What are the seven kings of Revelation 17:10?

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Jay Ross

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@Hobie that is an interesting read from historical documents and books, #17, #18 and #19 but it does not negate what I wrote or the scriptures I referenced. It only demonstrates the political demonization that went on during the early reformation years, when the German princes used the reformation to break away from the control of the Pope over Europe so as to set up their own kingdoms and power bases. In the early years of the settlement of America by the early protestants, i.e. puritans, anabaptists etc., who migrated from Europe, there was a general real hatred of Catholics and the Catholic Church, more so than in Europe. Claiming that the Roman Catholic Church was the antichrist is overlooking the advance of Islam into European countries before and during the period of the reformation in pain and eastern Europe.

This was the manifestation within the sea of humanity of the real "fourth beast" of Daniel 7:1-12 at work in the world at this time speaking out great things against God. This "invasion" of Europe is still occurring today with the migration of many people groups from the Middle Eastern conflicts that have occurred over the past 70 years.

But that is a very different slant and understand of Daniel 7:1-12 than is presently held by many within Christian circles and the history of Europe confirms this understanding. Satan is pushing this understanding that the antichrist that will be appear in our distant future, about a little over 1,000 years from now, will come out of the revived Roman empire.

However the fifth segment of the Statue prophecy in Daniel 2 as demonstrated above in my posts which have been confirmed with scripture and recorded history is not the revived roman empire as many want to believe but is in fact the Coalition of the Willing that invaded Iraq and gain domination of the land of Babylon and still has a tenuous hold over the land even now.

The IS beheading of Christians and/or Jews over the recent past number of years and player to us on our TV screen has been a religious statement that Allah as a God is far stronger than the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. In other words they have been speaking out great things against the God that Christians worship. This is why I believe that Islam is the manifestation of the fourth beast from heaven.

Shalom
 

Hobie

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Here is a good study with text:

"The Apocalypse, as the book is sometimes referred to, is derived from the Greek word apocalypsis which means a "disclosure," an "uncovering," or a "revelation." Therefore, the book of Revelation is not to be a mystery, but, on the other hand, it is to be understood by every truly sincere Bible student. Second, Revelation is a book of prophecy and it predicts things "which must shortly come to pass." (Rev. 1:1). Third, the book is filled with signs and symbols, and this is the method by which God showed the future to John who faithfully "bare record" of the visions "that he saw." (Rev. 1:2). He, for instance, saw a beast with seven heads (Rev. 13:1); a "great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns" (Rev. 12:3); and the "great whore that sitteth upon many waters" (Rev. 17:1).

Every Bible student should know that the Bible interprets itself. Take, for example, Revelation 17:1 - "the great whore that sitteth upon many waters." If you look at verse 15 of the same chapter, the Scripture says, "The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues." It is obvious that the "whore" is not a literal prostitute sitting on the Atlantic Ocean, but a representation of some kind of powerful organization that has many peoples, multitudes, nations, and tongues under her jurisdiction. And whatever the program or influence of this entity, it definitely does not operate with the blessing or approval of the Author of Revelation. Interestingly enough, throughout the Scriptures the sacred relationship of God to his obedient followers is compared to that of marriage. Notice how God feels when this relationship has degenerated into infidelity: "They say, If a man put away his wife, and she go from him, and become another man's, shall he return unto her again? shall not that land be greatly polluted? but thou [Israel] hast played the harlot with many lovers [following the idolatries and corrupt practices of the heathen nations about them], yet return again to Me, saith the Lord. Lift up thine eyes unto the high places [areas of idol worship and consecrated immoralityl, and see where thou hast not been lain with [the implication is that there is no such place that had not been defiled]. In the ways [the main ways of travel] hast thou sat for them [as a harlot looking for customers], as the Arabian in the wilderness [the hidden thief in the desert eagerly watching for travelers, or caravans, to prey upon]; and thou hast polluted the land with thy whoredoms and with thy wickedness. Therefore the showers have been withholden, and there hath been no latter rain; and thou hadst a whore's forehead [an attitude of impudence, brazenness, shamelessness]; thou refusedst to be ashamed...

Retum, thou backsliding Israel [literally, in the Hebrew, Turn back, O backturning Israel], saith the Lord....for I am married unto you." (Jer. 3:1-3, 12, 14). Therefore, a whore or harlot is used in the Bible as a symbol of a disloyal church that has left the Bridegroom, Jesus Christ, and is having illicit relations with other men or leaders or gods of this world. (See Ezekiel 16 and 23 for further confirmation)...

Revelation 12:1 begins with John seeing a symbolic mother in the sky, "clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars." She is pregnant and eager for her baby to arrive (verse 2), and Satan, shaped like a dragon, is present, ready "to devour her child as soon as it is born (verse 4)." Miraculously, the child escapes and is "caught up unto God, and to His throne (verse 5)."...
 

