Here is what it all comes down to—- and you’d better get it right!

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amigo de christo

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Wonderful wise words. Let the biblical Lord Jesus Christ be praised.
Oops. Not sure what happened there.
I had typed that we need to let the glorious biblical Lord Jesus Christ be praised.[/QUOTE]
Yes indeed sister . Let the glorious wonderous magnificent biblical LORD JESUS CHRIST be praised . This world is about to be ripped in two sister .SOON it will gather as one and come against the true lambs who did not conform to mainstream society and mainstream religoins .
The hour draws nigh and even is that our betrayer and our betrayal shall come . BUT NO WORRIES SISTER ,
Whether we live , die or suffer for JESUS , WE WIN . This ol world aint HOME . I say again IT AINT HOME .
Truth is , if anyone asked me where i would go for the most wonderful vacation , i would say , LET ME GO HOME .
IT Might confuse some , but the lambs KNOW i aint speakin about THIS EARTHLY PLACE NOR HOUSE as HOME .
HOME IS WHERE JESUS IS . THAT IS the DAY this heart longs for sister . JESUS IS TRULY the ONLY HOPE WE HAVE .
 
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Taken

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The "supposed NEW OSAS", was an OP started by one who DOES NOT BELIEVE in OSAS....

It's like saying LET ME DEFINE YOUR BELIEFS FOR YOU....THEN DISAGREE WITH THEM...

A load of nonsense.

Are you sure that it is not a flying saucer that comes back for them and takes them to the planet Xanadu and then drop them off in each area to live eternity with those that practiced that same sins.[/QUOTE]

Are you sure what SIN is?
 

Grailhunter

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Are you sure that it is not a flying saucer that comes back for them and takes them to the planet Xanadu and then drop them off in each area to live eternity with those that practiced that same sins.

Are you sure what SIN is?[/QUOTE]
LOL Read the Bible.
 

BloodBought 1953

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This is absolutely great stuff! Why can't you stick to it and not go off on tangents? The only thing I would say in mild criticism is that faith is not our "part," per se, because God even provides that for us. All we have to do is choose to follow Him.

When we speak of faith, there is a distinction that should be borne in mind. There is a kind of belief that is wholly distinct from faith. The existence and power of God, the truth of His word, are facts that even Satan and his hosts cannot at heart deny. The Bible says that “the devils also believe, and tremble;” but this is not faith. James 2:19. Where there is not only a belief in God's word, but a submission of the will to Him; where the heart is yielded to Him, the affections fixed upon Him, there is faith—faith that works by love and purifies the soul. Through this faith the heart is renewed in the image of God. And the heart that in its unrenewed state is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be, now delights in its holy precepts, exclaiming with the psalmist, “O how love I Thy law! it is my meditation all the day.” Psalm 119:97. And the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us, “who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” Romans 8:1.

There are those who have known the pardoning love of Christ and who really desire to be children of God, yet they realize that their character is imperfect, their life faulty, and they are ready to doubt whether their hearts have been renewed by the Holy Spirit. Such should not draw back in despair. We shall often have to bow down and weep at the feet of Jesus because of our shortcomings and mistakes, but we are not to be discouraged. Even if we are overcome by the enemy, we are not cast off, not forsaken and rejected of God. No; Christ is at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Said the beloved John, “These things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.” 1 John 2:1. And do not forget the words of Christ, “The Father Himself loveth you.” John 16:27. He desires to restore you to Himself, to see His own purity and holiness reflected in you. And if you will but yield yourself to Him, He that hath begun a good work in you will carry it forward to the day of Jesus Christ. Pray more fervently; believe more fully. As we come to distrust our own power, let us trust the power of our Redeemer, and we shall praise Him who is the health of our countenance.

The closer you come to Jesus, the more faulty you will appear in your own eyes; for your vision will be clearer, and your imperfections will be seen in broad and distinct contrast to His perfect nature. This is evidence that Satan's delusions have lost their power; that the vivifying influence of the Spirit of God is arousing you.

No deep-seated love for Jesus can dwell in the heart that does not realize its own sinfulness. The soul that is transformed by the grace of Christ will admire His divine character; but if we do not see our own moral deformity, it is unmistakable evidence that we have not had a view of the beauty and excellence of Christ.


Some people “ get it”..... others do not....You do....

Nice post....We are close to being on the same page, and if we are not— so what?
 
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BloodBought 1953

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Correct.
Jesus taught; THROUGH HIM, Laws were Fulfilled.



Disagree.
Jesus taught; "IF" a person goes "THROUGH HIM" (Heartfully believing, and Confessing, IN HIS WAY, HIS TRUTH, HIS LIFE); "THEN" that person would absolutely "merit" a place in HIS KINGDOM, (by and through His conversion).

Rom 10:
[9] That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, (THEN) thou shalt be saved.
[10] For (Because) with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Matt 18:
[3] And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye beconverted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.



