What is Repentance?

[robert derrick]

This is in response to the pseudo-spiritual 'repentance' inwardly in mind and heart only, as opposed to and separate from repentance from the sinful deeds of the flesh.

It is used to sidestep the Scripture: Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out. (Acts 3)

They do so to continue in the false belief that salvation by grace is without accompanying condition of repentance of dead works, so as to separate salvation from the life lived, by separating a 'spiritual' repentance from the natural body.

1. There is no Scripture stating that repentance unto conversion is 'spiritual' and 'in mind' only.

But Scripture does say: Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham. (Luke 3)

I.e. repentance in sight of God is known to all by fruits of repentance done in the flesh, even as we know the tree by it's fruit. (Matthew 12:33)

Repentance apart and separated from that of dead works, is the same as faith apart and separated from that of good works: they are both vain and dead.

2. Inside only 'spiritual' repentance apart from the deeds of the flesh, is the same as being 'spiritually' apart from walking after the Spirit in the flesh. It speaks of a Christ that came 'spiritually', but not in the flesh. (2 John 1:7)

3. 'Spiritual' repentance and changing of the mind only, separate from the actual doing of it, is not repentance at all, but is confession of sin to God: confession is the changing of the mind about sin, and agreeing with God from the heart, that sin is indeed sinful.

This brings forgiveness of sin, but only by repentance from dead works, can we have justification with God, which is with the work of faith outwardly, perfecting the faith in bodily living:

Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? (James 2)

Neither repentance nor faith are complete without the accompanying works of repentance and faith, which are the things that immediately accompany with salvation of God (Heb 6:9), and are the first principles of the doctrine of Christ. (Heb 6:1)

4. There is no Scripture for 'spirit-only' repentance , because we cannot repent 'spiritually': we cannot repent of our spiritual nature, which is the work of change that only God can do by grace, from that of the sinful nature to become partakers of the divine nature, which only occurs while having escaped the corruption of the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4). Which is by repentance from corrupt works. (Psalms 14:1)

We cannot repent inwardly of being sinners. We can only believe God, have faith in the blood of Jesus, and repent of dead works from the heart, and at that moment God converts us from sinner to saint in His presence, with forgiveness of sins, and change of nature and soul.

God does the inward work, that we cannot do, and we do the outward work, that only we can do by grace: repent of dead works and have living faith toward God to walk with Him, and do His righteousness to be righteous, even as He is righteous.

Simple and obvious conclusion: Unrepented sin is not repented of, and repentance with sin, is not repentance at all.

There is no salvation nor justification of God by grace without the things that accompany His salvation: repentance from dead works, and doing every good work of faith.

Repentance inwardly only is not repentance, but rather is confession of conviction of sin without repentance thereof. It is a delusional eyesalve, whereby one cannot see their guilt of sins before God, while the sins of the flesh yet remain:

I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. (Rev 3)

True zeal for God is to repent of dead works of the flesh, not just of being seriously convicted by God that sin is sinful indeed: the 'idea' of inner repentance before and apart from outer repentance, only serves to 'repent' of being convicted by sin, not to repent from sins:

Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves. (Isaiah 28:15)

Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord GOD. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin. Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel? (Ezek 18)

We repent of our sinful deeds of the flesh and unrighteous transgressions against God, and with faith of Jesus, God will make us a new heart and new spirit, which we cannot do ourselves, by 'repenting' of our old man and nature inwardly only.

 

[marks]

We cannot repent inwardly of being sinners.

That is exactly what we repent from, and that's why this is important. This is becoming a new man, one who not only hates sin, but has the power to not do it.

Much love!

 

[robert derrick]

That is exactly what we repent from, and that's why this is important. This is becoming a new man, one who not only hates sin, but has the power to not do it.

Much love!

There is no inward repentance of being a sinner by nature. We do not change our nature to become a new man. God does that with confession of the faith of Jesus.

We confess with Him our helplessness born into sin by nature, knowing all we can do is repent from our outward dead works.

There is no Scripture saying that we repent inwardly of the inner man of sin. Unless, you can quote one.

The main point being that the unconditionally saved believers insist there is an inward repentance for conversion (Acts 3:19), that is separate from later outward repentance: I.e. the things accompanying with salvation of God do not include turning from dead works, but only 'spiritually' turning from our sin nature. Which work of grace we cannot do.

They do so to separate 'unconditional' salvation by grace from the first condition of God's salvation, which is repentance from dead works. If they were to ever agree that outward repentance is necessary for inward work of grace, then they would be compelled to acknowledge a conditional salvation that comes with forsaking sin outwardly.