Hobie

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cont...
"a woman, when symbolized by a whore or harlot, is an apostate people or church. But, in addition to this, the word has yet another meaning when used symbolically. Just as a whore can symbolize an impure church, a virgin can be used to symbolize a pure church. Take, for instance, the following two Scriptures: "I have likened the daughter of Zion to a comely and delicate woman" and "For I am jealous over you with a godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ." (Jeremiah 6:2; 2.Cor.11:2). So could the "woman" of Revelation 12 possibly be "the true church" and not the Virgin Mary? Furthermore, her garment is the "sun," and she stands on the "moon," and wears a crown of "twelve stars." What is the significance of "the woman" being "clothed with the sun"? During His ministry, when Jesus was in the temple at Jerusalem and the rising sun came into full view over the Mount of Olives, He pointed to it and announced His mission as the Messiah, saying, "I am the light of the world: he that followeth Me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life." (John 8:12). Malachi, the last prophet of the Old Testament, had described the Coming One as "the Sun of righteousness." (Mal. 4:2). Now in vision on the Isle of Patmos during the last decade of the First Century A.D., John sees "a woman clothed with the sun" - that is, the glorious light of the "Sun of righteousness!" It is clear that this momentous event signifies the birth of the God-man, the Messiah! The momentous news of the ages is that the long-promised Deliverer has arrived! The pure woman - so long recognized by the now aging John to have represented God's true followers in the Church in both the Old and New Testament times - is at last now bathed in the bright splendor of His immediate Presence!

Moreover, she stands with "the moon under her feet." The Mosaic (Old Testament) dispensation had just ended and had been succeeded by the gospel dispensation. As the moon's lesser light is borrowed from the sun, so the sacrificial system, the Levitical priesthood, feasts, etc. had shone with a more subdued glory borrowed as types and shadows from what now had become Antitype and Substance in the full spiritual glory of the gospel era. The "woman" is wearing "a crown of twelve stars," representing the twelve apostles. "By the figure of prolepsis [anticipation of the whole completed picture], the church is represented as fully organized with its twelve apostles before the man-child, Christ, appeared upon the scene. This is easily accounted for by the fact that it was to be thus constituted immediately after Christ should commence His ministry; and He is more especially connected with this church than with that of the former dispensation." (Daniel and the Revelation, p. 545). To John, looking back from the end of the First Century upon a completed Apostolic Era to one described in the vision of Revelation 12 as just entering its first stages at the beginning of the Christian Era, this prolepsis would seem both logical and appropriate. Even so, with us today. After all, the events of Christ's birth and short life here on earth as portrayed by John's vision have proved so significant in our world's developing history that today the entire world designates its counting of years by the initials B.C. (Before Christ) and A.D. (Anno Domini, 1 A.D.--"in the year of the Lord," the supposed year of his birth, though actually over four years after His entrance into the world). From all the foregoing information, it then follows that "her child," Jesus Christ, was born to the true church. He was given to God's faithful as a whole, including Mary, who was herself a small, but important part, of the "woman" described in John's vision.

And who was it that inflicted suffering and temptation on the wonderful child Jesus? "And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon...stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered." (Rev. 12:3, 4). In verse 9, we learn that the dragon is "that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world" and once sought to destroy the Christ-child. "We're dealing with symbols! In the vision, the dragon is seen in heaven--yet Jesus, as we all know, was born on earth. So whom on earth does the dragon symbol stand for? Everyone who has heard the Christmas story knows it was King Herod who sent soldiers to Bethlehem to destroy all the baby boys there, hoping to kill Jesus among them. Herod's soldiers missed the infant Jesus, because in a dream God had warned His parents to escape. King Herod was a puppet of the Romans. Everyone knows too about Pontius Pilate - another Roman administrator - who nailed Jesus to the cross. It was Rome that tried to destroy Jesus. The great red dragon is primarily Satan--and, secondarily, his agent Rome, acting on Satan's behalf.

Triumphantly, after Satan and Rome killed our Saviour, Jesus rose from the dead and 'was caught up unto God, and to His throne' (verse 5), where He 'always lives' as our High Priest 'to make intercession' for us (Hebrews 7:25, 26).
"Frustrated in his attempt to kill the Son, the great red dragon now turned his hatred against the son's mother. But the mother escaped into the 'Wilderness' to a 'place prepared by God, in which to be nourished for one thousand two hundred and sixty days.' (Rev. 12:6)." (God Cares, Vol. 2, pp. 320, 321). As you are about to see, the experience of "the woman" [from the time of Christ's ascension to His Father's throne until the "remnant of her seed" appear and finish God's work on the earth in the closing moments of human probation at the end of the world] is much more suited to the history of the church...

As a matter of fact, the 1260-day prophecy is mentioned seven times in Daniel and Revelation. There are not, as some have supposed, several 1260-day periods; there is only one. It is mentioned seven times, because it is so very important: in Danjel 7:25 and 12:7 and also in Revelation 12:14, as a time, times (i.e., two times - the lowest plural), and a half time; in Revelation 11:2 and 13:5, as forty-two months; and in Revelation 11:3 and Revelation 12:6, as one thousand two hundred and threescore (sixty) days. In Bible prophecy, there are 360 days to a year, and if you multiply 360 times three and one-half, you will come up with the number-- 1260. Also, when time is used in Bible prophecy, a day stands for a year. (See Ezekiel 4:6; Num.14:34). Therefore, the Bible has given us the important key to figuring out the 1260-day prophecy, and that is this--that the 1260 days are actually 1260 literal years.

As Satan used the Roman Empire - particularly King Herod, Pontius Pilate and Nero, as well as many others - to put Christ to death and kill many of God's people, he, like a chameleon, changed his disguise once again after Western Rome's fall, but this time, he kept the same Roman roots. The "wilderness" (Rev. 12:6), symbolizing this 1260-year period, is also referred to as the "great tribulation" (Matt 24:21) - a time when millions of God's true people were martyred for refusing to follow the dictates of the Roman Church. The Bible accurately prophesied that the papal power, as symbolized by the "little horn" in Daniel 7:8, 20, 21 and the "leopard-bodied beast" in Revelation 13:2, would "make war with the saints." Only one "religious" organization has been responsible for more persecutions and deaths of faithful Bible-believing Christians than any other sect in history - The Holy Roman Catholic Church!

