What is the one true Church?

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Grailhunter

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I'll press you to cite what the Church formally teaches about marriage and sexuality, and I'll press you to pull your *** out of the 5th century.
People are not usually intelligent enough to entice me. And I have already said several times that the modern Catholic Church is a much better church.
And it is not only what councils decided back then, it is also what they did.

It's not funny, it's New Age mockery.
Nope.
 

Grailhunter

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You need to understand DEVELOPMENT OF DOCTRINE. I've posted this link 30 times in this board, but it falls of deaf ears.

LETTER OF POPE JOHN PAUL II
TO WOMEN

Taking up the themes I addressed in that document, I would now like to speak directly to every woman, to reflect with her on the problems and the prospects of what it means to be a woman in our time. In particular I wish to consider the essential issue of the dignity and rights of women, as seen in the light of the word of God.

This "dialogue" really needs to begin with a word of thanks. As I wrote in my Apostolic Letter Mulieris Dignitatem, the Church "desires to give thanks to the Most Holy Trinity for the 'mystery of woman' and for every woman-for all that constitutes the eternal measure of her feminine dignity, for the 'great works of God', which throughout human history have been accomplished in and through her" (No. 31).

2. This word of thanks to the Lord for his mysterious plan regarding the vocation and mission of women in the world is at the same time a concrete and direct word of thanks to women, to every woman, for all that they represent in the life of humanity.

Thank you, women who are mothers! You have sheltered human beings within yourselves in a unique experience of joy and travail. This experience makes you become God's own smile upon the newborn child, the one who guides your child's first steps, who helps it to grow, and who is the anchor as the child makes its way along the journey of life.

Thank you, women who are wives! You irrevocably join your future to that of your husbands, in a relationship of mutual giving, at the service of love and life.

Thank you, women who are daughters and women who are sisters! Into the heart of the family, and then of all society, you bring the richness of your sensitivity, your intuitiveness, your generosity and fidelity.

Thank you, women who work! You are present and active in every area of life-social, economic, cultural, artistic and political. In this way you make an indispensable contribution to the growth of a culture which unites reason and feeling, to a model of life ever open to the sense of "mystery", to the establishment of economic and political structures ever more worthy of humanity.

Thank you, consecrated women! Following the example of the greatest of women, the Mother of Jesus Christ, the Incarnate Word, you open yourselves with obedience and fidelity to the gift of God's love. You help the Church and all mankind to experience a "spousal" relationship to God, one which magnificently expresses the fellowship which God wishes to establish with his creatures.

Thank you, every woman, for the simple fact of being a woman! Through the insight which is so much a part of your womanhood you enrich the world's understanding and help to make human relations more honest and authentic.

3. I know of course that simply saying thank you is not enough. Unfortunately, we are heirs to a history which has conditioned us to a remarkable extent. In every time and place, this conditioning has been an obstacle to the progress of women. Women's dignity has often been unacknowledged and their prerogatives misrepresented; they have often been relegated to the margins of society and even reduced to servitude. This has prevented women from truly being themselves and it has resulted in a spiritual impoverishment of humanity.

Certainly it is no easy task to assign the blame for this, considering the many kinds of cultural conditioning which down the centuries have shaped ways of thinking and acting. And if objective blame, especially in particular historical contexts, has belonged to not just a few members of the Church, for this I am truly sorry.

May this regret be transformed, on the part of the whole Church, into a renewed commitment of fidelity to the Gospel vision.

When it comes to setting women free from every kind of exploitation and domination, the Gospel contains an ever relevant message which goes back to the attitude of Jesus Christ himself. Transcending the established norms of his own culture, Jesus treated women with openness, respect, acceptance and tenderness. In this way he honoured the dignity which women have always possessed according to God's plan and in his love.
As we look to Christ at the end of this Second Millennium, it is natural to ask ourselves: how much of his message has been heard and acted upon?
Again! Oh my gosh!
The modern Catholic Church is a much better Church than it was.
John Paul II 1978 until his death in 2005

Now do you want me to read you some quotes from the Malleus Maleficarum....the Church's torture manual for women?
I think we have had enough of that.
You need to start a thread on the good that the Catholic Church has done in the past and now.
Amazon Prime has about 20 books on Mother Teresa.
The past is the past....it time to look to the future and make the changes that will allow it to be a good future.
 

