When exactly do you become a Christian?

[GodsGrace]

Think about it how does someone start to get on the road to life? In my opinion it all starts with reading what Jesus has to say in the four Gospels then little by little start listening to his words and do what he says to do.

I am going to reread the Bible again, but first I am going to read the gospels so many times I have Jesus words memorized, in this way I can listen to Jesus words and put all his words into practice, little by little I can change into a better person following the words of Christ Jesus.



Reply

I agree with you wholeheartedly walter.
Jesus' commandments are not burdensome.
His load is easy and His burden is light.
LOVE GOD
LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR
LOVE YOURSELF

And when it SEEMS that there is some conflict between Jesus and any other NT writer...
we look to JESUS for the answer.

 

[Hillsage]

Because we are saved first and our spirit becomes alive.....
OR we gain the spirit quality of our being .... I can live with either understanding.

Scripture doesn't say our spirit was 'resurrected', it says it was "born again". And I believe our spirit's rebirth happened when the 'christos annointing' from GOD is being smeared onto our birth spirit. That's my latest UN-ORTHODOX view with our study in this thread.

Who said anything about 41 years??

I just did a Google search for a chronological bible timeline as to when those 3 verses were written. That's why I said; "There were no creeds saying "christian" in 41AD, 61AD, 62AD when the word "christian" was mentioned 2 times in ACTS and 1 time in 1Peter."

Why do we make everything so complicated?
The first creed is found in
1 Corinthians 15:3-4
3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,

Of course you know the above verse..so apparently you don't agree with it.
I'd ask who is the father of Jesus according to Luke 1:35.

The spirit of Jesus was first birthed from The Holy Spirit of God starting with the first man Adam at his creation in WEST EDEN. Then God planted "a garden EASTWARD in Eden." Then He anointed/'christos' the spirit of the first man Adam. I believe (unorthodox) that God 'with that anointing'; He called him (ekklesia) out of the 'world of mankind' and took him EAST to that Garden. That's my opinion and it doesn't matter if it's right or wrong.

But for me it explains so many questions never dealt with. Like the Barasovka mammoths in Siberia which are frozen in glaciers with undigested subtropical vegetation in their mouths.

So are you saying that we have scripture that is corrupted?

Yeah, but you can debate that with Aunty Jane I'm not interested. Just studied enough history to convince me AND to know I am not alone.

And what took 400 years??
The Apostles believed Jesus was divine and so did those the Apostles taught.
What took some time to understand was HOW a person could be explained as being both divine and human.
THIS is what took some time.
Jesus' divinity was never questioned.

If it was so well taught by the apostles then why was the church still fighting over it until the council of Nicaea in 325AD? And why are there ONENESS and UNITARIAN denominations today?

Jesus did say to not fear those that could kill the body but those that could kill the soul.
I'm not at all certain of how you understand 1 Peter 1:9-111

What part of 'triune man' was left out of your gehenna/hell verse, quoted above? It would be 'spirit'. Because you can't kill a spirit. All Spirits are eternal and therefore "ye are gods" (little g).

How did Peter deal with your quoted above verse?
1PE 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: 19 By which also he went and preached unto the SPIRITS in prison;

As for OSAS how did Peter deal with your position?
1PE 1:23* Being born again,(spirit) not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

This last verse spells out quite clearly how the soul is saved.
1PE 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit....." (bad place for theologians to capitalize the 'spirit of Cc-hrist' which is you and is in you alone, just as it is in 'many membered body' which is His corporate body)

obey the leading of the christos/anointed spirit in you. "....unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:
Therein lies the HIGH calling of the 'christ' anointing. A calling I don't see any of us having for ALL "the brethren".

I'm trying to keep the cookie jar low enough for all to get their hand in....to taste and see....where I am coming from.

 

[GodsGrace]

Scripture doesn't say our spirit was 'resurrected', it says it was "born again". And I believe our spirit's rebirth happened when the 'christos annointing' from GOD is being smeared onto our birth spirit. That's my latest UN-ORTHODOX view with our study in this thread.

I didn't use the word RESURRECTED Hillsage...
I said the spirit is made alive.
The spirit of each man is not active UNTIL a person becomes born from above.

