Jesus Second Coming

[amadeus]

It should be.

Perhaps according to your faith, but then what does God say?

"Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts." Prov 21:2

 

[Truth7t7]

Besides relying on Peter's letter, what are the proof texts to show that what John described as a millenial reign of Christ is not a literal one-thousand years?

Revelation 20:1-6 Isnt A Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Dont Be Deceived

Can you find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[Truth7t7]

My belief is not only different from that of the Catholics, but probably that of most Protestants as well.

By all means share your belief?

 

[Curtis]

2 Corinthians 5:8KJV
8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Jesus Christ Currently Reigns, Those Who Die In Christ, Are Present With Him In This Reign

1 Corinthians 15:25KJV
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

There’s a reign in heaven followed by the reign and permanent residence of Jesus on the earth.

I remind you that the entire church and all apostolic fathers such as Ignatius and polycarp, were 100% premillennialist for the first 300 years of the existence of the church, so your interpretation would be soundly rejected by the entire church for a 3 full centuries, had you lived then.

 

[Truth7t7]

There’s a reign in heaven followed by the reign and permanent residence of Jesus on the earth.

I remind you that the entire church and all apostolic fathers such as Ignatius and polycarp, were 100% premillennialist for the first 300 years of the existence of the church, so your interpretation would be soundly rejected by the entire church for a 3 full centuries, had you lived then.

The church fathers weren't all literal Millennialist, many believed in the second coming (Eternal Kingdom)

There Is no future earthly reign and residence of Jesus Christ on this earth as you claim

Many claim Jesus will literally return and rule "On This Earth" In A Millennium this being false in deception

Jesus warned his followers against this teaching, Jesus wont be found anywhere upon this earth as many claim

The Antichrist will be in Jerusalem, claiming to be Messiah Returned, "Beware"!

"Believe It Not" "Go Not Forth"

Matthew 24:23-27KJV
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Revelation 13:13-14KJV
13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

Revelation 19:20KJV
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

 

[amadeus]

By all means share your belief?

Jesus Second Coming

 

[LTJMP14]

Revelation 20:1-6 Isnt A Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Dont Be Deceived

Can you find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

All that you've cited supports a literal thousand year reign of Christ on physical planet Earth.

 

[Truth7t7]

There’s a reign in heaven followed by the reign and permanent residence of Jesus on the earth.

I remind you that the entire church and all apostolic fathers such as Ignatius and polycarp, were 100% premillennialist for the first 300 years of the existence of the church, so your interpretation would be soundly rejected by the entire church for a 3 full centuries, had you lived then.

As scripture clearly teaches below in 1 Corinthinas 15:23-24 , when Jesus Christ returns then comes (The End)

Many disregard (Then Cometh The End) as they desire to see a mortal Millennial Kingdom on earth, after the coming of Jesus Christ

afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the end, not a Millennial Kingdom on this earth as many falsely claim

(Then Cometh The End)

(Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory)

1 Corinthians 15:21-26 & 51-54KJV
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

 

[Truth7t7]

All that you've cited supports a literal thousand year reign of Christ on physical planet Earth.

Smiles, minus a literal earth and mortal humans, because they are non-existent in Revelation 20:1-6

A literal 1,000 year Kingdom on this earth, is a fabricated fairy tale of man

Just as post #228 above shows,at the return of Jesus Christ, (Then Cometh The End) not a Millennial Kingdom

 

[LTJMP14]

Smiles, minus a literal earth and mortal humans, because they are non-existent in Revelation 20:1-6

A literal 1,000 year Kingdom on this earth, is a fabricated fairy tale of man

Just as post #228 above shows,at the return of Jesus Christ, (Then Cometh The End) not a Millennial Kingdom

But all you've been doing is giving your own private interpretation. Why are you right and all who believe in a literal thousand years wrong?

 

[Truth7t7]

But all you've been doing is giving your own private interpretation. Why are you right and all who believe in a literal thousand years wrong?

You can believe as you like, people believe in Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy, dosent make them a reality

A Literal 1,000 Year Kingdom On This Earth, With Mortal Humans Present, Is Found No Place In Scripture

You Will Closely Note, You Were Presented Revelation 20:1-6, And You Were Unable To Find A Kingdom On This Literal Earth, Or Mortal Humans Present, Because The Claims Are Non-Existent

Sorta Like Making A Claim Jesus Lives On The Moon, Its Non-Existent In Scripture

Same Applies To The Claims Of A Millennial Kingdom On Earth With Mortal Humans Being Seen In Revelation 20:1-6

 

[LTJMP14]

You can believe as you like, people believe in Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy, dosent make them a reality

A Literal 1,000 Year Kingdom On This Earth, With Mortal Humans Present, Is Found No Place In Scripture

No need to go to pagan ideas,re Santa and the tooth fairy. That's a tell that you're not very confident in your position. Keep on topic. God promised Israel a land it has yet to fully possess. God keeps HIS promises and that land is on this earth. The thousand years is part of God's plan to fulfill the promises HE made log ago, which means it will be on this earth.