BreadOfLife

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And I thought I explained this to you.....molesting women and children is a criminal case.....civil cases are settlements.
If the case is against the Church it is civil.....settlement....can't put the Church in Prison.
If it is a person it is criminal unless the victim is payed off.....settlements to not press charges.
You obviously don't understand how the law works.
Felony cases are NOT ignored by the disctrict attorney simply because a victim doesn't want to pursue. If it is a misdemeanor, then they will - but NOT felony sexual assualt.

Settlments were pais in CIVIL cases - not criminal cases, Einstein.
Civil lawsuits are private matters. Criminal cases are public matters.DA . .

You need to understand the law and how it works.
Civil charges....they have to be filed.....the Catholic Church does not want that and will usually settle with the victims before it hits the courts.
EVERY cvil lawsuit involved money. That is the GOAL of a civil lawsuit - to get aas much as you can.
I defy you to show me an example of ANY civil lawsuit where the defendant DOESN'T try to settle for less.

There's not a defence lawyer ion the PLANET planet that is going to try to pay MORE, Einstein . . .

Celibate or not servicing God is a the same. As I said celibacy really means nothing but causes great evil and sin.
Soooooo, WHY are you so afraid to tell me why MARRIED PROTESTANT ministers are molesting children at a HIGHR rate??

If celibacy causes such "evil" - wouldn't you say that marriage ALSO causes this evil??
I see no variant of the word mortification in these scriptures......is the word in the Catholic Bible.
Soooo, let me get this straight –

You AGREE that the word “Trinity” doesn‘t need to be in the Bible because teaching is there – but you WON’T accept un the clear Scriptural teaching of mortification of the flesh because you don’t see th e word??

Another giant leap for yoiu in hypocrisy . . .

Rom. 8:13

If you live according to the flesh, you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

Col. 3:5
So put to death whatever in your nature belongs to the earth: sexual immorality, impurity, shameful passion, evil desire, and greed which is idolatry.

Gal. 5:24
Now those who belong to Christ have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

For one I disagree that there is more of any kind of sexual sins in the Protestant churches.
Is it beyond your understanding that horny men do weird things?
Not at ALL - as long as YOU understand that those "horny men" are as bountiful amon yout MARRIED Protestant ministers as they are among celibate Catholics. Even MORESO, according to the FBI and Insurance statistics as chronicled in Protestant author Philip Jenlkins' book, Pedophils and Priests.

This is a matter of public record, so you can choose to live in DENIAL of this fact - or coome to terms with it . . .

FAQ: Sexual Abuse by Protestant Clergy - The Doan Law Firm

Evangelicals ‘worse’ than Catholics on sexual abuse

Child Sex Abuse More Prevalent Among Protestants Than Among Catholics

There Is More Sexual Abuse In The Protestant Churches Than Catholic

Denial About Sexual Abuse In Evangelical Churches
I believe in saints as in Christians but I do not believe holly people....the scriptures are using an indirect context.....no Holy Peter...Holy Paul
Holy John or even Holy Apostles. Only God is Holy.....And that may have been one of reasons that the Catholics got off track....they see themselves with the authority of God so they think they are Holy.
Frankly, I don't care what YOU believe. You're all over the place anyway.
The Scriptures tell us that we, who follow Christ are BEUNG sanctifid throughout our life.

As I have already taught you - "Sanctify" is defined as "the act of makeking something HOLY."

Again I disagree that the problem is worse with the Protestants.
Of course you do.
That's because you live iin DENIAL of many things - not the least of which is the molestation problem in your Protestant sects.

I can show you headlines ALL day long - and you'll STILL close your eyes to the facts . . .

