Nation born in a day in 1948?

[dad]

Nevertheless the irrefutable fact remains that Ezekiel 20 is a gathering of Israel, followed by a another gathering in Ezekiel 22.

Just looking at al the mot

If it is talking about events surrounding the time around the captivity, then it does not matter.

in 1948 no sooner did Israel become a nation again when 6 Arab nations with good sized military attacked them to destroy them. Israel had virtually no military then, but miraculously won.

Not even a pathetic joke compared to how God promises to wipe out their enemies. Not fit at all.

Since then Israel has had several wars where they should have lost, but one miracle after another happened.

One man calls something a miracle, another calls it demonic activity, another calls it technology, another calls it geopolitical manoeuvring, etc etc etc. No one can call it God Personally absolutely destroying all enemies and having them dwell in safety.

You are grasping at straws to try to make a fit where there is no fit.

 

[dad]

We'll have to agree to disagree.

My take is not the time that Jesus returns but when Israel is born in a day, which we know happened only in 1948.

No, we do not know any such thing. The nation born before He comes would only be the start of the future nation, I would think. In other words, the saved, the redeemed Jews, the repentant Israel. That was not 1948. That may fit the converts of the early church who were Jewish, and that may fir the Jews saved in the Tribulation. That could not fit 1948. That is not the nation born in a day the bible talks about. The setting is found in the same chapter

"
Isaiah 66:12
For thus saith the Lord , Behold, I will extend peace to her like a river, and the glory of the Gentiles like a flowing stream: then shall ye suck, ye shall be borne upon her sides, and be dandled upon her knees.
Isaiah 66:13
As one whom his mother comforteth, so will I comfort you; and ye shall be comforted in Jerusalem.
Isaiah 66:14
And when ye see this, your heart shall rejoice, and your bones shall flourish like an herb: and the hand of the Lord shall be known toward his servants, and his indignation toward his enemies.
Isaiah 66:15
For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Obviously that was not 1948. The repentance of Israel at the very end is fast. The nation born that day I could see a good fit. God does come with fire then. God wiill gather them back and keep them safe then. He will be known to them then, and also to their enemies. He will comfort them then in Jerusalem. That is when. 1948 is not a fit.

 

[dad]

Exactly!!

There are two regatherings of Israel, the first in judgement of them - to pass them under the rod.
That is what we have now - and then later, He will regather the remnant of them who believe and serve Him.

Ezekiel 20:33-38
"[As] I live," says the Lord GOD, "surely with a mighty hand, with an outstretched arm, and with fury poured out, I will rule over you. I will bring you out from the peoples and gather you out of the countries where you are scattered, with a mighty hand, with an outstretched arm, and with fury poured out. And I will bring you into the wilderness of the peoples, and there I will plead My case with you face to face. Just as I pleaded My case with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so I will plead My case with you," says the Lord GOD. "I will make you pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant; I will purge the rebels from among you, and those who transgress against Me; I will bring them out of the country where they dwell, but they shall not enter the land of Israel. Then you will know that I [am] the LORD.

Except the commentary I posted places that passage in history not future prophesy.

 

[dad]

The great fundamentalist lie!
Masquerading as truth!


The Great rebellion against Christ and His holy church and apostles!

Reject all of sacred and apostolic Tradition who have the authority of Christ! (The holy apostles)

But accept, obey and submit to the tradition of men like those who translated the KJV Bible (and rejected many books and chapters) and the excommunicated heretic luther who invented the five heretical Solas!

Saul
The Jew
Pride
Hatred for Christ and Christians
Heretic
Fundamentalist

Paul
Humble
Saint
Faithful Christian
Love of Christ and Christians

Saul thought he was doing the will of God and acting righteously

Acts 9:1 And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,

2 And desired of him letters to Damascus to the synagogues, that if he found any of this way, whether they were men or women, he might bring them bound unto Jerusalem.

3 And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:

4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

6 And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem:

Then the risen Christ appeared!
The blinding light of truth prevailed!

Fundamentalism is faith without reason!

So be it with all those who sit in the error of rigorous puritanical fundamentalism!

Pure spiritual blindness, thick black scales!

Not sure who or what you are talking about here. I'll just chalk it up to more conflated religious drivel.

