United Methodists Lose 1M Members in a Single Day, Council of Bishops 'Grieves' Mass Exodus(After vote to allow gay clergy & ss unions)

[BlessedPeace]

CBN News 6/7/24

United Methodists Lose 1M Members in a Single Day, Council of Bishops 'Grieves' Mass Exodus

The United Methodist Church Council of Bishops has issued a response to one of the largest exoduses from the denominatio

www2.cbn.com

A million members. That's inspiring. That people in one accord of protest would unite for change by leaving an institution that itself changed so to embrace Apostasy.


Hallelujah!
There is no such thing as a gay church.

 

[Aunty Jane]

There is no such thing as a gay church.

There is no such thing as a gay Christian….but I have to qualify that statement. Those who are sexually oriented towards the same sex are not evil people…..they have a genuine hormonal leaning towards something over which they have no control. Are they to be victimized just because they were born this way?
I ask this in sincerity because of something Paul said…..at 1 Cor 6:9-11…

”Or do you not know that unrighteous people will not inherit God’s Kingdom? Do not be misled. Those who are sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, men who submit to homosexual acts, men who practice homosexuality, 10 thieves, greedy people, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners will not inherit God’s Kingdom.”
Now that is a comprehensive list, and if we look at what Paul said was the consequence of such behaviors, we see that drunkenness, immorality, aulterers, revilers, thieves and greedy people, as well as those who submit to homosexual acts, are all collected under one umbrella with the same outcome.
But look at what he says next….?

“And yet that is what some of you were. But you have been washed clean; you have been sanctified; you have been declared righteous in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and with the spirit of our God.”

So people may have engaged in any number of those things in the past…..and if they continued to practice them on becoming a Christian, they would disqualify themselves from inheriting the Kingdom…..so being homosexual is not the sin…it is engaging in homosexual acts, the same as engaging in heterosexual acts outsides of scriptural marriage also disqualifies a person. Jesus said that those who divorce and remarry when their spouse has not committed adultery is guilty of adultery (Matt 19:9)….how many people would this disqualify? What about drunkenness or people who revile others and use foul language? What is an idolater? Do we use images in our worship? An idol can be anything that is used as a religious symbol…even a cross is an image. How many wear them around their necks when God’s command was not to “make an image” of “anything” to be used in a religious way…bowing down to it or not. (Ex 20:4)

The way to show our Christianity is not in our jewelry but in our conduct and personality.

So the churches who openly welcome practicing homosexuals and do not require them to abide by the standard of marriage laid out in the scriptures, are basically sentencing them to death…..by not enforcing God’s standards, they are not giving them an opportunity to make a sacrifice for Christ, requiring less than the one he made for them. No one died from refraining from sex. Many single Christians sacrifice themselves for a good standing with God (Matt 19:12)…..in exercising the fruits of the spirit….”self-control and patience” are two that are most needed to live a life where love for God and his Christ are more important that love for one’s self.

 

[Earburner]

Methodist Church’s First Drag Queen Pastor: ‘God Is Nothing’ - The American Spectator | USA News and PoliticsThe American Spectator | USA News and Politics

Last year, the United Methodist Church accepted Isaac Simmons, who regularly preaches dressed as a drag queen under the name Ms. Penny Cost, as a candidate

spectator.org

 

[SavedInHim]

Methodist Church’s First Drag Queen Pastor: ‘God Is Nothing’ - The American Spectator | USA News and PoliticsThe American Spectator | USA News and Politics

Last year, the United Methodist Church accepted Isaac Simmons, who regularly preaches dressed as a drag queen under the name Ms. Penny Cost, as a candidate

spectator.org

Well, Methodists wanted inclusiveness; they got it.

 

[Spyder]

There is no such thing as a gay Christian….but I have to qualify that statement. Those who are sexually oriented towards the same sex are not evil people…..they have a genuine hormonal leaning towards something over which they have no control. Are they to be victimized just because they were born this way?
I ask this in sincerity because of something Paul said…..at 1 Cor 6:9-11…

Nobody has ever found the "gay gene." People are raised in such a way that the affection and intimacy of a same sex person is desirable. Back before 1974, psychologists knew it was a mental illness. Then, they changed the definition.

 

[Wrangler]

they have a genuine hormonal leaning towards something over which they have no control. Are they to be victimized just because they were born this way?

<sigh> The cause of wrong doing is not society’s concern but the action, the effect. What if it came to light that rapists and pedophiles and murderers had a hormonal imbalance; should victim laws all be repealed?

Biology. Politics/law. Not the same thing.

 

[Earburner]

Well, Methodists wanted inclusiveness; they got it.

