theJW
Member
Not to those in Churches.
Where they're taught that God is Three, and a Sadistic Trio who always lied....
Why Hell is not a place of eternal conscious torment.
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Where they're taught that God is Three, and a Sadistic Trio who always lied....
Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
theJW
Member
So, let me get this STRAIGHT!
God said that Adam would Die, but really intended to keep him (and the rest of us) ALIVE, they unrighteous being Burned Alive forever and EVER- for no reason other that their Sadism?
God said that Adam would Die, but really intended to keep him (and the rest of us) ALIVE, they unrighteous being Burned Alive forever and EVER- for no reason other that their Sadism?
Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
Not if Adam (and the rest of the dead “sleeping”) believed the gospel when:
“…the gospel preached also to them that are dead…” (1 Peter 4:6)
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
Isaiah describes this event as carcasses or corpses.
Isaiah 66:24
“And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.”
Isaiah 66:24 (Berean Standard Bible)
“As they go forth, they will see the corpses of the men who have rebelled against Me; for their worm will never die, their fire will never be quenched, and they will be a horror to all mankind.”
Isaiah 66:24 ESV
“And they shall go out and look on the dead bodies of the men who have rebelled against me. For their worm shall not die, their fire shall not be quenched, and they shall be an abhorrence to all flesh.”
Carcasses or corpses are not alive.
So the eternal state of the worms and the fire does not matter because the wicked are corpses or dead. Something that is dead is not alive.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Jesus said its better to tear out your own eye then to go to your "metaphor".
Jesus spoke more about your "metaphor" than He did about Heaven.
If Hell is a "Metaphor"....if "eternal damnation" is a metaphor, then when the verse says that "hell is created for the devil and His angels", then according to you, that also isn't "real".
Uh huh.
My contention is that while God is a consumming fire He is not the "Lake of Fire/Hell"
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
To all:
Hell is a real place and the Lake of Fire is a real place. While they are real and literal places, the duration of punishment in these places is not eternal. Isaiah 66:24 shows the destruction of the wicked. Even the devil is said to be destroyed in Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28.
Hell is a real place and the Lake of Fire is a real place. While they are real and literal places, the duration of punishment in these places is not eternal. Isaiah 66:24 shows the destruction of the wicked. Even the devil is said to be destroyed in Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28.
Johann
Well-Known Member
Do you have a problem with reading my posts?--We are NOT to scorn and mock--
2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2 Timothy 4:2
Preach: Psa_40:9; Isa_61:1-3; Jon_3:2; Luk_4:18-19, Luk_9:60; Rom_10:15; Col_1:25, Col_1:28
be: Luk_7:4, Luk_7:23; Act_13:5 *marg. Rom_12:12; 1Ti_4:15-16
in: Joh_4:6-10, Joh_4:32-34; Act_16:13, Act_16:31-33, Act_20:7, Act_20:18-21, Act_28:16, Act_28:30-31
reprove: Col_1:28-29; 1Th_2:11-12, 1Th_5:14, 1Th_5:20; Tit_1:13, Tit_2:15; Heb_13:22; Rev_3:19
exhort: 1Ti_4:13
all: 2Ti_2:21, 2Ti_2:25, 2Ti_3:10
1) "Preach the word" (kerekson ton logon) "Preach, proclaim, or herald the Word;" The charge of both the ministers and the church, Mat_28:18-20; 1Co_1:21-23; 2Co_5:19-20; Col_1:25-29. To preach the word means more than a "pet-part" of it, Act_20:26-27.
2) "Be instant in season, out of season" (episthethi e u k airos, akairos) "Be attentive, alert, diligent; seasonably, unseasonably;" When things seem favorable and unfavorable, day and night, Act_20:31.
