Why do people worry about sins

[Thankful 1]

1 John 3:8-10 (ESV)
[sup]8 [/sup]Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil. [sup]9 [/sup]No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God.
[sup]10 [/sup]By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

(1 John 3:8) “He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work”



Douay-Rheims Bible(1 John 3:8) “He that committeth sin is of the devil: for the devil sinneth from the beginning.”



New American Bible (1John 3:8) “Whoever sins belongs to the devil, because the devil has sinned from the beginning. Indeed, the Son of God was revealed to destroy the works of the devil”



New Jerusalem Bible (1John 3:8) “Whoever lives sinfully belongs to the devil, since the devil has been a sinner from the beginning. This was the purpose of the appearing of the Son of God, to undo the work of the devil.”



King James Bible (1John 3:8) “He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.”



New International Bible (1John 3:8) “The one who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning.”









Now this is another reason the Bible can’t be one’s teacher. People make it say just what they want it to say.



Ask yourself if a sinner is doing the translating of a bible, and a verse tell him or her they are of Satan if he or she sins, what is to stop the sinner from changing the verse? Remember he or she is a sinner and is of Satan, so they are going to be pushed very hard to do, as Satan wants.

 

[Duckybill]

(1 John 3:8) “He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work”

Douay-Rheims Bible(1 John 3:8) “He that committeth sin is of the devil: for the devil sinneth from the beginning.”

New American Bible (1John 3:8) “Whoever sins belongs to the devil, because the devil has sinned from the beginning. Indeed, the Son of God was revealed to destroy the works of the devil”

New Jerusalem Bible (1John 3:8) “Whoever lives sinfully belongs to the devil, since the devil has been a sinner from the beginning. This was the purpose of the appearing of the Son of God, to undo the work of the devil.”

King James Bible (1John 3:8) “He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.”

New International Bible (1John 3:8) “The one who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning.”

None that you quoted say "he who commits a sin is of the devil". The clear meaning is referring to those living sinful lives.

Now this is another reason the Bible can’t be one’s teacher. People make it say just what they want it to say.

I think you are doing that.

Ask yourself if a sinner is doing the translating of a bible, and a verse tell him or her they are of Satan if he or she sins, what is to stop the sinner from changing the verse? Remember he or she is a sinner and is of Satan, so they are going to be pushed very hard to do, as Satan wants.

So then, all of the Apostles who forsook Jesus are in Hell? I don't think so.

 

[Alethos]

The word sin is used in two principal ways in the Bible:

1. "the transgression of the law" (1 John 3:4)

2. The next is in the physical principle of the animal nature, which is the cause of all diseases, death, and resolution into dust. (Read Rom 8)

It is that which is in the flesh "which has the power of death"; and that power is called sin, because in our flesh is no good thing! The potential of evil is in the flesh, and comes as a result of transgression of Gods law whatever that law maybe at that time. Rom 7:7

Paul calls our animal nature "sinful flesh", that is "flesh full of sin " Rom 8:3; so that sin, came to stand for the substance called man. In human flesh "dwells no good thing" Rom 7:18 and all the evil a man does is the result of this principle dwelling in him. Sin operates upon the brain or mind, it excites the "propensities", and these set the "mind or intelligence" and "sentiments" to work in us. The propensities are blind, and so are the intellect and sentiments in a purely natural state; that is without the mind of God dwelling in us; when we think this way, the carnal mind operates under the sole impulse of the propensities, "the understanding is darkened through ignorance, because of the blindness of the heart" Eph 4:18. WE find the nature of the lower animals is as full of this physical evil principle as the nature of man; though it cannot be styled sin with the same expressiveness; because it does not possess them as the result of their own transgression; the name, however, does not alter the nature of the thing.

When we sin we access the carnal mind which is at enmity with God but when we live in the Spirit Mind we know this is life and peace.

May you all have life and peace.

Alethos

 

[Thankful 1]

None that you quoted say "he who commits a sin is of the devil". The clear meaning is referring to those living sinful lives.

I think you are doing that.

So then, all of the Apostles who forsook Jesus are in Hell? I don't think so.

How you drew such a conclusion I sure don’t understand. The apostles stopped sinning when they received the Holy Spirit. Only one with an indwelling of the Holy Spirit can defeat Satan/sin.