I just did a Google search for a chronological bible timeline as to when those 3 verses were written. That's why I said; "There were no creeds saying "christian" in 41AD, 61AD, 62AD when the word "christian" was mentioned 2 times in ACTS and 1 time in 1Peter."

What 3 verses?
I gave you the first creed in 1 Corinthians 15.
You could not believe this if you so wish.

As to the word Christian....
OK

But I'm not too interested in when words came about.

The spirit of Jesus was first birthed from The Holy Spirit of God starting with the first man Adam at his creation in WEST EDEN. Then God planted "a garden EASTWARD in Eden." Then He anointed/'christos' the spirit of the first man Adam. I believe (unorthodox) that God 'with that anointing'; He called him (ekklesia) out of the 'world of mankind' and took him EAST to that Garden. That's my opinion and it doesn't matter if it's right or wrong.

LOL
That's your opinion and you don't care if it's right or wrong.
I don't know....I thought I was speaking to an ADULT here!


How do you like this:
This Forum is called Christiansfortalk.
That's my opinion and I don't care if it's right or wrong.

But for me it explains so many questions never dealt with. Like the Barasovka mammoths in Siberia which are frozen in glaciers with undigested subtropical vegetation in their mouths.

What do mammoths in Siberia have to do with the Christian faith disintegrating because some are coming up with their very own version of Christianity?

You know...like persons that want to believe there were 2 Edens...one on the West side and one on the East side.
You can believe whatever you want to believe.....
but it will NOT be orthodox....accepted Christian teaching.

What other questions are you wondering about?
Who Cain married?
Musta been one of those East Side girls....(Billy Joel types).

You can think it...can't stop your brain.
But we just cannot know and should not speculate.

Yeah, but you can debate that with Aunty Jane I'm not interested. Just studied enough history to convince me AND to know I am not alone.

What should I debatge with Aunty Jane? She seems like a nice enough gal.
YOU made a statement about scripture being corrupted.
I thought you were Muslim there for a second.

If it was so well taught by the apostles then why was the church still fighting over it until the council of Nicaea in 325AD? And why are there ONENESS and UNITARIAN denominations today?

The church wasn't fighting over anything.
Creeds are to CLARIFY and put down in words (Elton John) what the CHURCH believes.

You should find out about Creeds and study some church history.
I like to tell this to as many persons as I can----but do they listen?
NO!

What part of 'triune man' was left out of your gehenna/hell verse, quoted above? It would be 'spirit'. Because you can't kill a spirit. All Spirits are eternal and therefore "ye are gods" (little g).

Yes sir.
The spirit cannot be killed.

How did Peter deal with your quoted above verse?
1PE 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: 19 By which also he went and preached unto the SPIRITS in prison;

YOU brought up the verse Hillsage...
Personally, I don't like discussing hell...although it exists for sure.

As for OSAS how did Peter deal with your position?
1PE 1:23* Being born again,(spirit) not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

The seed is not corruptible.
The word of God liveth forever.
This is what Peter stated.

Your SALVATION however, can become lost...it depends on YOU.

Peter also stated that baptism now saves us....
I hope you believe him when he teaches that too.

This last verse spells out quite clearly how the soul is saved.
1PE 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit....." (bad place for theologians to capitalize the 'spirit of Cc-hrist' which is you and is in you alone, just as it is in 'many membered body' which is His corporate body)

Ah.
So you don't believe in the Trinity.
Where is the word SPIRIT in 1 Peter 1:22 ??

obey the leading of the christos/anointed spirit in you. "....unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:
Therein lies the HIGH calling of the 'christ' anointing. A calling I don't see any of us having for ALL "the brethren".

I'm trying to keep the cookie jar low enough for all to get their hand in....to taste and see....where I am coming from.

Maybe the cookie jar is too low....
Because you are a very mysterious fellow.

 

[Hillsage]

What is The Way?

Good question, I'm trying to study that PATH now....but you keep interrupting with more elephant texts that take too long for me to respond to....

What is the difference between The Way and Christianity?

The closest person to me spiritually now, is the one who asked me your first question above, and then your second one below it. I studied afterward. What I posted (#178) was all I found after she asked. In that study on The Way I have now also found another term I am seeking enlightenment on. That being; "the Holy One". Jesus was called that first by apostle John then by demons.