SEASONABLE PREACHING
The bishop sent for John Berridge to reprove him for preaching at all hours and on all days. "My Lord, said he modestly, "I preach only at two times." "Which are they, Mr. Berridge?" "In season and out of season, my Lord. "
-6,000 Windows for Sermons
EVERYTHING BUT GOD'S WORD
An Ohio church called a pastor who qualified on nine points beyond all other candidates, being "selected on a strictly scientific basis." Some of these points included -"Spirituality -- but this doesn't mean belief in the virgin birth, or any of the other dogmas of the old church, such as Jonah and the whale." If candidates professed belief in any such ideas they were marked off on the first point. Other points were Intellectuality, Scholarliness, Adaptability, Poise, Personality, Tolerance and Sympathy, Vision, Appeal to Youth. The minister according to these qualifications, should enjoy the same things a college professor does," have a good "stage appearance," his shoes must always be shined and his suit pressed; he should have a tolerance for all religious sects. The minister chosen "scored ninety-three per cent out of a possible one hundred," outstripping the other candidates by a large majority. It is a relief to turn from this to Paul's word to ministers: "I charge thee... Preach the Word."
-Sunday School Times
a) "Reprove" (elegkson) For lack of truth and holiness.
b) "Rebuke" (epitimeson) "Admonish" those who live in sin.
c) "Exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine." (parakales en pase makrothumia kai didache) "Exhort in all (kinds of) longsuffering and teaching," (to repentance in faith), in every possible exhibition of suffering and every possible method of teaching, 1Co_9:20-23.
I'm here to let the lion loose, the gospel can defend itself--it is the DUNAMIS of God UNTO salvation to EVERONE that believe--too much philosophizing, without scripture is what I am witnessing.
I noticed amigo "liked" your post, but you will get to know me, as a brother in Christ, NOT your enemy.
Johann
Well-Known Member
I'm rooting for you Jack-urging you to do what God has called you to do-
Rom_10:8 But what doth it say? 'Nigh thee is the saying—in thy mouth, and in thy heart:' that is, the saying of the faith, that we preach;
Rom_10:15 and how shall they preach, if they may not be sent? according as it hath been written, 'How beautiful the feet of those proclaiming good tidings of peace, of those proclaiming good tidings of the good things!'
1Co_1:23 also we—we preach Christ crucified, to Jews, indeed, a stumbling-block, and to Greeks foolishness,
1Co_15:11 whether, then, I or they, so we preach, and so ye did believe.
2Co_4:5 for not ourselves do we preach, but Christ Jesus—Lord, and ourselves your servants because of Jesus;
1) "For we preach not ourselves," (ou gar heautous kerussomen) "For we proclaim not ourselves;" as heads of the Lord's church or lords of God's heritage, because God gave this honor and position to Jesus only, Eph_1:22-23.
2) "But Christ Jesus the Lord," (alla Christon lesoun kurion) "But Christ Jesus (as) Lord;" no man can say Jesus is "Lord," but in the Holy Spirit, 1Co_12:3. Jesus is the believer's savior and the obedient believer's Lord, Master, and King whose work is to be done by His servants and subjects, Joh_12:13; Luk_6:46; Joh_15:14; Eph_6:9.
3) "And ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake,” (heautous de doulous humon dia lesoun) "and ourselves your slaves (servants) on account of Jesus," or on behalf of, for Jesus' sake, 1Co_9:19-22; 2Co_5:13-20; Mat_20:25-28.
Contents: Truth taught, commended by the life. The preaching of the Lordship of Christ. The suffering of true ministers with Christ.
Characters: God, Christ, Paul.
Conclusion: A steadfast adherence to the truths of the Gospel, backed by constancy and sincerity, will commend the servant of God to the opinion of wise men. They should not be of proud spirit, but realize that they themselves are but vessels of little worth and in their perplexities for Christ’s sake let them know that God is able to support them and in Him they should ever trust and hope.
Key Word: Ministry, 2Co_4:1.
Strong Verses: 2Co_4:2, 2Co_4:5, 2Co_4:6, 2Co_4:7, 2Co_4:11, 2Co_4:16, 2Co_4:17, 2Co_4:18.
Striking Facts: 2Co_4:13-14. A great sustaining power for the persecuted servant of Christ is the hope of resurrection through Him. This hope will save us from sinking. We know that Christ was raised and His resurrection is an earnest and assurance of ours. What reason has a Christian to fear death who dies in hope of being raised by the Lord Jesus?