1 in 10 Young Protestants Have Left a Church Over Abuse

Evangelicals ‘worse’ than Catholics on sexual abuse

Evangelical Sex Abuse Record ‘Worse’ Than Catholic, Says Billy Graham’s Grandson

Protestants can no longer dismiss abuse as a ‘Catholic problem’

Child Sex Abuse More Prevalent Among Protestants Than Among Catholics

There Is More Sexual Abuse In The Protestant Churches Than Catholic

Catholic priests no guiltier of sex abuse than other clergy
 

Illuminator

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You have a question?
The first 5 ecumenical councils are accepted, for the most part, by Protestants, Orthodox, and Catholics. I've posted them several times. They are available on line for everyone to see. You don't accept them which places you way out in left field.

People who only see sin and evil in others, or in history for that matter, need to head for the nearest psychiatric facility. Anti-Catholicism is a mental and spiritual sickness.
 

Illuminator

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Meet the heroines of Christianity's formative years!

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Mike Aquilina and Christopher Bailey, in a follow-up to the best-selling The Fathers of the Church, have penned an inspiring companion volume on the Mothers of the Church that, like no other book, explores their impact on history and the Faith.

Mothers of the Church: The Witness of Early Christian Women will reinforce Catholics understanding of the part played by women in the early Church. Drawing upon a wide spectrum of sources, it illustrates the many kinds of women that left their mark on sacred history by responding to God s call. Whether they were martyrs, abbesses, mothers, desert solitaries, or managers of large family businesses, these women's stories will encourage you and deepen your faith.

Each chapter features a concise biography that is supplemented by quotes from the Fathers writings concerning the woman in question, poetry concerning her, and other ancient testimonials.

The authors authoritative yet accessible writing style deftly explores the important impact of early Christian women.

The Mothers of the Church include:

Holy Women of the New Testament
--St. Blandina
--St. Perpetua and St. Felicity
--St. Helena
--St. Thecla
--St. Agnes of Rome
--St. Macrina
--Proba the Widow
--St. Marcella
--St. Paula
--St. Eustochium
--St. Monica
--Egeria the Tourist
 
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Grailhunter

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Soooooo, WHY are you so afraid to tell me why MARRIED PROTESTANT ministers are molesting children at a HIGHR rate??

If celibacy causes such "evil" - wouldn't you say that marriage ALSO causes this evil??
I am not saying that Protestant don't do these things.....Just not the numbers or the depth.
Protestants don't have sex slaves....as the Pope apologized for.....Maybe we should look at exactly what he apologized for?
In a closed society the opportunity and the power the molesters have over their victims is real and destructive thing. It is not only the physical abuse but the mental harm can last a lifetime.

As it is more and more Nuns and victims of abuse by Priests are speaking out.....A lot of videos on the internet and you can see it on the news. My concern is if the Church does not change and change it approach to harboring criminals it will be a can of worms that could take centuries to recover from....The Church needs to act now! Denial will only make the problem worse and be never ending.
 

Grailhunter

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You AGREE that the word “Trinity” doesn‘t need to be in the Bible because teaching is there – but you WON’T accept un the clear Scriptural teaching of mortification of the flesh because you don’t see th e word??

Another giant leap for yoiu in hypocrisy . . .
The teaching is not there, not in context with the storyline of the Gospels....I have over a hundred scriptural reasons why the one person formula for the Trinity is false. Now it you want to call the Godhead the Trinity...I fine with that.
 

BreadOfLife

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Me commenting God said man and woman together is Good…is whiny…and then you repeat it …. LOL ok whiny…lol

1 Cor 7:
[37] Nevertheless he that standeth stedfast in his heart, having no necessity, but hath power over his own will, and hath so decreed in his heart that he will keep his virgin, doeth well.

Making a pledge of celibacy is verse [37] and conditional.


So what are you talking about he giving her not in marriage, has to do with a celibate priest?

[38] So then he that giveth her in marriage doeth well; but he that giveth her not in marriage doeth better.
This is the problem when the ignorant and unstable use a version like the KJV, which uses a brand of English that is difficult to understand for the uneducated. You'd be better off using a more modern translation due to your obvious limitations. New International Version

New International Version

So then, he who marries the virgin does right, but he who does not marry her does better.

New Living Translation
So the person who marries his fiancée does well, and the person who doesn’t marry does even better.

