What wisdom is this?

[Ziggy]

Eze 13:3 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe unto the foolish prophets, that follow their own spirit, and have seen nothing!
Eze 13:4 O Israel, thy prophets are like the foxes in the deserts.
Eze 13:5 Ye have not gone up into the gaps, neither made up the hedge for the house of Israel to stand in the battle in the day of the LORD.
Eze 13:6 They have seen vanity and lying divination, saying, The LORD saith: and the LORD hath not sent them: and they have made others to hope that they would confirm the word.
Eze 13:7 Have ye not seen a vain vision, and have ye not spoken a lying divination, whereas ye say, The LORD saith it; albeit I have not spoken?
Eze 13:8 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because ye have spoken vanity, and seen lies, therefore, behold, I am against you, saith the Lord GOD.
Eze 13:9 And mine hand shall be upon the prophets that see vanity, and that divine lies: they shall not be in the assembly of my people, neither shall they be written in the writing of the house of Israel, neither shall they enter into the land of Israel; and ye shall know that I am the Lord GOD.
Eze 13:10 Because, even because they have seduced my people, saying, Peace; and there was no peace; and one built up a wall, and, lo, others daubed it with untempered morter:
Eze 13:11 Say unto them which daub it with untempered morter, that it shall fall: there shall be an overflowing shower; and ye, O great hailstones, shall fall; and a stormy wind shall rend it.
Eze 13:12 Lo, when the wall is fallen, shall it not be said unto you, Where is the daubing wherewith ye have daubed it?
Eze 13:13 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; I will even rend it with a stormy wind in my fury; and there shall be an overflowing shower in mine anger, and great hailstones in my fury to consume it.
Eze 13:14 So will I break down the wall that ye have daubed with untempered morter, and bring it down to the ground, so that the foundation thereof shall be discovered, and it shall fall, and ye shall be consumed in the midst thereof: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
Eze 13:15 Thus will I accomplish my wrath upon the wall, and upon them that have daubed it with untempered morter, and will say unto you, The wall is no more, neither they that daubed it;
Eze 13:16 To wit, the prophets of Israel which prophesy concerning Jerusalem, and which see visions of peace for her, and there is no peace, saith the Lord GOD.
Eze 13:17 Likewise, thou son of man, set thy face against the daughters of thy people, which prophesy out of their own heart; and prophesy thou against them,
Eze 13:18 And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the women that sew pillows to all armholes, and make kerchiefs upon the head of every stature to hunt souls! Will ye hunt the souls of my people, and will ye save the souls alive that come unto you?
Eze 13:19 And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies?
Eze 13:20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.
Eze 13:21 Your kerchiefs also will I tear, and deliver my people out of your hand, and they shall be no more in your hand to be hunted; and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
Eze 13:22 Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life:
Eze 13:23 Therefore ye shall see no more vanity, nor divine divinations: for I will deliver my people out of your hand: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.

 

[Ziggy]

1Co 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

1Co 11:2 Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.

1Co 11:5 But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.
1Co 11:6 For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.
1Co 11:7 For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.
1Co 11:8 For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.
1Co 11:9 Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
1Co 11:10 For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.

1Co 11:13 Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered?
1Co 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?
1Co 11:15 But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering.
1Co 11:16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

Wash, rinse, repeat:
1Co 11:2 Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.
1Co 11:16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

1Co 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?

Num 6:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
Num 6:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When either man or woman shall separate themselves to vow a vow of a Nazarite, to separate themselves unto the LORD:
Num 6:3 He shall separate himself from wine and strong drink, and shall drink no vinegar of wine, or vinegar of strong drink, neither shall he drink any liquor of grapes, nor eat moist grapes, or dried.
Num 6:4 All the days of his separation shall he eat nothing that is made of the vine tree, from the kernels even to the husk.
Num 6:5 All the days of the vow of his separation there shall no razor come upon his head: until the days be fulfilled, in the which he separateth himself unto the LORD, he shall be holy, and shall let the locks of the hair of his head grow.

Mat 2:23 And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene.

Act 21:18 And the day following Paul went in with us unto James; and all the elders were present.
Act 21:19 And when he had saluted them, he declared particularly what things God had wrought among the Gentiles by his ministry.
Act 21:20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
Act 21:21 And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs.
Act 21:22 What is it therefore? the multitude must needs come together: for they will hear that thou art come.
Act 21:23 Do therefore this that we say to thee: We have four men which have a vow on them;
Act 21:24 Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads: and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law.
Act 21:25 As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written and concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication.
Act 21:26 Then Paul took the men, and the next day purifying himself with them entered into the temple, to signify the accomplishment of the days of purification, until that an offering should be offered for every one of them.

