What Is Required For Salvation?

[aspen]

I always thought it was a saving relationship with Christ, but after I started getting further involved in Christian circles I learned many people add quite a bit more to the mix:

1. Rejection of evolution and a belief in a literal interpretation of the Creation story

2. The virgin birth

3. The Trinity

4. The Eucharist - literal presence of Jesus in the bread and wine (Catholic)

5. KJV only

6. A second Baptism of the Holy Spirit

7. A literal interpretation of the Bible

8. Faith alone

9. A correct view of Christian doctrine

10. An exalted view of Satan - he is attacking us from behind every corner

11. Sabbath is Saturday! No! it's Sunday!!

12. The Bible divides history into dispensations!

13. All Christians must support the secular state of Israel

14. All people are born into total depravity

15. God decides who is saved before we are even born

Those are just a few of the extras, right off the top of my head; it just seems so strange to me that Christ's simple message of loving and serving other people and loving God can get so complicated.

Peace

 

[Rach1370]

I always thought it was a saving relationship with Christ, but after I started getting further involved in Christian circles I learned many people add quite a bit more to the mix:

1. Rejection of evolution and a belief in a literal interpretation of the Creation story

2. The virgin birth

3. The Trinity

4. The Eucharist - literal presence of Jesus in the bread and wine (Catholic)

5. KJV only

6. A second Baptism of the Holy Spirit

7. A literal interpretation of the Bible

8. Faith alone

9. A correct view of Christian doctrine

10. An exalted view of Satan - he is attacking us from behind every corner

11. Sabbath is Saturday! No! it's Sunday!!

12. The Bible divides history into dispensations!

13. All Christians must support the secular state of Israel

14. All people are born into total depravity

15. God decides who is saved before we are even born

Those are just a few of the extras, right off the top of my head; it just seems so strange to me that Christ's simple message of loving and serving other people and loving God can get so complicated.

Peace

Hey! You're right...people do confuse it unnecessarily! But really it just comes down to this:
Do you believe in Jesus? Do you love him? Do you believe he died and came alive again to conqueror our sins? If you answer yes to these, then you are saved!

All the other issues you put down come under what we call primary and secondary issues (or maybe open hand and closed hand issues). The primary issues are things that Christians should agree on, they are salvation issues: The virgin birth, Jesus was fully man and fully God, that he died on the cross, was buried and then rose again 3 days later. These are the things that basically define Christianity...if any of them are not true then our faith is meaningless.
Secondary issues are things that Christians can disagree or debate over...they are not salvation issues. New earth, old earth? Pre-Trib or Post-Trib? Calvinist or Aminian? These things should not divide Christians, but we are free to have have different opinions on them!

Some of the other things you mentioned (human depravity, christian doctrine, predestination) those things are important to a Christians overall understand about our God and our Faith, but these are things we grow into, learn in our walk as Christians. Believing Jesus was who he said he was and loving him, asking him to forgive us, that brings salvation, but it is also just the beginning of our Christian walk!
Hope this helped!
Rach

 

[aspen]

Hey! You're right...people do confuse it unnecessarily! But really it just comes down to this:
Do you believe in Jesus? Do you love him? Do you believe he died and came alive again to conqueror our sins? If you answer yes to these, then you are saved!

All the other issues you put down come under what we call primary and secondary issues (or maybe open hand and closed hand issues). The primary issues are things that Christians should agree on, they are salvation issues: The virgin birth, Jesus was fully man and fully God, that he died on the cross, was buried and then rose again 3 days later. These are the things that basically define Christianity...if any of them are not true then our faith is meaningless.
Secondary issues are things that Christians can disagree or debate over...they are not salvation issues. New earth, old earth? Pre-Trib or Post-Trib? Calvinist or Aminian? These things should not divide Christians, but we are free to have have different opinions on them!

