Oh....I see! Makes sense now...Mama Mia, yes it was. I said after the first century, apostolic authority ended. Therefore, since Revelation was written within the 1st century (90 ad), it has apostolic authority.
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Oh....I see! Makes sense now...Mama Mia, yes it was. I said after the first century, apostolic authority ended. Therefore, since Revelation was written within the 1st century (90 ad), it has apostolic authority.
Hi DNB,Yes, you are correct, but they are one and the same. The 1st century Apostles spread the Word orally, but simultaneously, it was being written down. So yes, chronologically, one did not necessarily precede the other in its entirety, but both occurred during the same period, up until the end of the 1st century. One does not contradict the other. But, what proceeded after the death of the Apostles and the writing of the Book of Revelation (last letter written), I don't believe has apostolic authority. It becomes much too subjective, unregulated, and conflicting/chaotic at this point.
Hi DNB,Not to give infallibility to his adherents, nor to offer new doctrines and dogma. But, to support, enlighten and edify his elect, with understanding of the pre-established God-ordained, Christian dogma, that ended after the 1st century.
No, as the church of acts knew water baptism itself did not save!Hi DNB,
Wouldn't the 500 year teaching that one does not need to be baptized or baptism doesn't save anyone be considered a "new doctrine and dogma"?
Curious Mary
Ummmmm.......Do you interpret His words or do you rely on someone else?Nope, on Him!
No, as the church of acts knew water baptism itself did not save!
Not new doctrine Jude 1:3 thee faith revealed by Christ must still be taught disciples must still be baptizedNot to give infallibility to his adherents, nor to offer new doctrines and dogma. But, to support, enlighten and edify his elect, with understanding of the pre-established God-ordained, Christian dogma, that ended after the 1st century.
No where specifically, you are correct.Thank you DNB.
Soooo where does Scripture tell us to STOP holding fast to oral traditions and tell us to hold fast only to the words the Apostles wrote? I can't find it.
Yes, we've been given the official document, there is no justifiable grounds to alter, add, or subtract from it.Hi DNB,
I think I understand what you are saying. The 27 books recognized by The Church are the only historical Christian writings that we as Christians should rely on for our Christian traditions?
Respectfully, Mary
THere are many doctrines that have been established by many denominations, that are in question of their veracity. All I'm saying is that it is solely the Bible where we go to determine the truth. Despite disagreements, we don't allow extra-Biblical works, or man's tradition to discern Christian orthodoxy.Hi DNB,
Wouldn't the 500 year teaching that one does not need to be baptized or baptism doesn't save anyone be considered a "new doctrine and dogma"?
Curious Mary
There will always be controversy, that's not the point. No new revelations since John's Book of Revelation.Not new doctrine Jude 1:3 thee faith revealed by Christ must still be taught disciples must still be baptized
There will always be controversy, that's not the point. No new revelations since John's Book of Revelation.
According to what was already revealed. Papal Bulls are not stating this, they are declaring new doctrine and Dogma.I know but there are still apostles teaching the nations baptizing the disciples and governing the church
Surely Marymog, you don't believe that salvation is obtainable by just the act of being immersed in water [as per Gr. baptizo, see below]Seven words from Scripture destroy YOUR interpretation of Scripture......"even baptism doth also now save us" (KJV)!
Hi Stumpmaster,Surely Marymog, you don't believe that salvation is obtainable by just the act of being immersed in water [as per Gr. baptizo, see below]
Quote from Albert Barnes' Notes on the Bible with reference to 1 Peter 3:21
Not the putting away of the filth of the flesh - Not a mere external washing, however solemnly done. No outward ablution or purifying saves us, but that which pertains to the conscience. This important clause is thrown in to guard the statement from the abuse to which it would otherwise be liable, the supposition that baptism has of itself a purifying and saving power. To guard against this, the apostle expressly declares that he means much more than a mere outward application of water.
Strong's G907
βαπτίζω
baptizō
bap-tid'-zo
From a derivative of G911; to make whelmed (that is, fully wet); used only (in the New Testament) of ceremonial ablution, especially (technically) of the ordinance of Christian baptism: - baptist, baptize, wash.
Total KJV occurrences: 80
Hi DNB,No where specifically, you are correct.
But, like I said, there comes a point where the Gospel must be established, which it was before time began. Therefore, The Apostles knew it thoroughly, and we don't consider that Jesus or God held back anything from them. As Paul said, 'I was not taught it by man, but by Jesus Christ'.
Who else can make that same claim today, and justify the delay in new revelation?
Like I said - It becomes much too subjective, unregulated, and conflicting/chaotic at this point, if man claims to have received anything new from God, that is equivalent to dogma. For example, Mary's assumption into heaven, and Theotokos, came about during the 6th and 18th centuries, respectively. And papal infallibility centuries after Christ. What are we to make of these 'new' and procrastinated revelations? It the pope is the vicar of Christ, why did God wait so long to enlighten the Church?
Such additions to Christian dogma is nothing but spurious and unjustifiable.
The Holy Spirit instructs the saved, and also thru the teachings of pastors and teachers, and biible reference works!Ummmmm.......Do you interpret His words or do you rely on someone else?
its the person baptized into that saves us, as if one does not receive Jesus as lord thru faith, then the water just gets you all wet!Seven words from Scripture destroy YOUR interpretation of Scripture......"even baptism doth also now save us" (KJV)!
Jude 1:3 eph 4:5According to what was already revealed. Papal Bulls are not stating this, they are declaring new doctrine and Dogma.