 

[Ziggy]

The battle belongs to the Lord and the victory is already won.
Why seek man's wisdom concerning His Word? You have the Spirit of Truth, aka the Holy Spirit to teach you.
“But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.”
— 1 John 2:27 (KJV)
There is only one Truth....His Truth.

Now on a personal note...I am surprised at some of your statements. One particular one is to suggest it was Satan speaking to Saul claiming to be Jesus....the Pharisees accused Jesus of performing miracles by the power of Baal....smh.
Simple faith of a child...this would be a good way to see His Word.
I didn't see you as one still on the milk....I now consider maybe you are still growing and on the milk.
In any case, the Holy Spirit will reveal His Word to you as you seek for Truth.
God Bless

So let me see if I hear this right..
You don't have a problem with God sending Satan to beat the crap out a righteous man like Job,
But you do have a problem with God sending Satan to beat the crap out of a murderer who is killing his people.
I understand Heart2Soul..
It don't look good.
But it is.
What happend to Job at the end?

HUGS

 

[Heart2Soul]

So let me see if I hear this right..
You don't have a problem with God sending Satan to beat the crap out a righteous man like Job,
But you do have a problem with God sending Satan to beat the crap out of a murderer who is killing his people.
I understand Heart2Soul..
It don't look good.
But it is.
What happend to Job at the end?

HUGS

He is a Sovereign God and Job's faith had to be tested just like the rest of us.
We all go through the testing of our faith.

 

[Ziggy]

2Ti 4:1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
2Ti 4:5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.
2Ti 4:6 For I am now ready to be offered, and the time of my departure is at hand.
2Ti 4:7 I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith:
2Ti 4:8 Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.
2Ti 4:9 Do thy diligence to come shortly unto me:
2Ti 4:10 For Demas hath forsaken me, having loved this present world, and is departed unto Thessalonica; Crescens to Galatia, Titus unto Dalmatia.
2Ti 4:11 Only Luke is with me. Take Mark, and bring him with thee: for he is profitable to me for the ministry.
2Ti 4:12 And Tychicus have I sent to Ephesus.
2Ti 4:13 The cloke that I left at Troas with Carpus, when thou comest, bring with thee, and the books, but especially the parchments.
2Ti 4:14 Alexander the coppersmith did me much evil: the Lord reward him according to his works:
2Ti 4:15 Of whom be thou ware also; for he hath greatly withstood our words.
2Ti 4:16 At my first answer no man stood with me, but all men forsook me: I pray God that it may not be laid to their charge.
2Ti 4:17 Notwithstanding the Lord stood with me, and strengthened me; that by me the preaching might be fully known, and that all the Gentiles might hear: and I was delivered out of the mouth of the lion.
2Ti 4:18 And the Lord shall deliver me from every evil work, and will preserve me unto his heavenly kingdom: to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.
2Ti 4:19 Salute Prisca and Aquila, and the household of Onesiphorus.
2Ti 4:20 Erastus abode at Corinth: but Trophimus have I left at Miletum sick.
2Ti 4:2 1Do thy diligence to come before winter. Eubulus greeteth thee, and Pudens, and Linus, and Claudia, and all the brethren.
2Ti 4:22 The Lord Jesus Christ be with thy spirit. Grace be with you. Amen.

You can only divide the word if the word is dividable.
You have to have the dark with the light.
The wheat with the tares.
And it's OUR job to do the rightfully dividing of it.

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Mat 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
Mat 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Pro 10:27 The fear of the LORD prolongeth days: but the years of the wicked shall be shortened.
2Ti 4:7 I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith:

Jas 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
Jas 3:7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:
Jas 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.

You have to see it to believe it.

HUGS

 

[Ziggy]

I am persuaded that throughout Paul's letters he is having a battle with his ego.
At times he is humble and he speaks the truth. At other times he becomes proud and boastful and wants to take the reigns and lead.
It is the ebb and flow of the tides.
He has seasons where the words he speaks are not his words but they are the Lord's.
At other times it is his words and not the Lord's.
The only way to rightfully divide Paul's letters is to be able to cross reference or reproof them by the law, the profits or Jesus's own words.
Because Paul is HUMAN like we all are. And he likes to be acknowledged for how wise he is.
But sometimes his wisdom is in conflict with God's wisdom.
This was my battle with Paul.

