Who wants to Judge a Man of God who lives i Health and Prosperity??

[Rita]

So you choose to just ignore and mock the eternal living Word of God???? Beware!!!====Believe and trust God's Word==God has promised==3John 1:2 Beloved, I wish """above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health"""", even as thy soul prospereth.====Psalm 112:3 """Wealth and riches shall be in his house:""" and his righteousness endureth for ever. Psalm 35:27 Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.
Yes!!! God wants to bless His family with health and prosperity but you are free to reject the gifts of God and live poor and sick= your choice!

I am not ignoring Gods word, I am merely taking it in context of the bigger picture. Anyone can quote a verse and say it is applicable, but it doesn’t take into account the threads that run right through scripture to the overall context. What about Paul, Jesus and John , how do you apply prosperity Christianity to their life experiences. Are you saying that Paul should have been cautious by proclaiming that he had learnt to be content in being poor at times. Or that he didn’t have faith when he prayed for his thorn to be taken away from him?
Wonder if you would give that warning if Paul, the great apostle, was standing before you. Now that would be an interesting conversation to observe.
Rita

 

[GISMYS_7]

Accepting and believing for the blessings and gifts God says He wants you to have is not the same and spending all your time seeking more and more money. THINK!!

 

[Rita]

Accepting and believing for the blessings and gifts God says He wants you to have is not the same and spending all your time seeking more and more money. THINK!!

I did not say it was seeking more and more money, you claim that Christians should not be poor or sick, that it is not Gods will. I am saying that if you look at scripture, and the examples I gave you, Mary and Joseph were chosen by God to bring up Jesus ( they were poor ) , John was instructed to spend time in the wilderness and not have much, God allowed Paul’s ‘ thorn in the side ‘ to teach him humility. All three were ‘ in Gods will ‘
So if you are claiming that it is not Gods will to be sick or poor, then you must believe that John, Paul and Jesus were not living in Gods will, that they were in fact getting something wrong.
Rita

 

[amadeus]

Who can the sick and poor help??

Who can pray and thereby help anyone?

"Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much." James 5:16

Can someone sick in body and poor in material riches be righteous and pray fervently?

 

[GISMYS_7]

Who can pray and thereby help anyone?

"Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much." James 5:16

Can someone sick in body and poor in material riches be righteous and pray fervently?

IF a sick poor man be be righteous and pray fervently would he stay sick and poor??

 

[amadeus]

IF a sick poor man be be righteous and pray fervently would he stay sick and poor??

Have you never known one? I recall my pastor's wife in her months of physical life. She was suffering from pancreatic cancer from what I have heard and read one of the most painful ways to live and die. Yes, she knew months before that she was dying but she never changed her routine of attending every church service until the very last one. She played the piano in services until she no longer could. Then when in the last few weeks she could not make it to the piano, she sat on the front row to sing and worship God.

On her final Sunday morning, my wife and another sister went to her little mobile home where she and her husband had lived for many years. It was located about 25 yards behind the church building. She had always walked that short distance previously. That morning she called my wife to ask for assistance to getting to church. With a sister on each side supporting her frail weakened body she made that final walk to her final service. Our next service was on Wednesday evening but for the first time ever she told her husband she would not be going. He went alone leaving her in her sickbed. A person from hospice was with her daily caring for all of her physical needs, but she never lacked for company. She was known all over the United States and dozens of people traveled to visit with her for those last days. They came to bless her and pray for her... but it was rather she that prayed for and blessed each and every one them. Both my wife and me received her blessings as well. I watched their bright smiling blessed faces as they departed after visiting with her. She could not get out of bed but she never refused to receive a visitor and she prayed with each one. On Saturday morning she never woke up from her night's sleep.

Her husband, the pastor, knew she was dying, but he did not know about her physical pain because she would never complain to him about it or even admit that it was there. She spoke of it to my wife only when no one else was around telling her how severe the pain was. She passed from this life in the flesh at the age of 90 years. Our little church building was too small for the funeral. They held the service in the largest funeral home in town which was not big enough to hold all of the people who came for that final memorial all of the USA and Canada. They truly loved her because she loved each one of them.

