What is the Lords Day?

[Hobie]

No. the Sabbath was NOT changed to Sunday.
Christians are NOT under the law that God gave to the Israelites through Moses.

I don't agree with that. The writings of the eary church defines the Lord's Day as Sunday.

The Lord's Day in Christianity is generally Sunday, the principal day of communal worship.

Lord's Day - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Well you have a problem as no place in scripture supports this idea of the first day or Sunday made into a holy day in anyway.
The Bible does not have anywhere that the Lord’s Day means Sunday, the first day of the week, or as some say, in honor of Christ’s resurrection. In fact this 'tradition' didn’t happen for 100 years, as Christians began abandoning the Sabbath to distance themselves from the Jews. But John was a Jew, and Jews rested on Sabbath, as did all Christians at this point. So when John wrote this, there was no change in any form of the Sabbath to the first day, this was from the apostate church and its 'tradition' and not from the Bible.

 

[Hobie]

Seventh day Adventists teach that near the end of time the “mark of the beast” of Revelation 14 will be placed upon those who worship on Sunday instead of Saturday. Go figure.

Mark of the Beast

Bible Truth Versus SDA Doctrine - Mark of the Beast

www.nonsda.org

Well lets go over the facts instead of just conjecture, The Catholic Church claims it has the authority to change the day of worship from Sabbath to Sunday and so dont need to follow scripture and they are clear about it, and many in the Christian world follow this 'authority'.....

The Sunday law was officially confirmed by the Roman Papacy. The Council of Laodicea in A.D. 364 decreed, “Christians shall not Judaize and be idle on Saturday but shall work on that day; but the Lord’s day they shall especially honour, and, as being Christians, shall, if possible, do no work on that day. If, however, they are found Judaizing, they shall be shut out from Christ” (Strand, op. cit., citing Charles J. Hefele, A History of the Councils of the Church, 2 [Edinburgh, 1876] 316).

Cardinal Gibbons, in Faith of Our Fathers, 92nd ed., p. 89, freely admits, “You may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we [the Catholic Church] never sanctify.”

Again, “The Catholic Church, … by virtue of her divine mission, changed the day from Saturday to Sunday” (The Catholic Mirror, official publication of James Cardinal Gibbons, Sept. 23, 1893).

“Protestants do not realize that by observing Sunday, they accept the authority of the spokesperson of the Church, the Pope” (Our Sunday Visitor, February 5, 1950).

“Of course the Catholic Church claims that the change [Saturday Sabbath to Sunday] was her act... And the act is a mark of her ecclesiastical authority in religious things” (H.F. Thomas, Chancellor of Cardinal Gibbons).

The Catholic Church claims that “the church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact” (Catholic Record of London, Ontario Sept 1, 1923).... Who Changed The Sabbath to Sunday? — The Church of God International

So think about it, when it comes to deciding to obey between God or the ideas of man, whose authority should we chose?

 

[St. SteVen]

Sunday is the day of the sun god, sol invictus, unconquerable sun(or something like that) instituted in the AD200's (guestimate) mandating everybody was to be relieved of work on sunday. Because of anti semitism, the laodicea bishopric changed worship from sabbath to sunday in the 300s AD (guestimate) as it was not judaized. Everybody was off that day anyways. FYI - What is the shortest day in the year Dec 22. Plus 3 days for resurrection? Yes rebirth of the sungod.

So... you seem to be claiming that worship on Sunday is a pagan religion. - LOL
Does the day of worship determine which god you worship?
Do those who worship on Saturday, honor Saturn?

 

[St. SteVen]

Seventh day Adventists teach that near the end of time the “mark of the beast” of Revelation 14 will be placed upon those who worship on Sunday instead of Saturday. Go figure.

As I understand it, they believe that Sunday worship IS the mark of the Beast.
Relating the mark on the forehead as the mind and the mark on a hand as what they do.

 

[St. SteVen]

Well you have a problem as no place in scripture supports this idea of the first day or Sunday made into a holy day in anyway.
The Bible does not have anywhere that the Lord’s Day means Sunday, the first day of the week, or as some say, in honor of Christ’s resurrection. In fact this 'tradition' didn’t happen for 100 years, as Christians began abandoning the Sabbath to distance themselves from the Jews. But John was a Jew, and Jews rested on Sabbath, as did all Christians at this point. So when John wrote this, there was no change in any form of the Sabbath to the first day, this was from the apostate church and its 'tradition' and not from the Bible.

We both have a problem.
The term "the Lord's Day" only appears in Rev. 1:10, and nowhere else in the Bible. Agreed.
However, the writings of the early church define "the Lord's Day" as Sunday.

Here's your problem.
You need to define "the Lord's Day" to mean something besides Sunday, as defined by the early church.