But it sounds important, as I am presently dwelling on this next verse; Reminding you how few times Holy One (with caps) is also found in some translations of the NT.

1JO 2:20* But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.

And John was speaking of 'this topic' just two versus earlier in regard to the infiltration into the church, of the spirit of anti-christ. A spirit which had crept into the church robbing it of being truly led by the 'spirit of christ' which indwells every true born again believer. IN MY OPINION of course.

1JO 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.


Maybe those who were in The Way were the "little children" (immature babes) who did progress to being totally 'holy as Jesus was holy' and 'perfect as our heavenly Father' in their christian walks to atain being called mature/perfect....christian.

1CO 2:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are PERFECT:.....

Works for me so far. But still a work in progress.

 

[GodsGrace]

Good question, I'm trying to study that PATH now....but you keep interrupting with more elephant texts that take too long for me to respond to....

Gosh golly gee.
You must be older than I am !

The closest person to me spiritually now, is the one who asked me your first question above, and then your second one below it. I studied afterward. What I posted (#178) was all I found after she asked. In that study on The Way I have now also found another term I am seeking enlightenment on. That being; "the Holy One". Jesus was called that first by apostle John then by demons.

But it sounds important, as I am presently dwelling on this next verse; Reminding you how few times Holy One (with caps) is also found in some translations of the NT.

1JO 2:20* But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.

And John was speaking of 'this topic' just two versus earlier in regard to the infiltration into the church, of the spirit of anti-christ. A spirit which had crept into the church robbing it of being truly led by the 'spirit of christ' which indwells every true born again believer. IN MY OPINION of course.

1JO 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.


Maybe those who were in The Way were the "little children" (immature babes) who did progress to being totally 'holy as Jesus was holy' and 'perfect as our heavenly Father' in their christian walks to atain being called mature/perfect....christian.

1CO 2:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are PERFECT:.....

Works for me so far. But still a work in progress.

Come back and report when you find out that the Way just means those that were following Christ....
They used to be Jewish...now they were following The Way.

It's exactly the same as being Christian except that the early Christians devised some tenets for the Christian religion....
as opposed to the Jewish Religion or the Islamic Religion.

They have their set of rules and we should have ours.
are YOU following the rules of Christianity?
Do YOU know what they are?

Enough for now Hillsage.
I'm a little worried that your blood pressure might get too high.

And I hope you know that I'm just kidding around half the time.
'night.

 

[Hillsage]

And I hope you know that I'm just kidding around half the time.
'night.

Kidding doesn't leave bite marks 'half the time'. And the other half of what you are saying leads me to believe I should make better use of my time.

This is a 'Nitenite' emoji. Have a good sleep.

 

[walter]

I do not rely on my self, I rely on Jesus words written in the Bible - when I read Jesus words it's like he is right next to me, giving me his advice and his instructions. And I pray to God for guidance also. I allow Jesus actual words to be my commentary.

Mark 7:7
They worship me in vain; their teachings are merely human rules.’ NIV

John 10:27
My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. New King James Bible

Luke 9:35
Then a voice from the cloud said, “This is my Son, my Chosen One. Listen to him.” New Living Translation

Matthew 7:24-26
24 “Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. 25 The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock. 26 But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand. NIV

John 18:37
....Everyone who belongs to the truth listens to My voice.” Berean Standard Bible

Matthew 7:7
New Living Translation
“Keep on asking, and you will receive what you ask for. Keep on seeking, and you will find. Keep on knocking, and the door will be opened to you.

Last edited: Today at 5:41 AM

====
I am very reluctant to listen to what any man has to say because of scriptures like these:

Matthew 24:23
“Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it.
24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect.
New King James Version

Matthew 24:5
5  for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many. NWT

Matthew 7:15
Holman Christian Standard Bible
“Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravaging wolves.

Galatians 1:8
New International Version
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse!

Mark 7:8-9
Weymouth New Testament
8 "You neglect God's Commandment: you hold fast to men's traditions." 9 "Praiseworthy indeed!" He added, "to set at nought God's Commandment in order to observe your own traditions!

