David in NJ
Well-Known Member
Was not me causing any argument but those who oppose the direct wording of Scripture
My posts are the same as Post 156 which you agreed with = who is arguing with who?
WHAT IS THE WATER IN JOHN 3:5?
- Thread starter GodsGrace
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
My posts are the same as Post 156 which you agreed with = who is arguing with who?
I think it has something to do with the cleansing from sin, to be made pure as well as the work of the Spirit (for the second time).
PS95
Well-Known Member
WHAT IS THE WATER IN JOHN 3:5?
- Thread starterGodsGrace
- Start dateJun 19, 2025
Believe it or not the water used in John 3:5 signifies the gospel. Elsewhere in Scripture, it is said that "all born again believers have in them this "living water" (John 7:38).
He that believeth on me, as the Scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water (Gospel).
That is, when believers witnesses to nonbelievers and these become saved it's because they heard the true Gospel! Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God (Romans 10:17).
And this is my take in undersetting of the subject.
To God Be the Glory
Hiddenthings
Member
The Water aspect speaks to a good confession and is within the meaning of the Spirit. It's so obvious I cannot believe this discussion has gone on as long as it has!
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
If that were true then JESUS would be saying that we need to be Born TWICE = directly from God BOTH times.
Once by the Gospel and then Born Again by the Spirit
But that is not what JESUS, in this passage of Scripture, declares.
In FACT, Jesus separated and DEFINED the TWO Births in the passage.
First Birth = "that which is flesh is flesh"
Second Birth = "that which is Spirit is spirit"
How was Jesus born?
Jesus was born thru Mary, growing inside her womb encapsulated in WATER, which is the amniotic fluid.
Amniotic fluid is a clear, water-like liquid that surrounds and protects a developing fetus during pregnancy.
It cushions the fetus, helps in its growth and development, and contains important nutrients and antibodies.
This is God's Way from Genesis and every human comes into the world this way.
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
Only works if Jesus actually said "Born AGAIN"....
And I know that it gets confusing for people because that's what is written/translated in English. But it's not what He said and not what He meant.
John, writing in Early Latin/Greek....
Said that Jesus said "Genethe anothen" or Born from Above....not Born again. The note in subtext in printed bibles is correct....the "again" is what's there due to tradition carried forward as an error made by Erasmus over 500 years ago.
But EVERYWHERE else in scripture "anothen" is used it means "above".
Then....
There are the troubling Jewish anthropologists....who state that "Born from Above" is a distinction of a class of individuals. (Caste based society classifying individuals? Say it isn't so!) But it conveniently gets forgotten by so many people who claim they are correct and perfect in theological matters with perfect hermeneutics.
And amniotic fluid...live birth....kinda redundant stating of the obvious. Especially when Paper and ink to write this section are going to equal several days labor.
Just saying....
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
Thank You for this
Even if we exchange Born Again to Born Above(which i love) it does not change the meaning for Jesus clearly stated we must be Born of the Spirit.
Jesus also separated the two births: "that which is flesh is flesh" = 1st Birth
"that which is Spirit is spirit" = Second Birth = from the Spirit/Above
Ephesians 2:1-3 VALIDATES John 3:1-10
Secondly, only humans are born from/in WATER and who can experience a Second Birth= Born from Above
Thirdly - Angels are created beings = no birth records and no scripture that states they were birthed
Fallen Angels cannot be redeemed = God did not grant Salvation to the fallen angels who serve satan.
again.
ἄνωθεν (anōthen)
Adverb
Strong's Greek 509: From ano; from above; by analogy, from the first; by implication, anew - over again
Last edited:
Apparently, natural birth of water in the mother's womb has been debunk by Jesus, after Nicodemus spoke of it as he understood.
Clearly, it was the water baptism upon repentance, as Jesus and His disciples were too water baptizing after John, and it continued to the book of Acts.
Shalom in the name of Jesus Christ
14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
This is the water Jesus spoke about, the water He would give, the water that cleanses from all sin. The Holy Spirit's work, whom Jesus sends, plus this gift from Jesus, whereas at the beginning, when one first has an encounter with the living God, one is not entirely cleansed from sin. One does however, know what sin is, whereas before one does not and thinks oneself at least as good as other men.
It is not again or anew. That was an error in translating made by Erasmus over 500 years ago. And the modern translators keep the error due to tradition even though it's wrong.
Nothing much was made of it until around the turn of the 19th century when it became a marketing campaign focusing on the personal relationship we have with Jesus.
Strongs lexicon of course is going to keep the error....
But then you have to completely erase the Anthropology of the Jews and make it fit this theology. The Born from Above classification of the heroes of Israel's past....which is what Jesus was telling Nicodemus he belonged to.. (Which gave Nicodemus a startle as evidenced by his claim to need a whole life do-over)
Scriptures are written in a very compact and restricted fashion. Paper and ink were expensive. Obvious information was always left out of any writing. (Which gave rise to Jewish Talmud tales) Like how many times Nicodemus knocked on the door, or that early evening into dark is Social Time in Israel. (Still is to this day) These bits of information are left up to the reader to insert for themselves. Same thing for those classified as "Born From Above" which the Jews still have as a Caste to this day. (They put a Hebrew name on it)
This whole "Born again " theology is American wackanoodle stuff out of mistranslating a single word that did not make sense to Erasmus. God may love Americans as much as anyone else in the world but He loves THE WHOLE WORLD....every tribe, nation, and language. (It is His creation)
It's OK to admit error....just admit it, ask forgiveness and move on. Don't double down claiming you are always right. It does you no favors. Makes someone look prideful and unapproachable. This is Christian discussion board where we have a chance to learn and grow from each other. Not argue over the dumbest stuff..
Besides....where it looks like it gives fuel for Calvinists....it really doesn't. Think it through...don't double down and not give it a second thought. Analyze what I have said carefully.
mailmandan
Well-Known Member
Wrong. The spiritual washing or purification of the soul (John 4:10,14; 7:37-39) that is accomplished by the Holy Spirit through the word of God (John 15:3; Ephesians 5:26) at the moment of salvation is not Spirit both times. Also "water" is used in the Bible as an emblem of the word of God, and in such uses it is associated with cleansing or washing. The new birth is brought to pass through "incorruptible seed, by the word of God, which lives and abides forever" (1 Peter 1:23) and the Holy Spirit accomplishes the washing of regeneration. (Titus 3:5)
Similar threads
