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Featured What Mormons Believe--according to a Former BYU Professor

Discussion in 'Unorthodox Doctrine Forum' started by Prayer Warrior, Sep 19, 2019.

  1. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    I'm sure the "scholars" have an explanation for this. I'm all tuckered out at the moment, but maybe I'll look into this later.
     
  2. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    You're sounding like Giuliano here. Are you two morphing into one person??

    Satan and the devil are the same being, and he is totally evil. There is nothing good in him.

    Edit: Here's a good article for Halloween night.

    Who is Satan? Who is the devil?

    Question: "Who is Satan? Who is the devil?"

    Answer:
    People's beliefs concerning Satan range from the silly to the abstract—from a little red guy with horns who sits on your shoulder urging you to sin, to an expression used to describe the personification of evil. The Bible, however, gives us a clear portrait of who Satan is and how he affects our lives. Put simply, the Bible defines Satan as an angelic being who fell from his position in heaven due to sin and is now completely opposed to God, doing all in his power to thwart God's purposes.

    Satan was created as a holy angel. Isaiah 14:12 possibly gives Satan’s pre-fall name as Lucifer. Ezekiel 28:12-14 describes Satan as having been created a cherub, apparently the highest created angel. He became arrogant in his beauty and status and decided he wanted to sit on a throne above that of God (Isaiah 14:13-14; Ezekiel 28:15; 1 Timothy 3:6). Satan’s pride led to his fall. Notice the many “I will” statements in Isaiah 14:12-15. Because of his sin, God permanently removed Satan from his exalted position and role.

    Satan became the ruler of this world and the prince of the power of the air (John 12:31; 2 Corinthians 4:4; Ephesians 2:2). He is an accuser (Revelation 12:10), a tempter (Matthew 4:3; 1 Thessalonians 3:5), and a deceiver (Genesis 3; 2 Corinthians 4:4; Revelation 20:3). His very name means “adversary” or “one who opposes.” Another of his titles, the devil, means “slanderer.”

    Even though he was cast out of heaven, he still seeks to elevate his throne above God. He counterfeits all that God does, hoping to gain the worship of the world and encourage opposition to God's kingdom. Satan is the ultimate source behind every false cult and world religion. Satan will do anything and everything in his power to oppose God and those who follow God. However, Satan’s destiny is sealed—an eternity in the lake of fire (Revelation 20:10).

    Source: Who is Satan? Who is the devil? | GotQuestions.org
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2019
  3. Grailhunter

    Grailhunter Well-Known Member

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    Do I need to send smoke signals! Because words are not sinking in. I am not telling you to believe me. I am telling you to go look it up for yourself. I have no denomination to defend. I have no denomination to promote. My ministry is the truth and I do not have to defend it because you can seek the truth. It just depends on if you care enough. The neat thing about being a minister of truth, I do not say, believe me, I say go look it up for yourself. The neat thing about being a minster of truth, I can have a blast with most of the denominations.

    The Jews did not misinterpret the Old Testament. But the Christians and Moslems took their denominational beliefs and superimposed them on the Old Testament scriptures. go look at it yourself.

    I am the first to say that the OT and Judaism really has no place in Christianity. But then, you really cannot understand the Bible without understanding the OT and Judaism. Just because I do not believe we should merge Judaism and Christianity, that does not mean I do not love the Jews and Israel.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2019
  4. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    Did you miss my statement way back in this thread? I'm anti-denominational. I'm defending Bible truth, not denominational doctrine.

    So, what truth are you defending if not Bible truth?
     
  5. Grailhunter

    Grailhunter Well-Known Member

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    How many times do I have to say go look at it for yourself. How many time did the word Satan appear in the original scriptures?
    In this discussion quoting NT scriptures only means you are missing the point. Satan is Satan, the question is, when does he become an issue. In the OT God is not warning anyone that He talked to, directly or indirectly, about a devil that tempts, or a devil that is the enemy of God.
     
  6. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    The Jews added to the OT with their commentaries, which some see as having the same weight as the OT. The Pharisees expounded on God's Word. To give an example, this is something I learned in one of my college Bible classes. The law says not to work on the Sabbath. The scribes and Pharisees expounded on this to the extreme. They determined that if a man had a pin in his suit, he was working on the Sabbath and violating the command.
     
