Why take purse, scrip, and sword?

[Job]

I don't believe that any good can come from it, to a new believer.

I agree.

I try to bridle my tongue........sometimes I fail.

There are also lurkers on the sidelines. Many are fence sitters who are trying to make a decision as to which side of the fence they want to be on. I'm sure some of them climb down off that fence back into their own yard. They come here looking for Jesus, but find the harsh reality of religion instead.

k

 

[pia]

Thanks so much. Laughter doeth good like medicine........

 

[pia]

I agree.

I try to bridle my tongue........sometimes I fail.

There are also lurkers on the sidelines. Many are fence sitters who are trying to make a decision as to which side of the fence they want to be on. I'm sure some of them climb down off that fence back into their own yard. They come here looking for Jesus, but find the harsh reality of religion instead.

k

Yeah you're so right, and it can at times make me weep a LOT. It's confusing enough without people who say they are Christians acting worse (at times) than the unbelievers. Love your term for it......'the harsh reality of religion', well put.
I am so stoked that there are people here who are a real blessing, thanks Job.
Just thought about bridling ones tongue, sooo hard at times lol.
Pia

 

[VictoryinJesus]

VictoryinJesus

The disciples were to now take these things which before they were not to take. This was because there was now going to be a change in the message and in Christ's literal physical presence among the disciples.

Before the message was 'the kingdom of God'. (Luke 9:1-2) "Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases. And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick." See also, (Matt. 3:1-2, 4:17, 10:5-6)

And at that time they were to not take these things. (Luke 9:3) "And he said unto them, Take nothing for your journey, neither staves, nor scrip, neither bread, neither money; neither have two coats apiece."

But Israel had rejected Christ the King and so had rejected the kingdom. Thus Christ was now going to the Cross. He would no longer be physically among them as He had been. And when He had been, no harm could ever come to them. He supplied all their needs. (John 17:12) Now the disciples will have to prepare. Use their God given senses. Provide for their self-defense if necessary.

So, Christ has been rejected. The message has changed. (See Matt. 28:18-20) The direction of the message has changed. (Acts 1:8) They would now be taking the message in faith and in the power of the Holy Spirit. They are to trust God, but, as the saying goes, 'keep your powder dry'. They are taking the message now to a Christ rejecting world.

Stranger

Stranger, I have been thinking about your reply. A lot. If you are correct and the kingdom was rejected(which we know that is true) and the message changed...then would this not answer so much? We hear the movement proclaiming Christ commanded us to raise the dead, cast out demons and heal the sick...did that message also change? Do those commands still apply? Literally for today. Or are they false teachings? Curious of your thoughts...

 

[bbyrd009]

nice Q. They either must be understood literally, and are therefore false teachings, or one must change their minds, and perceive differently to realize them. And we even more or less universally recognize the falseness in taking them too literally, a la Benny Hinn or whatever

 

[lforrest]

That is very kind of you Job, and after the night I have had, it really picked me up.....After both BOL and Marymog had a rather nasty go at me, misquoting as usual.....I think it would be so awesome if those of us who can discuss things without becoming venomous about it, could have a place to commune, without all the hullabaloo about catholisism, protestanism and the rest, and just concentrate on The Lord and sharing, what we have had revealed to us or sharing when we gain understanding on something, and to feel safe to ask questions of believers such as yourself and a couple of others I have come to respect here. Now that would be a way for us to be there for each other , to lift one another up, when needed etc. I truly think that is what a forum such as this should be. Also then the people who prefer their denominations, could have their own forum , and they could share the way they think appropriate. Seems to me that would solve some of the issues here. This whole thing makes me super sad, because if a person who has just received Christ should come onto this forum , I can't even imagine what they would make of all this ? I don't believe that any good can come from it, to a new believer. I would be interested what you think, or am I just being a 'little' too sensitive ?
When I first opened your post, I actually thought that you were poking fun at me ( albeit in a nicer way ), but I didn't think so after seeing that it was you.......I hope I was right ? lol
I am still spending quite a bit of time trying to find prior posts from you and a few others, who to me sound very honest and respectful ( which matters to an old bird like me ), but I can see it will take me some time........I must say though, that apart from a few, this forum is much improved compared to whatever the old forum I was on was called. There are a lot more sincere believers on here, and they appear, as I just pointed out, at a higher stage with the Lord than I have encountered before, just marvelous ! Sorry this got so long and thank you once again...........Bless you Pia

I avoid the Catholic debates as much as possible. After 97 pages of argument, in just one of many topics, I doubt anyone will change their mind. So what is the point to participatimg?

