Why was "the Tree" placed in the center of the garden (orchard)

[Stumpmaster]

So this is why God from the beginning did not allow people to eat the fruit of the tree of good and evil, because there is no meaning, because in a sense good and evil are relative, As you quote and describe, God wanted us to listen to His word from the beginning, to give us a normal and reasonable order of behavior, So the tree of good and evil is always in the middle of the garden, because it is God's plan. For us, the tree of good and evil is the foundation of all arrangements, but it is also the outside of all results.

 

[soberxp]

View attachment 70695

That's not what I meant.
Have you read what I said carefully?

Knowing good and evil is not the same thing as repentance.

All know the good and evil, but not all do the good.

Repentance is only for the still want to do something good, and it's not about knowing the good and evil, they want to be normal as the wish of God.

 

[One 2 question]

The Holy Spirit never contradicts the Word of God.

Sure, how can the the Word of God, being Christ and His Spirit contradict eachother. A kingdom divided against itself cannot stand.

But just to clarify. Are you saying that Jesus is the Word of God? Or are you saying the word of God is what Jesus was refering to when He said, man does not live by bread alone but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God?

This term 'word of God' has been used to refer to different people or things in this forum. It can become somewhat unclear what people are referring to.

 

[soberxp]

This term 'word of God' has been used to refer to different people or things in this forum. It can become somewhat unclear what people are referring to.

If someone proposes a doctrine that is the same as part of God's word, do you think it is God's word?

 

[St. SteVen]

However, if something is added, we can indeed judge whether it aligns with the word of God based on the entirety of the Scriptures.

Against what standard would you judge additions and omissions? The Bible has both.
The English translation is our best guesses at what the original said. (which no longer exists)

Majority Text vs. Critical Text vs. Textus Receptus - Textual Criticism 101 - Berean Patriot

[

 

[soberxp]

Against what standard would you judge additions and omissions? The Bible has both.
The English translation is our best guesses at what the original said. (which no longer exists)

Majority Text vs. Critical Text vs. Textus Receptus - Textual Criticism 101 - Berean Patriot

[

That's why we have all kinds of languages, and I can refer to the Chinese Bible, which is different from the English Bible, To judge reasoning. This is why God confused words in the time of Babel. God's deliberation transcends all time, action, and limitations.

 

[One 2 question]

If someone proposes a doctrine that is the same as part of God's word, do you think it is God's word?

What are YOU refering to when use the term 'God's word'? Again there are a number of different interpretations and uses of this term.

 

[soberxp]

What are YOU refering to when use the term 'God's word'? Again there are a number of different interpretations and uses of this term.

The word of God in the Bible, of course.

If I were to quote a book from another religion, I would use the title of the book, not the religious name or the word of God.(even if I think that is the word from God.)

 

[St. SteVen]

That's why we have all kinds of languages, and I can refer to the Chinese Bible, which is different from the English Bible, To judge reasoning. This is why God confused words in the time of Babel. God's deliberation transcends all time, action, and limitations.

I agree that God can use anything to communicate with us.
Even imperfect things.

[

 

[One 2 question]

The word of God in the Bible, of course.

If I were to quote a book from another religion, I would use the title of the book, not the religious name or the word of God.(even if I think that is the word from God.)

Ok. So some of God's truths that were revealed to humans and written down in scrolls. Of these others humans decided to bring some and not others and make them into one compilation or collection and call it the bible. This process was done many many times and still the churches debate fiercely over what should be added or removed.

Is this book what you refer to as God's word or is this evolving book the word of God?

Just trying to get some more clarification as to what YOU in particular mean when YOU use this term.

 

[soberxp]

Ok. So some of God's truths that were revealed to humans and written down in scrolls. Of these others humans decided to bring some and not others and make them into one compilation or collection and call it the bible. This process was done many many times and still the churches debate fiercely over what should be added or removed.

Is this book what you refer to as God's word or is this evolving book the word of God?

