kepha31 said:
It means he has been conned by Dave Hunt (a Whore duh Babble-on psycho) or something similar.
Lies of Dave Hunt #3
I have never read Dave Hunt. I have read some of the History of the Reformation by Wylie...I have read much of Foxe's Book of Martyrs...I have read books that used well known and trusted historians as sources for their works. Historians such as Wylie, deAubigne, Newton, and yes, even quotes from what many Catholics claim as the "early church "Catholic" fathers", as well as the records that have survived the persecutions and book burnings of the reformers. And yes, I agree that many of the reformers persecuted one another also...I am not holding up anyone as a paragon of virtue.
The Roman church did have its beginnings with the apostles. No one I think can refute that there was a Christian church in Rome by the end of the first century, and without doubt established even before Paul was carried there as a prisoner. The church at that time was persecuted mainly by Jews, but as the Roman hatred for Jews grew, the Christians also came under fire because of their connections to the synagogue as the early church still worshiped communally on Sabbath. You and other Catholic apologists have clamed that Sunday observance was instituted by the apostles, yet history, and even your own church, declares otherwise. This is just one example of many how the church of Rome slid into apostasy. The slide was gradual, but steady. It began in Rome and Alexandria, and over time, as the bishops of Rome found favor with the empire, and through various Empirical decrees such as the code of Justinian, gained civil influence over Rome and found power and influence to their liking, and became corrupted, enforcing Sunday observance over all the churches that decided to surrender to Roman authority, thus leavening the church. This apostasy spread,
but where Rome had little or no influence in those early centuries, there were Christian churches independent and continuing to observe the Sabbath.
"The primitive Christians did keep the Sabbath of the Jews;...therefore the Christians, for a long time together, did keep their conventions upon the Sabbath, in which some portions of the law were read: and this continued till the time of the Laodicean council." "The Whole Works" of Jeremy Taylor, Vol. IX,p. 416 (R. Heber's Edition, Vol XII, p. 416).
"From the apostles' time until the council of Laodicea, which was about the year 364, the holy observance of the Jews' Sabbath continued, as may be proved out of many authors: yea, notwithstanding the decree of the council against it." "Sunday a Sabbath." John Ley, p.163. London: 1640.
"Thou shalt observe the Sabbath, on account of Him who ceased from His work of creation, but ceased not from His work of providence: it is a rest for meditation of the law, not for idleness of the hands." "The Anti-Nicene Fathers," Vol 7,p. 413. From "Constitutions of the Holy Apostles," a document of the 3rd and 4th Centuries.
There is historical evidence that as early as the 3rd century there were large Sabbath keeping bishoprics or conferences in the eastern lands from Palestine to India. In later centuries these churches through the spread of the gospel extended as far as Seres (China) and Mongolia. The heresy of Sunday observance was limited to only those churches in the west that bowed their knees to the Roman bishops forsaking the Bible as their only source of spiritual authority.
Ambrose, the bishop of Milan in the 4th century, gave rise to the ancient saying "when in Rome, do as the Romans do" . In Milan, he observed the 7th day Sabbath. When in Rome, he observed Sunday.
"It was the practice generally of the Easterne Churches; and some churches of the west...For in the Church of Millaine (Milan);...it seems the Saturday was held in a farre esteeme... Not that the Easterne Churches, or any of the rest which observed that day, were inclined to Iudaisme (Judaism); but that they came together on the Sabbath day, to worship Iesus (Jesus) Christ the Lord of the Sabbath." "History of the Sabbath" (original spelling retained), Part 2, par. 5, pp.73, 74. London: 1636. Dr. Heylyn.
In the 4th century...."The ancient Christians were very careful in the observance of Saturday, or the seventh day...It is plain that all the Oriental churches, and the greatest part of the world, observed the Sabbath as a festival...Athanasius likewise tells us that they held religious assembles on the Sabbath, not because they were infected with Judaism, but to worship Jesus, the Lord of the Sabbath, Epiphanius says the same." "Antiquities of the Christian Church," Vol.II Book XX, chap. 3, sec.1, 66. 1137,1138.
Abyssinia - Remnants of Philip's Evangelism
"In the last half of that century St. Ambrose of Milan stated officially that the Abyssinian bishop, Museus, had 'traveled almost everywhere in the country of the Seres' (China). For more than seventeen centuries the Abyssinian Church continued to sanctify Saturday as the holy day of the fourth commandment." Ambrose, DeMoribus, Brachmanorium Opera Ominia, 1132, found in Migne, Patrologia Latima, Vol.17, pp.1131,1132.
Arabia, Persia, India, China
"Mingana proves that in 370 A.D. Abyssinian Christianity (a Sabbath keeping church) was so popular that its famous director, Musacus, travelled extensively in the East promoting the church in Arabia, Persia, India and China."
Council Laodicea - A.D.365
"Canon 16-On Saturday the Gospels and other portions of the Scripture shall be read aloud." "Canon 29-Christians shall not Judaize and be idle on Saturday, but shall work on that day; but the Lord's day they shall especially honor, and as being Christians, shall, if possible, do no work on that day."
"The Church, on the other hand, after changing the day of rest from the Jewish Sabbath, or seventh day of the week, to the first, made the Third Commandment refer to Sunday as the day to be kept holy as the Lord's Day. The Council of Trent (Sess. VI, can. xix) condemns those who deny that the Ten Commandments are binding on Christians." The Catholic Encyclopedia, Commandments of God, Volume IV, © 1908 by Robert Appleton Company, Online Edition © 1999 by Kevin Knight, Nihil Obstat - Remy Lafort, Censor Imprimatur - +John M. Farley, Archbishop of New York, page 153.
"...
you may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we never sanctify." The Faith of Our Fathers, by James Cardinal Gibbons, Archbishop of Baltimore, 88th edition, page 89. Originally published in 1876, republished and Copyright 1980 by TAN Books and Publishers, Inc., pages 72-73.
''Of course the Catholic Church claims that the change was her act. And the act is a mark of her ecclesiastical power and authority in religious matters.'' C. F. Thomas, Chancellor of Cardinal Gibbons, in answer to a letter regarding the change of the Sabbath, November 11, 1895.
“Tradition, not Scripture, is the rock on which the church of Jesus Christ is built.” Adrien Nampon, Catholic Doctrine as Defined by the Council of Trent, p. 157
"The Pope is of so great authority and power that he can modify, explain, or interpret even divine law". The pope can modify divine law, since his power is not of man, but of God, and he acts a vicegerent of God upon earth" Lucius Ferraris, Prompta Bibliotheca, art. Papa, II, Vol. VI, p. 29.
Apostasy is written all across the history of the Roman Church and its written in the blood of the 100s of 1000s of martyrs who gave their lives in defense of truth and conscience. You will claim that "the gates of hell could not prevail against the church", therefore the Catholic Church could not apostatize. The thing though that escapes you is that God's true church...those who did not bow to Roman usurped authority, were not prevailed against. There was always a remnant who did not bow their knees to Baal. Just as there is a remnant today.