Correct.

Glory to God,
Taken


Ugh.....if you believe that ANYBODY can “ merit” Heaven other than Jesus Christ, we are living in different universes....If one could merit Heaven....Jesus let Himself be Crucified for Nothing...

Ones Salvation is obtained by the mere acceptance of a GIFT......Christ did the work FOR you and you can accept what He did on your behalf as the Full Payment for your sins or you can reject it....Rught there is the entire difference between Heaven and Hell .....all that stuff you thought was meritorious? God saw it as “filthy rags” if you are trying to use these good things as your Justification....
 
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BarneyFife

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Ugh.....if you believe that ANYBODY can “ merit” Heaven other than Jesus Christ, we are living in different universes....If one could merit Heaven....Jesus let Himself be Crucified for Nothing...

Ones Salvation is obtained by the mere acceptance of a GIFT......Christ did the work FOR you and you can accept what He did on your behalf as the Full Payment for your sins or you can reject it....Rught there is the entire difference between Heaven and Hell .....all that stuff you thought was meritorious? God saw it as “filthy rags” if you are trying to use these good things as your Justification....
Excellent
 
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BarneyFife

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Rom 10:
[9] That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, (THEN) thou shalt be saved.
[10] For (Because) with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Matt 18:
[3] And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye beconverted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Not one word about merit.

We do not deserve salvation by doing our just duty. That's why grace is called "unmerited favor." All is of grace.
 
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Taken

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Ugh..... if you believe that ANYBODY can “ merit” Heaven other than Jesus Christ, we are living in different universes....

"IF" that is what I believed..."I " would have said that, but didn't. UGH, speak for yourself.
 

Taken

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Not one word about merit.

We do not deserve salvation by doing our just duty. That's why grace is called "unmerited favor." All is of grace.

Why respond to me for what BB said?
 

Grailhunter

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LOL Read the Bible.

Deflection...
Guess you do not know what sin is.[/QUOTE]
Sorry, I did not know this was a question.
I have a section in Grailhunter's Corner on sin...biblical and man-made.
Grailhunter’s Corner
It is important to know the difference between biblical sin and man-made sins.
They have had 2000 years to come up with dozens and dozens of man-made sins...male dominated religion....boy's club...boys will be boys.
Surprisingly as it may seem it is not that difficult to live a life with little sin.
As it is they have turned the moral theater into a minefield of biblical sins and man-made sins and it very easy to step on a real sin while focusing on man-made sins.
 

Psalm51

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This is absolutely great stuff! Why can't you stick to it and not go off on tangents? The only thing I would say in mild criticism is that faith is not our "part," per se, because God even provides that for us. All we have to do is choose to follow Him.

When we speak of faith, there is a distinction that should be borne in mind. There is a kind of belief that is wholly distinct from faith. The existence and power of God, the truth of His word, are facts that even Satan and his hosts cannot at heart deny. The Bible says that “the devils also believe, and tremble;” but this is not faith. James 2:19. Where there is not only a belief in God's word, but a submission of the will to Him; where the heart is yielded to Him, the affections fixed upon Him, there is faith—faith that works by love and purifies the soul. Through this faith the heart is renewed in the image of God. And the heart that in its unrenewed state is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be, now delights in its holy precepts, exclaiming with the psalmist, “O how love I Thy law! it is my meditation all the day.” Psalm 119:97. And the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us, “who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” Romans 8:1.

There are those who have known the pardoning love of Christ and who really desire to be children of God, yet they realize that their character is imperfect, their life faulty, and they are ready to doubt whether their hearts have been renewed by the Holy Spirit. Such should not draw back in despair. We shall often have to bow down and weep at the feet of Jesus because of our shortcomings and mistakes, but we are not to be discouraged. Even if we are overcome by the enemy, we are not cast off, not forsaken and rejected of God. No; Christ is at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Said the beloved John, “These things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.” 1 John 2:1. And do not forget the words of Christ, “The Father Himself loveth you.” John 16:27. He desires to restore you to Himself, to see His own purity and holiness reflected in you. And if you will but yield yourself to Him, He that hath begun a good work in you will carry it forward to the day of Jesus Christ. Pray more fervently; believe more fully. As we come to distrust our own power, let us trust the power of our Redeemer, and we shall praise Him who is the health of our countenance.

The closer you come to Jesus, the more faulty you will appear in your own eyes; for your vision will be clearer, and your imperfections will be seen in broad and distinct contrast to His perfect nature. This is evidence that Satan's delusions have lost their power; that the vivifying influence of the Spirit of God is arousing you.

No deep-seated love for Jesus can dwell in the heart that does not realize its own sinfulness. The soul that is transformed by the grace of Christ will admire His divine character; but if we do not see our own moral deformity, it is unmistakable evidence that we have not had a view of the beauty and excellence of Christ.

This post resonated with me very much.

