And you won't find God of the Bible at Kingdom Hall!
What if I don’t want eternal life?
- Thread starter Kabone
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amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
Thus the wrong hope is hoping in this life
but the hope that does so abound no matter what we face in this life , THE HOPE of forever being HOME with HIM one day ,
OH that is the hope that just keeps on a giving hope no matter what we must face and endure in this life .
NO wonder paul and silas COULD SING even in prison with ripped opened backs .
The abundant life , ITS NOT About the things of this world ,
Its about KNOWING CHRIST .
all the joy , peace , stability that many think they could have IF THEY HAD JUST MORE things in this life
WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO EVEN GIVE THEM
teh JOY peace , stablity a sheep can have EVEN WHEN IN THE DIREST of places .
JESUS IS OUR HOPE . Now to the trenches . Serving both and loving both GOD and mammon
IS A DELUSION . for one will indeed hold to the one and despise the other .
And boy do i have good news for the sheep
THE COMING OF KING JESUS draws nigh . Paradise awaits the sheep .
But do be prepared to lose all for loving HIM . because many will hate the sheep .
Rockerduck
Well-Known Member
There is no love like Jesus gives His chosen elect. I've felt it, there is no describing the love I did not deserve that He gave to me and that's what we will feel forever as the children of God. We belong to God. I can't wait to leave this world that keeps us in slavery and bondage to bills, taxes, laws, and pressures of life daily. The Apostle Paul said to live is Christ and to die is gain. So, in this life, I live for Jesus Christ every day.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Hello again TS…..
The death of my father at the young age of 52, motivated me to learn more about what happens to us when we die. Having been raised in the Anglican church, I was so worried about where he had gone and if he was OK? He was not a church goer himself, but made sure his children went to Sunday School and were confirmed in the church. After that my parents allowed us to make our own choices. So then I had good reason to dig deeper into the subject that most of us don’t know a lot about….and the whole church system is so focused on “going to heaven”, that they miss the purpose of us being created to live here on earth.
In my teens I stopped going to church because it was only a duty, not something I wanted to do…..I had never really learned anything of value from their education, and God was only a concept. I must admit though that I always knew he existed, but I didn’t really know Him….and I always wanted to. I was so sure that the “hell” my church preached was not of his doing, as it seemed totally opposed to his character.
In my early twenties, when my desire to know about what happens to us after death had been disappointed by so many unanswered questions, I was invited to study the Bible, rather than theology. I knew what the church taught, but I didn’t really agree with much of it, as I saw so much hypocrisy among its members. They picked up their “Christianity“ at the door of the church, and left it there on their way out.
I wanted to find God and because I had great respect for the Bible, a study of the scriptures was just what I needed to get to know my Creator….without fear and without simply carrying out a duty that seemed repetitive and meaningless.
When I was shown Eccl 9:5, 6, 10, a great weight was lifted from my shoulders.
“For the living know they will die; but the dead do not know anything, nor have they any longer a reward, for their memory is forgotten. Indeed their love, their hate and their zeal have already perished, and they will no longer have a share in all that is done under the sun. . . . Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might; for there is no activity or planning or knowledge or wisdom in Sheol where you are going.” (NASB)
“Sheol” there is translated as “the grave” in the Jewish Tanakh. “Sheol” is the Hebrew equivalent to the Greek “hades”, which in most Bibles is translated as “hell”. There is no such place….”hell” is “the grave”.
The dead know nothing….they cannot think, plan, or do anything. My Dad was “sleeping” just as Jesus said of Lazarus. (John 11:11-14) So they cannot suffer.
Did you notice in verse 6 that, at death, emotions too have “perished”….including “love”. That is God’s primary quality, so it confirms what the Jews were taught in their Scripture, and believed originally, about death. That it was the cessation of life….but not forever. A return to life was promised, that the Bible reveals as a “resurrection”.…a return to life, in the flesh, reunited with those we have lost. (John 5:28-29)
A “restoration of all things” foretold by the prophets. (Acts 3:21)
We do not have an immortal soul that continues to live after the death of the body…..that was an adopted belief originating from the pagan Greeks. It is not taught in Scripture.
So, contrary to all that I had been taught, the Scriptures opened up to me a whole new view of life and death, and our purpose here on this lovingly prepared planet. I learned that death was never supposed to happen, so unlike the animals, we have no ‘program’ to accept it….the death of loved ones leaves painful holes in our life that never get filled. The scars are there for as long as we live.