I understand how many became offended and to his defence. We all want to be defended even when we make mistakes and don't want to admit them. This is natural. And those who are weak and unlearned do wrestle with Paul's letters, because they are meant to be wrestled with.
This is Jacob's trouble. This is the wrestling and prevailing.
Jesus accused the Scribes and Pharisees of worrying about the material things, but they forgot the weightier matters of the law.
Judgement, Mercy, and faith.
Mat 23:23
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

In Paul's case it is the battle of the spirits. Paul's spirit vs. the Lord's Spirit.
Paul feels like a prisoner, that he is in bonds, that he is a slave to the Lord.
And he has to go through this until he comes to the knowledge that he, his ego, has to die.

When I read the letters to Timothy I see this transition. I no longer see Paul striving to be Paul.
I see him finally submitting to God.
This battle is also the battle I see in Revelation. Where the beast/flesh/wordly/ego/I/me.. is cast out forever. It is baptised in that lake of fire.
The world today has let this Beast of an ego loose, very few have actually been born again.
You.. your ego.. your beast that is your mind, your heart, your flesh, has to die.
And you have to Let go and let God.
666 6=me 6=myself 6=I, the number of a man.
My mind, my heart, my might..

Thou shalt love the lord thy God with all your heart and mind and soul.
I have given man a new heart, a mind of Christ, and my Spirit to walk in and do my will.
Because he has given all of himself to us.

1Jo 4:19 We love him, because he first loved us.

You are the idol that is what divides you from being one with the Lord.
Paul was his own worst enemy. He was a thorn in his own flesh.

Exo 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

Psa 82:6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
Psa 82:7 But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.

Leaven...beware the leaven..

My battle is over.
Thankyou for everyones comments.
I appreciate every one of you, and if I came off rather harsh, I'm sorry.
I needed to see this to the finish line.
I will still see the leaven from the unleaven in Paul's letters.
and at times we may disagree on a certain issue which concerns Paul.
Like they say.. patience is a virtue. And I will try to be as virtuous as possible.

Much Love
HUGS

 

[Truther]

So your quoting Paul to beat up on Peter?

What's that saying...
steal from Peter to pay Paul..
sounds about right..

Hugs

You needed proof, you got it on all 3 subjects.

 

[Ziggy]

You needed proof, you got it on all 3 subjects.

Thank You

Hugs

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I'm not thinking..
I hear, look here, go there... and I copy paste.
It just is what it is..

HUGS

understood. Read your post on the other thread about what Paul would have to go through. That has been my struggle with this topic. Yes, can see Saul as you have pointed out... before conversion. The former, but then one must consider the latter end. Just an opinion but Saul went from (much like job ) being revered when they laid their coats at his feet when he consented to Stephens death ...to despised, weak, and preaching the Faith he once destroyed. That light appeared and asked why do you persecute Me, Saul. For me it was an eye opening opportunity for Saul in that one question: Saul, Saul are you not therefore born after the flesh in persecuting that which is born after the Spirit..Me? you never answered the question about Stephen. Proverbs 16:7 When a man's ways please the Lord, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him.

Could the above not be said of Stephen ...in Saul being overcome and won by the Mercy of Christ? My struggle with your topic has been looking at all the wreckage of all the horrible things I’ve done in the past. Which gives so much for the accuser to say ... see there at all she did to destroy?

Saul/Paul shows God can make crooked paths straight. Jesus also told Peter that satan wanted to sift him as wheat...Peter also had to go through some things. Jesus told Peter “I pray your faith fails not.” There is a verse that says ‘and overthrows the faith of many’ followed immediately by Nevertheless God’s foundation stands sure, having this seal, God knows those who are His. As He told Peter ‘and nothing will overthrow it’ even the gates of hell will not prevail against.

Not denying who Saul was, only do not want to forget what work Christ revealed in Paul in the end. Not denying Saul was a vessel fitted for destruction which does what a vessel fitted for destruction does...it destroys. But as you have pointed out God can make a new vessel and new lump. Does this not show a New birth? Still consider Paul a brother and one converted and taught of God.

