There certainly is a dynamic that keeps people enslaved when they become dependent on public assistance. Not talking about those who are disabled, are addicted, have psychiatric problems, etc. But there are people who ought to be working who can live fine without doing so. Work is spiritual, and the first solution to poverty is to work. I have a business and I have low-skill entry-level jobs that pay $9 to start. People laugh at me and ask me why they should work for $9 when they can do nothing and net the equivilent of about $7 an hour from unemployment. They'll call back when their unemployment runs out, but until then why should they work for only $2 an hour? That's not healthy. There are so many programs that are pushed on so many people that it really does enslave people. They have aid for dependent children, medicaid, food stamps, housing assistance, earned income tax credit, additional child tax credit, and countless other public aid programs. A woman with a couple of kids can get $30,000+ in public aid. I know plenty of people similarly situated who work for less than that and manage to live in relative comfort compared to most of the world. Working is far healthier. And don't tell me there are no jobs because I have unfilled job opening right now that nobody wants.

 

[Foreigner]

Money is not the problem. Using money to determine a person's character or worth to society is the problem

Exactly. Just look at how Democrats insult and degrade the wealthy, and claim that they aren't paying their fair share.

 

[Strat]

Exactly. Just look at how Democrats insult and degrade the wealthy, and claim that they aren't paying their fair share.

The ones they depend on for everything,including their pseudo compassion with other people's money.

 

[Brother James]

Interestingly, Todd Akin lives...

http://washingtonexaminer.com/missouris-akin-left-for-dead-on-comeback-trail/article/2509741#.UGyREUbCz8B

At least he won't be beholden to the likes of Karl Rove, etc. if he gets into the senate. I can only imagine a tea partier who has been scorned by the establishment actually getting to the senate...

 

[Brother James]

How odd, Todd Akin now leads Claire McCaskill in the polls. Funny how Karl Rove and the Republican establishment abandoned him while conservatives like Mike Huckabee and Newt Gingrich flocked to his aid. The establishment Republicans would rather let the Democrats keep the senate than to support Akin. Think about that. What does that say about the Republican party? This is a clear-cut reason why I am not a Republican.

 

[aspen]

How odd, Todd Akin now leads Claire McCaskill in the polls. Funny how Karl Rove and the Republican establishment abandoned him while conservatives like Mike Huckabee and Newt Gingrich flocked to his aid. The establishment Republicans would rather let the Democrats keep the senate than to support Akin. Think about that. What does that say about the Republican party? This is a clear-cut reason why I am not a Republican.

Rove would rather concede than lose. Narcissists only back winners.

 

[Foreigner]

Rove would rather concede than lose. Narcissists only back winners.

"I am through with politics." - Aspen