Revelation 1:10-12 NET
I was in the Spirit[a] on the Lord’s Day[b] when[c]
I heard behind me a loud voice like a trumpet,
11 saying: “Write in a book what you see and send it to the seven churches—
to Ephesus, Smyrna,[d] Pergamum, Thyatira, Sardis, Philadelphia, and Laodicea.”
12 I[e] turned to see whose voice was speaking to me,[f]
and when I did so,[g] I saw seven golden lampstands,

Footnotes​

1. Revelation 1:10 tn Or “in the spirit.” “Spirit” could refer either to the Holy Spirit or the human spirit, but in either case John was in “a state of spiritual exaltation best described as a trance” (R. H. Mounce, Revelation [NICNT], 75).
2. Revelation 1:10 tn Concerning the phrase κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ (kuriakē hēmera) BDAG 576 s.v. κυριακός states: “pert. to belonging to the Lord, the Lord’s…κ. ἡμέρᾳ the Lord’s day (Kephal. I 192, 1; 193, 31…) i.e. certainly Sunday (so in Mod. Gk….) Rv 1:10 (WStott, NTS 12, ’65, 70-75).”
3. Revelation 1:10 tn The conjunction καί (kai) is not introducing a coordinate thought, but one that is logically subordinate to the main verb ἐγενόμην (egenomēn).
4. Revelation 1:11 tn Grk “and to Smyrna.” For stylistic reasons the conjunction καί (kai) and the preposition εἰς (eis) have not been translated before the remaining elements of the list. In lists with more than two elements contemporary English generally does not repeat the conjunction except between the next to last and last elements.
5. Revelation 1:12 tn Throughout the translation John’s use of καί (kai) often reflects the varied usage of the Hebrew conjunction ו (vav). A clause which καί introduces has been translated in terms of its semantic relationship to the clause that preceded it. If the καί seemed redundant, however, it was left untranslated; that is the case in this verse.
6. Revelation 1:12 tn Grk “with me.” The translation “with me” implies that John was engaged in a dialogue with the one speaking to him (e.g., Jesus or an angel) when in reality it was a one-sided conversation, with John doing all the listening. For this reason, μετ᾿ ἐμοῦ (met’ emou, “with me”) was translated as “to me.”
7. Revelation 1:12 tn Grk “and turning I saw.” The repetition of ἐπιστρέφω (epistrephō) is somewhat redundant in contemporary English and has been translated generally.

 

[Hobie]

We both have a problem.
The term "the Lord's Day" only appears in Rev. 1:10, and nowhere else in the Bible. Agreed.
However, the writings of the early church define "the Lord's Day" as Sunday.

Here's your problem.
You need to define "the Lord's Day" to mean something besides Sunday, as defined by the early church.

Revelation 1:10-12 NET
I was in the Spirit[a] on the Lord’s Day[b] when[c]
I heard behind me a loud voice like a trumpet,
11 saying: “Write in a book what you see and send it to the seven churches—
to Ephesus, Smyrna,[d] Pergamum, Thyatira, Sardis, Philadelphia, and Laodicea.”
12 I[e] turned to see whose voice was speaking to me,[f]
and when I did so,[g] I saw seven golden lampstands,

Footnotes​

1. Revelation 1:10 tn Or “in the spirit.” “Spirit” could refer either to the Holy Spirit or the human spirit, but in either case John was in “a state of spiritual exaltation best described as a trance” (R. H. Mounce, Revelation [NICNT], 75).
2. Revelation 1:10 tn Concerning the phrase κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ (kuriakē hēmera) BDAG 576 s.v. κυριακός states: “pert. to belonging to the Lord, the Lord’s…κ. ἡμέρᾳ the Lord’s day (Kephal. I 192, 1; 193, 31…) i.e. certainly Sunday (so in Mod. Gk….) Rv 1:10 (WStott, NTS 12, ’65, 70-75).”
3. Revelation 1:10 tn The conjunction καί (kai) is not introducing a coordinate thought, but one that is logically subordinate to the main verb ἐγενόμην (egenomēn).
4. Revelation 1:11 tn Grk “and to Smyrna.” For stylistic reasons the conjunction καί (kai) and the preposition εἰς (eis) have not been translated before the remaining elements of the list. In lists with more than two elements contemporary English generally does not repeat the conjunction except between the next to last and last elements.
5. Revelation 1:12 tn Throughout the translation John’s use of καί (kai) often reflects the varied usage of the Hebrew conjunction ו (vav). A clause which καί introduces has been translated in terms of its semantic relationship to the clause that preceded it. If the καί seemed redundant, however, it was left untranslated; that is the case in this verse.
6. Revelation 1:12 tn Grk “with me.” The translation “with me” implies that John was engaged in a dialogue with the one speaking to him (e.g., Jesus or an angel) when in reality it was a one-sided conversation, with John doing all the listening. For this reason, μετ᾿ ἐμοῦ (met’ emou, “with me”) was translated as “to me.”
7. Revelation 1:12 tn Grk “and turning I saw.” The repetition of ἐπιστρέφω (epistrephō) is somewhat redundant in contemporary English and has been translated generally.