 

[Ziggy]

understood. Read your post on the other thread about what Paul would have to go through. That has been my struggle with this topic. Yes, can see Saul as you have pointed out... before conversion. The former, but then one must consider the latter end. Just an opinion but Saul went from (much like job ) being revered when they laid their coats at his feet when he consented to Stephens death ...to despised, weak, and preaching the Faith he once destroyed. That light appeared and asked why do you persecute Me, Saul. For me it was an eye opening opportunity for Saul in that one question: Saul, Saul are you not therefore born after the flesh in persecuting that which is born after the Spirit..Me? you never answered the question about Stephen. Proverbs 16:7 When a man's ways please the Lord, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him.

Could the above not be said of Stephen ...in Saul being overcome and won by the Mercy of Christ? My struggle with your topic has been looking at all the wreckage of all the horrible things I’ve done in the past. Which gives so much for the accuser to say ... see there at all she did to destroy?

Saul/Paul shows God can make crooked paths straight. Jesus also told Peter that satan wanted to sift him as wheat...Peter also had to go through some things. Jesus told Peter “I pray your faith fails not.” There is a verse that says ‘and overthrows the faith of many’ followed immediately by Nevertheless God’s foundation stands sure, having this seal, God knows those who are His. As He told Peter ‘and nothing will overthrow it’ even the gates of hell will not prevail against.

Not denying who Saul was, only do not want to forget what work Christ revealed in Paul in the end. Not denying Saul was a vessel fitted for destruction which does what a vessel fitted for destruction does...it destroys. But as you have pointed out God can make a new vessel and new lump. Does this not show a New birth? Still consider Paul a brother and one converted and taught of God.

Yes!

Stephen:
Luk 15:7 I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance.
Yes!

My struggle with Paul is/was my own struggle with myself.
I see this same struggle in Paul.
It's the not wanting to let go of self. of ego.
In his letters they are truth, but I hear his ego wanting to take the credit...
There are some things I disagree with Paul on. Some things give too much liberty for other's learning to misinterpret.
As we see in all the churches today. There is room for error.
I can go to a teacher and they will tell me how they hear Paul. I can go to another and have a different interpretation.
This confusion.. this babel..babylon.. is everywhere in all the churches.
Jesus told John to go to 7 different churches. Each one had something different they was doing right or doing wrong.
They were not all in unity.
It's even moreso today.

And then there is.. you need not that any man teach you for the Holy Spirit will teach you all things.
And this is good.. but you still have to overcome your own thinking and interpretations.
It's a battle. It Is Spiritual Warfare.
And this is what I saw in Paul, I see it in myself, I see it in the forum, in the churches, in the world.

VictoryInJesus... Amen.. your name says it all.

Thank You
HUGS

 

[amadeus]

He is a Sovereign God and Job's faith had to be tested just like the rest of us.
We all go through the testing of our faith.

Why did God need to test Job, who according the very first verse in the Book of Job was a "perfect" man?

Job was not yet like Jesus.

Job did not know the name of the Messiah. He did not know the fulfillments described more completely in the written NT, but God has never changed and his requirement that we come unto to Him in submission has never changed. Job in his way with what he knew was striving as we see with the sacrifices offered and his insistence on retaining his own integrity, his righteousness:

"God forbid that I should justify you: till I die I will not remove mine integrity from me.
My righteousness I hold fast, and will not let it go: my heart shall not reproach me so long as I live." Job 27:5-6

"Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him: but I will maintain mine own ways before him." Job 13:15

His integrity, his righteousness and his own ways?

Herein we see a problem in where Job was in spite of his efforts. His efforts were well intended, but they were his own. In the OT again long before the Messiah came, in the words of Jeremiah are told the problem, Job's problem, which is still the problem, I believe, of many today who claim to be have the Holy Spirit and to be finally saved already:

"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem 10:23

Job was "perfect" in what he had and what he was doing with what he had. He was still far from humbling himself as he needed to humble himself:

"So these three men ceased to answer Job, because he was righteous in his own eyes." Job 32:1

The three men went after Job as people on this forum sometimes go after one another... with the wrong attitude and erroneous presumptions... but Job was also missing something important.

Job was striving, but he was too caught up in leading himself and holding fast to his integrity, his righteousness and his own ways. If Job had integrity, righteousness and ways that were 'good' were they not God's?