"Step by step, the Roman Empire (the dragon) did indeed give its power, throne, and great authority [Revelation 13:2] to the Catholic Church...A climax came in 538, when the armies of the Empire [the unfallen Eastern division] drove the Arian Ostrogoths out of Rome. By 538, therefore, the 1260 years could begin." (God Cares, Vol.2, p.328). "In the sixth century the papacy had become firmly established. Its seat of power was fixed in the imperial city, and the bishop of Rome was declared to be the head over the entire church. Paganism had given place to the papacy. The dragon had given to the beast 'his power, and his seat, and great authority.' Revelation 13:2. And now began the 1260 years of papal oppression foretold in the prophecies of Daniel and the Revelation. Daniel 7:25; Revelation 13:5-7. Christians were forced to choose either to yield their integrity and accept the papal ceremonies and worship, or to wear away their lives in dungeons or to suffer death by the rack, the fagot, or the headsman's ax. Now were fulfilled the words of Jesus: 'Ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and some of you shall they cause to be put to death. And ye shall be hated of all men for My name's sake.' Luke 21:16, 17. Persecution opened upon the faithful with greater fury than ever before, and the world became a vast battlefield. For hundreds of years the church of Christ found refuge in seclusion and obscurity. Thus says the prophet: 'The woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and three-score days.' Revelation 12:6.

"The accession of the Roman Church to power marked the beginning of the Dark Ages...."https://www.stepstolife.org/tag/virgin-mary/
 

Bobby Jo

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... The Church of Rome alone can fill this unique position.

What nonsense!

Are there seven Popes? Seven Districts? Seven Sects? Seven Thoughts as to why you should make such an unfounded assertion?

LOOK EVERYONE -- I have a THEORY, -- of course it has no FACTS or SUBSTANTIATION, but I'm going to DECLARE IT AS A TRUTH.

Where do these people come from?
Bobby Jo
 

Davy

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Jerusalem was basically not much after the Romans tore it down in 70 AD, it did not have power of the beast, much less the state of Israel.
....

No need for lengthy discourses of deception concerning Rome's pagan history being misapplied to Christ's Church, which is a basic Jewish concept.

It is not the Church's fault that pagan Rome in 70 A.D. destroyed Jerusalem and scattered the Jews, nor that later Christian nations in Europe forced unbelieving Jews to either convert or leave. God has promised those kind of things would happen upon Israel for rebelling against Him and turning to idols, etc.

The idea that the pope is the Antichrist was an idea the early Protestant Church surmised because of their being persecuted by the Roman Church. But none of that panned out to fulfill the Bible prophecies for the end of this world, particularly in Christ's Book of Revelation.

So trying to argue that a pope is the Antichrist, or even trying to move Bible prophecy meant for the very end back in time to early Rome, is just hot air by the deceived.
 

Bobby Jo

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... trying to argue that a pope is the Antichrist, or even trying to move Bible prophecy meant for the very end back in time to early Rome, is just hot air by the deceived.

This is correct. But it doesn't answer who the Seven Kings (and Eighth) ARE!

Perhaps if one were to follow the Daniel 2:45 FIVE, and discover that Chapter 7 presents the Fifth - "divided" FOUR, then we might find the Seven and the Eighth.


What Was I Thinking?!? I must have had some sort of mental lapse ...
Bobby Jo
 
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Hobie

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Lets see if the traditions are from "Jewish concept"...

"The Catholic Church makes tradition above or equal to Scripture, but in actuality many of its traditions actually stem from pagan sun worship. Its teachings, beliefs and practices come from Mithraism—a form of paganism that existed in Babylonian times.

These pagan practices are symbols of apostasy against God. Of this, the Twentieth Century Encyclopedia of Catholicism says the following:

'The missionary history of the [Catholic] Church clearly shows her adaptability to all races, all continents, all nations. In her liturgy and her art, in her tradition and the forming of her doctrine, naturally enough she includes Jewish elements, but also elements that are of pagan origin. In certain respects, she has copied her organization from that of the Roman Empire, has preserved and made fruitful the philosophical intuitions of Socrates, Plato and Aristotle, borrowed from both Barbarians and the Byzantine Roman Empire—but always remains herself, thoroughly digesting all elements drawn from external sources...In her laws, her ceremonies, her festivals and her devotions, she makes use of local customs after purifying them and "baptizing" them.'....

In the Antichrist Identified section, we discussed how the four beasts of Daniel 7, representing the four successive world powers, took the religious rites and ceremonies from each preceding kingdom as it fell, so that Babylonian traditions continued through the ages. Rome, the final kingdom, still clings to these pagan traditions today.

The Papacy claims that its system of worship has been handed down through tradition. They are absolutely correct. But these are not the teachings of Jesus, but rather the traditions of Babylon.

Roman Catholic doctrines such as infant baptism, sprinkling during baptism, teachings on death and immortality, tonsured and celibate priests with power over the dead, prayers to the dead and to relics, repetitive prayers with the use of beads, doctrines on forgiveness of sins, teachings on hell, the mass, and Sunday worship are doctrines actually derived directly from ancient Babylon, not the Bible....Paganism and Catholicism | Catholic Church Practices
 

Davy

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Anyone can attend a multitude of different Protestant denominations today and also... find some old pagan symbols and ideas mixed in with them. It's not a thing that is solely involving Rome and the Catholic Church.