Her husband has continued on these past 8 years without her. All they had was that little mobile home and a used car they made payments on each month. Now at 95 her husband continue to minister to people, but in this world of worldly possession he has little else. Rich he is, certainly, in the Spirit of God. He called me only a minutes ago to say he had arrived home from another 150 mile trips to minister to the needs of the sick and hungry. For him that is his life as it has been for more years than most of us have been alive in our flesh.

"...Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk." Acts 3:6

And they do... walking on the water with their eyes on Jesus. He ministers now as did his sick wife did until there was no more time for her... with no riches in the banks of men... but wealthy indeed, both of them, in the weightier things of God...

"I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God." Rom 12:1-2

Give God the glory!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

IF a sick poor man be be righteous and pray fervently would he stay sick and poor??

If an Apostle who is righteous pray to have a debilitating infirmity removed- will it stay with them?

 

[justbyfaith]

Doctrine involving material prosperity is false.

Well, then, sell all that you have and give to the poor....including your computer.

Jesus was not wealthy

That is disputable (see 2 Corinthians 8:9). No question that He became poor for our sakes.

Mary and Joseph were chosen by God to bring up Jesus ( they were poor ) ,

Are you certain? They were given gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh.

 

[GISMYS_7]

I did not say it was seeking more and more money, you claim that Christians should not be poor or sick, that it is not Gods will. I am saying that if you look at scripture, and the examples I gave you, Mary and Joseph were chosen by God to bring up Jesus ( they were poor ) , John was instructed to spend time in the wilderness and not have much, God allowed Paul’s ‘ thorn in the side ‘ to teach him humility. All three were ‘ in Gods will ‘
So if you are claiming that it is not Gods will to be sick or poor, then you must believe that John, Paul and Jesus were not living in Gods will, that they were in fact getting something wrong.
Rita

Read the Bible!! Mary and Joseph received much gold and wealth at the birth of Jesus.
God considers poverty to be a curse. We find this to be true when we look at Job’s story. God was blessing him with health and abundance; however, it was when Satan intervened that God’s blessings were interrupted. Let’s read it.

“Does Job fear God for nothing?” Satan replied. “Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land” (Job 1:9-10).

When Job was under attack from the devil he encountered poverty, sickness and calamity. After Job survived the devil’s attack, everything was restored and he lived a long prosperous life of enjoying God’s blessing.

 

[amadeus]

When Job was under attack from the devil he encountered poverty, sickness and calamity. After Job survived the devil’s attack, everything was restored and he lived a long prosperous life of enjoying God’s blessing.

But, his children who died in chapter 1 were still dead at the end of chapter 42. New children born do not replace those who have died!

Ask any parent who has lost a child he loved! A few months ago in Oklahoma a young family of four were caught in a fire in their own home. The mother and son survived with slight injuries. The father survived only after an extended period of time in the hospital. The oldest child, their teenaged daughter was killed in the fire. They still have their son, but do you suppose that their beloved son fills in all of the emptiness left by their deceased daughter?

"If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable." I Cor 15:19

"Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see." Rev 3:17-18

 

[Paul Christensen]

Well, then, sell all that you have and give to the poor....including your computer.

It is not having material wealth that is the issue. It is teaching that God automatically gives wealth to those who demand it by naming and claiming, and teaching that people who live in poverty are faithless and therefore are not pleasing God.

If I am left alone, and reach the end of my life, one of my last acts will be to sign my house over to my daughter, and transfer my bank account funds to her as well, so that there is no conflict about how my assets and money is to be used after my death.

We have all seen how when a millionaire dies, arguments develop between members of the family, and resulting court cases and lawyers' fees gobble up vast amounts of what is left. If a Christian believer is a millionaire, he needs to ensure that his wealth is distributed fairly at his death so there is no need for lawyers and court action. How his family deals with their share of the wealth is then up to them, and the believer can stand before the judgment seat of Christ with a clear conscience.