 

[dad]

You and the heresy of “faith alone” say salvation is by believing? That renders this verse and all those about baptism meaningless
Negating the word of God

paul taught faith but never “faith alone”

1 cor 13:2 all faith without charity avails NOTHING!

True. However that is not talking about earning salvation,. that is the gift of God. If someone's works are burned, they are still saved. They simply will not have much rewards.

13:13 the greatest is not faith but charity

Absolutely. God wants us to be loving above all. That is how He is. The verse is not talking about three flavors of salvation there and we only get to pick one to save us! Jesus saves. Gifts and attributes we may have do not.

Phil 1:29 not called to “faith alone” but to suffer for the sake of Christ

Yes, very good advice.

Some people were facing persecution.
Philippians 1:29
For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

It was not suffering that saved them of course. They were persecuted because they were saved! The One who saves us will see us through all things.
Philippians 1:6
Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

He keeps us, He saves us.

 

[dad]

But this problem does not exist in Protestant churches? Whatever

No doubt it does, but has not been their trademark.

The union of the holy church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles is such that it cannot be harmed by the sins of men!

Believers are the church He founded.

Automatic excommunication is incured upon the exercise of the intellect and will to teach error or Hersey or to commit grave sin! Men are sinners, with a sin nature and free will, but we should choose that which is good and holy! Rom 6:13

Great, so who gets to start with excommunicating a pope?

The members of Christ in communion with God and each other are in a state of sanctifying grace!

Great. Hopefully some church outfit doesn't think they have a monopoly on that.

We deplore the sins and outrages of abuse, most of which is done by homo’s on young boys, in any group especially those calling themselves Christian, the communists began infiltration in the seminary’s in the 30’s and the modernist’s and homo’s in the 60’s and 70’s

I don't know, and have no reason to debate that.

This is a symptom of error and Hersey
Modernism or theological liberalism, of the modern apostasy and nowhere does the true church teach anyone to do these things, nor do the Protestant sects which have the same issues! And we don’t blame the Protestant sects or leaders!

My rule of thumb is that if a daycare is known to be riddled with molesters, I would suggest sending kids elsewhere.

 

[dad]

Because we must be taught by Christ thru his apostles in the holy church Matt 28:19

That message is for us all actually.
Matthew 28:19
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
In case you claim it was just the apostles there listening, the next verse clears that up. Those He is talking to extend to the end of the world! The apostles died loooong ago.

Matthew 28:20
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I am right, you are wrong. The chapter was talking to the enemies of Israel. Yes God is using them to chastise Israel. Yes He knew the secular nation would exist at that time. No, it was not Him tenderly gathering then to get there and protecting them yet etc.

I never said He would tenderly gather them. The verses Iposted show the opposite as is happening even now!

 

[dad]

I never said He would tenderly gather them. The verses Iposted show the opposite as is happening even now!

Post the verse again then. I suspect that may not be talking about the latter days.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Post the verse again then. I suspect that may not be talking about the latter days.

Ez. 38: "8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land that is brought back from the sword, and is gathered out of many people, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste: but it is brought forth out of the nations, and they shall dwell safely all of them."

Latter:
'aḥărîṯ
Pronunciation
akh-ar-eeth'

Part of Speech
feminine noun
Root Word (Etymology)
From אַחַר (H310)
Dictionary Aids
TWOT Reference: end (31x), latter (12x), last (7x), posterity (3x), reward (2x), hindermost (1x), miscellaneous (5x).
Outline of Biblical Usage [?]

1. after part, end
   
   
   1. end, issue, event
      
      
   2. latter time (prophetic for future time)
      
      
   3. posterity
      
      
   4. last, hindermost

So The Russian alliance will attck Israel in the last days!

Ezekiel 20:33-38
King James Version

33 As I live, saith the Lord God, surely with a mighty hand, and with a stretched out arm, and with fury poured out, will I rule over you:

34 And I will bring you out from the people, and will gather you out of the countries wherein ye are scattered, with a mighty hand, and with a stretched out arm, and with fury poured out.

35 And I will bring you into the wilderness of the people, and there will I plead with you face to face.

36 Like as I pleaded with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so will I plead with you, saith the Lord God.