Regardless of where people stand regarding this debate, I'd like to thank @BarnyFife and @Blood Bought 1953 for a great, thought-provoking conversation. I have enjoyed this thread very much and am grateful to have come across it. Bless you both!
 

Grailhunter

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Ugh.....if you believe that ANYBODY can “ merit” Heaven other than Jesus Christ, we are living in different universes....If one could merit Heaven....Jesus let Himself be Crucified for Nothing...

Ones Salvation is obtained by the mere acceptance of a GIFT......Christ did the work FOR you and you can accept what He did on your behalf as the Full Payment for your sins or you can reject it....Rught there is the entire difference between Heaven and Hell .....all that stuff you thought was meritorious? God saw it as “filthy rags” if you are trying to use these good things as your Justification....

See note 2.
Now if you want that long list of scriptures that tell us that it is a biblical requirement to be obedient to Christ I can copy them back here again...and even get someone to read them to you.

We are discussing theology and Christians beliefs. This particular topic can ruin lives and lead people to hell so it gets serious.

1..No one is saying that being good and doing good has anything do with being initially saved, everyone agrees that, that is through Christ.

2..No one here is saying that being good and doing good justifies us, it all about the biblically requirement to us to be obedience to Christ.

3..I am saying that being good and doing good is what Christians are repeatedly told to do. Being good and doing good is obedience to Christ. I mean really, what is the alternative that is being proposed here by some.

4..I am saying that sinful lifestyles can lead to hell...whether they believe in Christ or not.

5..I am not saying that sinful lifestyles cannot be forgiven. Even towards the end someone that has committed the worst of horrible sins or a sinful lifestyle can repent and be forgiven. That is all depends on sincerity and Christ will know the intentions and truths of the heart and will judge according. But that is Christ's choice to send that Christian to heaven or hell. I do contend that a change of heart at the last minute and expecting forgiveness is very risky, because, could someone like Hitler or serial killers change their character in that last few moments of their life? Not saying I know, but I would debate it.

6..I am saying that repentance is required to be initially saved. That repentance is not only acknowledging that you have sinned but a commitment to obey and be good and do good....the best you can. Salvation was not designed for perfection. Then after one is saved and commits sins, that repentance is required to get those sins forgiven. Again a commitment not to keep doing the same sin over and over again. It is not wrong for Christ to expect us to learn from our mistakes...we maybe slow learners but...

7..No one here is saying that you have to be perfect to go to heaven.

8..Then again, heaven is not going to be full of evildoers.

9..No one is saying that being good and doing good is salvation. It is obedience to Christ.

10..And the Bible says over and over again that we should obey Christ and our deeds will be judged, come Judgment Day.

11..Alternatively sins can lead to hell, particularly lifestyle sins because you cannot repent for something you intend to do or even continue to do. You cannot play Christ for a fool. You cannot con Christ, he know the heart and the intent.

12..I do contend that your average Christian will show up on Judgment Day and pass with flying colors.

13..In regard to sins, what is being discussed here is mostly lifestyle sins.

The disclaimer....if you are so messed up in the head that you cannot control your actions....that is still between you and Christ on Judgment Day and that is up to Him. On the other hand if this is you, and you cannot control your actions, you need to seek psychiatric help, because who knows what harm you could do to yourself or others.
 
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Taken

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Deflection...
Guess you do not know what sin is.
Sorry, I did not know this was a question.
I have a section in Grailhunter's Corner on sin...biblical and man-made.
Grailhunter’s Corner
It is important to know the difference between biblical sin and man-made sins.
They have had 2000 years to come up with dozens and dozens of man-made sins...male dominated religion....boy's club...boys will be boys.
Surprisingly as it may seem it is not that difficult to live a life with little sin.
As it is they have turned the moral theater into a minefield of biblical sins and man-made sins and it very easy to step on a real sin while focusing on man-made sins.[/QUOTE]

Yes, it was a question.
Thanks for the link to your corner, but not interested in reading all through your thoughts to guess what your answer might be.
 

Grailhunter

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Sorry, I did not know this was a question.
I have a section in Grailhunter's Corner on sin...biblical and man-made.
Grailhunter’s Corner
It is important to know the difference between biblical sin and man-made sins.
They have had 2000 years to come up with dozens and dozens of man-made sins...male dominated religion....boy's club...boys will be boys.
Surprisingly as it may seem it is not that difficult to live a life with little sin.
As it is they have turned the moral theater into a minefield of biblical sins and man-made sins and it very easy to step on a real sin while focusing on man-made sins.

Yes, it was a question.
Thanks for the link to your corner, but not interested in reading all through your thoughts to guess what your answer might be.[/QUOTE]
No harm, no foul
 

Taken

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Yes, it was a question.
Thanks for the link to your corner, but not interested in reading all through your thoughts to guess what your answer might be.
No harm, no foul[/QUOTE]

No answer.