The sin leading to death is one committed by a person who has the indwelling of the Holly Spirit, and has been taught by God, to come to know God.



Baby Christians, those who are not yet spiritual will still sin, but not a spiritual Christian.



(1 Corinthians 3:1-3) “Brothers, I myself was unable to speak to you as people of the Spirit; I treated you as sensual men, still infants in Christ. What I fed you with was milk, not solid food, for you were not ready for it; and indeed, you are still not ready for it since you are still unspiritual. Isn’t that obvious from all the jealousy and wrangling that there is among you, from the way that you go on behaving like ordinary people?”

 

[Duckybill]

How you drew such a conclusion I sure don’t understand. The apostles stopped sinning when they received the Holy Spirit. Only one with an indwelling of the Holy Spirit can defeat Satan/sin.

Huh??? Aren't you the one preaching that those who commit sin are of the devil???

The sin leading to death is one committed by a person who has the indwelling of the Holly Spirit, and has been taught by God, to come to know God. Baby Christians, those who are not yet spiritual will still sin, but not a spiritual Christian.

"Baby Christians" don't have the Holy Spirit?

You really need to find out who has been teaching you.

 

[Thankful 1]

Huh??? Aren't you the one preaching that those who commit sin are of the devil???

"Baby Christians" don't have the Holy Spirit?

You really need to find out who has been teaching you.

Now who told you that baby Christians do not have an indwelling of the Holy Spirit?



(Acts 2:38-39) “You must repent, Peter answered and every one of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. The promise that was made is for you and your children, and for all those who are far away, for all those whom the Lord our God is calling to himself.”

 

[Duckybill]

Now who told you that baby Christians do not have an indwelling of the Holy Spirit?

(Acts 2:38-39) “You must repent, Peter answered and every one of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. The promise that was made is for you and your children, and for all those who are far away, for all those whom the Lord our God is calling to himself.”

You say those who commit sin are of the devil. The Apostles sinned a GREAT sin by denying Jesus. Which way will you go?

 

[Thankful 1]

You say those who commit sin are of the devil. The Apostles sinned a GREAT sin by denying Jesus. Which way will you go?

You keep misquoting me, why is that? The apostles could not help but sin before they received the Holy Spirit. Only through the power of God can man defeat Satan/sin.

 

[Duckybill]

You keep misquoting me, why is that?

What did I misquote?

The apostles could not help but sin before they received the Holy Spirit. Only through the power of God can man defeat Satan/sin.

Jesus taught them for years. They were not 'baby Christians'. I truly hope that God isn't as strict on you as you are on nearly everyone.

 

[Foreigner]

But you can still have the Holy Spirit inside you and end up committing a sin.

 

[Thankful 1]

But you can still have the Holy Spirit inside you and end up committing a sin.

Paul was writing to the Corinthians, and these people were baptized Christians. Peter told us when one becomes baptized in Jesus’ name they will receive the Holy Spirit. According to Paul that did not make one spiritual. Until one becomes spiritual he or she will sin, according to Paul and that is scripture.



(Acts 2:38-39) “You must repent, Peter answered and every one of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. The promise that was made is for you and your children, and for all those who are far away, for all those whom the Lord our God is calling to himself.”



(1 Corinthians 3:1-3) “Brothers, I myself was unable to speak to you as people of the Spirit; I treated you as sensual men, still infants in Christ. What I fed you with was milk, not solid food, for you were not ready for it; and indeed, you are still not ready for it since you are still unspiritual. Isn’t that obvious from all the jealousy and wrangling that there is among you, from the way that you go on behaving like ordinary people?”



John tells us that if one sins he or she does not know God. Also John tells us that if one sin they are of Satan.





(1 John 3:3-9) “Surely everyone who entertains this hope must purify himself, must try to be as pure as Christ. Any one who sins at all breaks the law, because to sin is to break the law. Now you know that He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin: anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him. My children do not let anyone lead you astray’ to live a holy life is to be holy just as He is holy’ to lead a sinful life is to belong the Devil, since the Devil was a sinner from the beginning. It was to undo all that the Devil has done that the Son of God appeared. No one who has been begotten by God sins: because God’s seed

 

[Duckybill]

1 John 3:8 (ESV)
[sup]8 [/sup]Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning.

1 John 3:8 (NASB)
[sup]8 [/sup]the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning.

1 John 3:8 (AMP)
[sup]8 [/sup][But] he who commits sin [who practices evildoing] is of the devil [takes his character from the evil one], for the devil has sinned (violated the divine law) from the beginning.