2 John 9-11
9 Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take them into your house or welcome them. 11 Anyone who welcomes them shares in their wicked work. NIV

Romans 16:17
17  Now I urge you, brothers, to keep your eye on those who create divisions and causes for stumbling contrary to the teaching that you have learned, and avoid them.

Acts 17:11, 2 Timothy 3:16-17, Romans 15:4, John 17:17, 1 Thessalonians 2:13

I don't trust any commentary that explains anything unless it comes from Jesus or an Apostle. Each and every scripture guides me a little bit more.

* The Father and Jesus give specific instructions for us to listen to Jesus and Jesus gives us specific instructions not to listen to the traditions of men.

 

[GodsGrace]

Kidding doesn't leave bite marks 'half the time'. And the other half of what you are saying leads me to believe I should make better use of my time.

This is a 'Nitenite' emoji. Have a good sleep.

LOL
I agree Hillsage.
No kidding around with you!

And here's how you could make better use of your time...
try to study what it means to be a Christian.
Stop adding weird ideas to a religion that is ALREADY established and which just requires FOLLOWING
by those that believe that Jesus is God and that He is the Lord of their life and what this means.
Learn orthodox Christianity and leave the weird ideas behind.

And I'm not kidding.

 

[GodsGrace]

I do not rely on my self, I rely on Jesus words written in the Bible - when I read Jesus words it's like he is right next to me, giving me his advice and his instructions. And I pray to God for guidance also. I allow Jesus actual words to be my commentary.

Mark 7:7
They worship me in vain; their teachings are merely human rules.’ NIV

John 10:27
My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. New King James Bible

Luke 9:35
Then a voice from the cloud said, “This is my Son, my Chosen One. Listen to him.” New Living Translation

Matthew 7:24-26
24 “Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. 25 The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock. 26 But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand. NIV

John 18:37
....Everyone who belongs to the truth listens to My voice.” Berean Standard Bible

Matthew 7:7
New Living Translation
“Keep on asking, and you will receive what you ask for. Keep on seeking, and you will find. Keep on knocking, and the door will be opened to you.

Last edited: Today at 5:41 AM

====
I am very reluctant to listen to what any man has to say because of scriptures like these:

Matthew 24:23
“Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it.
24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect.
New King James Version

Matthew 24:5
5  for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many. NWT

Matthew 7:15
Holman Christian Standard Bible
“Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravaging wolves.

Galatians 1:8
New International Version
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse!

Mark 7:8-9
Weymouth New Testament
8 "You neglect God's Commandment: you hold fast to men's traditions." 9 "Praiseworthy indeed!" He added, "to set at nought God's Commandment in order to observe your own traditions!

2 John 9-11
9 Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take them into your house or welcome them. 11 Anyone who welcomes them shares in their wicked work. NIV

Romans 16:17
17  Now I urge you, brothers, to keep your eye on those who create divisions and causes for stumbling contrary to the teaching that you have learned, and avoid them.

Acts 17:11, 2 Timothy 3:16-17, Romans 15:4, John 17:17, 1 Thessalonians 2:13

I don't trust any commentary that explains anything unless it comes from Jesus or an Apostle. Each and every scripture guides me a little bit more.

* The Father and Jesus give specific instructions for us to listen to Jesus and Jesus gives us specific instructions not to listen to the traditions of men.

Well, actually, Paul did instruct the Thessalonians to hold to what they were taught both in writing and ORALLY.
He was referring to traditions...a tradition, in this case, means a teaching.

Otherwise, generally, I agree with you post.

2 Thessalonians 2:15
15 So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught, whether by word of mouth or by letter from us.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes...the beginning of a new course in life.
Baptism was not a Jewish practice...not a ritual washing like the Mikva.
Jesus’ baptism was a presenting of himself to do the will of his Father, surrendering his own will and sticking to this difficult course that he knew would end with his death.
He was baptized with water first, and then came the baptism with Holy Spirit. You can’t have one without the other.

Jesus surrendered His human will.
His divine will was exactly the same as the Father's will.
Yes.