Well it was the Roman Catholic Church not the early church, and if you look you can see what they say....

"Question:​

Until recently, I always thought Catholics worshiped on the Sabbath, and that the early Church moved the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday. Is this true?

Answer:​

This is a common misunderstanding. Catholics do not worship on the Sabbath, which according to Jewish law is the last day of the week (Saturday), when God rested from all the work he had done in creation (Gen. 2:2-3). Catholics worship on the Lord’s Day, the first day of the week (Sunday, the eighth day); the day when God said “Let there be light” (Gen. 1:3); the day when Christ rose from the dead; the day when the Holy Spirit came upon the Apostles (Day of Pentecost). The Catechism of the Catholic Church says: “The Church celebrates the day of Christ’s Resurrection on the ‘eighth day,’ Sunday, which is rightly called the Lord’s Day” (CCC 2191).
The early Church did not move the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday. Instead “The Sabbath, which represented the completion of the first creation, has been replaced by Sunday, which recalls the new creation inaugurated by the Resurrection of Christ” (CCC 2190). Sunday is the day Catholics are bound to keep, not Saturday."

https://www.catholic.com/qa/did-the-early-church-move-the-sabbath-from-saturday-to-sunday

"Q. Why do some religions say that the Sabbath day is Saturday while others — including Catholics — say it’s on Sunday? (Eldon, Missouri)

A. No, Catholics do not say that the Sabbath is on Sunday. The Sabbath is on Saturday, as it was in the Old Testament when God rested from all the work he had done in creation (Gn 2:2-3) and as it is observed by Jews today.

Christians, though, celebrate Sunday instead, because that is the day on which Jesus rose from the dead and the day on which the Holy Spirit came upon the apostles.

As the Catechism of the Catholic Church explains: “Sunday is expressly distinguished from the Sabbath which it follows chronologically every week; for Christians its ceremonial observance replaces that of the Sabbath. In Christ’s Passover, Sunday fulfills the spiritual truth of the Jewish Sabbath and announces man’s eternal rest in God” (No. 2175).".... The Sabbath: Saturday or Sunday?/ Catholic view of 'the rapture' - Catholic Review

"And claiming authority over it

It is true that the Catholic Church through the authority of Christ replaced the Hebrew Sabbath (Saturday) with the Lord's Day (Sunday); however, this occurred very early - well before the time of Emperor Constantine in the fourth century. For Christians two important events happened on Sunday. First, the Resurrection of Christ occurred on Easter Sunday (John 20:1ff). Secondly, the Holy Spirit descended upon the Church on Pentecost Sunday (Acts 2:1ff). Also after His Resurrection, Jesus appeared to the Apostles twice, each on Sunday (John 20:19 & 26). As a result, Sunday became known as the Lord's Day for Christians." .... The Sabbath or the Lord's Day

"Why does the Catholic Church claim to have changed the Sabbath commandment from Saturday to Sunday?
In the Convert's Catechism of Catholic Doctrine, we read:

Question: Which is the Sabbath day?
Answer: Saturday is the Sabbath day.

Question: Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?
Answer: We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church, in the Council of Laodicea, (336 A.D.) transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday.

Question: Why did the Catholic Church substitute Sunday for Saturday?
Answer: The Church substituted Sunday for Saturday, because Christ rose from the dead on [Easter] Sunday, and the Holy Ghost descended upon the Apostles on a [Pentecost] Sunday.

Question: By what authority did the Church substitute Sunday for Saturday?
Answer: The Church substituted Sunday for Saturday by the plenitude of that divine power which Jesus Christ bestowed upon Her!"... Why does the Catholic Church claim to have changed the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday?

You can check all the Catholic sites, and its much the same, so need to honestly address what Catholics themselves claim and believe rather than put things in the Bible that are not there, or try to refute history which is quite clear...

 

[St. SteVen]

Well it was the Roman Catholic Church not the early church, and if you look you can see what they say....

I'm familiar with that interview and the claims made by that individual.
Seems to actually prove my point.

Does the evidence you brought say that "the Lord's Day" is something other than Sunday?

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Many people claim that this proves the Sabbath was changed using this verse..
Revelation 1:10
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,

What is the Lord's day? Lets look in the Bible:

The "Lord's day" according to scripture, is the 7th day, the sabbath day of the Lord.

Genesis 2:1-3,4 - 'the seventh day', 'God', 'day', 'the LORD God' [… God [the LORD] … day …]

Exodus 16:23 - "the LORD", "to morrow [the seventh day] is the rest of the holy sabbath unto the LORD' [... the LORD ... [day] ...]