Yes, I do know. As of 3 years ago, I am an x-member of the UMC, because of the splitting nature of the Gay Agenda that was happening to the church.
Well, finally it is here, and the church that I did attend, has now left the UMC, and are now "headed" under a different name. Church-ianity is the same, no matter where you go. I won't be going back, nor will I become an active member elsewhere.

 

[Earburner]

Nobody has ever found the "gay gene." People are raised in such a way that the affection and intimacy of a same sex person is desirable. Back before 1974, psychologists knew it was a mental illness. Then, they changed the definition.

It's a spiritual illness.

 

[Rockerduck]

I was a minister at a Methodist church when news of the split was coming. God told me to leave there. Then the Holy Spirit said to go to a nearby Baptist Church.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Nobody has ever found the "gay gene." People are raised in such a way that the affection and intimacy of a same sex person is desirable. Back before 1974, psychologists knew it was a mental illness. Then, they changed the definition.

I don’t think it’s a matter of a “gay gene” though......and it has nothing to do with upbringing either as siblings with the same upbringing can be vastly different in their sexual orientation. A mental illness? It’s as much physical as psychological.

Research reveals.....
“The term “transgender” refers to a person whose sex assigned at birth (i.e. the sex assigned at birth, usually based on external genitalia) does not align their gender identity (i.e., one’s psychological sense of their gender). Some people who are transgender will experience “gender dysphoria,” which refers to psychological distress that results from an incongruence between one’s sex assigned at birth and one’s gender identity. Though gender dysphoria often begins in childhood, some people may not experience it until after puberty or much later.”

So even in early childhood these traits can be clearly visible. So the condition itself is not “wicked” bit simply another product of “sin in our flesh” as Paul described it....this then can make war with our mind if we have to suppress something so basic in our nature. Sexual attraction is powerful and to have to stifle it requires strong self-control. For Christians, the desire to please God must be stronger than our desire to satisfy our flesh. God will give such ones an extra portion of his spirit to overcome what they “were” to become something they now “are”... morally “clean” in God’s eyes. It won’t make their homosexuality go away however, but will give them the will to suppress it, knowing that with such sacrifices, “God is well pleased”.

Those churches who give homosexuals free licence are culpable because they are encouraging “lame sacrifices” to God in the guise of “lame” excuses to remain morally unclean in his eyes.

 

[Aunty Jane]

<sigh> The cause of wrong doing is not society’s concern but the action, the effect. What if it came to light that rapists and pedophiles and murderers had a hormonal imbalance; should victim laws all be repealed?

Biology. Politics/law. Not the same thing.

This is a bit of a knee jerk response, Wrangler.....In no way was I condoning the actions, but trying to understand the reasons for them......
The reasons do not justify the action, and that was my point. People can change their behavior even if their sexual orientation remains the same. That is not really fixable in this world.....but all will be rectified in the new world to come. (Rev 21:2-4)

Rapists and pedophiles have criminal behaviours that are aberrant and abhorrent, but most homosexuals do not have “victims”....they have same sex partners, some of whom have been in monogamous relationships for years. They are not necessarily wicked people but their sexual behavior is not in accord with God’s standards. But neither are those in heterosexual relationships if they are not married. Neither are those who are divorced and remarried in unscriptural circumstances. So not so hasty with the judgment. Read my original post again.

The ones who parade in the streets as if they have something to be proud of, obviously have no intention to change their behavior, but if a person wants to become a Christian, they will have to change their whole attitude towards the same sex and choose a life of celibacy. For those who are afflicted, it’s a big ask and one that God will reward.

 

[Spyder]

I don’t think it’s a matter of a “gay gene” though......and it has nothing to do with upbringing either as siblings with the same upbringing can be vastly different in their sexual orientation. A mental illness? It’s as much physical as psychological.

Research reveals.....
“The term “transgender” refers to a person whose sex assigned at birth (i.e. the sex assigned at birth, usually based on external genitalia) does not align their gender identity (i.e., one’s psychological sense of their gender). Some people who are transgender will experience “gender dysphoria,” which refers to psychological distress that results from an incongruence between one’s sex assigned at birth and one’s gender identity. Though gender dysphoria often begins in childhood, some people may not experience it until after puberty or much later.”

So even in early childhood these traits can be clearly visible. So the condition itself is not “wicked” bit simply another product of “sin in our flesh” as Paul described it....this then can make war with our mind if we have to suppress something so basic in our nature. Sexual attraction is powerful and to have to stifle it requires strong self-control. For Christians, the desire to please God must be stronger than our desire to satisfy our flesh. God will give such ones an extra portion of his spirit to overcome what they “were” to become something they now “are”... morally “clean” in God’s eyes. It won’t make their homosexuality go away however, but will give them the will to suppress it, knowing that with such sacrifices, “God is well pleased”.

Those churches who give homosexuals free licence are culpable because they are encouraging “lame sacrifices” to God in the guise of “lame” excuses to remain morally unclean in his eyes.