They don't want any condition on their salvation, because they don't want any responsibility for their salvation.

 

[Robert Gwin]

This is in response to the pseudo-spiritual 'repentance' inwardly in mind and heart only, as opposed to and separate from repentance from the sinful deeds of the flesh.

It is used to sidestep the Scripture: Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out. (Acts 3)

They do so to continue in the false belief that salvation by grace is without accompanying condition of repentance of dead works, so as to separate salvation from the life lived, by separating a 'spiritual' repentance from the natural body.

1. There is no Scripture stating that repentance unto conversion is 'spiritual' and 'in mind' only.

But Scripture does say: Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham. (Luke 3)

I.e. repentance in sight of God is known to all by fruits of repentance done in the flesh, even as we know the tree by it's fruit. (Matthew 12:33)

Repentance apart and separated from that of dead works, is the same as faith apart and separated from that of good works: they are both vain and dead.

2. Inside only 'spiritual' repentance apart from the deeds of the flesh, is the same as being 'spiritually' apart from walking after the Spirit in the flesh. It speaks of a Christ that came 'spiritually', but not in the flesh. (2 John 1:7)

3. 'Spiritual' repentance and changing of the mind only, separate from the actual doing of it, is not repentance at all, but is confession of sin to God: confession is the changing of the mind about sin, and agreeing with God from the heart, that sin is indeed sinful.

This brings forgiveness of sin, but only by repentance from dead works, can we have justification with God, which is with the work of faith outwardly, perfecting the faith in bodily living:

Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? (James 2)

Neither repentance nor faith are complete without the accompanying works of repentance and faith, which are the things that immediately accompany with salvation of God (Heb 6:9), and are the first principles of the doctrine of Christ. (Heb 6:1)

4. There is no Scripture for 'spirit-only' repentance , because we cannot repent 'spiritually': we cannot repent of our spiritual nature, which is the work of change that only God can do by grace, from that of the sinful nature to become partakers of the divine nature, which only occurs while having escaped the corruption of the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4). Which is by repentance from corrupt works. (Psalms 14:1)

We cannot repent inwardly of being sinners. We can only believe God, have faith in the blood of Jesus, and repent of dead works from the heart, and at that moment God converts us from sinner to saint in His presence, with forgiveness of sins, and change of nature and soul.

God does the inward work, that we cannot do, and we do the outward work, that only we can do by grace: repent of dead works and have living faith toward God to walk with Him, and do His righteousness to be righteous, even as He is righteous.

Simple and obvious conclusion: Unrepented sin is not repented of, and repentance with sin, is not repentance at all.

There is no salvation nor justification of God by grace without the things that accompany His salvation: repentance from dead works, and doing every good work of faith.

Repentance inwardly only is not repentance, but rather is confession of conviction of sin without repentance thereof. It is a delusional eyesalve, whereby one cannot see their guilt of sins before God, while the sins of the flesh yet remain:

I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. (Rev 3)

True zeal for God is to repent of dead works of the flesh, not just of being seriously convicted by God that sin is sinful indeed: the 'idea' of inner repentance before and apart from outer repentance, only serves to 'repent' of being convicted by sin, not to repent from sins:

Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves. (Isaiah 28:15)

Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord GOD. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin. Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel? (Ezek 18)

We repent of our sinful deeds of the flesh and unrighteous transgressions against God, and with faith of Jesus, God will make us a new heart and new spirit, which we cannot do ourselves, by 'repenting' of our old man and nature inwardly only.

A sincere regret of committing a sin, and a confession for forgiveness, and a vow to not repeat it. That is the way I would define it Bob.

 

[marks]

The main point being that the unconditionally saved believers insist there is an inward repentance for conversion (Acts 3:19), that is separate from later outward repentance: I.e. the things accompanying with salvation of God do not include turning from dead works, but only 'spiritually' turning from our sin nature. Which work of grace we cannot do.

That does not address my beliefs, but makes a mockery of them. I'm pretty certain you don't really understand what I think.

Much love!

 

[marks]

They do so to separate 'unconditional' salvation by grace from

Care to ascribe any other evil motives, or just that one?

Seriously . . .

 

[robert derrick]

A sincere regret of committing a sin, and a confession for forgiveness, and a vow to not repeat it. That is the way I would define it Bob.

I see that as simple confession from the heart: agreeing with God of the sin.

I see repentance not as a mental or inward thing only, as confession is, but the necessary working response to confession.

As I said, the whole point here is to counter the notion that repentance, like confession, is spiritual and inward only necessary for salvation, and so make salvation is made separate from any accompanying works of repentance, and thus we have 'unconditionally secured' salvation.