One such example is the pagan day Easter which comes from pagan's sexual fertility worship Eastra, some say which was of Saxon origin, and others say it has even earlier origins as Ishtar worship in ancient Babylon (probably the more accurate account). At some point in Christian history, the name Easter was adopted to represent the time of our Lord Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection, which that day per God's Word is actually aligned with the timing of the Old Testament passover. This is why Apostle Paul would say Jesus is our Passover sacrificed for us in 1 Corinthians 5:7.

Thus there is a Christian passover, and that's about Christ's crucifixion and resurrection. And what is even more strange is how the 1611 KJV translators swapped the New Testament manuscript Greek word pascha in Acts 12:4 which means passover, for the pagan festival word Easter! They did that of course because calling the time of our Lord's crucifixion and resurrection by then per tradition was called Easter.

Ask yourself. Where do bunny rabbits fit in with the time of our Lord Jesus' death on the cross and His resurrection? The rabbit thing comes from the old pagan fertility goddess that was worshiped at pagan Easter. The pagans held sexual fertility rituals as part of that, which of course is an abomination to our Heavenly Father and His Son.

Who first was guilty of following pagan things that it made our Heavenly Father scatter them through the countries? God's Israel. For the Jews, which were the southern "kingdom of Judah", He still left them room to correct their false pagan worship (as per Hosea 1). But for the "kingdom of Israel" which were the ten northern tribes of Israel, God scattered them first and gave them a bill of divorce (Jeremiah 3; Hosea). The ten tribes lost their heritage as part of old Israel, and never returned to the holy lands, and are still lost to the Jews and to the world today.

The early Protestant Reformers understood this. They understood God's warnings to Israel in Deuteronomy 4 & 28 for falling away to pagan worship. Yet many of them also are in danger of falling away because of supplanted traditions that have nothing to do with The New Covenant Jesus Christ.
 

Bobby Jo

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... the four beasts of Daniel 7, representing the four successive world powers ...
Daniel 2:45 says FIVE successive world powers, of which the Fifth is "divided" between the Daniel 7 Three Superpowers and the U.N.

Scripture and History are simple, -- it's the Religious False Doctrines that confuse things,
Bobby Jo
 

Hobie

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Here is a list I came across of Pre-Reformation and Reformers Interpretations:

Date Name Reference Interpretation

c. 1310 Dante Alighieri
Rev. 17 Harlot=Roman Church

c. 1331 Michael of Cesena
Rev. 17 Harlot/Antichrist=Roman Church, Pope

c. 1345 Johannes de Rupescissa
Antichrist, Rev. 17 Babylon, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Roman church

c. 1350 Francesco Petrarch
Rev. 17 Harlot=Papal Court

c. 1367 John Milicz
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin=Papacy


c. 1379 John Wycliffe
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn. Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Papacy


c. 1388 Matthias of Janow
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Hierarchy/Papacy


c. 1390 John Purvey
Antichrist, Rev. 13 666, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy


c. 1393 Walter Brute
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin=Papacy/Bishop of Rome/Papacy

c. 1412 John Huss
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy


c. 1497 Girolamo Savonarola
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

Reformation Era Interpretations:

1522 Martin Luther
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1543 Philipp Melanchthon
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 Andreas Osiander
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1554 Nicolaus von Amsdorf
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1558 Johann Funck
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1560 Virgil Solis
Antichrist, Little Horn, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1570 Georg Nigrinus
Antichrist= Pope

1572 David Chytraeus
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin= Papacy

1530 Johann Oecolampadius
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1557 Heinrich Bullinger
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 William Tyndale
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 George Joys
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1554 Nicholas Ridley
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1553 Hugh Latimer
Antichrist=Papacy

1582 Thomas Cranmer
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 John Bale
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1562 John Jewel
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1587 John Foxe
Antichrist, Man of Sin=Bishop of Rome

1563 Anglican Formulas
Antichrist=Papacy

1547 John Knox
Antichrist, Little Horn=Church of Rome/Papacy

1593 John Napier
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 13 1st Beast, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast =Pope/Papacy/Latin Empire

1614 Thomas Brightman
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

1618 David Pareus
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Beast=Pope/Papacy

Sir Isaac Newton
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

John Wesley
Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy also Antichrist

And they ask the question, "In view of the foregoing Reformation interpretations identifying Papacy as the Antichrist and Man of Sin, why do so many Evangelical Protestants today believe the Man of Sin and Antichrist are future individuals?"

Are we failing in our duty to warm the churches of the Reformation, as we see them drift back to the Papal Power, the AntiChrist.
 

Davy

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Here is a list I came across of Pre-Reformation and Reformers Interpretations:

Date Name Reference Interpretation

c. 1310 Dante Alighieri
Rev. 17 Harlot=Roman Church

c. 1331 Michael of Cesena
Rev. 17 Harlot/Antichrist=Roman Church, Pope

c. 1345 Johannes de Rupescissa
Antichrist, Rev. 17 Babylon, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Roman church

c. 1350 Francesco Petrarch
Rev. 17 Harlot=Papal Court

c. 1367 John Milicz
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin=Papacy


c. 1379 John Wycliffe
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn. Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Papacy


c. 1388 Matthias of Janow
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Hierarchy/Papacy


c. 1390 John Purvey
Antichrist, Rev. 13 666, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy


c. 1393 Walter Brute
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin=Papacy/Bishop of Rome/Papacy

c. 1412 John Huss
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy


c. 1497 Girolamo Savonarola
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

Reformation Era Interpretations:

1522 Martin Luther
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1543 Philipp Melanchthon
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 Andreas Osiander
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1554 Nicolaus von Amsdorf
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1558 Johann Funck
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1560 Virgil Solis
Antichrist, Little Horn, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1570 Georg Nigrinus
Antichrist= Pope

1572 David Chytraeus
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin= Papacy

1530 Johann Oecolampadius
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1557 Heinrich Bullinger
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 William Tyndale
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 George Joys
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1554 Nicholas Ridley
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1553 Hugh Latimer
Antichrist=Papacy

1582 Thomas Cranmer
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 John Bale
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1562 John Jewel
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1587 John Foxe
Antichrist, Man of Sin=Bishop of Rome

1563 Anglican Formulas
Antichrist=Papacy

1547 John Knox
Antichrist, Little Horn=Church of Rome/Papacy

1593 John Napier
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 13 1st Beast, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast =Pope/Papacy/Latin Empire

1614 Thomas Brightman
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

1618 David Pareus
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Beast=Pope/Papacy

Sir Isaac Newton
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

John Wesley
Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy also Antichrist

And they ask the question, "In view of the foregoing Reformation interpretations identifying Papacy as the Antichrist and Man of Sin, why do so many Evangelical Protestants today believe the Man of Sin and Antichrist are future individuals?"

Are we failing in our duty to warm the churches of the Reformation, as we see them drift back to the Papal Power, the AntiChrist.

Proves absolutely nothing.

Was Bible prophecy fulfilled regarding what the Antichrist was to do... in JERUSALEM? (2 Thess.2)? NO! It never was, as that prophecy Apostle Paul gave for the coming false one sitting in a temple in Jerusalem proclaiming himself as God, has yet to happen today! Gurgle, gurgle, down... goes men's leaven doctrines that Rome is the Revelation Babylon harlot for the end of this world.
 

Bobby Jo

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RePost:

... the four beasts of Daniel 7, representing the four successive world powers ...
Daniel 2:45 says FIVE successive world powers, of which the Fifth is "divided" between the Daniel 7 Three Superpowers and the U.N.

Scripture and History are simple, -- it's the Religious False Doctrines that confuse things,
Bobby Jo
 

Davy

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I would really like to agree with you, but the scriptures do not support your theory. At the present moment in History with the Brexit exit of Britain from the European Union of nations we are seeing Satan working very hard to keep the delusion of the revived roman empire in place so that we look in the wrong direction in the formulation of our understanding of the book of Daniel and the end times.

In the Prophecy in Daniel 2 on the kingdoms that have dominion over the land of the Chaldeans, i.e. Babylon, the Roman Empire does not figure, nor is the Roman Empire the Fourth beast of Daniel 7:1-12.

In reading the Daniel 2 statue prophecy we also need to consider what Jeremiah wrote concerning the Land of Babylon, where he prophecies, that the Land of Babylon will be devastated and desolated for a period of two ages which is for around 2,000 years, in Jeremiah 50:1-40.

Then in Revelations 16:17-21, it speaks that during the period of great turmoil in the world during the 20 century, that Babylon will be remembered once more for the outpouring of God’s Wrath, on Babylon, and historically this occurred in 1926 when the nation of Iraq was established over what had previously been the land of the Chaldeans, i.e. Babylon.

What this tells us that around 100-120 BC the Grecian empire that had domination over the Land of Babylon at that time, pulled all of the utilities apart and gathered all of the people in the land of Babylon and shipped them and the stripped utilities out of Babylon to another part of their portion of the Greek Empire. This indicates that the Roman empire had no dominion over the land of Babylon at any time and when Roman tried to enter the land of Babylon, they found that it had no people nor could the land support them and they return once more homewards bound.

Now Jeremiah 50:1-40 confirms for us that there is an approximate gap of around 2,000 years between the third segment, Greece, and the fourth segment which today is known as the nation of Iraq.

Then Jeremiah 50:41-51:48 speaks of a king of the north and many kings going up against Babylon/Iraq and gaining dominion over the land but their intention was to heal the land and they fell away and then God sort out the Medes to begin the destruction of Babylon which is what is happening at this present time.

So, the fifth segment that has/had dominion over the land of Babylon for a time is the Coalition of the Willing lead by the USA and its President, i.e. king. The punishment for these nations of the coalition of the Willing for healing the land instead of bringing destruction to the land of Babylon is the over running of these nations with many men and these men will raise a shout of victory over the nations of the Coalition of the Willing.

So, our understanding of the five nations that has/had dominion over the land of Babylon is, 1. Babylon, 2. The Medes and the Persians, 3. The Greek Empire, 3a. A period of around 2,000 years where Babylon laid devastated and desolated, 4. Iraq and 5. The Coalition of the Willing lead by the USA.

He the Daniel 2 Statue prophecy ends with the statement that during the time of these kings, God will establish His everlasting Kingdom.

To be continued: -

Shalom

Just another false idea above from Jews to get Christian brethren to focus away... from Jerusalem for the very end of this world.

Rev 11:1-2
11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
KJV


The above Scripture reveals another Jewish temple is to be built in Jerusalem for the end, per the Book of Daniel events, and of the Gentile armies of the Antichrist (beast king) ruling there for 42 months, the latter 3.5 years of Dan.9:27 (see Rev.13:4-5).


Rev 11:7-8
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
KJV

The beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit is about the "another beast" of Rev.13, a king, established in the temple of God at Jerusalem. That's about the coming Antichrist for the end of this world. Verse 8 there is specific that will happen in Jerusalem, and it will involve the one God's Word calls the "dragon" (see Rev.12:9 for who that is).