1 John 3:8 (Darby)
[sup]8 [/sup]He that practises sin is of the devil; for from [the] beginning the devil sins.

1 John 3:8 (GW)
[sup]8 [/sup]The person who lives a sinful life belongs to the devil, because the devil has been committing sin since the beginning.

1 John 3:8 (MaceNT)
[sup]8 [/sup]he that lives in sin, imitates the devil; for the devil was a sinner from the beginning.

 

[Thankful 1]

1 John 3:8 (ESV)
[sup]8 [/sup]Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning.

1 John 3:8 (NASB)
[sup]8 [/sup]the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning.

1 John 3:8 (AMP)
[sup]8 [/sup][But] he who commits sin [who practices evildoing] is of the devil [takes his character from the evil one], for the devil has sinned (violated the divine law) from the beginning.

1 John 3:8 (Darby)
[sup]8 [/sup]He that practises sin is of the devil; for from [the] beginning the devil sins.

1 John 3:8 (GW)
[sup]8 [/sup]The person who lives a sinful life belongs to the devil, because the devil has been committing sin since the beginning.

1 John 3:8 (MaceNT)
[sup]8 [/sup]he that lives in sin, imitates the devil; for the devil was a sinner from the beginning.

Proves my point does it not?

Now this is another reason the Bible can’t be one’s teacher. People make it say just what they want it to say.



How many sinners do you know that only sin once in a while? Would that be once a week? How about once a month? Gosh what is living in sin? If one sins today, and then never sins again, that would say he or she is repentant, right? Now if one sins today, and is going to sin again next week, I doubt that person is repentant, right?

 

[Duckybill]

Proves my point does it not?

So now you're saying one sin won't send us to Hell???

Now this is another reason the Bible can’t be one’s teacher. People make it say just what they want it to say. How many sinners do you know that only sin once in a while? Would that be once a week? How about once a month? Gosh what is living in sin? If one sins today, and then never sins again, that would say he or she is repentant, right? Now if one sins today, and is going to sin again next week, I doubt that person is repentant, right?

Or we could all imagine we are sinless. Then we wouldn't have to confess our sins to God. But that would cause another problem. Unconfessed sin. Unforgiven sin. It's MUCH better to confess sins than hide them.

Luke 18:11 (ESV)
[sup]11 [/sup]The Pharisee, standing by himself, prayed thus: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector.
[sup]13 [/sup]But the tax collector, standing far off, would not even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, a sinner!’ [sup]14 [/sup]I tell you, this man went down to his house justified, rather than the other.

Proverbs 28:13 (ESV)
[sup]13 [/sup]Whoever conceals his transgressions will not prosper, but he who confesses and forsakes them will obtain mercy.

 

[Rach1370]

I am not your judge, and as far as I remember you were never told by me you would go to Hell.

My job is to give a word. I am doing what Jesus has told me to do.

Ask yourself who taught you about God. Has Jesus ever called you out by name? Do you still sin?

(1 John 3:9) “No one, who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God.”

(1 John 3:8) “He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work”

So you didn't specifically tell me that I was headed for hell, but it's acceptable that you told pretty much everyone here in general that they were? Just because you weren't pointing a finger directly at me doesn't mean you weren't playing judge. You were making broad sweeping accusations against everyone, that's just ridiculous given you cannot know the state of their hearts and relationship with God.

If Jesus gave you a job, did He give you licence to be mean about it? Because that's how you quite often come across. I don't ask you to compromise what you feel to be the truth...I know I would refuse to do the same. Despite the fact that we obviously disagree, it's not my job to decide if Jesus is actually telling you something. But I would seek to remind you that we are told that if we rebuke brothers and sisters in Christ, we need to do it in a loving manner.

As far as everything else. You quote 1 John, but only the bits that support your reasoning. There are other passages aswell:

[8] If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. [9] If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. [10] If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
(1 John 1:8-10 ESV)

Please note the 'have'...present tense. And the fact that the elderly apostle John was refering to himself as well...'we'. How does that fit in with your 'mature' Christian theme? John was the 'one whom Jesus loved'. After a lifetime of growth and fellowship with Christ, he was still confessing to sinning sometimes.