The whole notion of a repentance of mind, apart from works of repentance, never entered into my mind, until the 'unconditionally secure' believers were confronted with the plain Scripture, that repentance is necessary with conversion and forgiveness of sins (Acts 3:19). And so, rather than acknowledge it as such, they came up with 'mind repentance' only, which really is the same as mental faith only, which is dead.

The only thing I have going for me in the doctrine of Christ and obedience to it by grace, is that I have learned not to let my own cherished beliefs get in the way of Scriptural truth. Otherwise, we enter into the devilish place of not letting Scripture get in the way of our cherished beliefs.

I know we disagree in certain matters, but I do also know that you are faithful when it comes to always bringing in Scripture as basis for your beliefs, which is a strong discipline to admire. Even if we don't always agree on the beliefs based on the Scriptures.

 

[marks]

which is repentance from dead works.

What do you call "dead works"? What does that mean to you? Is it only a collection of behaviors and thoughts?

Let's use for example something that may not be sin to you, and may be to me. We've been talking about drinking. I know that God does not want me to drink alcohol, and I don't. If I do, I believe it would be sin. Not because there something intrinsically wrong with drinking alcohol. But because I know it's not right for me. There is no Law here, only my agreement with God. And if I were only concerned with outward behaviors, I could even say, "Gee! Drinking alcohol isn't intrinsically sin, so I'll have a glass! Have I sinned? Yes, I have. I've gone against what I believe God intends for me. I've gone against my faith.

What is it in me that does this? Where does that come from?

What makes works "dead"? Can things which are not intrinsically sinful be "dead works"? What about the man who donated 1 million dollars towards the construction of a hospital for the poor. Has he sinned? The act is good on it's face.

But what if the man did it as a way to avoid what he knew God wanted him to do, which was to set up an orphanage in Haiti, where he would never see the results, and would never receive the acclaim? His act was rebellion and therefore sin. What does it mean then to repent from dead works? To repent of giving money to for a hospital? Or to repent from a rebellious heart?

What is it that needs to change, really? His actions? Yes. But what is behind his actions? It's his rebellion, the state of his heart. That's what needs repenting of. The thing that makes those works "dead works".

They are dead because they originate from the dead man of flesh.

We to repent of everything the flesh man does, not just some list of sins we have in our minds. Everything! All of it. But really, we're still talking surface. Because what happens when we declare everything he does wrong - the child of Adam - but hold onto him? The fleshy man?

This is the circumcision of the heart, cutting away the flesh.

I'm not just repudiating sins, I'm repudiating the source of those sins, the old man, the man of flesh. And every time those sins creep back in, I stand on the fact that I've repented from all of that, in the exchange for a new mind. If it's not from the mind of Christ, I disallow it in my life. If I have a problem keeping it out, I get help from my redeemer. I've already repented - received a new mind - and now I'm learning self-control.

Do you see more what I'm saying?

Much love!

 

[robert derrick]

What do you call "dead works"? What does that mean to you? Is it only a collection of behaviors and thoughts?

Let's use for example something that may not be sin to you, and may be to me. We've been talking about drinking. I know that God does not what me to drink alcohol, and I don't. If I do, I believe it would be sin. Not because there something intrinsically wrong with drinking alcohol. And if I were only concerned with outward behaviors, I could even say, "Gee! Drinking alcohol isn't intrinsically sin, so I'll have a glass! Have I sinned?

What makes works "dead"? Can thing which are not intrinsically sinful be "dead works"? What about the man who donated 1 million dollars towards the construction of a hospital for the poor. Has he sinned? The act is good on it's face.

But what if the man did it as a way to avoid what he knew God wanted him to do, which was to set up an orphanage in Haiti, where he would never see the results, and would never receive the acclaim? His act was rebellion and therefore sin.

What is it that needs to change, really? His actions? Yes. But what is behind his actions? It's his rebellion, the state of his heart. That's what needs repenting of. The thing that makes those works "dead works".

They are dead because they originate from the dead man of flesh.

We to repent of everything the flesh man does, not just some list of sins we have in our minds. Everything! All of it. But really, we're still talking surface. Because what happens when we declare everything he does wrong - the child of Adam - but hold onto him? The fleshy man?

This is the circumcision of the heart, cutting away the flesh.

I'm not just repudiating sins, I'm repudiating the source of those sins, the old man, the man of flesh. And every time those sins creep back in, I stand on the fact that I've repented from all of that, in the exchange for a new mind. If its not from the mind of Christ, I disallow it in my life. If I have a problem keeping it out, I get help from my redeemer.