Exodus 16:25 - 'to day [the seventh day]; for to day is a sabbath unto the LORD: to day' [... the LORD ... day]

Exodus 20:8-11 - 'the sabbath day', 'the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God', 'sabbath day' [... the LORD ... day ...]

Exodus 31:15 - 'the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD ... the sabbath day' [... the LORD ... day]

Exodus 35:2,3 - 'the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD', 'the sabbath day' [… the LORD … day …]

Leviticus 23:3 - 'the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD'

Deuteronomy 5:12,14 – 'the LORD', 'the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God' [… the LORD … day …]

Psalms 92:1 - 'A Psalm or Song for the sabbath day. It is a good thing to give thanks unto the LORD'

Isaiah 56:6 - 'Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath [day] from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant' (context new covenant) [... the LORD ... sabbath [day] ...]

Isaiah 58:13 - 'the sabbath ... my [the LORD's] holy day ... the holy [day] of the Lord' [... [the LORD's] ... day]

Isaiah 66:22,23 – 'the LORD', 'one sabbath [day] to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD' [… the LORD … [day] …]

Jeremiah 17:21 - 'saith the LORD... on the sabbath day' [... the LORD ... day]

Matthew 12:8 - 'the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day' [... the ... Lord ... day]

Mark 2:28 - 'the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day' [... the ... Lord ... day]

Luke 6:5 - 'the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath [day]' [... the ... Lord ... [day]]

Revelation 1:10 - 'the Lord's day'

There is no such thing as 'Sunday sacredness' in all of Scripture, except as a Mark of the Beast (Daniel 7:25).

The Sabbath is the 'Lords Day', not Sunday or the first day.

There is only one Sabbath, Saturday. If you regard that as special, by all means, set it aside. I regard everyday as special and thank God that I woke up.
But there is a special day, that most Christians identify as the most important event in history, the day of Christ's resurrection.


Now on the first day of the week Mary Magdalene came to the tomb early, while it was still dark, and saw that the stone had been taken away from the tomb. John 20:1

But the angel answered and said to the women, “Do not be afraid, for I know that you seek Jesus who was crucified. 6 He is not here; for He is risen, ... Matt. 28:5
>Can you imagine any Sabbath day more important than that day?

On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul talked with them, intending to depart on the next day, and he prolonged his speech until midnight. Acts 20:7

One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God. Rom. 14:5-6

Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. Col. 2:16

Besides that, there are over 200 Sabbath laws that the Jews were to keep. They could not do work of any kind. Meals had to be prepared before sundown on Friday. They could only walk so far, couldn't bend down to pick something up ...This was really more of a burden. They failed to keep the law in every way. Oh occasionally for short periods of time they might have had a perfect day here and there.
Christ fulfilled the law (613 laws) for us and particularly did not emphasize trying to keep the Sabbath. On the contrary, he worked and so did the Disciples on the Sabbath. He criticized the Pharisees for their condemnation of the disciples picking some heads of wheat for food!

You cannot keep those Sabbath laws anyways, so what are you pretending to do, be holy on the Sabbath?
That is regarded by some as legalism. Be careful! If you live by the Law you will be judged by the Law!
>> You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace. Gal. 5:4

 

[St. SteVen]

Now on the first day of the week Mary Magdalene came to the tomb early, while it was still dark, and saw that the stone had been taken away from the tomb. John 20:1

On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul talked with them, intending to depart on the next day, and he prolonged his speech until midnight. Acts 20:7

Good post, thanks.
This reminds me of all the significant things that happened on the first day of the week.

1) The resurrection
2) Jesus' appearance to the disciples after his resurrection
3) Jesus appears again a week later
4) The outpouring at Pentecost
5) The revelation of John came on the Lord's Day
6) The Acts 20 gathering
7) There must be one more that I am missing (to make 7) - LOL
Perhaps the 1 Corinthians 16:2 reference below?

1 Corinthians 16:2 NET
On the first day of the week, each of you should set aside some income[a]
and save[b] it to the extent that God has blessed you,[c] so that a
collection will not have to be made[d] when I come.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Well you have a problem as no place in scripture supports this idea of the first day or Sunday made into a holy day in anyway.
The Bible does not have anywhere that the Lord’s Day means Sunday, the first day of the week, or as some say, in honor of Christ’s resurrection. In fact this 'tradition' didn’t happen for 100 years, as Christians began abandoning the Sabbath to distance themselves from the Jews. But John was a Jew, and Jews rested on Sabbath, as did all Christians at this point. So when John wrote this, there was no change in any form of the Sabbath to the first day, this was from the apostate church and its 'tradition' and not from the Bible.