 

[GISMYS_7]

We all choose to believe God's Word or we choose to reject it!!! And you???
Believe and trust God's Word==God has promised==3John 1:2 Beloved, I wish """above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health"""", even as thy soul prospereth.====Psalm 112:3 """Wealth and riches shall be in his house:""" and his righteousness endureth for ever. Psalm 35:27 Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.
Yes!!! God wants to bless His family with health and prosperity but you are free to reject the gifts of God and live poor and sick= your choice!

 

[Paul Christensen]

We all choose to believe God's Word or we choose to reject it!!! And you???
Believe and trust God's Word==God has promised==3John 1:2 Beloved, I wish """above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health"""", even as thy soul prospereth.====Psalm 112:3 """Wealth and riches shall be in his house:""" and his righteousness endureth for ever. Psalm 35:27 Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.
Yes!!! God wants to bless His family with health and prosperity but you are free to reject the gifts of God and live poor and sick= your choice!

What do you think about Job? He went through poverty and sickness with three friends who accused him of sin because of it. I wonder if one of his friends was an ancestor of Kenny Copeland?

 

[Rita]

Well, then, sell all that you have and give to the poor....including your computer.



That is disputable (see 2 Corinthians 8:9). No question that He became poor for our sakes.



Are you certain? They were given gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh.

When Jesus was presented at the Temple they gave doves and pigeons as a sacrifice, this was after they had been given the gifts at his birth and after they had travelled to Egypt, if they had been wealthy they would have brought a lamb ( Leviticus states that if someone could not afford a lamb they could take birds )

Rita

 

[Rita]

Read the Bible!! Mary and Joseph received much gold and wealth at the birth of Jesus.
God considers poverty to be a curse. We find this to be true when we look at Job’s story. God was blessing him with health and abundance; however, it was when Satan intervened that God’s blessings were interrupted. Let’s read it.

“Does Job fear God for nothing?” Satan replied. “Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land” (Job 1:9-10).

When Job was under attack from the devil he encountered poverty, sickness and calamity. After Job survived the devil’s attack, everything was restored and he lived a long prosperous life of enjoying God’s blessing.

I do read my bible, hence why I posted in this thread after ‘ reading my bible ‘ with reference to Jesus being presented at the temple, after the gift you mentioned were given. If they were still wealthy why would they give the birds instead of a lamb, you only did that if you could not afford a lamb. So, yes they were given those gifts, but I am sure Mary and Joseph would have given what was required of the law in Leviticus if they could afford to.
Also It was the Lord who said ‘ have you considered my servant Job ‘ He played a part in what Job experienced. Is it a curse to go through trials, to suffer, if it is in fact to bring Glory to God. Also he lost what he had. Look at Joseph, he lost everything for many many years, it led to many blessings in the end, but he still had to go through the trials. Also what about Gods people in Eqypt , they were slaves, look at the references in the NT about how slaves should respond to their masters - teaching , advice ect . Slaves were not wealthy and would have had very little.
All I am saying is that you cannot have a blanket approach to wealth and prosperity when throughout scripture there is evidence that Gods people were not always in prosperity on a worldly level.

By the way you didn’t mention John or Paul !
Rita

 

[justbyfaith]

When Jesus was presented at the Temple they gave doves and pigeons as a sacrifice, this was after they had been given the gifts at his birth and after they had travelled to Egypt, if they had been wealthy they would have brought a lamb ( Leviticus states that if someone could not afford a lamb they could take birds )

Rita

No I'm thinking that it was before.

The sacrifice of the doves was at the circumcision of the child; which was when He was eight days old.

Jesus did not receive the gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh until He was 2.

 

[GISMYS_7]

But, his children who died in chapter 1 were still dead at the end of chapter 42. New children born do not replace those who have died!