"And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." Mark 10:18

Job had been striving, but too full of himself, he needed help so Satan was allowed access to him to, as you say, test him... to allow Job the opportunity to humble himself.

The Only Way to a higher place with God is by going down and allowing Him to lift us up. Job was not learning that by himself...

"When thou art bidden of any man to a wedding, sit not down in the highest room; lest a more honourable man than thou be bidden of him;
And he that bade thee and him come and say to thee, Give this man place; and thou begin with shame to take the lowest room.
But when thou art bidden, go and sit down in the lowest room; that when he that bade thee cometh, he may say unto thee, Friend, go up higher: then shalt thou have worship in the presence of them that sit at meat with thee.
For whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted." Luke 14:8-11

 

[Heart2Soul]

Why did God need to test Job, who according the very first verse in the Book of Job was a "perfect" man?

Job was not yet like Jesus.

Job did not know the name of the Messiah. He did not know the fulfillments described more completely in the written NT, but God has never changed and his requirement that we come unto to Him in submission has never changed. Job in his way with what he knew was striving as we see with the sacrifices offered and his insistence on retaining his own integrity, his righteousness:

"God forbid that I should justify you: till I die I will not remove mine integrity from me.
My righteousness I hold fast, and will not let it go: my heart shall not reproach me so long as I live." Job 27:5-6

"Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him: but I will maintain mine own ways before him." Job 13:15

His integrity, his righteousness and his own ways?

Herein we see a problem in where Job was in spite of his efforts. His efforts were well intended, but they were his own. In the OT again long before the Messiah came, in the words of Jeremiah are told the problem, Job's problem, which is still the problem, I believe, of many today who claim to be have the Holy Spirit and to be finally saved already:

"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem 10:23

Job was "perfect" in what he had and what he was doing with what he had. He was still far from humbling himself as he needed to humble himself:

"So these three men ceased to answer Job, because he was righteous in his own eyes." Job 32:1

The three men went after Job as people on this forum sometimes go after one another... with the wrong attitude and erroneous presumptions... but Job was also missing something important.

Job was striving, but he was too caught up in leading himself and holding fast to his integrity, his righteousness and his own ways. If Job had integrity, righteousness and ways that were 'good' were they not God's?

"And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." Mark 10:18

Job had been striving, but too full of himself, he needed help so Satan was allowed access to him to, as you say, test him... to allow Job the opportunity to humble himself.

The Only Way to a higher place with God is by going down and allowing Him to lift us up. Job was not learning that by himself...

"When thou art bidden of any man to a wedding, sit not down in the highest room; lest a more honourable man than thou be bidden of him;
And he that bade thee and him come and say to thee, Give this man place; and thou begin with shame to take the lowest room.
But when thou art bidden, go and sit down in the lowest room; that when he that bade thee cometh, he may say unto thee, Friend, go up higher: then shalt thou have worship in the presence of them that sit at meat with thee.
For whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted." Luke 14:8-11

On top of that he confessed a hidden truth about his faith...he said "that thing I FEARED the MOST...has come upon me." Fear is lack of trust? Lack of faith? Having too much cares of the world?
Yes he had to be tested...and he was purged of that fear. imho

This person's comment sums up what I perceived about Job.


Job 3:25

“For the thing which I greatly feared is come upon me, and that which I was afraid of is come unto me.”

King James Version (KJV)
William's comment on 2020-05-02 11:46:21:

Though Job was indeed a believer, yet there remained a fearfulness within him. It is a picture of the reality that no matter our level of walk with the Lord in this life, for most of us there is always another level of purification. In each instance with Satan at the throne God said, behold.... In other words the enemy had quit looking for access against Job because of the Lord's protection, but God is hones even with the enemy. The Lord showed Satan Job's weakness and used the enemy to purify Job for yet another level.

This shows what I see as a truth of the kingdom. Sooner or later God will bring you face to face with your greatest fear in order to show you that he is greater than all of your fear. Though Job demanded answers, when God actually presented himself in the whirlwind Job stood silent with his hand over his mouth knowing God was greatest of all and answered to no one.

