Why do Catholics…

[Brakelite]

The faith of Rome is contrary to the gospel, contrary to scripture.
Rome says that we must be pure and holy in order that God shall dwell with us.
The faith of Jesus, the gospel and scripture declares that God must dwell with us, and in us, in order to make us holy or pure at all.

Thus is why catholicism is an anti Christian, anti evangelical, anti gospel form of religious counterfeit Christianity.

 

[Illuminator]

One leader or tens of thousands of leaders makes no difference to me, some are more sensible than others but generally I reject them all because I'm non-denom and have always avoided the shackles of organised religion..

Disorganized religion is a shackle unto itself. You guys can't even organize an inner city soup kitchen.

Several evangelical scholars have noted that the problem with Protestant ecclesiology is that there is no Protestant ecclesiology. In many denominations—and especially in non-denominational churches—there is no hierarchy of churches responsible to a central head, no accountability beyond the local congregation, no fellowship beyond the local assembly, no missional emphasis that gains support from hundreds of congregations, and no superiors to whom a local pastor must submit for doctrinal or ethical fidelity.​

by Daniel Wallace, an American professor of New Testament Studies at Dallas Theological Seminary.

 

[Dropship]

Running with the herd of organised religions won't do us any good if they're all going up the spout..-
"Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling" (Philippians 2:12)

 

[Philip James]

He cannot physically be in two places at once...

Hello Brakelite,

Why not?

If Jesus can multiply loaves and fishes to feed our bellies, certainly He can multiply Himself to feed our souls..
(There is a reason John places this miracle just before the Bread of Life discourse)

Hmm now, Jesus holds up the Bread and says, here I am.. You say He cant be on two places at once... Who should I believe?

Pax et Bonum

 

[True Faith]

Hello Brakelite,

Why not?

If Jesus can multiply loaves and fishes to feed our bellies, certainly He can multiply Himself to feed our souls..
(There is a reason John places this miracle just before the Bread of Life discourse)

Hmm now, Jesus holds up the Bread and says, here I am.. You say He cant be on two places at once... Who should I believe?

Pax et Bonum

Since you claim that Jesus is God himself....

Whose will did God himself come down from heaven to do, if not his own??

you cannot say "the Son came to do the will of the Father" nor can you say "God the Son came to do the will of God the Father"... You have to answer without removing Jesus from being God Himself and God Himself from being Jesus..

 

[Brakelite]

Since you claim that Jesus is God himself....

Whose will did God himself come down from heaven to do, if not his own??

you cannot say "the Son came to do the will of the Father" nor can you say "God the Son came to do the will of God the Father"... You have to answer without removing Jesus from being God Himself and God Himself from being Jesus..

You don't need a trinitarian mindset to answer this, in fact, it's a definite handicap. Jesus is the Son of God. No-one disputes that, unless they think it metaphorical. I think it literal. If the Father truly beget a Son, what else, or who else, can the Son be but God begotten? God didn't beget humans... He made them. God didn't beget angels... He created them. And He did so through His Son. For me, that is what the scriptures reveal. As far as I know, God didn't reveal how the Son was begotten, and we don't need to know the mechanics. God sent His Son to become human so that He could die for man. That's really about all we need to know. Everything else derives from that. It is not necessary to know what took place prior to the need for the human race to be saved, IMO.

 

[amigo de christo]

In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God , and the Word was God .
Now let all that draws breath both praise and thank the glorious Lord .

 

[BreadOfLife]

...for justification.
Why do you seek to be continually re-justified by the blood of Christ? Protestants know that happens one time for all time and does not need to be repeated. For the believer the sacrifice of Christ accomplishes it's task the first time it is believed on. And accomplished forever, not needing to be repeated.

WRONG.
That’s like saying that doing the Lord’s will is nothing more than a vain attempt to achieve justification with every act.
If you are not in a state of grace – you cannot receive the Eucharist.
Receiving the Eucharist doesn’t RE-justify us. I nourishes our sou.