I belong to Jesus. There is no doubt. I was baptised at 17 and by His grace I've been growing in Him ever since. But I do not say I am perfect. I know I sin. I strive not to, and I repent of it when I do, and I worry about any sin I may be unaware of. I know it exists and I pray that God will make me aware of it and convict me of it. Do you honestly think God will condemn me for that?

Well I agree with most of wht you have written although I would question "free life" and what that might mean to you.

I do like how you speak of striving to be like Christ, unfortunately many Christians in the world believe Jesus will accept them as they are; meaning no need for change and growth. A dangerous mindset to have when we know the Word will be our judge.

Best we get to know our judge very well.

Alethos

Hey! By living a 'free life' I don't mean that we are free to act and behave as we choose. I mean that living with the knowledge that we are no longer slaves to sin, that we have been redeemed by Jesus....that is amazingly freeing! It changes how we live when we know this. We want to live for Him, we want to avoid sinning and grow in and towards Him. We are no longer held down by the death sentence of sin...we are free to live forward...towards Jesus.

 

[Alethos]

Hey! By living a 'free life' I don't mean that we are free to act and behave as we choose. I mean that living with the knowledge that we are no longer slaves to sin, that we have been redeemed by Jesus....that is amazingly freeing! It changes how we live when we know this. We want to live for Him, we want to avoid sinning and grow in and towards Him. We are no longer held down by the death sentence of sin...we are free to live forward...towards Jesus.

Hi Rach,

Thanks for your comments. Keep glowing!

Interesting that your comment highlighted in blue is the very subject matter I am dealing with at Rom 6:9,10,11...if you seek to know "how" this was made possible, please feel welcome to visit anytime.

Bring an open mind ^_^ and a willing heart.

 

[Thankful 1]

Rach, You quoted 1John 1:8-10 doing so I believe as to prove that I just take scripture out of context to make it read the way that suits me. Well read the following.



Jesus has and is personally teaching me about God. I have a job to do, and it is not a pleasant job. I do not make any friends, nor do people like what I say. All that hurts me, but I do as I am told to do.



(1 John 1: 8-10)[sup] “[/sup]If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. If we claim we have not sinned, we make himout to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives.”



You need to see John was saying if one says he or she says they have never sinned they are liars.



If one is forgiven of all unrighteousness are they not then sinless? Could they then be liars if they say they are sinless?



John later says:



(1 John 3:3-9) “Surely everyone who entertains this hope must purify himself, must try to be as pureas Christ. Any one who sins at allbreaks the law, because to sin is to break the law. Now you know thatHe appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin: anyonewho lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or knownHim. My children do not let anyone lead you astray’ to live a holy life is tobe holy just as He is holy’ to lead a sinful life is to belong the Devil, sincethe Devil was a sinner from the beginning. It was to undo all that the Devil has done that the Son of God appeared. No one who has been begottenby God sins: because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he hasbeen begotten by God.”



(1 John 3:8) “He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because thedevil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appearedwas to destroy the devil's work”



John told us those who did not know God sinned and asked forgiveness and were forgiven, but once a person comes to know God he or she will not sin.



Scripture goes on to say that if a person who does know God uses their free will to sinthere is no repentance for that person.



(Hebrews 10:26-31) “If, after we have been given knowledge ofthe truth, we should deliberately commit any sins, then there is no longer anysacrifice for them. There is left onlythe dreadful prospect of judgment and of the fiery wrath that is to devour yourenemies. Anyone who disregards the Law of Moses is ruthlessly put to death on theword of two witnesses or three; and you may be sure that anyone who tramples onthe Son of God, and who treats the blood of the covenant which sanctified himas if it were not holy, and who insults the Spirit of grace, will be condemnedto a far severer punishment. We are allaware who it was that said: Vengeance is mine; I will vindicate his people. It is a dreadful thing to fall into thehands of the living God.”



