Truth is not relative

[justbyfaith]

"God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written," Rom 3:4

That includes me too to the extent that I am in error and teach what I believe as truth. Who is the Truth?

"Jesus saith unto him, I am … the truth..." John 14:6

Who sees Jesus better than through a glass darkly?

"For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part...I Cor 13:12

Jesus also said, "Thy word is truth." (John 17:17).

I think that there are those who think that we can never come to the knowledge of the truth; because the truth is somehow elusive and therefore if anyone says that they have it, they must be in some form of pride.

However, those who are ever learning and never come to the knowledge of the truth are not put in a good light by holy scripture (see 2 Timothy 3:6-9, esp. v.7).

Therefore it is not necessarily a false statement for someone to say that they do have and know the truth; it is not arrogant or prideful to say so. Especially if one has spent much time studying holy scripture in order to come to the knowledge of it.

2Ti 2:15, Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Those who rightly divide the word of truth can be said to have the knowledge of the truth.

Truth = fact.

 

[amadeus]

@justbyfaith

justbyfaith said: ↑
Jesus also said, "Thy word is truth." (John 17:17).

I think that there are those who think that we can never come to the knowledge of the truth; because the truth is somehow elusive and therefore if anyone says that they have it, they must be in some form of pride.

However, those who are ever learning and never come to the knowledge of the truth are not put in a good light by holy scripture (see 2 Timothy 3:6-9, esp. v.7).

Therefore it is not necessarily a false statement for someone to say that they do have and know the truth; it is not arrogant or prideful to say so. Especially if one has spent much time studying holy scripture in order to come to the knowledge of it.

2Ti 2:15, Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Those who rightly divide the word of truth can be said to have the knowledge of the truth.

Those really rightly divide the word of truth do not do so by a better exegesis. They do it by not quenching the Holy Spirit within themselves and by being led always by the Holy Spirit.

Paul's written verse which you quoted does not say that a person will receive the truth by study. He said to study to get God's approval, which means to obey and study. A man may receive truth in his Bible studies, but only if he is led to truth by the Holy Ghost. That is rightly dividing!

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

Those who simply study the scripture and use their own brain according to what men have described as exegesis without the Holy Spirit will weary themselves go the way that Solomon describes here:

"And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh." Ecc 12:12

Truth = fact.

What does that mean? That is man's definition perhaps according to Webster, but what does it have to do with the discussion? God is bound by His Word. His Word is Jesus. The Word was made flesh. We are to have written in our hearts the Word of God and that only happens by the Holy Spirit.

"To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:" Col 1:27

 

[justbyfaith]

Jhn 12:48, He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

 

[justbyfaith]

@amadeus,

You seem to pride yourself on your relationship to the Holy Spirit.

But I would say that if you reject anything that is the plain teaching of God's word, that you have rejected the teaching of the Holy Spirit. How then is your relationship with Him as strong as you think it is?

2Co 3:12, Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:

If men weren't so inclined towards deceiving themselves, they wouldn't even need the Holy Spirit to be able to interpret God's word correctly.

But in receiving the Spirit of truth, men become inclined to believe the truth when they see it; and therefore their interpretations end up being right on the money.

All one needs to do to have the Spirit of truth is to be inclined towards believing and receiving truth.

Of course the Spirit comes in as the result of faith in Jesus.

But those who have the Spirit of truth simply accept the scripture at face value; and if people did this, they would not need a "Spirit" to guide them.

Fact is, the Spirit of truth motivates us to accept the scriptures at face value; and without Him we are simply inclined to deceive ourselves concerning what we read in the scripture of truth. Therefore we need the Spirit of truth in order to be inclined towards receiving the truths of holy scripture at face value.

 

[Enoch111]

Since Jesus is the Truth (as well as the Way and the Life), God is Truth personified. And because He has given mankind a divinely written Word of God, God's truth can be relative only to God's character. So the Holy Bible is God's Truth. And to ensure that we have the true Word of God, Christians must insist that in English the only faithful and reliable translation is the King James Bible today (which has also been updated as the King James 2000 Bible).

Can Christians know the truth? Absolutely. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth, and we are promised that He will guide us into all truth. He also gives the children of God an unction (or anointing) so that the truth may be seen, believed, and held.

On the other hand Satan is the Father of Lies, so his primary weapon against humanity is deception. Although he deceives the world, he can also deceive Christians who cling to man-made teachings rather than revealed truth.

One of the biggest attacks of Satan is against the deity of Christ and the true Gospel. They are attacked from every side, and under the garb of *Christian* beliefs. Therefore all Christians must be constantly on guard against false doctrines and false practices. The second biggest attack is on the Bible itself, and we know that all modern Bible versions are corrupt. But the inspiration, inerrancy, and infallibility of the Bible are also under attack, particular in seminaries.

Christians should also be aware of the philosophy of Relativism, and how it has corroded Western society.