Just trying to get some more clarification as to what YOU in particular mean when YOU use this term.

Can I speak my mind about the Bible and God's word, because I think I can rationally analyze whether God's word is being used correctly, Because I don't think the Book of Enoch should be excluded from the Bible as an apocrypha. It is the absence of this part that has led to all kinds of debates today about redemption and salvation.

The book of Enoch makes it clear that in the future, believers will live in one place and unbelievers live in one place.

Death is complete death.

 

[St. SteVen]

The forbidden tree placed where it had to be confronted often.

Why was the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil
placed in the center (midst) of the orchard (garden) of Eden?

Interestingly, Adam and Eve had to be deceived to "eat thereof".

It seems they had no intention of eating from the forbidden tree.

What was going on here?

Whether you take the story as literal or figurative, it begs many questions.

 

[One 2 question]

The forbidden tree placed where it had to be confronted often.

Why was the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil
placed in the center (midst) of the orchard (garden) of Eden?

Interestingly, Adam and Eve had to be deceived to "eat thereof".

It seems they had no intention of eating from the forbidden tree.

What was going on here?

Whether you take the story as literal or figurative, it begs many questions.

Yes, and yet again the eternal never ending story of the Creator unfolds. His script just playing out exactly as He envisioned.

What was going on here?

What has played out since then gives us mere humans a bit of an insight as to why God orchestrated this strange situation.

He designed and created this tree of knowledge of good and evil. He placed it in such a location that it would be a regular means of temptation as God designed humans to have the ability to be tempted. God sent an angel with the ability to tempt humans. And an unlimited time to be tempted as they had access to the tree of life so they could live forever with both the temptation and the tempter.

God had a plan. And we know from hindsight that He cursed humans with no means of breaking it. Then God sent His Son to break it. And since then we can be reconciled to Him.

Therefore God's mercy and grace, forgiveness and work of reconciliation were hidden in Himself until ..... He designed this plan for an offence to happen. From that point on God can unveil a fuller manifestation of His character.

 

[Earburner]

Actually they had to break God’s law to eat it.
Having created humans in his image, God gave them free will, but it was not unconditional.....in order to keep living indefinitely, the humans had to obey their Creator, and the fruit of this tree represented God’s sovereign right to make the rules associated with living forever. He placed this tree as his own property, under penalty of death.
The “other” tree in the garden was the one that guaranteed everlasting life.....when they partook of the TKGE, access to the “tree of life” was denied and they were evicted from the garden, never to enter it again.

Without the devil lying about the penalty, the woman would never have taken the fruit, but he inferred that there was a sinister motive in God's planting of this one tree, and that he was holding back something that would benefit them and make them “like God”.
He wanted to separate the humans from their Sovereign Creator and take his place in their lives. He desired their worship and it was he who wanted to “be like God”.

To allow the devil to prove his claims that the humans were better off disobeying their God, Luke tells us that God delivered rulership of the world over to him, and that the devil could give rulership to whomever he wished. (Luke 4:6-7)

The Bible answers all of them.....

Hmm....just thinking out loud:
As for the issues between God and Satan, this is something that I have had concern over.
If there be anyone who is extreme in their vanity, it is those who desire to the utmost that they are to be worshipped. Honestly, should we say that such vanity has a valuable purpose? Sorry, I don't see it.

And then there is the other vain situation of who shall have rulership? Seriously, even among the people of this world, does it ever really matter? None ever really do serve to the people's benefit.

So here we are, still at the mercy of two Eternal beings, both having the knowledge of good and evil ALSO, and never able to get along.
It does sound very familiar.

It is readily apparent to me that the problem all along has been the "Tree of the Knowledge of good and evil". So why then should God create such a thing in the first place, and then bring it into the Garden of His new creation of A&E?

It's all for nothing but a huge sorting process, of "Who is on the Lord's side and who is not".
And, it is as simple as this: If any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His. Rom.8:8-9.
Therefore, I do conclude that ALL of it is not meant for now or even in this dimension, but rather "somewhere over the rainbow".
Not even the fondest memory from here, or anything about this temporary, transitory world of continual struggle shall be remembered. In that, I do find Peace!