Some of the other things you mentioned (human depravity, christian doctrine, predestination) those things are important to a Christians overall understand about our God and our Faith, but these are things we grow into, learn in our walk as Christians. Believing Jesus was who he said he was and loving him, asking him to forgive us, that brings salvation, but it is also just the beginning of our Christian walk!
Hope this helped!
Rach

Thanks for your response, Rach

Here's my problem - most Christians would agree that these issues are not primary to our salvation, until someone disagrees with them. The fact is, disagreement with any one of those issues sets a person apart as a heretic in the Christian circles that believe them to be true. So, doctrine may not save, but does it damn us?

Peace

 

[Foreigner]

What Is Required For Salvation?

"Lord Jesus, I am a sinner. I know that you died for my sins on the cross.
I ask you to please forgive me and be my Savior and Lord. In Jesus name. Amen."

-- If you prayed that sincerely and do your best to live that, you have done what is required for Salvation.

 

[BritGuy]

I always thought it was a saving relationship with Christ, ...

It is... but even those words are a cliche, making your idea just as vacuous as many others . . . unless you say how you get into that relationship, uning clear instructions that result in salvation, not opinion.

 

[Rach1370]

Hey Aspen! I recognize your problem, but I think the thing you need to remember is this: people will always disagree with you. And even if it is not a salvation issue, if you don't think the same as them, well then, "you're damned!!!". As hard as it can be when people are in your face, remember that it's what God thinks that matters.
Having said that, I also think that what BritGuy said also has merit. To really know Jesus a Christian must have sound doctrine, or at least be working towards it. My point this: You could say "I love Jesus, but I don't believe in the Trinity". The bible so overwhelmingly points to the Trinity, that to deny it is to deny Jesus....you can't love what you deny. Do you see my point? Yes, Jesus bring salvation, but we need a sound doctrine and understanding of the bible so we know who Jesus is, what he offers, and how that effects us and our lives.
A great, and fairly easy to read book about this is "Doctrine: What Christians Should Believe", by Mark Driscoll & Gerry Breshears.

A part of the reason Christians attend church and read the bible and other books, is the learn these things and to grow. If salvation was as inclusively simple as "Jesus saves me", we wouldn't need these things. We need to understand what it means that "Jesus saves me", just as much as we need to believe it!

Anyway, I hope this helps...sometimes I struggle to clearly say what I mean!!!
Rach

 

[Miss Hepburn]

I wonder if this would be a fabulous time form me to type my most favorite verse that changed my life....Said as Orson Wells would and very slowly,
Off the top...
Let he who is rich not boast of his riches. And let he who is strong not boast of his strength.
And let he who is wise not boast (glory) of his wisdom...but
he
who does
boast
let
him boast of
t-h-i-s,

That
he know
and und-er-stand

me.

So saith the Lord.

 

[jiggyfly]

I wonder if this would be a fabulous time form me to type my most favorite verse that changed my life....Said as Orson Wells would and very slowly,
Off the top...
Let he who is rich not boast of his riches. And let he who is strong not boast of his strength.
And let he who is wise not boast (glory) of his wisdom...but
he
who does
boast
let
him boast of
t-h-i-s,

That
he know
and und-er-stand

me.

So saith the Lord.

Very good choice Miss Hepburn, Paul said, if anyone had reason to boast, he did but that after meeting Christ all the things he thought were worthy of boasting looked like manure (and probably smelled like it too) in comparison to knowing Christ.

 

[aspen]

Thank you everyone for your opinions. I love to hear as much as I can from other Christians.

Peace

 

[BritGuy]

Thank you everyone for your opinions. I love to hear as much as I can from other Christians.

Peace

You are in an unsafe, unsaved and un-blessed state until you hear God's opinion, and do it.

 

[jiggyfly]

You are in an unsafe, unsaved and un-blessed state until you hear God's opinion, and do it.

Do what? Can you elaborate?

 

[aspen]

'BritGuy said:

It is... but even those words are a cliche, making your idea just as vacuous as many others . . . unless you say how you get into that relationship, uning clear instructions that result in salvation, not opinion.

Yeah....you have a point.