Actually, you have the bigger problem. Nobody needs to prove that Sunday was the "Lord's Day" biblically. When John wrote in Revelation about the "Lord's Day" he didn't have to be referring to Sunday. Nobody needs biblical proof that "Saturday got changed to Sunday" because it's not nor has ever been a matter of biblical law! I've told you that repeatedly, as others have, and you simply ignore the point.

The point is, if the change from emphasis on Saturday to emphasis on Sunday was the product of *Christian tradition* then *it does not need biblical justification!* It is simply the product of Christian tradition, which I've told you was displayed by Paul again and again.

Paul applied both reason and liberty in the practices of Christians in the pagan Roman environment. It was a matter of discretion, and not law. And Christians from that time forward have the same liberty to choose days to meet on, worship on, or avoid.

But you want to stir trouble up over something that *does not require biblical justification,* though Paul does justify the reasonable application of non-legal traditions and relevant practices. You just want to cause trouble and ignore these facts. You have not answered any of these relevant points, proving this.

 

[Hobie]

I'm familiar with that interview and the claims made by that individual.
Seems to actually prove my point.

Does the evidence you brought say that "the Lord's Day" is something other than Sunday?

If you look through Revelation at what John put down, its clear he is referring to the Lord who made the Sabbath at Creation.

Revelation 10:6
And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:

Revelation 14:7
Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

What specific commandment, was John citing? The 4th Commandment, specifically, Exodus 20:11,

Exodus 20:11
For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

 

[Hobie]

There is only one Sabbath, Saturday. If you regard that as special, by all means, set it aside. I regard everyday as special and thank God that I woke up.
But there is a special day, that most Christians identify as the most important event in history, the day of Christ's resurrection.


Now on the first day of the week Mary Magdalene came to the tomb early, while it was still dark, and saw that the stone had been taken away from the tomb. John 20:1

But the angel answered and said to the women, “Do not be afraid, for I know that you seek Jesus who was crucified. 6 He is not here; for He is risen, ... Matt. 28:5
>Can you imagine any Sabbath day more important than that day?

On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul talked with them, intending to depart on the next day, and he prolonged his speech until midnight. Acts 20:7

One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God. Rom. 14:5-6

Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. Col. 2:16

Besides that, there are over 200 Sabbath laws that the Jews were to keep. They could not do work of any kind. Meals had to be prepared before sundown on Friday. They could only walk so far, couldn't bend down to pick something up ...This was really more of a burden. They failed to keep the law in every way. Oh occasionally for short periods of time they might have had a perfect day here and there.
Christ fulfilled the law (613 laws) for us and particularly did not emphasize trying to keep the Sabbath. On the contrary, he worked and so did the Disciples on the Sabbath. He criticized the Pharisees for their condemnation of the disciples picking some heads of wheat for food!

You cannot keep those Sabbath laws anyways, so what are you pretending to do, be holy on the Sabbath?
That is regarded by some as legalism. Be careful! If you live by the Law you will be judged by the Law!
>> You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace. Gal. 5:4

I think if such a change had been made, much would have been written in scripture, and yet not one word. It is clear that Jesus never stated that after His death, the Sabbath would be changed and celebrated on Sunday. And scripture is clear, the Sabbath was kept after Christ's resurrection. Jesus Himself foretold that Jerusalem would be destroyed by enemy armies and warned His followers of the time of the invasion saying, "But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:" Matthew 24:20.

Before the invading Roman legions destroyed Jerusalem in A.D. 70, the Christians safely fled from the city and were spared from death. Their departure was in the autumn and not on the holy Sabbath day. Jesus forewarned His followers of this destructive event and it showed in His words that it was meant to keep the Sabbath after His resurrection.

Nothing in the Bible texts in the New Testament even hint at a change of worship from Saturday to Sunday after Christ's resurrection and ascension. Instead we find the Apostle Paul and the Gentiles kept the Sabbath Day after Jesus' death

Paul preaches on the Sabbath day in Antioch: "And when the Jews were gone out the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath… And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God." Acts 13:42-44

Paul preaches on the Sabbath day near Philippi: "And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto the women which resorted thither. And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul." Acts 16:13,14.

Paul preach on the Sabbath day in Thessalonica: "And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures," Acts 17:2

Paul preaches on the Sabbath day in Corinth; "And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks," Acts18:4

Paul was very active in teaching the Gentiles to worship on the seventh day, the Sabbath and the Resurrection. He never advocated a change of the Sabbath and he was there long after the resurrection.

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

We all know that in the OT the Sabbath Day was set aside as a respected day of the week. And so, weekly cycles became important in Jewish culture. We do not need a boatload of verses to prove this. It is an established and well-known part of Jewish Law.