The significance of water baptism is made a mockery of by the churches who baptize infants, as if there is some magic charm in sprinkling water on a baby. There is no proxy arrangement as each one must make a personal decision to follow Christ, once they are of accountable age......minor children are judged by their parent’s relationship with God (even if only one is a Christian. 1 Cor 7:14)

I have to agree.
There was a reason why infants were baptized in the early church.
Augustine changed this reason in the 5th century.
Today, baptizing an infant is a mockery, as you've stated.

There are still two baptisms now, as the first one is made in full knowledge of what it means to be a Christian, and comes with the forgiveness of sins (with the blood Jesus shed on our behalf) and a presenting of ourselves according to that knowledge, and the making of a commitment to God as a footstep follower of his precious son.
Only in that condition can the second baptism with Holy Spirit take place.
The first one is about our choice to serve God, and the second is about God’s choice as to where we serve him.....I do not believe that all Christians are going to heaven...only those baptized with the spirit will enter heaven as “born again” after their resurrection to spirit life in heaven.

You're speaking outside of orthodox Christianity and I will not reply to this.
The Holy Spirit is received at baptism. Even in infant baptism.

I don't know what you mean by the second baptism being about God's choice as to where to serve Him.
We serve God every waking moment----when we want to; sometimes we fail.

§Those that enter heaven are those that believed in God and lived their life as best they good obeying Him.
We are born from above when we decide to follow God and the spirit never dies.

The resurrection takes place when our soul and spirit is rejoined with our body at the end of time.

Earth was never supposed to be a training ground for heaven......spirit life in heaven was not even mentioned to Adam, who threw away the blessed life that humans were meant to enjoy on earth.
That didn’t mean that God changed his mind about who was going to live here. He carefully and lovingly prepared this earth for human life in beautiful surroundings and with an abundance of everything for their enjoyment...even the other creatures who were made to share life here with us, would add to our enjoyment.

Agreed.
Do some state that this is a training ground?

Isaiah’s prophesies give us a glimpse of the life to come....(Isa 65:16-25)

Yes, those who take the lead are held to a much higher standard and accountability as was demonstrated even in Jesus’ day with the Pharisees....because they had led the people into error, Jesus consigned them to “Gehenna”....a place of no return. Religious leaders even today are held to that same standard.

Agreed.
James 3:1
1 Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, knowing that as such we will incur a stricter judgment.

All false religion in the Bible is grouped into one entity, called in Revelation, “Babylon the great” or “the greater Babylon” (Rev 17:3-6; Rev 18:4-5)....so what is the Babylon connection?

Why is this entity pictured as a harlot, and the mother of all the other harlots? This is satan’s global Religious empire.......it is global because it embraces all the false religious concepts that originated in ancient Babylon.

As you might recall, Babylon was the place where Nimrod raised up rebellion again after the flood. He and his cronies did not want to spread abroad in the earth as God had instructed them, because they wanted to stay where they were and make a “celebrated name” for themselves and to build cities......one with a tower with its top in the heavens to their own glory......but God put a stop to that by confusing their language so that they left off building that tower (Gen 11:1-9).....but their subsequent scattering after that did not make their grandiose ideas go away however......because every group who understood one another, settled in a different place, but took their basic ideas with them. Which explains why the same themes are found in all false worship, no matter where they lived on earth, in what culture they formed, or what they called themselves.

A flood legend is known in almost every culture on earth, and the same basic elements of false worship are present in their beliefs and practices....these include the worship of multiple gods...belief in immediate life after death...and a hell of eternal torture in flames, contrasted with a heaven of eternal bliss.

None of these concepts were found in the Jewish faith among those whom God rescued from Egyptian slavery, giving them his written laws and instruction about acceptable worship.
None are found in Jewish Scripture, but after many centuries of apostasy, they too succumbed to many of these false teachings....especially about death and the afterlife.

So if the belief system we choose has any or all of those concepts lingering....it is the wrong religion.....
”Babylon the great” is an affront to the true God, Yahweh and his worship. Accepting the lies as truth doesn’t mean arguing about details of the same lie....it is that we accepted the lie as truth in the first place....can you see the difference?

The Christian religion relies on what Jesus taught.
Jesus is the ultimate revelation of God and we are to follow HIS teachings.

