Where Do People Go During God's Wrath?

[tomwebster]

When/if you're able to address posted Scripture you might get another reply from me.

Your verse: "Psa 139:13 For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb, " is talking about the making of your physical body, the covering, and has little to do with our conversation.

 

[TexUs]

So "inmost being" is now the external "covering"?

 

[tomwebster]

So "inmost being" is now the external "covering"?

Wrong word, the word you must be talking about is H3629 and it is still talking about the physical, flesh body. I have know idea where you saw "inmost being."

Psa 139:13 For (H3588) thou (H859) hast possessed (H7069) my reinsH3629) thou hast covered (H5526) me in my mother's (H517) womb. (H990)

Psa 139:13 כיH3588 אתהH859 קניתH7069 כליתיH3629 תסכניH5526 בבטןH990 אמי׃H517

Added: Both words are talking about the body. We are created in the image and likeness of God. Let me try to explain it differently because I do not think you are following what I am saying. We, humans, are a three part being, just like God is a three part being. We have a soul, we have a spirit, and we have a body. When we were in heaven with God, who created us in the first earth age, we had an angelic body, now, in this age, we have a flesh body. When we die, our flesh body returns to the dust of the ground, from which it was made, and once again we take on our angelic body. Our soul and spirit need a body to house it.

 

[TexUs]

Wrong word, the word you must be talking about is H3629 and it is still talking about the physical, flesh body. I have know idea where you saw "inmost being."

In the mode widely circulated translation, the NIV. I don't advocate for it, it's just what I can see the fastest, but the "no idea" thing throws me off...

ESV: inmost parts
NASB: inward parts

Take your pick.

And I don't think you can arrive at Ps 139:13 supporting a physical body. I'd concede to, "it can be either" but I don't think it can be physical for sure.
It's translated and used other places as heart, mind, kidneys... Suffice it to say, the author was clear he was referring to something inwardly. More than just "sack of bones". "inner being" or "inner parts" is a pretty darn good translation of the most likely meaning.

So what did God "stitch together" from inwardly that'd have Psalm 139:13 make sense? Because soul certainly does. Meat bag does not.

When we were in heaven with God, who created us in the first earth age

Support this with scripture.

Our soul and spirit need a body to house it.

As well as this.

 

[tomwebster]

In the mode widely circulated translation, the NIV. I don't advocate for it, it's just what I can see the fastest, but the "no idea" thing throws me off...

ESV: inmost parts
NASB: inward parts

Take your pick.

I never use those nor do I look at them, I don't trust the translators. When I study Scripture I use the KJV, and the Hebrew and Greek text. I also use common sense.

And I don't think you can arrive at Ps 139:13 supporting a physical body.

I do and I did!

I'd concede to, "it can be either" but I don't think it can be physical for sure.
It's translated and used other places as heart, mind, kidneys... Suffice it to say, the author was clear he was referring to something inwardly. More than just "sack of bones". "inner being" or "inner parts" is a pretty darn good translation of the most likely meaning.

So what did God "stitch together" from inwardly that'd have Psalm 139:13 make sense? Because soul certainly does. Meat bag does not.

The whole physical body, inside and out. The soul and spirit are separate from the body just as Christ and the Holy Spirit are separate from God in the Trinity. I don't care if you agree or not.

Support this with scripture.


As well as this.

Jer 1:5 "Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations. "

God knew Jeremiah before he was even in his mother’s womb, Jeremiah's soul, spirit and spiritual body were with God prior to conception.

==
H8130
שׂנא, śânê' , A primitive root; to hate (personally) : - enemy, foe, (be) hate (-ful, -r), odious, X utterly.

Mal 1:1 The burden of the word of the LORD to Israel by Malachi.
Mal 1:2 I have loved you, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob,
Mal 1:3 And I hated (H8130)Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.

Why would God hate Esau personally, if He had not known Esau before.

The war in heaven mentioned in Rev was fought at the end of the first earth age. Rev 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels. Isaiah 14, and Ezekiel 28 both alludes to this war

The hard part for you will be to put these verses together to understand that their was an earth and heaven age before this one. If you can't understand it put it on the shelf for now, someday you will see that it is true.


Finally, are we made in the image and likeness of God. Is God a Triune God = three parts = Father, Son and Holy Spirit, all the same and separate. Are we made in the image of God. That is how I see man as soul, body and spirit. All three are always present, but they are still three parts. Again, put it on the shelf if it too much for you right now, someday you will understand it.

 

[TexUs]

I never use those nor do I look at them, I don't trust the translators. When I study Scripture I use the KJV, and the Hebrew and Greek text. I also use common sense.

Ahhhh yes so you trust the homosexual translation.
Just poking fun at you but I don't see the point of using a translation if when you read it, you have no idea what you read. It's much like Latin to the commoners back during the Reformation period- what's the point if nobody knows what's being said?
The NIV was a "mini-Reformation" of sorts that gave the Bible in easily understandable format to the masses. You must give it that. For study it sucks.
The ESV is highly accurate though, more so I feel than the KJV.
The NKJV is very similar to the ESV.