Thus it's really ignorant to claim a U.S. President associated with the Antichrist and those Gentiles of Rev.13:2 that tread Jerusalem for 42 months. Even U.S. Presidents that don't really cater to American Jews pretty much support them in their quests. The U.S. will support the orthodox Jews with building their new temple in Jerusalem, just as Trump has supported them in recognizing Jerusalem as Israel's capital.
 

Hobie

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Anyone can attend a multitude of different Protestant denominations today and also... find some old pagan symbols and ideas mixed in with them. It's not a thing that is solely involving Rome and the Catholic Church.

One such example is the pagan day Easter which comes from pagan's sexual fertility worship Eastra, some say which was of Saxon origin, and others say it has even earlier origins as Ishtar worship in ancient Babylon (probably the more accurate account). At some point in Christian history, the name Easter was adopted to represent the time of our Lord Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection, which that day per God's Word is actually aligned with the timing of the Old Testament passover. This is why Apostle Paul would say Jesus is our Passover sacrificed for us in 1 Corinthians 5:7.

Thus there is a Christian passover, and that's about Christ's crucifixion and resurrection. And what is even more strange is how the 1611 KJV translators swapped the New Testament manuscript Greek word pascha in Acts 12:4 which means passover, for the pagan festival word Easter! They did that of course because calling the time of our Lord's crucifixion and resurrection by then per tradition was called Easter.

Ask yourself. Where do bunny rabbits fit in with the time of our Lord Jesus' death on the cross and His resurrection? The rabbit thing comes from the old pagan fertility goddess that was worshiped at pagan Easter. The pagans held sexual fertility rituals as part of that, which of course is an abomination to our Heavenly Father and His Son.

Who first was guilty of following pagan things that it made our Heavenly Father scatter them through the countries? God's Israel. For the Jews, which were the southern "kingdom of Judah", He still left them room to correct their false pagan worship (as per Hosea 1). But for the "kingdom of Israel" which were the ten northern tribes of Israel, God scattered them first and gave them a bill of divorce (Jeremiah 3; Hosea). The ten tribes lost their heritage as part of old Israel, and never returned to the holy lands, and are still lost to the Jews and to the world today.

The early Protestant Reformers understood this. They understood God's warnings to Israel in Deuteronomy 4 & 28 for falling away to pagan worship. Yet many of them also are in danger of falling away because of supplanted traditions that have nothing to do with The New Covenant Jesus Christ.
Here is a good explanation I came across on how paganism crept into the early church...

"...How does one begin to explain the connection between the pagan sun worship and paganizing of the true worship of God and His only begotten Son?

To begin with, the sun god of the Persians was Mithras and subsequent empires including the Roman Empire through the 4th century. During the 4th century, Mithras "mysteriously" vanished and Roman "Christianity" began. A Christianity not like that of the 1st century with the apostles guarding against the inroads from false doctrines and traditions; but, a polluted, corrupt "Christianity" with pagan rituals and ceremonies.

A major influence was Mithras, it was invoked in the inscriptions of the Biblical Artaxerxes, king of Babylon: making Mithras one of the pagan gods that God had warned His chosen people to beware of. And yet, in the 4th century, by way of a Satanic "if you can’t beat em join em" deception, a blend of the worship of God and the worship of pagan gods was officially proclaimed as "Christianity" by the Roman Empire.

The graven images of the pagan deities, given "Christian" titles, appeared in direct violation of the 2nd commandment. And the Sunday observance of "Deis Solis", the day of the sun began to be brought in by pagan worshipers as they climbed into the bandwagon of the swelling Christian church which accommodated them but in turn voiding the 4th commandment.

The Persians had overthrown Babylon and picked up many of the gods and religious practices of the conquered people. The Medo-Persians added to the religious rites and ceremonies of the Babylonians and the cult of Mithraism with its seven levels of initiation formed a cornerstone of the system of sun worship. When the Persians were defeated by Alexander the Great, Mithraism began to spread throughout the Greek Empire.

The Medo-Persians conquered Babylon, but the Babylonian system of worship was not destroyed, merely refined. Similarly, when Greece conquered the Medo-Persian Empire, the names of the gods changed but the system of worship remained essentially the same, and the same deities were worshipped in Rome under a different garb.

It was one of the principle aims of Alexander to spread the Greek culture and philosophy throughout his realm. They picked up Mithraism, and the religion of Greece added many refinements, rites and ceremonies to the earthly systems of worship.

The Roman Empire conquered Greece and other lands were Mithraism had spread from Greek culture and had power to control world events. They would thus incorporate aspects and refinements of all the religious systems of history and especially Mithraism as it evolved through the years and became influential in the rise of paganism worship in Roman culture and eventually into the Christian church.

Many attributes of the Babylonian pagan worship and Persian worship found its way into the church at Rome, some were substitutes for the true worship as in the pagan religion. The ancient Chaldeans of Babylon worshipped a pantheon of male and female gods representing the sun god. There were largely three aspects to this system of sun worship, representing the father, mother, and the son. These were the god Bel (Baal) or Merodach, Ninus the son, who was also worshipped as Tammuz, and the female goddess Rhea who was also worshipped as Ishtar, Astarte, or Beltis representing the mother. She was also referred to as the ‘queen of heaven’, and the ‘wrath subduer’. Mother and child worship was the basis of the ancient religions.