There is more to do with "upbringing" than meets the eye. If there is more than one child in the house, I'd bet they both see actions of parents differently. Then again, "upbringing" is also relationships with peers and adults outside of the house. Parents don't get to see much of that - and that isn't even mentioning the large numbers of single-parent households (which is compounded by the possibility of a dysfunctional single parent.

Happen to imagine the thoughts of a young person who is going through clinical depression and feelings of no worth?

A person who grows up feeling unloved by a parent who does not display affection can develop traits leading to acceptance of affection from same-sex persons. That is typically how it happens.

Homosexuality is a learned problem and is not genetic. It is difficult to assign the original fault, and it is also difficult to cure.

In the world we live in today, homosexuality is celebrated as if it a great act of courage. That is simply going to lead to more of them.

We have become a culture that does not assign guilt. We preach 'acceptance" of nearly everything, so what would motivate a person living a homosexual lifestyle to change?

 

[Spyder]

More than 100 medical professionals and groups have signed onto a declaration that calls for a shift in focus toward addressing underlying psychological problems in children who experience discomfort with their sex.
The Doctors Protecting Children Declaration was issued by pediatricians, doctors, researchers, medical ethics advocates, and faith-based medical groups on June 6 at a news conference in Washington.

Instead, psychotherapy for underlying mental health issues such as depression, autism, anxiety, and emotional trauma should be the “first line of treatment” for children who are confused or distressed about their sex, the declaration states. “We are here defying the claims made by these medical organizations in the U.S. that those of us who are concerned are a minority, and that their protocols are consensus,” Dr. Jill Simmons, a pediatrician and the executive director of ACPeds, said at the event. “They are not consensus, and we are speaking in a loud and unified voice: Enough.”

 

[Wrangler]

So not so hasty with the judgment.

Not so hasty? God told us 4,000 years ago homosexuality is a sin. Not my judgment.

 

[BlessedPeace]

This is a bit of a knee jerk response, Wrangler.....In no way was I condoning the actions, but trying to understand the reasons for them......
The reasons do not justify the action, and that was my point. People can change their behavior even if their sexual orientation remains the same. That is not really fixable in this world.....but all will be rectified in the new world to come. (Rev 21:2-4)

Rapists and pedophiles have criminal behaviours that are aberrant and abhorrent, but most homosexuals do not have “victims”....they have same sex partners, some of whom have been in monogamous relationships for years. They are not necessarily wicked people but their sexual behavior is not in accord with God’s standards. But neither are those in heterosexual relationships if they are not married. Neither are those who are divorced and remarried in unscriptural circumstances. So not so hasty with the judgment. Read my original post again.

The ones who parade in the streets as if they have something to be proud of, obviously have no intention to change their behavior, but if a person wants to become a Christian, they will have to change their whole attitude towards the same sex and choose a life of celibacy. For those who are afflicted, it’s a big ask and one that God will reward.

You sound like Arthur.

 

[Wrangler]

This is a bit of a knee jerk response

Not an answer to my question.

What if it came to light that rapists and pedophiles and murderers had a hormonal imbalance; should victim laws all be repealed?

To go to difference is disregarding the genus, the similarity.

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

My Presbyterian church spit over gays preaching and the wanna be weddings...

It was just plain nasty.

Good for those who left the Methodists

 

[lforrest]

So many tithe into a local church, sometimes for generations. Then due to a decision by convention they are forced to adopt some policy or leave. Even if the local church are of the same accord they can't just leave the denomination and keep their investments in the building, for example. It belongs to the denomination as far as I'm aware.

 

[Wrangler]

Even if the local church are of the same accord they can't just leave the denomination and keep their investments in the building, for example. It belongs to the denomination as far as I'm aware.

That’s what happened with my congregation. The building and property ended up selling for $2M.

The price of religious liberty. Although there were 5 precedents in civil cases in our favor and none against, our church leadership decided that taking the issue to court was unbiblical.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Not so hasty? God told us 4,000 years ago homosexuality is a sin. Not my judgment.

C’mon Wrangler….you have better comprehension skills than that surely…?
What part of…
“This is a bit of a knee jerk response, Wrangler.....In no way was I condoning the actions, but trying to understand the reasons for them......
The reasons do not justify the action, and that was my point. People can change their behavior even if their sexual orientation remains the same. That is not really fixable in this world.”…..did you fail to understand?

God hates the sin, not the sinner….

Was I saying that homosexual acts were not a sin? Or was I merely stating that sexual orientation was mainly responsible (for those who are gender dysphoric), wanting to practice this sin?
Sexual deviation is a sin…period! No matter if it is homosexual or heterosexual…both merited the death penalty under God’s law, so we know how God feels about it….