What you say about the OT is true,,,,but God revealed Himself to different generations.
At different times.
He removed those to whom He revealed Himself from pagan teachings.... from the religions that were worshipping a multitude of gods.

When Israel fell to the worship of false gods, Yahweh accused them of “adultery”...spiritual adultery. So all false worship elicits the same response from him to this day. “Babylon the great” is a prostitute....in bed with the world that Jesus told us to be “no part” of. (John 18:36; James 4:4)

False worship has one author....and so does true worship....and never the twain shall meet. If it does, and our beliefs are nothing more than glossed over Babylonian concepts, then our worship of God is futile. (2 Cor 6:14-18; Rev 18:4-5)

It all comes down to what one believes false worship is.
ANY denomination that has sprung up very recently will never be following the worship that Jesus taught,,,that was foretold in the OT,,,and that the Apostles taught.

That will include, the LDS, the JWs, Scientology, SDA, I'd add to this the religion of Islam.

This is not to say that those in these denominations cannot be saved,,,,
but I AM saying that what they teach is NOT orthodox. It is NOT mainline Christianity,,,it is NOT what the Apostles taught and it's the APOSTLES that were with Jesus and knew what HE taught.

Any teaching outside of this is not orthodox Christianity.

 

[Matthias]

Jesus surrendered His human will.
His divine will was exactly the same as the Father's will.
Yes.

I have to agree.
There was a reason why infants were baptized in the early church.
Augustine changed this reason in the 5th century.
Today, baptizing an infant is a mockery, as you've stated.


You're speaking outside of orthodox Christianity and I will not reply to this.
The Holy Spirit is received at baptism. Even in infant baptism.

I don't know what you mean by the second baptism being about God's choice as to where to serve Him.
We serve God every waking moment----when we want to; sometimes we fail.

§Those that enter heaven are those that believed in God and lived their life as best they good obeying Him.
We are born from above when we decide to follow God and the spirit never dies.

The resurrection takes place when our soul and spirit is rejoined with our body at the end of time.



Agreed.
Do some state that this is a training ground?


Agreed.
James 3:1
1 Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, knowing that as such we will incur a stricter judgment.


The Christian religion relies on what Jesus taught.
Jesus is the ultimate revelation of God and we are to follow HIS teachings.

What you say about the OT is true,,,,but God revealed Himself to different generations.
At different times.
He removed those to whom He revealed Himself from pagan teachings.... from the religions that were worshipping a multitude of gods.

It all comes down to what one believes false worship is.
ANY denomination that has sprung up very recently will never be following the worship that Jesus taught,,,that was foretold in the OT,,,and that the Apostles taught.

That will include, the LDS, the JWs, Scientology, SDA, I'd add to this the religion of Islam.

This is not to say that those in these denominations cannot be saved,,,,
but I AM saying that what they teach is NOT orthodox. It is NOT mainline Christianity,,,it is NOT what the Apostles taught and it's the APOSTLES that were with Jesus and knew what HE taught.

Any teaching outside of this is not orthodox Christianity.

What would you say is the difference between “orthodox Christianity” and “Christianity”?

 

[walter]

Well, actually, Paul did instruct the Thessalonians to hold to what they were taught both in writing and ORALLY.
He was referring to traditions...a tradition, in this case, means a teaching.

Otherwise, generally, I agree with you post.

2 Thessalonians 2:15
15 So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught, whether by word of mouth or by letter from us.

I agree with any tradition that can be explained with scriptures alone, Jesus warned us of tradition that changed the meaning and did not follow scripture.

 

[GodsGrace]

What would you say is the difference between “orthodox Christianity” and “Christianity”?

Simple.
Orthodox (small o) is just good, ole' plain Christianity the way it was taught in the early church and which dictated the belief system for this religion/faith.

Christianity, these days, could mean anything.
Some believe it means that they follow Jesus - whatever that means to them.
Some believe they could make up their own Christian doctrine/tenets....
including not believing in baptism,,,including not believing that Jesus is §God,,,
including that a person could never lose their salvation -no matter what-, including that good works
are not necessary.

etc.

 

[GodsGrace]

I agree with any tradition that can be explained with scriptures alone, Jesus warned us of tradition that changed the meaning and did not follow scripture.