 

[Truth7t7]

No need to go to pagan ideas,re Santa and the tooth fairy. That's a tell that you're not very confident in your position. Keep on topic. God promised Israel a land it has yet to fully possess. God keeps HIS promises and that land is on this earth. The thousand years is part of God's plan to fulfill the promises HE made log ago, which means it will be on this earth.

You teach (Dual Covenant Theology) in (Two Peoples Of God) Israel/Church

There Is one covenant between God and man, the shed blood upon Calvary, period

All the promises and covenants made to Abraham, were fulfilled in Jesus Christ

Galatians 3:16KJV
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

The Church Is The Israel Of God, The Twelve Tribes Scattered Abroad

James 1:1KJV
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

 

[farouk]

No need to go to pagan ideas,re Santa and the tooth fairy. That's a tell that you're not very confident in your position. Keep on topic. God promised Israel a land it has yet to fully possess. God keeps HIS promises and that land is on this earth. The thousand years is part of God's plan to fulfill the promises HE made log ago, which means it will be on this earth.

Hi @LTJMP14 ; one argument which I have heard, used to try to undermine a real, literal millennium is that because "the cattle on a thousand hills" Psalm 50.10 uses the word 'thousand', therefore this supposedly proves that the millennium is not on earth (a far fetched argument, IMHO)....

 

[farouk]

You teach (Dual Covenant Theology) in (Two Peoples Of God) Israel/Church

There Is one covenant between God and man, the shed blood upon Calvary, period

All the promises and covenants made to Abraham, were fulfilled in Jesus Christ

Galatians 3:16KJV
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

The Church Is The Israel Of God, The Twelve Tribes Scattered Abroad

James 1:1KJV
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

I don't see the church in the Old Testament; it started in the NT, in Acts 2.

 

[LTJMP14]

You teach (Dual Covenant Theology) in (Two Peoples Of God) Israel/Church

There Is one covenant between God and man, the shed blood upon Calvary, period

All the promises and covenants made to Abraham, were fulfilled in Jesus Christ

Galatians 3:16KJV
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

The Church Is The Israel Of God, The Twelve Tribes Scattered Abroad

James 1:1KJV
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

No. God's promises to Israel are still in effect and will be fulfilled. The 144,000 are literal Jews as are the two witnesses, and the church is the Body of Christ consisting of both Jews and Gentiles.

 

[farouk]

No. God's promises to Israel are still in effect and will be fulfilled. The 144,000 are literal Jews as are the two witnesses, and the church is the Body of Christ consisting of both Jews and Gentiles.

@LTJMP14 In the end, the difference between Israel and the church in Scripture is indeed of significance in terms of Scripture interpretation.

 

[Truth7t7]

Hi @LTJMP14 ; one argument which I have heard, used to try to undermine a real, literal millennium is that because "the cattle on a thousand hills" Psalm 50.10 uses the word 'thousand', therefore this supposedly proves that the millennium is not on earth (a far fetched argument, IMHO)....

The fact is 2 Peter 3:8 was given to man, so they can understand the (Thousand Years) In Revelation 20

The Lords realm is "Eternal" void of literal earthly time, Revelation 20:1-6 is 100% in the Lordseternal spiritual Angel,Heaven, Devil,Satan, The Souls,The Dead, God, Christ

It's that simple

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

 

[Truth7t7]

No. God's promises to Israel are still in effect and will be fulfilled. The 144,000 are literal Jews as are the two witnesses, and the church is the Body of Christ consisting of both Jews and Gentiles.

The 144,000 represents (The Church) those that are called, chosen, and sealed by the Holy Spirit, and added to the Church on earth during the tribulation

 

[farouk]

The fact is 2 Peter 3:8 was given to man, so they can understand the (Thousand Years) In Revelation 20

The Lords realm is "Eternal" void of literal earthly time, Revelation 20:1-6 is 100% in the Lordseternal spiritual Angel,Heaven, Devil,Satan, The Souls,The Dead, God, Christ

It's that simple

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

It's all being 'reserved'. as the context shows; God is patient in His plans. The verse does not mean that any time the word 'thousand' is used in Scripture it doesn't really refer to anything specific, time-wise. It doesn't mean that suddenly 'nothing means anything and anything means nothing' supposedly overrules the literal sense.