(Hebrews 6: 4) “As for thosepeople who were once brought into the light, and tasted the gift from heaven,and received a share of the Holy Spirit, and appreciated the good message ofGod and the powers of the world to come and yet in spite of this have fallenaway it is impossible for that to be renewed a second time. They cannot be repentant if they havewillfully crucified the Son of God and openly mocked Him.”

 

[Alethos]

(Hebrews 10:26-31) “If, after we have been given knowledge ofthe truth, we should deliberately commit any sins, then there is no longer anysacrifice for them. There is left onlythe dreadful prospect of judgment and of the fiery wrath that is to devour yourenemies. Anyone who disregards the Law of Moses is ruthlessly put to death on theword of two witnesses or three; and you may be sure that anyone who tramples onthe Son of God, and who treats the blood of the covenant which sanctified himas if it were not holy, and who insults the Spirit of grace, will be condemnedto a far severer punishment. We are allaware who it was that said: Vengeance is mine; I will vindicate his people. It is a dreadful thing to fall into thehands of the living God.”

Hi Thankful1 & Rach,

If you dont mind can I add a brief comment? I see the need to be very careful when quoting these Scriptures that we apply some very strong scriptural definitions on the type of sin being referred.

Thankful1 - I write this in support of your above comments which I believe reflect the true spirit behind Heb 10:26 and other passages mentioned.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

It is my belief this verse for instance is not referring to ordinary sins, but to those sins which are very grievous in Gods sight. We might call them "final sins", like that of the apostasy where people are willfully and knowingly preaching lies. These types of sins by there very nature place them outside of God's reach, and if continued His forgiveness is no longer possible. The danger of this sin is one may never return to His favour.

I must also point out that this withdrawal of forgiveness is not due to the unavailability of mercy on His part, but rather the offender has cut themselves off from the possibility of forgiveness. You might like to consider Heb 10:29 as this stresses the nature and seriousness of the sin in question.

This language is the most severe and reveals how important it is when we "teach" (in the forum) that our teaching is sure and in accordance with the Father and Son.

This sin in Heb 10:26 is qualified "after we have "received" the "knowledge" of the truth" compare Heb 6:4 is clear: "those who have once been enlightened... who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away…"

I ask kindly. Please be careful not to overlook the context; here we could confuse everyday struggles with the flesh with the most seroius of sins.

I say these things knowing that some may be struggling with a perticular sin, which easily besets them and I know how difficult this can be to overcome. Heb 12:1

How might we "DELIBERATELY" sin?

By forsaking the assembly Heb 10:25.
By despising the liberty in Christ by holding onto the Law of Moses Heb 10:29.
By denying Christ 2 Tim 2:12; Mat 10:33.
And as already mentioned willingly teach lies for personal gain Titus 1:11

I hope this helps in some small way?

In the Masters Service

Alethos

 

[RichardBurger]

Hebrews 10:26-29
The Just Live by Faith 26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,
27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries.
28 Anyone who has rejected Moses' law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.
29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?
NKJV

I see that this has been used by some to say that if we commit a sin after salvation then there is no longer any sacrifice for sin.

First of all what is this sin being talked about? Based on verses 28 and 29 I feel it is the sin of rejecting Jesus and the grace that He paid for on the cross. It is a fact that if a person rejects the work of Jesus on the cross there is nothing else that will save him/her. IMHO it has nothing to do with the sins of the flesh.

 

[Thankful 1]

Hebrews 10:26-29
The Just Live by Faith 26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,
27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries.
28 Anyone who has rejected Moses' law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.
29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?
NKJV

I see that this has been used by some to say that if we commit a sin after salvation then there is no longer any sacrifice for sin.

First of all what is this sin being talked about? Based on verses 28 and 29 I feel it is the sin of rejecting Jesus and the grace that He paid for on the cross. It is a fact that if a person rejects the work of Jesus on the cross there is nothing else that will save him/her. IMHO it has nothing to do with the sins of the flesh.

Yes! So says whom?



I would like to share something. Jesus has made his Home in me, and has guided me for over thirty years; he is my friend and God. I tell him by word and deed that I love him every day, all day long. Jesus is closer to me then my wife, whom I loved dearly, and would never have been unfaithful. If I would deliberately commit a sin, an act that I knew God would not like, I would then be rejecting Jesus, and accepting Satan/sin. Satan would then enter the house of God, what an insult to God.



I could never do such a thing to my Lord and God.