To elaborate, Christ tells us to love God with all of our heart soul and mind; suggesting a relationship with God is needed for salvation. Since all relationships require the participation/reciprocation of at least two individuals; some form of communication; and mutual appreciation/affection/love; by definition all of the aspects listed need to be present in a relationship with God in the form prayer, worship, and loving/serving our neighbors.

Peace

 

[rcbako]

I believe that relationship with God is only the starting point. You are exactly right aspen that relationship in any kind require participation of both parties. Relationship with God should be more in action and not in words alone. James taught that faith should accompany works. The same principle applies to relationship with God.

 

[SaberTruth]

I see the problem as one of implication. That is, some secondary beliefs imply things that contradict one or more primary tenets. I've also observed that people have an uncanny ability to skip merrily through life believing very contradictory things. But when it comes to what I personally think is the most minimal statement of faith, I came up with this:

Three Laws Saved

 

[tomwebster]

I see the problem as one of implication. That is, some secondary beliefs imply things that contradict one or more primary tenets. I've also observed that people have an uncanny ability to skip merrily through life believing very contradictory things. But when it comes to what I personally think is the most minimal statement of faith, I came up with this:

Another "teacher" that isn't satisfied with God's plan and must create his own.

 

[SaberTruth]

Another "teacher" that isn't satisfied with God's plan and must create his own.

What??

Is this how you say 'hello' to people you don't know at all?

 

[tomwebster]

What??

Is this how you say 'hello' to people you don't know at all?

I've read your posts, you're not new.

 

[SaberTruth]

I've read your posts, you're not new.

I have not conversed with you before, far as I know.

At any rate, what I wrote was in line with the gospel stated clearly in scripture. I'm sorry that offends you.

 

[Surf Rider]

I wonder if this would be a fabulous time form me to type my most favorite verse that changed my life....Said as Orson Wells would and very slowly,
Off the top...
Let he who is rich not boast of his riches. And let he who is strong not boast of his strength.
And let he who is wise not boast (glory) of his wisdom...but
he
who does
boast
let
him boast of
t-h-i-s,

That
he know
and und-er-stand

me.

So saith the Lord.

It's always a fabulous time to state scritpures that God has used to change our life!

Blessings.

 

[Surf Rider]

As with anything, it can be debated until well after the cows come home.

I like the gist of the 3 laws saved thingy. Cool.

So can we reduce it the the very basics? How much can that be reduced? I find it hard to reduce to less than these three:

1)God. Thus, His eternal attributes are entailed simply by who He is: God. List them as you wish, which is quite profitable, but can readily become contentious yet again.
2)Man. Thus, his sinful state by who he is: man. List them as you wish, but yet again, this also can become quite contentious. Nevertheless, just as with God, the core is undeniable, and that's what it all must be based upon.
3)Christ. Thus, His salvation for man, to God. Debate Him as you wish. Be contentious to your heart's content. But the core is undeniable: no man come to God but by Him.

Thus, all three are encompased. And without any one of these three, there is no salvation.

Three laws saved.

All must be based upon these three. If any detracts in any way, shape, or form, either directly or implied, from any other the totality of the other, then indeed, it is faulty. The problem to this, of course, is that there is always a loophole: persoanl application/interpretation of the three. Just as in the movie.

So as long as man lives, because his heart is desperately wicked and deceitful above all things, anything that has ever been said will always be twisted and circumvented one way or another: it is a fact of life.

Acts 4:3-8 gives us the 3 laws saved. Add to it or subtract to it at personal risk. Christendom has added all sorts to it, as evidenced in their doctrinal statements. And just look at the sick fruit that it has borne! The apostles had it right: God, man, Christ -- and their implicit positions to each other. Anything else opens the door wide to error. Perhaps it would be prudent if we did as the apostles in their preaching: God, man, and Christ. And that, simply given, confronts a person: will they repent or not? This is why so much of Christendom doesn't even preach repentance any more! Sad state of affairs that we find ourselves in.

"In many words is folly."