Then it doesn't change into human blood and human tissue. You can believe that it does if you want in your Catholic delusion, but it doesn't change into human blood and tissue.

And the Church has NEVER taught that the bread and wine take on the physical properties of actual tissue and blood.

I already explained that in an earlier post. At the Last Supper, Jesus instituted the SACRAMENTAL prescription for consuming His Body and Blood. He DIDN’T tell the Apostles to take a bite out of His arm. He introduced the method for changing the SUBSTANCE of the bread and wine into flesh and blood, while maintaining the ACCIDENTS of bread and wine.
YOUR rejection of the Eucharist is more a matter of ignorance than disbelief – or, at least I HOPE it is . . .

You sound like the disciples who left Him in John 6:66 and returned to their former way of life because they couldn’t handle what He was telling them.
It takes a leap of faith – which MOST non-Catholics aren’t willing to take.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Receiving the Eucharist doesn’t RE-justify us. I nourishes our sou.

Ceremonial foods don't do that:

"9Do not be carried away by all kinds of strange teachings. It is good for our hearts to be strengthened by grace, not by eating ceremonial foods, which is of no benefit to those who do so." Hebrews 13:9​

 

[Ferris Bueller]

And the Church has NEVER taught that the bread and wine take on the physical properties of actual tissue and blood.

Then It's figurative.

Either it's the actual blood and body of Christ, or it's not. Obviously, we take the blood and body of the sacrifice and it's effect into us by faith, via the Holy Spirit. Christ is in us via the Holy Spirit, not by having his literal blood and flesh in our stomachs. That's a "strange teaching".

 

[BreadOfLife]

Ceremonial foods don't do that:

"9Do not be carried away by all kinds of strange teachings. It is good for our hearts to be strengthened by grace, not by eating ceremonial foods, which is of no benefit to those who do so." Hebrews 13:9​

CORRECTION:
Symbolic, ceremonial foods that only POIINT to Christ don’t do that.
The Body and Blood of Christ, however, ABSOLUTELY does – and Jesus Himself tells us this:

John 6:53-58
So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, YOU HAVE NO LIFE IN YOU. Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood HAS ETERNAL LIFE, and I will raise him up on the last day. For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him. As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever feeds on me, HE ALSO WILL LIVE BECAUSE OF ME. This is the bread that came down from heaven, not like the bread[c] the fathers ate, and died. Whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Then It's figurative.

Either it's the actual blood and body of Christ, or it's not. Obviously, we take the blood and body of the sacrifice and it's effect into us by faith, via the Holy Spirit. Christ is in us via the Holy Spirit, not by having his literal blood and flesh in our stomachs. That's a "strange teaching".

It was a “strange teaching” to the Pagan Romans as well, who accused the Early Church of CANNIBALISM for their ardent belief in the Real Presence. Your opinion is NOT new.

So, congratulations – you’re in in the company pf Pagan Rome . . .

 

[Ferris Bueller]

CORRECTION:
Symbolic, ceremonial foods that only POIINT to Christ don’t do that.
The Body and Blood of Christ, however, ABSOLUTELY does

Don't you know Paul was talking about the old covenant ceremonial foods? And don't you know the bread and the wine observance is a Passover observance? Those things don't have any power. Just as they did not have any power in the old covenant. The power is in the actual sacrifice of Christ on the altar in heaven, not in the old covenant symbols and types of Christ here on earth, which the Bread and the wine are. They are commemorative symbols of the reality in heaven, not the reality itself. You're still approaching God through the symbols of the old covenant in a religion of endlessly repetitious lifeless, worthless, outward ceremonial rituals that you think give you eternal life. That is the very essence of the works gospel condemned in scripture, and you are oblivious to that fact.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

It was a “strange teaching” to the Pagan Romans as well, who accused the Early Church of CANNIBALISM for their ardent belief in the Real Presence. Your opinion is NOT new.