As the power of pagan Rome declined, the power of papal Rome increased as the church accumulated more and more power and influence. When the emperor Constantine accepted the veneer of Christianity and Paganism and Christianity blended into one, Rome became the religious capital of the world. Abbot's Roman History, p.236 declares:

"..The transfer of the emperor's residence to Constantinople was a sad blow to the prestige of Rome, and at the time one might have predicted her speedy decline. But the development of the Church, and the growing authority of the Bishop of Rome, or the pope, gave her a new lease on life, and made her again the capital (this time the religious capital) of the world...."

From 538 A.D., when the emperor Justinian issued a decree, proclaiming the pope to be supreme in religious matters he assumed the garb of representative of Jesus Christ on earth. When Constantine moved his seat to Constantinople, the popes inherited the power of the Roman emperors - their prestige, the pagan religious beliefs, and even their titles."
 

Bobby Jo

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... the popes inherited the power of the Roman emperors - their prestige, the pagan religious beliefs, and even their titles."

... except ROME IS DEAD. The world does not pay it's taxes to ROME, and Italy occupies that ancient geography.

Perhaps we should consider Dan. Chapter 2, which CONFIRMS that Rome is passed, and we are in a FIFTH "divided" empire of CLAY (Ref. 2:45), as further amplified by Chapter 7 which delineates the THREE SUPERPOWERS and the UNITED NATIONS.


But what good are urban myths, unless some fall prey?
Bobby Jo
 
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Hobie

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... except ROME IS DEAD. The world does not pay it's taxes to ROME, and Italy occupies that ancient geography.

Perhaps we should consider Dan. Chapter 2, which CONFIRMS that Rome is passed, and we are in a FIFTH "divided" empire of CLAY (Ref. 2:45), as further amplified by Chapter 7 which delineates the THREE SUPERPOWERS and the UNITED NATIONS.


But what good are urban myths, unless some fall prey?
Bobby Jo
I would think that over as the money is flowing...
The Catholic Church Is Rich Enough to Settle Sex Abuse Cases Forever
 

Bobby Jo

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Hobie

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Lets go over what had to happen, and who the seventh king and kingdom is, it must satisfy the following requirements:

The timeline – It must appear on earth sometime after the sixth kingdom (Rome), and yet sometime before the eighth kingdom (the last before Christ coming).

Activity – Like all of the other kingdoms on this list, it must dominate and persecute God’s people (either Israel, or spiritual Israel which are those grafted in, Christians).

Type – It must be arguably describable as a religious kingdom as it says blasphemy or that it has the power and authority of God, promoting idolatry among other evil intents.

Significance – As with the other kingdoms, it should alter the course of history in a manner that fulfills Biblical prophecy, in terms of the people and nations of the world.

So if you look closely, there is only one power in all history that meets the description given here. In other words, God closes every other option, and forces us to the only possible conclusion: the Catholic Church alone fulfills all the points of identity established.

From the Roman Empire comes this entity and it is the same one that comes as the little horn in Daniel. The details of the visions of the little horn of Daniel 7 and the first beast of Revelation 13 reveal they are the same.

Daniel 7:21-22 King James Version (KJV)
21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;
22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.


Revelation 13:7 King James Version (KJV)
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

We see it also in Revelation 11:
Revelation 11:7 King James Version (KJV)
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

Notice also that the beast and the little horn rule for the same period of time:

Daniel 7:25 King James Version (KJV)
25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Revelation 13:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

The 1260 years of the Dark Ages, compare 'time, times, and dividing of time','forty and two months'.

The four beasts of Daniel have a total of 7 heads and also has 'ten horns'.

Daniel 7:4-7 King James Version (KJV)
4 The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it.
5 And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh.
6 After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it.
7 After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.

Which show up in Revelation:

Revelation 13:1 ...'And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.'

Revelation 17:3 ...'So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.'

It gets its power from the dragon who is Satan himself:

Revelation 12:3-9 King James Version (KJV)
3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.
6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Revelation 17 then describes and gives us a glimpse of what Babylon will be like, using prophetic language, it describes a woman who rejects God with her whole being:

"And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH" (Revelation 17:4-5).

The woman that rides the Beast has all the identifying features of who is this entity. In the Bible, as we saw, a woman represents a church:

"I have likened the daughter of Zion to a comely and delicate woman" (Jeremiah 6:2).

Isaiah the prophet extends the symbol of a woman to that of a bride. The pure bride represents the pure Church:

"For as a young man marrieth a virgin, so shall thy sons marry thee: and as the bridegroom rejoiceth over the bride, so shall thy God rejoice over thee" (Isaiah 62:5).

Hosea describes the union of God and His people:

"And I will betroth thee unto me for ever; yea, I will betroth thee unto me in righteousness, and in judgment, and in lovingkindness, and in mercies" (Hosea 2:19).

The same symbolism is employed in the New Testament:

"...for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ" (2 Corinthians 11:2)

"Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish" (Ephesians 5:25-27).

"Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready" (Revelation 19:7).

Paul writes the church at Corinth, "Oh, that you would bear with me in a little folly; and indeed you do bear with me. For I am jealous for you with godly jealousy. For I have betrothed you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ (2 Corinthians 11:1-2)." Clearly, the true church is here described as "betrothed" to Jesus Christ (in the position of an engaged woman to her fiancé who is Jesus Christ).

Now look at Acts 7:37-38

37 This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear.38 This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:

Then in Revelation 12:1-5, we read the account of the "woman"—this time ancient Israel, the "church in the wilderness" being used by God to bring forth the Messiah, "a male child who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron."