I wondered why, if death was inevitable, we can have such intense grief when it touches us. If it takes us to a better place, then why does it feel so wrong…and why do we fear it?
Ecclesiastes, written by Solomon, also speaks about the death of animals, and this too was an eye opener.
Eccl 3:18-20 says…
”I said to myself concerning the sons of men, “God has surely tested them in order for them to see that they are but beasts.” For the fate of the sons of men and the fate of beasts is the same. As one dies so dies the other; indeed, they all have the same breath and there is no advantage for man over beast, for all is vanity. All go to the same place. All came from the dust and all return to the dust.” (NASB)
We have no advantage over the animals in death…..we all breathe the same air, (spirit) and die the same death, but for us this seems to be so foreign. God made us in his image and likeness, so he never intended for us to die. The “tree of life” in the garden of Eden was the means to live an “everlasting life” in mortal flesh. (Gen 3:22-24)
God created us to live forever as it says in Eccl 3:11….”He has made everything appropriate in its time. He has also set eternity in their heart, yet so that man will not find out the work which God has done from the beginning even to the end.”
We have “eternity” programmed into our hearts….which is why death feels so wrong. We were to have forever to learn new things about God and his creation.
Reading Revelation will create more questions than it answers unfortunately. Why? Because the precepts created by the church fight with what the Bible teaches about life and death. It’s the reason why there are so many unanswered (or should I say, unanswerable) questions, whereas the Bible itself answers all questions without contradiction.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
I see so many things in this post that requires deeper understanding….
1) Why was there a need to choose an ‘elect’ few to go to heaven?
2) Why do we need to “leave this world” as if it wasn’t the place God created for humans to live forever?
3) Why is the world such an awful place to live if God created it? If we are in slavery here…to whom are we enslaved and why?
4) Why did Paul express a desire to go to heaven, when humans were created to live on earth?
What are Christians going to do in heaven?
Can you tell me?
Earburner
Well-Known Member
Actually, aside from what church-ianity teaches, the KJV Bible John 3:18 makes it very plain.
Those who choose to not believe are "condemned already".
Q. And what is that condemnation?
A. One shall never be resurrected and shall remain DEAD forever, being totally unconscious, as if they never lived.
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When Jesus said,
John 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation G2920 (condemnation).
You don't believe its the same thing mentioned here
Acts 24:15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.
You're really gonna be disappointed!
Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
Rockerduck
Well-Known Member
The Apostle Paul said in Romans 12:2 be not conformed to this world and as the NLT says it - Don’t copy the behavior and customs of this world but let God transform you into a new person by changing the way you think. Then you will learn to know God’s will for you, which is good and pleasing and perfect.
Romans 8:16 - The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,
In Genesis 3 God cursed the earth.
1. The elect are many, not a few. John 10:29 -My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.
2. God's wrath is coming
1 Thessalonians 5:9 -For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
3. Life isn't fair in this world. Just look at all the recent tragedies, mass shootings, floods, Attacks against gov't. etc. Paychecks are not keeping up.
4. Sheep and goats parable and 1 Corinthians 2:9 - But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love Him.
Revelation 20:12-15
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books.
13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. 14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.
Earburner
Well-Known Member
Death [dieing] no more and hades [the dead and the grave] no more.
Yes, verse 15 says it all. No belief in Jesus, then NO Eternal life whatsoever!!
No one has ever been physically born with an eternal living soul!!! That's another fallacy of church-ianity.
Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
And notice the dead "were in" death and hades and dead were delivered up out of death and hades "first"
Death and Hades delivered up the dead (( who)) were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. 14 (( Then )) Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 (( And anyone)) not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.
Then death and hades are cast into the lake of fire (along with anyone not found in the book of life)
Ever notice the dead come out of death first, then death itself is first cast into the lake and that is second death.
Which is then followed by verse 15 speaking of anyone else
Earburner
Well-Known Member
It's a man made "hope" "that... they allow", which is a fallacy.
If one does not have the Gift of the Holy Spirit [eternal life- 1John 5:11-13] within them, before their mortal death, it is impossible for God to resurrect them.
Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
You posted that in #72
Are you under the impression I missed this or disagree with it or am somehow not agreeing with the verses posted?
So you agree, they will be tormented day and night forever! Good. Hell fire is everlasting, as Jesus said.
Earburner
Well-Known Member
It's all to be understood figuratively. KJV John 3:18 and Romans 8:9 explain it thoroughly.
To be not part of Jesus' resurrection NOW (born again of the Spirit), is to have no resurrection at all after mortal death!!
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