This thread is for me and @Wrangler to explore areas we might view things in common, or to discuss where and why we differ in approach to God and Jesus.
Anyone else, you are welcome to respond if @Wrangler and I have issues understanding or explaining between us.
But please let @Wrangler answer and show support. Our previous Q&A draw plenty of objections, but here I am trying to find where we can more effectively communicate and agree how to express the relations or process we see around God and Jesus. Thank you for your support and help to explore.
A. General process and pattern of humanity receiving laws and these being fulfilled in spirit
B. Jesus as the Center of the Cross and the fulfillment/redemption process
C. How we as the people or church body receive, respond and act to fulfill this process
@Wrangler to keep track of our responses, let's put A B or C at the top of each post or reply, so I can follow up on each angle without losing track.
A. The general pattern in the Bible
I explain this comparing it to the grief process where growth happens in stages.
First God gave the laws in writing through Moses. These get corrupted by man's selfish desire for control or greed/mammon/material rewards. The sacrifice of Jesus breaks this cycle of retribution, like hitting rock bottom with addiction and starting over, agreeing to renounce and not repeat the past.
But it takes stages of denial, projection of blame and anger, before forgiving and letting go for resolution and peace, for full healing and recovery.
The break in the cycle of sin and suffering caused by ego and man's selfish desires over others is what Jesus represents bh sacrifice and redemption THROUGH Forgiveness.
The analogy or parable I have used to describe this process: Jesus is God's perfect justice sent into this world, similar to an Anti-Virus program that can clean up all the virus corruption in the system that represents man's sins built up and corrupting humanity and society. When you download an anti-viral program, you have to kill the system and reboot with the program inside. So when the system restarts, the program can infiltrate the entire operating system and all files to clean up all the virus corruption.
This is the modern parable I have used to explain why Jesus had to be sent and sacrificed in our world in order to eradicate the corruption caused by sin like a virus embedded in computer systems that cannot debug themselves.
With the pattern of first giving the laws in writing, then Jesus coming later to fulfill the laws in Spirit, I also compare this with the political process of Founders establishing Constitutional laws in writing, then the people learning to receive and live by the Spirit of Justice and Peace to follow and fulfill these laws as well in the spirit of Justice with Mercy and Peace that Jesus and the Holy Spirit represent collectively for all humanity.
We go through the same process.
Luther brought the Reformation of the church, to take back responsibility for the laws by people following the laws directly through God's connection with man through Christ as the Word of God incarnate, instead of relying on church elders to act as the middleman. And now today we are seeing this same Reformation of the state with people enforcing laws and Justice directly in order to become responsible for being our own govt. When this is done through agreement with God and everyone in Christ Jesus, it brings true and lasting peace and justice. (If power or justice is assumed by selfish greed and force AGAINST others by threat of political oppression or physical violence, then that is Antichrist. So we are in the midst of that process escalating right now.)
B.
Anyone else, you are welcome to respond if @Wrangler and I have issues understanding or explaining between us.
But please let @Wrangler answer and show support. Our previous Q&A draw plenty of objections, but here I am trying to find where we can more effectively communicate and agree how to express the relations or process we see around God and Jesus. Thank you for your support and help to explore.
A. General process and pattern of humanity receiving laws and these being fulfilled in spirit
B. Jesus as the Center of the Cross and the fulfillment/redemption process
C. How we as the people or church body receive, respond and act to fulfill this process
@Wrangler to keep track of our responses, let's put A B or C at the top of each post or reply, so I can follow up on each angle without losing track.
A. The general pattern in the Bible
I explain this comparing it to the grief process where growth happens in stages.
First God gave the laws in writing through Moses. These get corrupted by man's selfish desire for control or greed/mammon/material rewards. The sacrifice of Jesus breaks this cycle of retribution, like hitting rock bottom with addiction and starting over, agreeing to renounce and not repeat the past.
But it takes stages of denial, projection of blame and anger, before forgiving and letting go for resolution and peace, for full healing and recovery.
The break in the cycle of sin and suffering caused by ego and man's selfish desires over others is what Jesus represents bh sacrifice and redemption THROUGH Forgiveness.
The analogy or parable I have used to describe this process: Jesus is God's perfect justice sent into this world, similar to an Anti-Virus program that can clean up all the virus corruption in the system that represents man's sins built up and corrupting humanity and society. When you download an anti-viral program, you have to kill the system and reboot with the program inside. So when the system restarts, the program can infiltrate the entire operating system and all files to clean up all the virus corruption.
This is the modern parable I have used to explain why Jesus had to be sent and sacrificed in our world in order to eradicate the corruption caused by sin like a virus embedded in computer systems that cannot debug themselves.
With the pattern of first giving the laws in writing, then Jesus coming later to fulfill the laws in Spirit, I also compare this with the political process of Founders establishing Constitutional laws in writing, then the people learning to receive and live by the Spirit of Justice and Peace to follow and fulfill these laws as well in the spirit of Justice with Mercy and Peace that Jesus and the Holy Spirit represent collectively for all humanity.
We go through the same process.
Luther brought the Reformation of the church, to take back responsibility for the laws by people following the laws directly through God's connection with man through Christ as the Word of God incarnate, instead of relying on church elders to act as the middleman. And now today we are seeing this same Reformation of the state with people enforcing laws and Justice directly in order to become responsible for being our own govt. When this is done through agreement with God and everyone in Christ Jesus, it brings true and lasting peace and justice. (If power or justice is assumed by selfish greed and force AGAINST others by threat of political oppression or physical violence, then that is Antichrist. So we are in the midst of that process escalating right now.)
B.
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