 

[Davy]

I'm having a battle with Paul. I've asked Peter to come and work this out with me.
I've had this battle before but have not found a resolution.
In truth, I see Paul as the wolf who comes in and scatters the sheep.
Leading them towards the gentiles rather then leading the gentiles to God.
I am supposed to take the word of a man, that Jesus showed himself to him,
and no one with him could verify this. He has no witnesses.
John was a witness, the works that Jesus did was a witness. The words he spoke and the walk he walked are all found in the scriptures.
Paul aka Saul, began under the teaching of one Gamaliel. Who had perfect knowledge of the law. He was a "doctor" of the law. He doctored the law. I hear Jesus saying it is written in your law.. etc.. who was writing their law? Aye Gamaliel, the one Paul was learned by.
He claims to be a Jew and then a Roman, then an Israelite of the tribe of Benjamin.
He set out on a mission to destroy this new body which Jesus himself had begun.
He had letters from the High Priest and those who sat at the council meetings,
no doubt the same stock that had Jesus killed.
And I'm supposed to trust this Pharisee because he said, Jesus said...

I like what Paul says, it sounds sweet. It sounds easy. Just do this and you'll be fine.
I don't trust him. Plain and simple.
Whether you agree or disagree, right now doesn't matter.
He knows the law. He knows the prophets. I just feel he twists them.
All of a sudden what was tithing once every 3 years has now become a weekly collection.
It's a money thing... tv evangelists.. just send money to sow some seed..
a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.

The one sign God gave Isreal to show that they followed the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is the seventh day Sabbath.
Rome comes in, and mind you Paul claims to be a Roman, and changes the Sabbath to
Sun worship day. We know this. We've read this. it's documented. It's a fact.
And the reason they did so was because they hated the Jews.
IDOLATRY...
#1 cause for Israel backsliding.. every time.

Peter says the unstable and the unlearned wrest with Paul and his epistles.
That his words are hard to be understood. And I find myself hearing:
God is not the author of confusion.

From here forward I am the lunatick son.
I will most likely be falling into the water (grace) and into the fire (judgement) .
Any one who feels inclined to add to the discussion is welcome,
However, let me make this clear, My battle is not with you, it is with Paul
and being led away from God into a world of Idolatry.

Let the battle begin:

Absolutely nuts!

 

[Ziggy]

Absolutely nuts!

Don't comment until you read all..
you won't understand otherwise.
thank you
HUGS

 

[Davy]

Don't comment until you read all..
you won't understand otherwise.
thank you
HUGS

You made it very clear in your very first post! If you didn't mean it, you should not have said it!

You said:
"However, let me make this clear, My battle is not with you, it is with Paul
and being led away from God into a world of Idolatry."


Jesus chose Apostle Paul to write the majority of the New Testament Books! And Paul agrees with all... of Christ's Apostles, and the OT Patriarchs and prophets. The only difference was that Paul was not called and chosen by Jesus until later, on the way to Damascus per Acts 9. The Gospel Paul preached is the same Gospel Lord Jesus and His disciples preached, as Jesus chose Paul to preach The Gospel to the Gentiles AND to kings, AND to the children of Israel.

 

[Ziggy]

You made it very clear in your very first post! If you didn't mean it, you should not have said it!

You said:
"However, let me make this clear, My battle is not with you, it is with Paul
and being led away from God into a world of Idolatry."


Jesus chose Apostle Paul to write the majority of the New Testament Books! And Paul agrees with all... of Christ's Apostles, and the OT Patriarchs and prophets. The only difference was that Paul was not called and chosen by Jesus until later, on the way to Damascus per Acts 9. The Gospel Paul preached is the same Gospel Lord Jesus and His disciples preached, as Jesus chose Paul to preach The Gospel to the Gentiles AND to kings, AND to the children of Israel.

Thank you for your comment.

 

[Yan]

The scribes and Pharisees accused Jesus of Blasphemy for saying himself was God.
And that he cast out devils by Satan..
Jesus asked If I cast out devils by Satan, then who do you cast them out by?

Mat 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:
Mat 12:26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?
Mat 12:27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.
Mat 12:28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.

Is this what you mean Yan?