I don't care if you agree or not.

Well at least you keep an open mind.

Jer 1:5 "Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations. "

And yet, in this exact passage, it also says we were formed in the womb.
The question is what the "knew" means. Considering the Hebrew yada was used ("to know") which carries tons of uses (past, present, future, figurative, literal, etc) I don't think you can base your support on this one word.

I read this and see that God formed him in the womb- and knew of him before he formed him. It's knowledge of him.

Mal 1:1 The burden of the word of the LORD to Israel by Malachi.
Mal 1:2 I have loved you, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob,
Mal 1:3 And I hated (H8130)Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.

Why would God hate Esau personally, if He had not known Esau before.

Where's the text support the Lord not knowing Esau before? This was written after Esau.

The hard part for you will be to put these verses together to understand that their was an earth and heaven age before this one.

In other words, you think it'll be difficult for me to add to the Bible, "This marks the end of the first age" in which case, you'd be right: I have a very difficult time adding to what the text says.

You've provided no scripture that says we were created in the first age. Much less that God created us before Adam and Eve, anywhere.
You've still provided no scripture that says our soul and spirit need a body to house it.
If these are your opinions, that's fine, but please don't act like they're Biblical.

 

[australia]

The ESV is highly accurate though, more so I feel than the KJV.

Considering the Hebrew yada...

Given that you're familiar with the Hebrew, can you show the Hebrew that gives the ESV's 'inmost parts' in order to clarify the 'highly accurate' ESV?

 

[TexUs]

Given that you're familiar with the Hebrew, can you show the Hebrew that gives the ESV's 'inmost parts' in order to clarify the 'highly accurate' ESV?

Do you not feel that heart, kidney, mind... "inmost parts" is an accurate translation of a word that refers to them?

 

[tomwebster]

[/color]
Ahhhh yes so you trust the homosexual translation.
...If these are your opinions, that's fine, but please don't act like they're Biblical.

So what is homosexual about the KJV? King James didn't do any of the writing. Why did God hate Esau when Esau was still in the womb?

 

[TexUs]

So what is homosexual about the KJV? King James didn't do any of the writing. Why did God hate Esau when Esau was still in the womb?

Again, I don't know where you find support that Malachi was speaking of something said before he was born.
Jacob and Esau lived 1831BC (roughly). Malachi references a rebuilt temple which places it after 515BC.

 

[tomwebster]

Again, I don't know where you find support that Malachi was speaking of something said before he was born.
Jacob and Esau lived 1831BC (roughly). Malachi references a rebuilt temple which places it after 515BC.

Was Malachi speaking or was God speaking? You believe as you wish.

 

[TexUs]

The Lord was, clearly. However there's nothing I see in that passage to support Him saying this before Esau was born and thus making it a prophetic statement.
On the contrary, He speaks in past tense "I have loved", "have I hated", "I have laid", "and left".

 

[tomwebster]

The Lord was, clearly. However there's nothing I see in that passage to support Him saying this before Esau was born and thus making it a prophetic statement.
On the contrary, He speaks in past tense "I have loved", "have I hated", "I have laid", "and left".

Yes, He speaks in the past tense because it was in the past that God hated him. I know you don't see it, so! Believe anything you want.

 

[TexUs]

Yes, He speaks in the past tense because it was in the past that God hated him. I know you don't see it, so! Believe anything you want.

Let's say, for an example, "I hated that bully in school".
To most everyone, this means I am looking back from the present, to the past, and saying "I hated that bully in school".

But you are taking this as "I hated that bully in school... before I know of him".

I'm sorry but I just don't think the text supports your view. It certainly doesn't contradict it, but it doesn't support it, either.

 

[tomwebster]

Let's say, for an example, "I hated that bully in school".
To most everyone, this means I am looking back from the present, to the past, and saying "I hated that bully in school".

But you are taking this as "I hated that bully in school... before I know of him".

I'm sorry but I just don't think the text supports your view. It certainly doesn't contradict it, but it doesn't support it, either.

No one is talking about what YOU know. I am talking about what GOD KNOWS.

Maybe you are unaware that their was an earth and heaven age before the one we are in right now. That is when God knew Esau, Jeremiah, and all of us. That is when the elect received their justification. That is were Satan fell. It's all in Scripture, have you ever read it?

 

[TexUs]

Your argument of world ages is based upon periods in the text, correct?

 

[tomwebster]

Your argument of world ages is based upon periods in the text, correct?

That discussion would take us too far away from the OP. Read the section in Bible Study Forum on Three Earth Ages.

 

[TexUs]

That discussion would take us too far away from the OP. Read the section in Bible Study Forum on Three Earth Ages.

I am the OP, it was a simple question.