Do yo see more what I'm saying?

Much love!

Do yo see more what I'm saying?

Yes, I think so. You seem to be arguing a 'full' or 'whole' repentance must include repenting of the source of the outer deeds of the body, which is the inner man of sin: the inner sinful nature that is at enmity with God. I.e. repent of being carnally minded, which produces walking after the flesh and not after the Spirit.

I.e. It is not enough to merely repent of outward works of the flesh (dead works), which is only reaching the surface or symptoms of the real problem: we must also repent of the source that produces them: inner repentance first, with outer repentance following?

At this point, we need Scripture to prove your point. So far, I don't see any such thing in Scripture that plainly says or shows that it is our part to repent of being a sinner, which at least appears to being able to change our inner sinful nature to that of the divine nature ourselves.

Repentance by definition is to change to an opposite, and so repenting of being a sinner or repenting of our sinful nature born with, means changing it to something opposite, which is exactly what we cannot do, and is exactly what only God can do by grace, because of the blood of Jesus.

I'm not just repudiating sins, I'm repudiating the source of those sins, the old man, the man of flesh.

And so, without Scripture proving it, I completely disagree with this 'ability' to change ourselves from inner sinner to inner saint to the satisfaction of God. It would be far more convincing, yet fruitless, to try and change our outward lives from sinner to saint through our own force of will, without grace and help of God.

The inner repentance you speak of is not repentance, as in changing anything, but is confession: agreement with God from the heart, that the inner old man, who's nature of sin must be changed, before we ever hope to please Him. And it is this very confession of the faith of Jesus that pleases God by grace to thus change us inwardly, as we go on to do the work of faith which is change our outward man, not by will alone, but through faith by grace: which is with help of God.

Confession is entirely inward. Repentance is entirely outward. Confession is agreeing with God of the need of His help by grace to forgive, change, and save us inwardly. Repentance is the work of faith with God's help of the need to change ourselves outwardly.

Conversion is the change that only God can do, and conversion requires repentance from dead works with faith and confession from the heart.

Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out. (Acts 3)

We repent of our dead works outwardly, and God converts us inwardly: inner repentance would be converting ourselves from sinful to righteous.

God converts our nature through confession of faith, we convert our lives through faith with help of God.

 

[marks]

And so, without Scripture proving it, I completely disagree with this 'ability' to change ourselves from inner sinner to inner saint to the satisfaction of God.

We don't change ourselves.

I'm just trying to explain that repentance is a lot more than just promising to not do something again.

Much love!

 

[TEXBOW]

All you have to do is be water baptized.

 

[marks]

Yes, I think so. You seem to be arguing a 'full' or 'whole' repentance must include repenting of the source of the outer deeds of the body, which is the inner man of sin: the inner sinful nature that is at enmity with God. I.e. repent of being carnally minded, which produces walking after the flesh and not after the Spirit.

I don't think you are understanding me.

I repented when I came to realize I was wrong. I was wrong in the way I acted, I was wrong in the way I thought, and as I came to learn, I was in fact the wrong kind of man. This is much more than looking at our behavior, and saying oh that lie was wrong, I won't lie anymore. New Testament repentance goes much deeper than that. Once I realized I needed what Jesus offered, believed, received, I was born from God, who gave me that new mind. Made me a new man.

Much love!

 

[Robert Gwin]

I see that as simple confession from the heart: agreeing with God of the sin.

I see repentance not as a mental or inward thing only, as confession is, but the necessary working response to confession.

As I said, the whole point here is to counter the notion that repentance, like confession, is spiritual and inward only necessary for salvation, and so make salvation is made separate from any accompanying works of repentance, and thus we have 'unconditionally secured' salvation.

The whole notion of a repentance of mind, apart from works of repentance, never entered into my mind, until the 'unconditionally secure' believers were confronted with the plain Scripture, that repentance is necessary with conversion and forgiveness of sins (Acts 3:19). And so, rather than acknowledge it as such, they came up with 'mind repentance' only, which really is the same as mental faith only, which is dead.

The only thing I have going for me in the doctrine of Christ and obedience to it by grace, is that I have learned not to let my own cherished beliefs get in the way of Scriptural truth. Otherwise, we enter into the devilish place of not letting Scripture get in the way of our cherished beliefs.

I know we disagree in certain matters, but I do also know that you are faithful when it comes to always bringing in Scripture as basis for your beliefs, which is a strong discipline to admire. Even if we don't always agree on the beliefs based on the Scriptures.

Thanks again Bob for you kind comments sir.