Hugs

That was part of it, but in other verse they always accused Jesus in those verses I'd shown above (Matthew 11:18; Mark 3:20-30; John 7:19-21; Luke 7:33; John 8:48-52; John 10:18-21). Jesus uses Beelzebub to cast out the devil (Ifrit) because Ifrit was the strongest evil creature (Mark 3:23-27) and mostly used in sorcery, and the only thing to cast it out is by using Beelzebub which has a higher degree rank in spiritual hierarchy, just like Jesus said satan cast out satan because in the world of satan uses hatred and pride that's why the higher rank of devil was used to show who Jesus is. But mostly all people who got the mystical disease by witchcraft always shown as golden tumors and golden mice (1 Samuel 6), this is mean as they always seek innocent people to be used as redemption of their sins such as corruption (symbolize as mice) and the golden part was symbolize as mammon, but since Jesus whosoever doeth the crime must carry their own sins into the cross and their offerings of the innocent blood were no longer can wipe out their sins instead of they commit more crime by violate the first commandment (Exodus 20:3), fifth commandment (Exodus 20:13), and 8th commandment (Exodus 20:16) because usually they used false flag propaganda to put someone else as their victim to be used as their sin redemption (similar to those freemason had done).

Why did not all believers could cast out beelzebub from a man similar to the sons of Sceva (Acts of the apostles 19:13-20), because they were lack of faith and fasting.
Mankind cannot cast the devil out from a man for entire life, that's why some people will encounter re-possession after they'd delivered out in exorcism (Mark 9:14-29; Luke 9:37-42). But re-possession could be from the witchcraft act, Jesus can cast out demons out from a man but Jesus can not stop the evil men who rebellious to God and practice witchcraft to harm others because some witchcraft have a freewill to be afraid of God or not, thats why these kind of people will be condemn by God on the day they died.

 

[Truther]

Don't comment until you read all..
you won't understand otherwise.
thank you
HUGS

Ziggy, your belief system is what troubles you.

Paul had the solution and you simply don't understand what he taught.

You think Paul contradicted himself, right?

 

[Ziggy]

If we were living in "those" days... which we are only more modern.
The people were sick. They had to donate to the temple for their sins. Their sickness they said was because they were sinners.
Just kept the money rolling, just like they do today. They had no mercy or compassion for the people.
They give them medicines which made them more sick, so they pay more at the money changing tables... kind of like the Pharmaceutical Industry we have today.

So Jesus.. God.. Healer.. goes on on HIS day to give people rest and healing.
And what did the establishment do? They criticised him for actually KEEPING the law.
See it says on the Sabbath you are not to do your own works.
Their works was killing people. Keeping them sick. Not only that, but because Jesus was healing on the Sabbath day, imagine how much money they lost come the first day of the week when people came to buy and sell for healing.

So this is the atmosphere that Saul lived under. This law of killing anyone who disobeyed with their law, their works.
He was not only sent to kill, but believed he did it as a service to God. In fact it was to Satan himself that sat in the Temple, showing himself that he , the establishment, was God.

When Jesus came, he came to destroy the works of the devil himself.
There was no possible way for Jesus to cast himself out of the Temple, because they already threw him out.
He asked.. how do you cast out satan then? They couldn't that's why people were sick. and they kept them sick.

Just like they do today.
If you chase after the world and the way it does things. No mercy, no compassion, no love. Then you living under the law of the Satan.
If you chase after Jesus and his Kingdom and do it His way. With Mercy, With Compassion, With Love. he you place yourself under the Law of Christ, which is the law of God, which is the Father of all those that believe and have faith in Him.

Paul needed to be drawn out of that abyss. He needed to REPENT and come back to the Lord.
And I seen that Light that shone on him on the way to damascus as it were Satan whom God allowed to "punish" him
for all that he had done in the name of God, which wasn't really God but was the devil sitting in the temple showing himself that he was God.

I'm good with Paul now. I seen his struggle with the flesh. I seen him overcome his own will and allowing Jesus to work His will.
I seen him get all kinds of plagues poured on him. Beatings, and prisons, and sickness, and cold, and hunger..
But Jesus said to Job... All this.. just save his life.. don't touch his life. It's mine, I paid for it.

And those three friends of Job, when you read their arguments they sound rational. But for some reason God didn't approve of their offerings.
He even had Job in the end offer up offerings for them.
And that's what I saw.. the struggle.. the I want, hear me, this is what I say... and that's what rubbed me the wrong way.
I saw him as the deceiver.. but he was the one who had been deceived, by following the beast system that sat in Jerusalem in those days.

Just like today.

Hugs
Thank You

 

[VictoryinJesus]

"that thing I FEARED the MOST...has come upon me."

Consider ‘that thing I feared the most has come upon me’ with
Hebrews 5:7-8 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; [8] Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;

Isaiah 11:1-5 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: [2] And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord ; [3] And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the Lord : and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears: [4] But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked. [5] And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.