English Standard Version
So then he who marries his betrothed does well, and he who refrains from marriage will do even better.

Berean Standard Bible
So then, he who marries the virgin does well, but he who does not marry her does even better.

Berean Literal Bible
So then also, the one marrying the own virgin does well, and the one not marrying will do better.

Good News Translation
So the man who marries does well, but the one who doesn't marry does even better.

International Standard Version
So then the man who marries the virgin acts appropriately, but the man who refrains from marriage does even better.
 

Grailhunter

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Frankly, I don't care what YOU believe. You're all over the place anyway.
The Scriptures tell us that we, who follow Christ are BEUNG sanctifid throughout our life.

As I have already taught you - "Sanctify" is defined as "the act of makeking something HOLY."
Yeshua was Holy.....you and I and our neighbor will never be Holy.
 

Grailhunter

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The first 5 ecumenical councils are accepted, for the most part, by Protestants, Orthodox, and Catholics. I've posted them several times. They are available on line for everyone to see. You don't accept them which places you way out in left field.
People are not my God.....and are usually stupid.
 

BreadOfLife

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You repeatedly use the Term “cherry-picking” as an implied slam accusation….

Scripture is Full of:
THIS “acceptable”… “THAT” not acceptable…
“THIS” applicable to “THIS” person.
“THAT” applicable to “THAT” person.

And absolutely that is “cherry-picking”.

What Applies to YOU, does not Apply to me, and visa versa.

If a person, any person CHOOSES to be, remain, change their mind regarding celibacy…their choice that applies to them.

When the prerequisite for any JOB is to promise to be and remain celibate for the entirety of their natural life….that is a tall order, that hangs on their own natural weakness to keep their promise.
I presume Some do maintain their promise….and suspect as Scripture teaches men are weak…and many fall short of keeping their promise … and have to deal with their own secret shortcomings, shame, and maybe a good thing to have access to plenty of wine to drown their sorrows.
Cherry-picking, as YOU and others here engage in, is the act of plucking verses OUT if their proper context.
I don't do that. If I isolare a verse - I always provide the context.
 
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Grailhunter

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People who only see sin and evil in others, or in history for that matter, need to head for the nearest psychiatric facility. Anti-Catholicism is a mental and spiritual sickness.
Are you saying you only see evil and sin in others....because that is not me. I want turn the topic to the good the Catholic Church has done and is doing.
 

BreadOfLife

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Yeshua was Holy.....you and I and our neighbor will never be Holy.
Thank you for another heretical statement.

It's heretical becauuse you are not only limiting God's poer - nut you are rejecting His promises.
And it borders on blasphemy because you are calling God Himself a Liar.

1 Pet. 2:9

But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light.

1 Peter 1:16
Since it is written, “You shall be holy, for I am holy.”

1 Peter 1:15
But as he who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct

Hebrews 12:14
Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord.
 
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BreadOfLife

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LOL First they have to report it. When the Police get physic we are all in trouble.
The point is, einstein - that felony criminal cases are NOT settled with money.
That is done is CIVIL court.

Do your
homework . . .
 

Grailhunter

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The point is, einstein - that felony criminal cases are NOT settled with money.
That is done is CIVIL court.

Do your
homework . . .
Never said they were but it is you that does not know how they work.
Look in to how these settlement work.
Do you think the Priest goes to prison and the Catholic Church pays the settlement?
 

BreadOfLife

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The teaching is not there, not in context with the storyline of the Gospels....I have over a hundred scriptural reasons why the one person formula for the Trinity is false. Now it you want to call the Godhead the Trinity...I fine with that.
Sooooo - you actually believe that the Bible teaches AGSINsT the mortfication of the flesh??
That it teaches that the spirit and the soul should be sacrificed for the flesh - and NOT the other way around??

Can you substantiate that?
Chapter and Verse please . . .
 
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Jim B

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People are not usually intelligent enough to entice me. And I have already said several times that the modern Catholic Church is a much better church.
And it is not only what councils decided back then, it is also what they did.


Nope.
Much better than what/whom?