I'd have to say that anything THE APOSTLES taught
will necessarily have to be found in the bible.

I don't believe Jesus taught them anything weird that is not found in scripture.
However, I also believe that some on these Forums believe stuff Jesus never taught and they think it's found in scripture...
What the Apostles taught is the truth.
(but first comes Jesus, of course).
The Apostles clarified what Jesus taught - when necessary.

 

[walter]

I don't believe Jesus taught them anything weird that is not found in scripture.

I agree with you 100% You love Jesus, his Father and the Bible, we have something in common.

 

[GodsGrace]

I agree with you 100% You love Jesus, his Father and the Bible, we have something in common.

I hope we have something in common.
I love God Father, God Son and God Holy Spirit.

 

[walter]

I hope we have something in common.
I love God Father, God Son and God Holy Spirit.

Does Jesus speak those words? If he did I would believe them, and I would think his followers would talk about what Jesus taught them.

Acts 17:11
Berean Standard Bible
Now the Bereans were more noble-minded than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if these teachings were true.

That's exactly what I do like the Bereans, I examine the Scriptures every day to see if these teachings were true.

I don't go with something I figured out is true, Jesus and the apostles speak in agreement, and I listen and do what they say.

 

[Matthias]

Simple.
Orthodox (small o) is just good, ole' plain Christianity the way it was taught in the early church and which dictated the belief system for this religion/faith.

Christianity, these days, could mean anything.
Some believe it means that they follow Jesus - whatever that means to them.
Some believe they could make up their own Christian doctrine/tenets....
including not believing in baptism,,,including not believing that Jesus is §God,,,
including that a person could never lose their salvation -no matter what-, including that good works
are not necessary.

etc.

“Christianity, these days, could mean anything.”

I don’t think it can - perhaps you are using hyperbole - but I do believe Christianity is a spectrum which began before orthodoxy with the Jewish sect (Jewish Christianity),includes orthodoxy, and extends beyond orthodoxy.

A couple of days ago I posted the following quote from Gavin Ortlund (a Protestant pastor; Baptist) and it received little attention -

“The early church did not look Protestant.

It also did not look Roman Catholic or Eastern Orthodox.

The early church looked like the early church: imperial, diverse, foreign, changing, harsh, beautiful, and profound.

It is a tradition we all relate to but no single church today owns.”

https://x.com/gavinortlund/status/1971652569568063989?s=46&t=T64e94h2unfHH-VO4i01zA

I’d like to hear your thoughts on what he said.

 

[GodsGrace]

Does Jesus speak those words? If he did I would believe them, and I would think his followers would talk about what Jesus taught them.

Acts 17:11
Berean Standard Bible
Now the Bereans were more noble-minded than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if these teachings were true.

That's exactly what I do like the Bereans, I examine the Scriptures every day to see if these teachings were true.

I don't go with something I figured out is true, Jesus and the apostles speak in agreement, and I listen and do what they say.

I'm not going to get into this Walter....because, apparently, you do not believe in the Trinity and to be considered a Christian a person must believe in the Trinity.

Yes. Jesus HIMSELF stated that He is God.

Jesus said MY FATHER AND I ARE ONE.
Not one like you and I might be one.
ONE IN NATURE.
John 10:30
Jesus had a divine nature while on earth.

WHOEVER HAS SEEN ME HAS SEEN THE FATHER.
Seeing Jesus is the same as Seeing God Father.
John 14:9

YOU HAVE SAID IT.
To the High Priest at His trial when asked "Are you the Christ, the son of God?"
Matthew 26:64


You're not studying scripture Walter.
You're studying what someone is telling you...
Your truth is what someone is inculcating in you.
Read the NT for yourself instead if you want to be like the Bereans.

 

[Behold]

I'm not going to get into this Walter....because, apparently, you do not believe in the Trinity

The doctrine of the Trinity, was created about 400 Yrs after Christ was Crucified.

So, it was not believed by 400 yrs of born again Christians, as it was not yet created as a Theology.

No one has to beleive in the Trinity to be a Christian.

God only requires faith in Christ., to become a Christian.

What you are teaching is what the Catholic Church teaches, while you claim you're not a Catholic.