It then in verse 5 tells the story about "the woman"—now after Christ ascended we see the true church—fleeing into the wilderness to "a place prepared by God." This is for the time, and times, and half a time or 1260 years of the Dark Ages, and as you read through the verses after that, its even more evident that this "woman" is, in fact, the true church that is protected by God Himself from the wrath of Satan.

So when we come to the "woman" of Revelation 17, it should be very obvious that (letting the Bible interpret its own symbols) this woman is indeed a church. However, this church, "sitting on a scarlet beast" is full of fornication which affects the "inhabitants of the earth" and truly a spiritual "harlot."

There is the only one church on earth that fulfills these identifiers of the woman called Babylon in Revelation 17. The description of Babylon given in the book of Revelation clearly identifies Babylon as this antichrist power that persecuted the true believers and has let corruption in and has reached across the world. Because of this church's deviations from the Bible, the Protestants of the Reformation and after, referred to the Roman Catholic Church, as spiritual Babylon.
 

Davy

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Here is a good explanation I came across on how paganism crept into the early church...

"...How does one begin to explain the connection between the pagan sun worship and paganizing of the true worship of God and His only begotten Son?

To begin with, the sun god of the Persians was Mithras and subsequent empires including the Roman Empire through the 4th century. During the 4th century, Mithras "mysteriously" vanished and Roman "Christianity" began. A Christianity not like that of the 1st century with the apostles guarding against the inroads from false doctrines and traditions; but, a polluted, corrupt "Christianity" with pagan rituals and ceremonies.

A major influence was Mithras, it was invoked in the inscriptions of the Biblical Artaxerxes, king of Babylon: making Mithras one of the pagan gods that God had warned His chosen people to beware of. And yet, in the 4th century, by way of a Satanic "if you can’t beat em join em" deception, a blend of the worship of God and the worship of pagan gods was officially proclaimed as "Christianity" by the Roman Empire.

The graven images of the pagan deities, given "Christian" titles, appeared in direct violation of the 2nd commandment. And the Sunday observance of "Deis Solis", the day of the sun began to be brought in by pagan worshipers as they climbed into the bandwagon of the swelling Christian church which accommodated them but in turn voiding the 4th commandment.

The Persians had overthrown Babylon and picked up many of the gods and religious practices of the conquered people. The Medo-Persians added to the religious rites and ceremonies of the Babylonians and the cult of Mithraism with its seven levels of initiation formed a cornerstone of the system of sun worship. When the Persians were defeated by Alexander the Great, Mithraism began to spread throughout the Greek Empire.

The Medo-Persians conquered Babylon, but the Babylonian system of worship was not destroyed, merely refined. Similarly, when Greece conquered the Medo-Persian Empire, the names of the gods changed but the system of worship remained essentially the same, and the same deities were worshipped in Rome under a different garb.

It was one of the principle aims of Alexander to spread the Greek culture and philosophy throughout his realm. They picked up Mithraism, and the religion of Greece added many refinements, rites and ceremonies to the earthly systems of worship.

The Roman Empire conquered Greece and other lands were Mithraism had spread from Greek culture and had power to control world events. They would thus incorporate aspects and refinements of all the religious systems of history and especially Mithraism as it evolved through the years and became influential in the rise of paganism worship in Roman culture and eventually into the Christian church.

Many attributes of the Babylonian pagan worship and Persian worship found its way into the church at Rome, some were substitutes for the true worship as in the pagan religion. The ancient Chaldeans of Babylon worshipped a pantheon of male and female gods representing the sun god. There were largely three aspects to this system of sun worship, representing the father, mother, and the son. These were the god Bel (Baal) or Merodach, Ninus the son, who was also worshipped as Tammuz, and the female goddess Rhea who was also worshipped as Ishtar, Astarte, or Beltis representing the mother. She was also referred to as the ‘queen of heaven’, and the ‘wrath subduer’. Mother and child worship was the basis of the ancient religions.

As the power of pagan Rome declined, the power of papal Rome increased as the church accumulated more and more power and influence. When the emperor Constantine accepted the veneer of Christianity and Paganism and Christianity blended into one, Rome became the religious capital of the world. Abbot's Roman History, p.236 declares:

"..The transfer of the emperor's residence to Constantinople was a sad blow to the prestige of Rome, and at the time one might have predicted her speedy decline. But the development of the Church, and the growing authority of the Bishop of Rome, or the pope, gave her a new lease on life, and made her again the capital (this time the religious capital) of the world...."

From 538 A.D., when the emperor Justinian issued a decree, proclaiming the pope to be supreme in religious matters he assumed the garb of representative of Jesus Christ on earth. When Constantine moved his seat to Constantinople, the popes inherited the power of the Roman emperors - their prestige, the pagan religious beliefs, and even their titles."

I'm well aware of pagan associations within Rome and the Byzantine. But that's not the point. With the Jews at Christ's first coming, the religious sects had also taken over the seat of Moses, and not all those in the sects (like Pharisees, scribes, et al) were actually born of Israel. The Kenites, a people that came from the land of Canaan, were Israel's scribes in charge of God's written word at that time. Per Ezra 9, the children of Israel that returned from Babylon were discovered having taken wives of the Canaanites and had children by them.

So did that mean all... the Jews in that time mixed up their race? No. Like Paul said in Romans 11 that God had preserved a remnant of Israel that had not bowed the knee to Baal, He also no doubt preserved a remnant among the Jews that kept to His commandments and remained separate. Why can this same type of event not be seen among Roman Christians then? Just as five of the seven Churches in Asia had problems in them which Jesus rebuked, the Roman Church is no different. But Jesus did not condemn all in those Churches, i.e., those who were not guilty.