 

[Helen]

@pia
It is good to know that there are some good positive people here that sow some excellent thoughts... the more we sow the positive things of God, we are watering down the negative hostile stuff.
I lean much upon the 'inner promptings' of The Spirit...I confess I am not much of an intellectual at all. But, I do read their ( intellectual) threads and try to follow some of those long words. LOL
I think at the moment this site has a very nice balance of people...some friendly, some not...different personalities , all different.

 

[Stranger]

Stranger, I have been thinking about your reply. A lot. If you are correct and the kingdom was rejected(which we know that is true) and the message changed...then would this not answer so much? We hear the movement proclaiming Christ commanded us to raise the dead, cast out demons and heal the sick...did that message also change? Do those commands still apply? Literally for today. Or are they false teachings? Curious of your thoughts...

I don't understand what you ask when your say, 'then would this not answer so much?'

You say you hear the movement. Are you saying you see this in Scripture for today? Are you aware of certain Scripture that speaks to this? If not I can find it but I would like to know that I am addressing the Scripture you are addressing.

Stranger

 

[aspen]

I avoid the Catholic debates as much as possible. After 97 pages of argument, in just one of many topics, I doubt anyone will change their mind. So what is the point to participatimg?

Clarifying your own beliefs.

 

[amadeus]

We are told to be "gentle as doves yet wise as serpents" for a reason.

My husband has recently felt God calling him to be a father to young men addicted to drugs. When you interfere, those that want these young men to remain with them rather than shown a way out; they will threaten your life. We have children in our home, so yes, my husband keeps a pistol on standby. We are not aggressive people. We don't hate, we have empathy, but yet, I don't see it as wrong or against God for the head and leader of our home to protect his family.

But at the same time, there is another sword that is far more powerful and is always yielded out of love and gives freedom to those it comes against.


Ephesians 6:12-18 KJV
[12] For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places . [13] Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand. [14] Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; [15] And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace; [16] Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked. [17] And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God: [18] Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;
which is the word of God:

Hebrews 4:12 KJV
[12] For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

I have been slain by the sword.

Those that lead others into capitivity must also be killed by the sword. Hopefully by the sword of God's word(bringing in the light and truth of the Son), rather than the literal sword that only ends life, rather than give it.

There is a time and place for both. I think.

I am not speculating why Jesus told them; if they had no sword, to sell their garment to buy one. I still do not know. There is a good reason, Christ never wastes words. Let us not forget He also included; purse and (I am sorry when I first wrote "stave" which was an error...) "scrip" is what Jesus said.

In looking for why Jesus said to sell their garment to buy a sword, we might consider the cost of the pearl of great price:

Mat 13:45 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls:
Mat 13:46 Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.

The pearl of great price is the kingdom of God. The Way into that kingdom is through the Word of God, which is the Sword, is it not? Remember also that the Way into the Tree of Life is through the flaming sword.

"So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life." Gen 3:24

 

[pia]

But, I do read their ( intellectual) threads and try to follow some of those long words. LOL

Hi, yeah I am in the same boat lol...Oh well , since it never seemed to matter to the Lord, it doesn't worry me. If there is a word I would like to understand I look it up in my dictionary. Had to laugh the other day, as a friend pointed out a word I was using incorrectly, which I realized I had done since I first came to OZ lol... some words I had gotten the gist of, but not the actual whole meaning. Thought that was hilarious after all these years, but it happens once in a while

 

[Stranger]

Stranger, I have been thinking about your reply. A lot. If you are correct and the kingdom was rejected(which we know that is true) and the message changed...then would this not answer so much? We hear the movement proclaiming Christ commanded us to raise the dead, cast out demons and heal the sick...did that message also change? Do those commands still apply? Literally for today. Or are they false teachings? Curious of your thoughts...

Yes the kingdom was rejected and thus the message changed. And the direction of the new message changed. Before it was to Israel only, 'repent and be baptized for the kingdom of heaven is at hand'. (Matt. 10:5-15) Now the message is 'believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved'. (Acts 8:35-37) And it is to all the world. (Matt. 28:19)

Because you have evil angels and demons existing and possessing people and trying to thwart anything God is doing no matter which time period we are under, then the messenger of God will always encounter these. So healings and casting out demons will be part of our ministry as Christians, as (Mark 16:15-18) says. But I believe this is done within the local body of believers due to the gifts God has given and the authority of the leadership in that body. That doesn't mean an individual may not encounter and need to exercise certain gifts during his worldly duties, but overall these things, I believe, are exercised in the Church.

Not everyone is going to be healed and there are not demons behind every bush. I don't believe these gifts are to be taken on the road like a circus show. If we just busy ourselves in giving the Gospel and doing our part in the local body, we will no doubt encounter and have experiences with these. And then we deal with it. This way, I believe, we don't let it go to our heads as the disciples did. (Lu. 10:17) Instead we focus on what is greater, (Luke 10:20) "Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven."

Stranger