Summarized Bible
Shalom brother
J.
Johann
Well-Known Member
If this is the topic you want to expound on, do so,--
2Ti 2:14 Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.
2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
2Ti 2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
1) "Study to shew thyself approved unto God" (spoudoson seauton dokimon parastesai to theo) "Be eager to present (stand up straight) thyself approved toward God," or give diligence to present thyself and thy work to God, approved. What God approves, He will bless.
2) "A workman that needeth not to be ashamed" (ergaten anepaischunton) "A workman unashamed or unblushing," that needs not blush or be ashamed. One is neither to be ashamed of the Word of God or work of God. He is to study that he may be able to teach or preach it without blushing, Joh_5:39; Act_17:11; 1Pe_3:15.
3) “Rightly dividing the word of truth" (orthotomounta ton logon tes aletheias) "Cutting straight (in an orthodox manner), (rightly dividing or dissecting) the Word of truth." Rightly administering the Word and work of God, or rightly handling it, Luk_24:44, according to the Lord's Commission, Mar_16:15; Mat_28:18-20; Act_1:8.
To study and rightly divide the word of truth leads to right conclusions. To study the Word wrongly divided, out of contextual setting, leads to wrong conclusions, errors, perversions, and distortions of the Word of truth.
Study: Heb_4:11; 2Pe_1:10, 2Pe_1:15, 2Pe_3:14 *Gr.
approved: Act_2:22; Rom_14:18, Rom_16:10; 2Co_5:9, 2Co_10:18; Gal_1:10; 1Th_2:4
a workman: Mat_13:52; 2Co_3:6, 2Co_6:3-4; 1Ti_4:6, 1Ti_4:12-16
rightly: Mat_13:52; Mar_4:33; Luk_12:42; Joh_21:15-17; Act_20:27; 1Co_2:6, 1Co_3:1-2; 2Co_4:2; 1Th_5:14; Heb_5:11-14
Handling aright (orthotomounta). Present active participle of orthotomeō, late and rare compound (orthotomos), cutting straight, orthos and temnō), here only in N.T.
It occurs in Pro_3:6; Pro_11:5 for making straight paths (hodous) with which compare Heb_12:13 and “the Way” in Act_9:2. Theodoret explains it to mean ploughing a straight furrow. Parry argues that the metaphor is the stone mason cutting the stones straight since temnō and orthos are so used. Since Paul was a tent-maker and knew how to cut straight the rough camel-hair cloth, why not let that be the metaphor? Certainly plenty of exegesis is crooked enough (crazy-quilt patterns) to call for careful cutting to set it straight.
Robertson
Is that what Paul is saying--preach Christ, and Him crucified?
Or preach hell--everyone terrified?--believe it or no, the majority is not even afraid of Hell or eternal consequences. Nor the preaching of the thunders and lightning's of Mt. Sinai
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Joh 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
Joh 3:20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
Joh 3:21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
Shalom brother, sorry for the edit, an afterthought-
J.
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Johann
Well-Known Member
Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
Ecc 12:14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
@marks love Ecclesiastes-and I can see why.
Patrick1966
Well-Known Member
I'm inclined to feel the same way but I've had so-called "brothers in Christ" here virtually condemn me for sharing my belief that God loves all of us and won't permit any of us to be lost forever. Perhaps you share that view; I don't know.
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
What do you make of this?
The restoration of Sodom and Gomorrah from "eternal" fire Jude 1:7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire. Zephaniah 2:9 Therefore, as surely as I live,” declares the Lord Almighty, the God of Israel, “surely Moab will become like Sodom, the Ammonites like Gomorrah— a place of weeds and salt pits, a wasteland forever. The remnant of my people will plunder them; the survivors of my nation will inherit their land.” Ezekiel 16:53 “‘However, I will restore the fortunes of Sodom and her daughters and of Samaria and her daughters, and your fortunes along with them,
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Fair enough.
What is the purpose of the Lake of Fire?
Meaningful, or meaningless?
What will it accomplish?
Johann
Well-Known Member
I don't share that view-but I don't see you as an enemy of the cross.
J.
Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
“Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.” (Revelation 2:5)
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