Unforgiveness and fellowship with God

[Windmillcharge]

They actually did and even prayed to the Father to not hold their sins against them

No they did what I have been saying to do.
They handed the situation, the off3nders over to God.

Jesus's words in
Luke 23:34
Jesus said, “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.

If that is saying ' I forgive them' then what I have been consistently saying is forgiving, because that is in ess3nce what I have been saying we should do.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

No, Jesus prayed to the Father and ask Him to forgive them.
You must have missed the part where Jesus said "Jesus said, “Father, forgive them"

I see you have no answer for the very plain, easy to understand instructions Jesus gives us in Mark 11:25,26

This is so easy to get, one has to have help from the devil to mis-understand

 

[Phil .]

Since unforgiveness, like any other sin, breaks our fellowship with God, Christians should desire to restore that fellowship. To have fellowship with God, peace in our hearts and minds is worth more than anything else.

Also, thinking about the Fruits of the Spirit, a spirit of unforgiveness hinders regarding those.

22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
24And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
Galatians 5:22-25

Are we willing to crucify our flesh regarding a spirit of unforgiveness? Or do we harbor a spirit of pride, unwilling to yield?

God is infinite, isn’t it so?

 

[Windmillcharge]

No, Jesus prayed to the Father and ask Him to forgive them.
You must have missed the part where Jesus said "Jesus said, “Father, forgive them" View attachment 41542

I see you have no answer for the very plain, easy to understand instructions Jesus gives us in Mark 11:25,26

This is so easy to get, one has to have help from the devil to mis-understand View attachment 41541

Please re read my post before this one, number 321 and then tell me I've missed what Jesus said.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Please re read my post before this one, number 321 and then tell me I've missed what Jesus said.

Your claim is Jesus did not forgive them which is not true.

He did forgive them which is proven by Him asking the Father to not hold their sins against them.

IF He had not forgiven them, He would instead be asking the Father to hold their sins against them.

 

[Windmillcharge]

Your claim is Jesus did not forgive them which is not true.

He did forgive them which is proven by Him asking the Father to not hold their sins against them.

IF He had not forgiven them, He would instead be asking the Father to hold their sins against them.

His words were Father forgive them, which is as I have been saying we should imitate Jesus is what I have been saying a Christian should do.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

His words were Father forgive them, which is as I have been saying we should imitate Jesus is what I have been saying a Christian should do.

But you previously claimed Jesus... refused to forgive them, which is not true.

IF He had not forgiven them, He would instead be asking the Father to hold their sins against them.

 

[Windmillcharge]

But you previously claimed Jesus... refused to forgive them, which is not true.

IF He had not forgiven them, He would instead be asking the Father to hold their sins against them.

Jesus has not forgiven them. He is handing that over to God the Father, in doing so he is showing that he is willing to forgive, but until they repent both he and God the Father cannot forgive.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Jesus has not forgiven them

That's not true.

IF He had not forgiven them, He would instead be asking the Father to hold their sins against them.

But, feel free to continue believing Jesus lied about it...

 

[Windmillcharge]

That's not true.

IF He had not forgiven them, He would instead be asking the Father to hold their sins against them.

But, feel free to continue believing Jesus lied about it... View attachment 41670

Jesus address Almighty God, calling him, ' Father.' He asks him to do something. Jesus praise Forgive them.
He is not saying I forgive them, but passing that task over to God the Father.
Jesus cannot forgive them because they have not repented.

You may believe what you .ike,but your view is not shared by any of the commentaries I can consult online.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

You may believe what you .ike,but your view is not shared by any of the commentaries I can consult online.

That's the problem... you are consulting commentaries rather than God's Word!

IF He had not forgiven them, He would instead be asking the Father to hold their sins against them.

Asking the Father to forgive them is NOT something the Lord would have done if He had not wanted them to be forgiven.

ANYTIME you see someone teaching it's OK to not forgive... they are teaching doctrines of demons.

 

[Windmillcharge]

ANYTIME you see someone teaching it's OK to not forgive... they are teaching doctrines of demons.

Interesting view that.
The implications are that God and Jesus teach the doctrines of demons.
John 3:18 anyone who does not believe in the Son is condemned already.
Paul in 1 cor 5, hand an u repentant man over to Satan and do not mix with ' christians' who blatantly sin.

Basic Christianity. We are forgiven by God on our repentance, as Jesus shows on the cross the unrepentant offender does not have to be forgiven.
( you need to show that Jesus's words mean more than a request for God to forgive. )

Forgiveness without repentance is endorsing sinful behaviour, while a rebuke/explanation of such behaviour not only shows it is wrong but opens the way for a change.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

The implications are that God and Jesus teach the doctrines of demons.

The devil is very pleased that you have accepted this viewpoint that he has shared with you




Do you believe Jesus is a liar???