As for that darn tree, you mean to say that no one had a torch or a flame thrower,.. a bomb maybe, or even an axe??
Wait a minute! Hold up!!

Jesus did talk about a tree and such a tool, but then again, its use was for a different application,...or is it?? And what about the other tree? The Tree of Life? Surely that means something!
Luke 3
[9] And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees**: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the [lake of?] fire.
(**Notice that the word "trees" is in the plural as in two trees).

Is Jesus saying to each of us that within us there is one of two "trees" that is producing either bad fruit or good fruit? Yes, he is!!
Hmmm....back to Rom. 8:8-9.

Gal. 5
The Tree of the knowledge of good and evil
[19] Now the works [fruit] of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
[20] Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
[21] Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

The Tree of Life:
[22] But the fruit [works] of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
[23] Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

 

[Keiw]

The forbidden tree placed where it had to be confronted often.

Why was the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil
placed in the center (midst) of the orchard (garden) of Eden?

Interestingly, Adam and Eve had to be deceived to "eat thereof".

It seems they had no intention of eating from the forbidden tree.

What was going on here?

Whether you take the story as literal or figurative, it begs many questions.

Satan lied to Eve, She was mislead into eating of that tree. Adam ate of it to stand by her over God. It was God who gives it all to them, free of charge life everlasting as long as you never eat of that tree. What a bad choice she and Adam made.

 

[St. SteVen]

Satan lied to Eve, She was mislead into eating of that tree. Adam ate of it to stand by her over God. It was God who gives it all to them, free of charge life everlasting as long as you never eat of that tree. What a bad choice she and Adam made.

Do you think they really understood the consequences?
Were the consequences even fully stated?
What reference point did Adam have to understand the consequences?

 

[St. SteVen]

--- PARODY ---

The Fall revisited

God: What is this thing you have done?
Adam: She made me do it.
God: What say you?
Eve: The serpent made me do it.
God: You will have great pain in childbirth.
Eve: That wasn't the original consequence.
God: You will eat by the sweat of your brow.
Adam: That wasn't the original consequence.
God: On your belly you will go, eating dust.
Serpent: Hey, leave me out of this.

 

[Keiw]

Do you think they really understood the consequences?
Were the consequences even fully stated?
What reference point did Adam have to understand the consequences?

Yes. God warned them, they would die on the day of eating of that tree. Satan said-you positively will not die( a lie)They died a spiritual death that day, the physical death came many years later. Adam was over 900. A day is as a thousand years to God. She gave up life everlasting, never sick, never without and believed one who did 0 for her or Adam over God who handed them that paradise for free.

 

[One 2 question]

Yes. God warned them, they would die on the day of eating of that tree. Satan said-you positively will not die( a lie)They died a spiritual death that day, the physical death came many years later. Adam was over 900. A day is as a thousand years to God. She gave up life everlasting, never sick, never without and believed one who did 0 for her or Adam over God who handed them that paradise for free

We aren't told all the things God told Adam and Eve. All their daily conversations in the cool of the day are not available in the bible. Do you think God was aware of the conversations Adam and Eve had with eachother and with the serpent? Could God have known Satan's intent? If He did, could He have intervened and removed the serpent from the garden. Or did the created serpent have a free will which not even God could violate.

So many unknowns hey. But if God wants us to know what He told Adam and Eve then we do have the Spirit Who was in the garden with A & E. The Spirit can tell us directly if God permits.

 

[St. SteVen]

St. SteVen said:
Do you think they really understood the consequences?
Were the consequences even fully stated?
What reference point did Adam have to understand the consequences?

Yes. God warned them, they would die on the day of eating of that tree. Satan said-you positively will not die...

What sort of death was Adam expecting? It seems that the Serpent told them the truth.
They did not die in the day they ate thereof.