However, the Christian Week evolved from this by tradition, and not by law, because for Christians, the Law of Moses had passed. And since Jesus was taken down from the cross before the Sabbath Day, and rose on the 3rd day, Christianity recognized Sunday as the day on which Christ arose.

It is from this that the Weekly cycle became known, by Christians, with the recognition that Sunday is the "Lord's Day." The weekly cycle was perpetuated by tradition, and not by law, with a special recognition of Sunday as the "Lord's Day." It didn't "replace" the Sabbath Law--it merely succeeded Sabbath observance under the Law with Sunday observances by tradition.

This can hardly be disputed since all through the centuries Sunday has been recognized as special, with respect to tradition and not law. Any argument about observing a special day *by law* was dismissed by Paul as "argumentation" over nothing, except that he allowed for traditional observances for people of faith.

That men of faith may observe days by tradition....

Rom 14.6 Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord.

That men of faith may *not* observe days by law...

Gal 4.9 .Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again? 10 You are observing special days and months and seasons and years! 11 I fear for you, that somehow I have wasted my efforts on you.

Good morning @Randy Kluth and @Hobie

Randy.... you say... "
"We all know that in the OT the Sabbath Day was set aside as a respected day of the week. And so, weekly cycles became important in Jewish culture. We do not need a boatload of verses to prove this. It is an established and well-known part of Jewish Law."

But you neglect to post the reason this was done....

Gen 2:1-3
1 Thus the heavens and the earth were completed, and all their hosts.

2 By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done.

3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

AND

The ten commandments #4...
Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a sabbath of the Lord your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter, your male or your female servant or your cattle or your sojourner who stays with you.

For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day and made it holy.

But most fail to acknowledge that the Fri 6PM to Sat 6PM Sabbath came about at the end of God's creation of all things... and was reaffirmed, in stone, when Moses was on Mt. Sinai... and are recorded not just in Exodus 20 but also Deuteronomy 5

Where the 4th commandment there reads

12 ‘Observe the sabbath day to keep it holy, as the Lord your God commanded you.
13 Six days you shall labor and do all your work,
14 but the seventh day is a sabbath of the Lord your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter or your male servant or your female servant or your ox or your donkey or any of your cattle or your sojourner who [k]stays with you, so that your male servant and your female servant may rest as well as you.
15 You shall remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and the Lord your God brought you out of there by a mighty hand and by an outstretched arm; therefore the Lord your God commanded you to observe the sabbath day.

With the addition over the Exodus account of

"You shall remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and the Lord your God brought you out of there by a mighty hand and by an outstretched arm; therefore the Lord your God commanded you to observe the sabbath day."

People fail to remember that the original 10 were given to God's chosen... at a time when we... those grafted in... were not known about.

Jesus came and said.... he did not come to replace the law, but to fulfill the law. (Matthew 5:17)

Jesus also said in Matthew 15:24 ... But He answered and said, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

HE DID NOT COME FOR you, me, or the POPE... (Sorry Frankie) It was not until that we were grafted into the tree and the potential of born again/salvation was extended to us.

Romans 11: 11... I say then, they did not stumble so as to fall, did they? May it never be! But by their transgression salvation has come to the Gentiles, to make them jealous

12 Now if their transgression is riches for the world and their failure is riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their fulfillment be!
13 But I am speaking to you who are Gentiles. Inasmuch then as I am an apostle of Gentiles, I magnify my ministry,
14 if somehow I might move to jealousy my fellow countrymen and save some of them.
15 For if their rejection is the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead? 16 If the first piece of dough is holy, the lump is also; and if the root is holy, the branches are too.

That is precisely why I feel that when Jesus was crucified and was found out of the tomb on a Sunday morning, after AFTER the end of a Sabbath... that it is not only appropriate but imperative for us to embrace the "Son of God" which we know as God the Son....

17 But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree,
18 do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you.
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.”
20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear;
21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.
22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off.
23 And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.
24 For if you were cut off from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these who are the natural branches be grafted into their own olive tree?

He, Christ Jesus, is the one who made it possible for US to have an eternity in heaven....

He is the one who said in John 14: 13-14
13 “Whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son.

14 “If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it.

Just like God's original chosen were commanded to remember the Sabbath and keep it holy... And that is from Friday night to Saturday night (approx 6PM each) .... not Saturday as some would claim. {It was they who were commanded that.... and we as being grafted in will not be considered equal to them)

It is of equal importance... IF NOT MORE SO ... that we who were grafted into the tree with God's chosen
worship Christ Jesus on the day we found his tomb to be empty, and prophecy was fulfilled, to worship Him who has made our salvation possible.... on the day that began the surity of our slavation.