What is relativism?

by Matt Slick

Relativism is the philosophical position that all points of view are equally valid and that all truth is relative to the individual. This means that all moral positions, all religious systems, all art forms, all political movements, etc., are truths that are relative to the individual. Under the umbrella of relativism, whole groups of perspectives are categorized. In obvious terms, some are:

• cognitive relativism (truth) - Cognitive relativism affirms that all truth is relative. This would mean that no system of truth is more valid than another one, and that there is no objective standard of truth. It would, naturally, deny that there is a God of absolute truth.
• moral/ethical relativism - All morals are relative to the social group within which they are constructed.
• situational relativism - Ethics (right and wrong) are dependent upon the situation.

Unfortunately, the philosophy of relativism is pervasive in our culture today. With the rejection of God, and Christianity in particular, absolute truth is being abandoned. Our pluralistic society wants to avoid the idea that there really is a right and wrong....

What is relativism? | CARM.org

 

[justbyfaith]

Hi @Enoch111,

loved your post, but wanted to get your opinion on one thing in particular.

In the situation of Corrie Ten Boom, who harbored Jewish people during WWII by lying to the Nazis,

was her moral choice relative in that love turned out to be a higher principle than truth?

I consider that Romans 3:1-9 tells us that the ends do not justify the means; but I wanted to get your take on this.

 

[Willie T]

It sounds like you all are making the same old Legalistic, Fundamentalistic argument that there is only one way to interpret every verse in the Bible.... "YOUR" way.

 

[justbyfaith]

It sounds like you all are making the same old Legalistic, Fundamentalistic argument that there is only one way to interpret every verse in the Bible.... "YOUR" way.

1Jo 2:20, But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.
1Jo 2:21, I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.

1Jo 2:26, These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you.
1Jo 2:27, But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

2Co 3:12, Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:

2Pe 1:20, Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

Mat 7:13, Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Mat 7:14, Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

 

[Willie T]

1Jo 2:20, But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.
1Jo 2:21, I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.

1Jo 2:26, These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you.
1Jo 2:27, But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

2Co 3:12, Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:

2Pe 1:20, Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

LOL You don't even know what that last verse means, do you?

 

[justbyfaith]

LOL You don't even know what that last verse means, do you?

It means that the interpretation of scripture is to be public and well-known; so that if someone rejects the public interpretation of scripture in favour of their own private interpretation, they are very likely in error.

 

[Willie T]

It means that the interpretation of scripture is to be public and well-known; so that if someone rejects the public interpretation of scripture in favour of their own private interpretation, they are very likely in error.

Why did you change the word, "scripture", for the originally written word, "prophesy"?

 

[Marymog]

It means that the interpretation of scripture is to be public and well-known; so that if someone rejects the public interpretation of scripture in favour of their own private interpretation, they are very likely in error.

Hi,

I agree with the title of this thread: Truth is not relative

Sadly tooooo many Christians make Scripture THEIR own truth, or as you said "own private interpretation", even though it is at odds with "the public interpretation of Scripture"!

Tough part is: Who decides what is the correct "public interpretation of Scripture"? Does the majority rule?

Peace...Mary

 

[justbyfaith]

Hi,

I agree with the title of this thread: Truth is not relative

Sadly tooooo many Christians make Scripture THEIR own truth, or as you said "own private interpretation", even though it is at odds with "the public interpretation of Scripture"!

Tough part is: Who decides what is the correct "public interpretation of Scripture"? Does the majority rule?

Peace...Mary

That would be the reality of scripture that prevails after all debate has been accomplished.

 

[justbyfaith]

Why did you change the word, "scripture", for the originally written word, "prophesy"?

2Pe 1:20, Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

I gather that you were hoping that I didn't know this verse well enough to be able to reply as I have replied.

 

[Willie T]

Again, I reiterate.… the passage says nothing about "public interpretation of scripture." It is saying the prophet did not invent the "prophesy" he foretold, himself, rather, he was told what to repeat to the people.

 

[justbyfaith]

Again, I reiterate.… the passage says nothing about "public interpretation of scripture." It is saying the prophet did not invent the "prophesy" he foretold, himself, rather, he was told what to repeat to the people.

I simply disagree with you.

Read the verse again until you understand it.

 

[Willie T]

Disagree all you want, but that doesn't change what is written.

 

[justbyfaith]

It basically is teaching that the prophecy of scripture is not interpreted privately, but publicly.

Not that the prophet himself was not to interpret his own prophecies; but that those who read the prophecy of scripture are to accept the public interpretation after all the intricacies of what it could mean in light of other scripture has been hashed out; and that we ought not to hold to an interpretation that has not been publicly hashed out in this manner. Because privately interpreted scripture can have its flaws. Two heads are better than one in determining the true meaning of what is written.

 

[Willie T]

It basically is teaching that the prophecy of scripture is not interpreted privately, but publicly.

Not that the prophet himself was not to interpret his own prophecies; but that those who read the prophecy of scripture are to accept the public interpretation after all the intricacies of what it could mean in light of other scripture has been hashed out; and that we ought not to hold to an interpretation that has not been publicly hashed out in this manner. Because privately interpreted scripture can have its flaws. Two heads are better than one in determining the true meaning of what is written.

Do you know what a "Targum" is? Look it up.
Targum | biblical literature

 

[justbyfaith]

Definition of Targum

: an Aramaic translation or paraphrase of a portion of the Old Testament

Is there a point?