Ask any parent who has lost a child he loved! A few months ago in Oklahoma a young family of four were caught in a fire in their own home. The mother and son survived with slight injuries. The father survived only after an extended period of time in the hospital. The oldest child, their teenaged daughter was killed in the fire. They still have their son, but do you suppose that their beloved son fills in all of the emptiness left by their deceased daughter?

"If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable." I Cor 15:19

"Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see." Rev 3:17-18

Job 42:10 And the LORD turned the captivity of Job, when he prayed for his friends: also the LORD gave Job twice as much as he had before.

Job 42:11 Then came there unto him all his brethren, and all his sisters, and all they that had been of his acquaintance before, and did eat bread with him in his house: and they bemoaned him, and comforted him over all the evil that the LORD had brought upon him: every man also gave him a piece of money, and every one an earring of gold.

Job 42:12 So the LORD blessed the latter end of Job more than his beginning: for he had fourteen thousand sheep, and six thousand camels, and a thousand yoke of oxen, and a thousand she asses.

Job 42:13 He had also seven sons and three daughters.

Job 42:14 And he called the name of the first, Jemima; and the name of the second, Kezia; and the name of the third, Kerenhappuch.

Job 42:15 And in all the land were no women found so fair as the daughters of Job: and their father gave them inheritance among their brethren.

Job 42:16 After this lived Job an hundred and forty years, and saw his sons, and his sons' sons, even four generations.

Job 42:17 So Job died, being old and full of days.

 

[GISMYS_7]

I do read my bible, hence why I posted in this thread after ‘ reading my bible ‘ with reference to Jesus being presented at the temple, after the gift you mentioned were given. If they were still wealthy why would they give the birds instead of a lamb, you only did that if you could not afford a lamb. So, yes they were given those gifts, but I am sure Mary and Joseph would have given what was required of the law in Leviticus if they could afford to.
Also It was the Lord who said ‘ have you considered my servant Job ‘ He played a part in what Job experienced. Is it a curse to go through trials, to suffer, if it is in fact to bring Glory to God. Also he lost what he had. Look at Joseph, he lost everything for many many years, it led to many blessings in the end, but he still had to go through the trials. Also what about Gods people in Eqypt , they were slaves, look at the references in the NT about how slaves should respond to their masters - teaching , advice ect . Slaves were not wealthy and would have had very little.
All I am saying is that you cannot have a blanket approach to wealth and prosperity when throughout scripture there is evidence that Gods people were not always in prosperity on a worldly level.

By the way you didn’t mention John or Paul !
Rita

Jesus had a man in His group who had the duty to care for the money BOX not little bag!!!

 

[amadeus]

Job 42:10 And the LORD turned the captivity of Job, when he prayed for his friends: also the LORD gave Job twice as much as he had before.

Job 42:11 Then came there unto him all his brethren, and all his sisters, and all they that had been of his acquaintance before, and did eat bread with him in his house: and they bemoaned him, and comforted him over all the evil that the LORD had brought upon him: every man also gave him a piece of money, and every one an earring of gold.

Job 42:12 So the LORD blessed the latter end of Job more than his beginning: for he had fourteen thousand sheep, and six thousand camels, and a thousand yoke of oxen, and a thousand she asses.

Job 42:13 He had also seven sons and three daughters.

Job 42:14 And he called the name of the first, Jemima; and the name of the second, Kezia; and the name of the third, Kerenhappuch.

Job 42:15 And in all the land were no women found so fair as the daughters of Job: and their father gave them inheritance among their brethren.

Job 42:16 After this lived Job an hundred and forty years, and saw his sons, and his sons' sons, even four generations.

Job 42:17 So Job died, being old and full of days.

I am glad you are able to quote those verses. One day perhaps God will allow you understand some of the weightier things which He has for each of us.

 

[Rita]

Jesus had a man in His group who had the duty to care for the money BOX not little bag!!!

Seriously , that’s the best you can do on response to my post !
Rita