As we are told in ​

1 Peter 1:3-4

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy chas caused us to be born again to da living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,​

4 to obtain an inheritance which is imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in heaven for you,

It is by the resurrection of Christ Jesus that we have hope.
According to His great mercy, He has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you…

Being forgiven of sin and justified before God gives Christians tremendous hope. Christians are changed from being an enemy of God bound for hell, to a forgiven child of God with an eternal inheritance in heaven that can never be taken away. What can be better news than that?

​

We owe HIM our devotion and certainly a day unto itself for praise.​

If you, or any feel so strongly about the Sabbath of Genesis and Exodus... by all means continue... but you should also consider extending you worship by one day in honor of what was done for you that came to an end on a Sunday over 2000 years ago.

 

[Randy Kluth]

If you look through Revelation at what John put down, its clear he is referring to the Lord who made the Sabbath at Creation.

Revelation 10:6
And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:

Revelation 14:7
Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.​

What specific commandment, was John citing? The 4th Commandment, specifically, Exodus 20:11,

Exodus 20:11
For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

In other words, you have no evidence at all? The "commandments of God" in the NT are the commandments of Jesus--not the commandments of the Law of Moses. To imply otherwise is false doctrine.

John 13.34 “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another."

 

[Randy Kluth]

Good morning @Randy Kluth and @Hobie

Randy.... you say... "
"We all know that in the OT the Sabbath Day was set aside as a respected day of the week. And so, weekly cycles became important in Jewish culture. We do not need a boatload of verses to prove this. It is an established and well-known part of Jewish Law."

But you neglect to post the reason this was done....

I did not neglect it--it was irrelevant to state *why* God initiated the Law of Moses. NT Theology explains why the Law came into being and why it was surpassed by the New Covenant of Christ. The Law could not give Eternal Life--it simply confirmed the curse that had been given in Eden--the soul that sins shall die. Any sin will condemn to an eternity without God.

And so, only through Christ can we obtain Eternal Life. The Law proved itself incapable of doing anything other than blessing those who live in covenant with God. A New Covenant was required to both bless us in covenant and give us Eternal Life.

You should know this. It renders irrelevant any reason God may have given for giving Israel the Law. Incidentally, Jesus confirmed every element of the Law *before the Cross,* and then stated that he had come to "fulfill the Law." Therefore, every element of the Law, including the Sabbath Law, has been fulfilled in him and in his new command, to "love one another." Pushing "religious days" upon Christians does a terrible disservice and upends sound Christian theology.

 

[St. SteVen]

The point is, if the change from emphasis on Saturday to emphasis on Sunday was the product of *Christian tradition* then *it does not need biblical justification!* It is simply the product of Christian tradition, which I've told you was displayed by Paul again and again.

That's a great point.

 

[Hobie]

In other words, you have no evidence at all? The "commandments of God" in the NT are the commandments of Jesus--not the commandments of the Law of Moses. To imply otherwise is false doctrine.

John 13.34 “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another."

Its there in words as plain as the proverbial nose on ones face, but as they say 'a man convinced against his will'.... So you must decide according to your conscience what is written here in Gods Word, as the Lords Day from Creation was the Sabbath, and John clearly put it down in many verses.

 

[Hobie]

Good morning @Randy Kluth and @Hobie

Randy.... you say... "
"We all know that in the OT the Sabbath Day was set aside as a respected day of the week. And so, weekly cycles became important in Jewish culture. We do not need a boatload of verses to prove this. It is an established and well-known part of Jewish Law."

But you neglect to post the reason this was done....

Gen 2:1-3
1 Thus the heavens and the earth were completed, and all their hosts.

2 By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done.

3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

AND

The ten commandments #4...
Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a sabbath of the Lord your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter, your male or your female servant or your cattle or your sojourner who stays with you.

For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day and made it holy.

But most fail to acknowledge that the Fri 6PM to Sat 6PM Sabbath came about at the end of God's creation of all things... and was reaffirmed, in stone, when Moses was on Mt. Sinai... and are recorded not just in Exodus 20 but also Deuteronomy 5

Where the 4th commandment there reads

12 ‘Observe the sabbath day to keep it holy, as the Lord your God commanded you.
13 Six days you shall labor and do all your work,
14 but the seventh day is a sabbath of the Lord your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter or your male servant or your female servant or your ox or your donkey or any of your cattle or your sojourner who [k]stays with you, so that your male servant and your female servant may rest as well as you.
15 You shall remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and the Lord your God brought you out of there by a mighty hand and by an outstretched arm; therefore the Lord your God commanded you to observe the sabbath day.

We owe HIM our devotion and certainly a day unto itself for praise.​

If you, or any feel so strongly about the Sabbath of Genesis and Exodus... by all means continue... but you should also consider extending you worship by one day in honor of what was done for you that came to an end on a Sunday over 2000 years ago.

Well, why dont we extend the whole way, and see a bit of how far it goes in these false doctrines and corruption that was brought in using this method..