So, congratulations – you’re in in the company pf Pagan Rome . . .

I guess I'm supposed to be...uh...what...hurt by this, lol?

 

[Ferris Bueller]

...and Jesus Himself tells us this:

John 6:53-58
So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, YOU HAVE NO LIFE IN YOU. Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood HAS ETERNAL LIFE, and I will raise him up on the last day. For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him. As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever feeds on me, HE ALSO WILL LIVE BECAUSE OF ME. This is the bread that came down from heaven, not like the bread[c] the fathers ate, and died. Whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.

But by your own admission the elements aren't the actual blood and body of Christ(???). So you don't have eternal life in you either. But somehow you're partaking of the actual blood and body of Christ without actually partaking of the actual body and blood of Christ and so you have eternal life by them. What contradictory nonsense!

Frankly, I'm glad you Catholics are here so the rest of us who have lived our whole lives separated from the lunacy of the Catholic religion can see just how truly absurd and strange your beliefs are. For I admit before I got into in depth discussions with Catholics I really just regarded you folks as just having differing views of essentially the same faith. Ha! Not even close. More Protestants need to see how absurd and off the rails your religion actually is. Please keep informing Protestants about what you really believe and practice in your religion. Everyone needs to see the full extent of your strange and unBiblical beliefs and practices. You're your own worst enemy!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

So what. Symbols are tools used to express concepts and ideas. No one owns them. All those symbols that you say are pagan don't express the concepts the pagans attached to them. Now they recall Christ's resurrection. In fact someone who insists that they still symbolize the concepts that pagans gave them. lacks the expertise required to discuss the matter

I agree. But they were incorporated into the church as a compromise to the pagans flooding into the church in the gentile lands. Especially when Rome made it the implied preferred church! Just like today, people become part of the external church but are never saved.

 

[Illuminator]

But by your own admission the elements aren't the actual blood and body of Christ(???).

Use the quote feature instead of lying about what BoL said. The rest of your arrogant ranting isn't worth a reply.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

But by your own admission the elements aren't the actual blood and body of Christ(???).

Use the quote feature instead of lying about what BoL said.

↓↓↓

Jesus instituted the SACRAMENTAL prescription for consuming His Body and Blood. He DIDN’T tell the Apostles to take a bite out of His arm. He introduced the method for changing the SUBSTANCE of the bread and wine into flesh and blood, while maintaining the ACCIDENTS of bread and wine.

If they are still bread and the wine then they can't be the actual blood and body of Christ. Good grief, man, what a Catholic delusion! You people are deluded!

 

[Philip James]

And don't you know the bread and the wine observance is a Passover observance? Those things don't have any power.

Dear Ferris,

as they make a pretense of religion but deny its power. Reject them.

If there is no power in the sacraments, if the POWER of the Holy Spirit is not active in Baptism... Why bother?

Time to walk away from the powerless doppelgangers, and come embrace the real thing..

You too! Are welcome to come to the wedding Feast of the Lamb of God!

Pax et Bonum

 

[Ferris Bueller]

I grew up in the cold dead, regimented church. Then I got born again and I discovered the world of the Holy Spirit where you do not worship God through cold dead scripted ceremonies and rituals. You actually 'see' God face to face in the Holy Spirit and you praise and worship and serve him in the simplicity of robust singing, prayer, and obedience to live in godly love and service to one another, meeting together in open fellowship with each other to share our experiences and encourage and minister to one another. That's all! That's what life in Christ through the Holy Spirit is all about.

When I got born again I realized there is the church of the world, and there is the true church of God's holy people, filled with his Spirit seeking him in Spirit and truth and not caught up in the deceitfulness of competing rituals and styles of worship. I implore you who are caught in the church of the world to be born again and filled with the Holy Spirit and live the true life that Jesus died to give his people. Escape the man-made delusion and lies and come into the light!

"17For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Spirit." Romans 14:17​