  7. Grailhunter

    Grailhunter Well-Known Member

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    Truth is truth....seek the truth. Some translations are better than others, still go back and look at it yourself. Why do you think they took God the Father's name and God the Son's name out of scriptures? Why do you thing they replaced all the "Y's" with "J's" Why would they name Christ with a word that did not exist until the 1600's. How many places did they insert the devil in the OT? Why do you think they put the Latin word Lucifer in an English Bible. Then there is the Comma Johanneum Addition in NT. Any Bible out there has nearly 30,000 alterations...why would you not want to look at the truth.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2019
  8. Grailhunter

    Grailhunter Well-Known Member

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    I am not asking you to look at the mistakes of the NT Jews. I am saying, look at what men have done to the Bible.
     
  9. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    I've read it for myself! The serpent in the Garden was Satan, the devil--the tempter, the deceiver....
     
  10. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    I know that you believe that men have messed up God's Word, but I do not believe that legitimate translations are messed up. I will never believe that God cannot see to it that His Word is translated correctly--by His grace through faith!!!
     
  11. Grailhunter

    Grailhunter Well-Known Member

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    What can I say...the truth is out there.... Grace and faith has nothing to do with living a lie.
     
  12. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    GOD'S WORD=TRUTH. IT'S IN THERE!

    Again, where do you find the truth??
     
  13. Grailhunter

    Grailhunter Well-Known Member

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    Are you asking me how do you study the scriptures? If I did not like you I would not bother.

    In the grand scheme of things....our adversaries are not the Mormons.
    Our adversaries are those that have deceived people like you by altering the Word of God.
    The scriptures do say that there is only one name that can be called on for salvation, they have taken that away from you.
    People like the Moslems, the Calvinists, the Jehovah Witnesses, communism, and liberals that promoted drug use.
    Bigger fish to fry.
     
  14. Giuliano

    Giuliano Well-Known Member

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    One example is from Yoma 85b which states the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. Here is a link to that: Yoma 85b

    And here is commentary of that section of the Talmud.

    Saving a Life Is Keeping Shabbat

    There is a difference between Shabbat and all other mitzvot. When it comes to mitzvot in general, the rule is, "There is nothing that stands before saving a life." Meaning, that saving a life "pushes away" the obligation of doing the mitzvah. One is still theoretically obligated, but saving a life trumps the obligation. Regarding Shabbat, however, the Rambam says, "When it comes to a sick person, Shabbat is like a weekday, for all the things that he needs." In other words, when it comes to saving a life, it is as if Shabbat does not exist.

    It is wrong then to twist the Sabbath into something hurtful or even lethal. It was given to bring pleasure to men, not make them into slaves.

    I can't find the original text from the Talmud now; but I found a site that agrees with Jesus about looking at a woman with lust or fantasizing about her is spiritual adultery -- and the idea comes from the Talmud where a rabbi said that looking a woman's finger the wrong way could be spiritual adultery.

    Kallah Classes | Jewish Family Site

    It is also important to have pure and holy thoughts at the time of relations and only to think of each other (not to fantasize about anyone else, as this is a form of adultery on a spiritual level).
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2019
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  15. Giuliano

    Giuliano Well-Known Member

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    I thought the "new covenant" was about not needing books.
     
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  16. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    I have read explanations as to why these changes were made, and I'm satisfied with these explanations. I'm certainly not willing to do what you've done and throw God's Word into question because of some changes.
     
  17. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    I'm so glad to know that you like me. I couldn't imagine how you would treat me if you didn't. ;)

    Our adversary is the devil and his minions, period--however his schemes are being manifested, through cults or Communists.
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2019
  18. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    In light of what you say here, how do you explain this?

    Numbers 15:32-36--And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. 33 And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation. 34 And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him. 35 And the Lord said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. 36 And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the Lord commanded Moses.
     
  19. Prayer Warrior

    Prayer Warrior Well-Known Member

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    What?? Okay, now you have me chuckling. What do you mean?
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2019
  20. Grailhunter

    Grailhunter Well-Known Member

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    You underestimate me, you underestimate me greatly. Do you think that my only interest in this thread is defending Jane and Mormonism?
     
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