Mark 11:25,26
And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.
But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.

Yeah so, feel free to not forgive others... and see what happens to you when you croak someday

 

[MatthewG]

Since unforgiveness, like any other sin, breaks our fellowship with God, Christians should desire to restore that fellowship. To have fellowship with God, peace in our hearts and minds is worth more than anything else.

Also, thinking about the Fruits of the Spirit, a spirit of unforgiveness hinders regarding those.

22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
24And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
Galatians 5:22-25

Are we willing to crucify our flesh regarding a spirit of unforgiveness? Or do we harbor a spirit of pride, unwilling to yield?

Reminds me, Debp, of this.

23 All the people were astonished and said, “Could this be the Son of David?”

24 But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “It is only by Beelzebul, the prince of demons, that this fellow drives out demons.”

25 Jesus knew their thoughts and said to them, “Every kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and every city or household divided against itself will not stand. 26 If Satan drives out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then can his kingdom stand? 27 And if I drive out demons by Beelzebul, by whom do your people drive them out? So then, they will be your judges. 28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I drive out demons, then the kingdom of Godhas come upon you.

29 “Or again, how can anyone enter a strong man’s house and carry off his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man? Then he can plunder his house.

30 “Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters. 31 And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. 32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come


It seems there is a separation between believers and unbelievers. Those who reject Yahava here, will find out in the afterlife what is true, however will by their own wanting to go away from God will be given what they desire, and placed outside the gates.

What is interesting, is there nothing that stated here by Jesus that they can not turn around, it seems it the willingly person who desires the world over Yahava.

The world chokes the word out the spiritual life of a person who end up getting entangled within it, such as the anger, hatred, jealous, envy, etc.

 

[Marcipa]

Ahhhh, now the "wanting" part is very difficult if you are hurt deeply enough. Of course we "want to" to obey Jesus...but if ones heart is not easily softened toward those folks, I find I have to pray every time I think of past hurts and those who did them because I already forgave them but, still can at times feel the hurt all over again..then back to the drawing board "Lord please help me to feel this forgiveness in my heart, so that I will know it is sincere! Please Lord, give me compassion and grace-that I extend the very same to them that You have given me Lord.
Some say it can be a process, some say no, it should happen right away! Either way, God does know each of our hearts and knows that we want badly to not only forgive, but to forget, just like God.
JMHO

Good thread @Debp !

Sometimes I am able to forgive but struggle with the forgetting part. I tend to distance myself from those people because of that.

 

[Nancy]

Sometimes I am able to forgive but struggle with the forgetting part. I tend to distance myself from those people because of that.

You are like me sister, I have been leaning way more towards "flight" rather than "fight", hate confrontation.

 

[amigo de christo]

You are like me sister, I have been leaning way more towards "flight" rather than "fight", hate confrontation.

I Just woke from the craziest dream. I dreamt that I was on-line and I kept seeing articles and stories about a specific tattoo people were getting which looked a little like the one I made in paint. This tattoo signifed that those who had it were saved by grace without doing anything at all because Jesus already did it for them when he died and rose again. No confession of faith, no belief, no changing of their worldly ways, no salvation message. This dream was disturbing and many non believers as well as Christians were getting this tattoo. I'm sure we will see something similar arise in the future

it aint time to run , its time TO FIGHT sister . to fight and contend for the true faith NOW . this monster of a delusion
is taking many captive to this lie .

 

[chiclady]

Although forgiveness is a command that "We ought to love our neighbor," it would take some time to fully forgive whilst in the process of healing and acceptance, otherwise it can only bring back and harbor grudge, blame and bitterness. It is easy to say, live a life patterned after the image of Jesus, who after being beaten and spat on, did not retaliate, instead sacrificed His life for the purpose of forgiveness of sins. "There is a time for everything." (Ecclesiastes 3:1)

 

[Pearl]

Although forgiveness is a command that "We ought to love our neighbor," it would take some time to fully forgive whilst in the process of healing and acceptance, otherwise it can only bring back and harbor grudge, blame and bitterness. It is easy to say, live a life patterned after the image of Jesus, who after being beaten and spat on, did not retaliate, instead sacrificed His life for the purpose of forgiveness of sins. "There is a time for everything." (Ecclesiastes 3:1)

Hi there @chiclady welcome to the forum, I hope you enjoy being here and are blessed.

Sometime we need a lot of help from God to forgive but it can be done,

 

[chiclady]

Hi there @chiclady welcome to the forum, I hope you enjoy being here and are blessed.

Sometime we need a lot of help from God to forgive but it can be done,

Thanks Pearl. Yes, we do need His help so whatever recycling thoughts that may be causing unforgiveness will lead to full forgiveness. We should remember that the Lord can choose to not forgive an unforgiving servant, that He best explained in a Parable.(Matthew 18:21-35)