1. The Midsummer festival of the Pagan was held on June 24 of each year.
The Nativity of St. John is held every year on June 24 by Papal Rome.

2. The assumption of Semiramus who became the mother godess of all Pagans.
The assumption of Mary, who became worshipped as the mother of God rather than just a good woman.

3. The mother goddess was given the title, and worshipped as the Queen of Heaven. Jer. 7:18
The Virgin Mary is given the title, and worshipped as the Queen of Heaven by Papal Rome.

4.The "Queen of Heaven" is wrath subduer of the Pagan god.
Mary, "Queen of Heaven" subdues the wrath of Christ and His Father against sinners.

5. Cakes decorated to the goddess with a "+" drawn on it. Jer. 44:17,19
Hot cross buns are backed for Mary in most Roman Catholic churches

6. 40 days fasting before Easter for Tammuz, Ezek. 8:14
The fast of 40 days (Lent) before Easter is doctrine with no scripture to support it.

7. Pagan festival of Easter. Ezek 8:16
The Roman Catholic church initiated the pagan festival of Easter first in Christiandom.

8. The resurrection of Tammuz on Easter, and the procession of graven images during Easter holy week
All Roman Catholic churches parade partake in processions of graven images of Jesus, Mary, and Peter, and of the saints during Easter week

9. Veneration of graven images of Baal, Ishtar, Tammuz and lesser gods in the heavens
All Roman Catholic churches venerate graven images of Jesus, Mary, Peter, and of the "lesser" saints in the heavens.

10. The belief of the constant immortality of the soul, and burning place of eternal torment.
Rome teaches the belief of immortality of the soul and a burning place of eternal torment.

11. Pagans believed in the doctrine of purgatory.
Papal Rome teaches the doctrine of purgatory.

12. The belief of the dead visiting the living on a certain day each year. A feast is then held for all the dead on first day of November.(Called all souls day).
Papal Rome teaches they must hold a festival for the dead on all souls day held Nov. 2, and all saints day held Nov. 1 of each year.

13. Burning candles to the gods Jer 11:17; Ezek 8:11.
Papal Rome, has the people burn candles in their "masses".

14. Chants and repetitive prayers. Beaded prayer chains.
Papal Rome uses chants and the beaded prayer chains.(Rome calls the chant "Gregorian chant" and the beaded chained "Rosary").

15. Pagans wear amulets and idols to scare away evil spirits.
Roman Catholicism teaches the wearing of crucifixes and medals as a method of protection. The scapular is proof of that fact.

16. Pagan's would paint the child Tammuz and his mother Semiramus with the glory of the Sun around their heads.
Rome paints the child Jesus and his mother Mary with halos of the Sun around their heads.

19. Pagan's performed infant baptism, and the sprinkling of holy water.
Papal Rome practices infant baptism, as well as the sprinkling of holy water.

20. Pagans taught Necromancy (Talking to the dead).
Papal Rome teaches Mysticism (Novenas/prayers to the dead).

21. The first day of the week kept sacred to honor the sun god Mithra. The name of the day was changed to "SUN"day .
Papal Rome admitted they changed the Sabbath from day 7 to day one in honor of "SUN"day.

22. The title Pontifex Maximus was given to the chief head of the pagan Babylonian system of idolatry.
The title Pontifex Maximus is the main title of the Popes of Rome.

23. Pagan gods (Janus and Cybele) were believed to be holders of the keys to Heaven and Hell.
The pope claims to have the keys of Peter or Heaven and Hell within his clutches.

24. The Pagan high priest king is believed to be the incarnate of the Sun god.
The Pope proclaims to be Jesus Christ in the flesh on Earth.

.....It just keeps going.They took the ancient pagan mystery religions and system of worship and brought it into the church, and subverted the true worship in the early church. So need to be careful how far you extend in this manner....

 

[St. SteVen]

If you look through Revelation at what John put down, its clear he is referring to the Lord who made the Sabbath at Creation.

The Sabbath points to the creation week. The creation week does NOT point to the Sabbath.
Sabbath was not introduced to the Israelites until Exodus chapter 16 with the collection of manna.
And there is no evidence of anyone observing the Sabbath until then. Verse 30 specifically.

I'll ask you again...
Does the evidence you brought prove that "the Lord's Day" is something other than Sunday?

 

[Hobie]

The Sabbath points to the creation week. The creation week does NOT point to the Sabbath.
Sabbath was not introduced to the Israelites until Exodus chapter 16 with the collection of manna.
And there is no evidence of anyone observing the Sabbath until then. Verse 30 specifically.

I'll ask you again...
Does the evidence you brought prove that "the Lord's Day" is something other than Sunday?

It clearly does, but if you cannot see or hear what is in the verses, one may have issues seeing the truth in Gods Word.