37 And I will cause you to pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant:

38 And I will purge out from among you the rebels, and them that transgress against me: I will bring them forth out of the country where they sojourn, and they shall not enter into the land of Israel: and ye shall know that I am the Lord.


God gathers Israel with fury and rules.
He ends a diaspora (1948) and gathers the people (ongoing)
Passes them under a rod of judgfment (historically a nation invading them)
Results: Israel will no longer have the rebels, and the Jews will know the Lord ( the new Covenant Jer. 33).

when jesus returns He gathers Israel from the four corners of the earth and gives them the promised kingdom.

 

[marks]

Ezekiel 20:33-38
King James Version

I have NOT paid sufficient attention to this chapter!

This thread is helping me put some pieces together!

Much love!

 

[dad]

Ez. 38: "8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land that is brought back from the sword, and is gathered out of many people, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste: but it is brought forth out of the nations, and they shall dwell safely all of them."

That is talking to Israel's enemies, and not about Him having already gathered them.

So The Russian alliance will attck Israel in the last days!

Right, and so? That has what to do with claiming GOD restored them and that is why they are there? No. It just tells us that the nation will be there and be attacked and from the rest of the bible we know that is part of the time of Jacob's trial. They need to cry out to God and repent, so they endure many trails at that time. THEN He restores them to the land and brings them from afar etc.

Ezekiel 20:33-38

That time according to bible commentary I read was history. How does that help you or 1948?

 

[marks]

I'll just chalk it up to more conflated religious drivel.

Well that's nice!

 

[post]

Paul is not saying the unbelieving Jews are still part of Israel. he's saying the opposite from Romans 9 through Romans 11. He doesn't suddenly change his mind in one verse.

He doesn't change his mind in one verse, Romans 9:6.
All throughout Romans 9-11, in fact all throughout the whole Bible, rebellious and unbelieving children of Jacob are still called Israel. Believing Gentiles are not called Israel: Israel is called Israel, whether they are believing or whether they are idolatrous.

So in reality is it not you who is taking one single verse, Romans 9:6, and creating for yourself an alternate universe where the believing Gentiles have replaced Israel all over the whole scripture and there is no such thing as Israel at all, contrary to everything the scripture says and the reality of our present age?

 

[Zao is life]

He doesn't change his mind in one verse, Romans 9:6.
All throughout Romans 9-11, in fact all throughout the whole Bible, rebellious and unbelieving children of Jacob are still called Israel. Believing Gentiles are not called Israel: Israel is called Israel, whether they are believing or whether they are idolatrous.

So in reality is it not you who is taking one single verse, Romans 9:6, and creating for yourself an alternate universe where the believing Gentiles have replaced Israel all over the whole scripture and there is no such thing as Israel at all, contrary to everything the scripture says and the reality of our present age?

No, because Israel was not replaced, not did it cease to exist, just because Gentiles were added to the remnant of Israel that remained. The root of the olive tree is Christ, not Abraham.

 

[dad]

Well that's nice!

Unless you can clarify and relate it to the thread, it seems to be banter.

 

[marks]

Unless you can clarify and relate it to the thread, it seems to be banter.

Sorry! It was meant as sarcasm, as a form of metacommunication, over your dismissive comment to @theefaith .

The point being, you admittedly didn't understand what they were communicating, but rather than ask for clarification, and rather than offer your understanding to see if it was correct, you labeled and dismissed it.

Much love!

 

[dad]

Sorry! It was meant as sarcasm, as a form of metacommunication, over your dismissive comment to @theefaith .

The point being, you admittedly didn't understand what they were communicating, but rather than ask for clarification, and rather than offer your understanding to see if it was correct, you labeled and dismissed it.

Much love!

I got the general drift..religious drivel. Sorry you can't defend or clarify it.

 

[marks]

Found it . . .

MATHEMATICAL PROPHECY



Bible Prophecy

THE AMAZING RETURN

of

ISRAEL AND JERUSALEM

Math Prophecy: The Return of Israel | World News + Prophecy

“Who has heard such a thing?
Who has seen such things?
Shall the Earth be made
to give birth in one day?
Or shall a Nation be born at once?
For as soon as Zion was in labor,
she gave birth to her children.”
(Isaiah 66:8)

The Return of Israel … May 14, 1948


You are about to read one of the most fascinating and remarkable prophecies in the Bible . . .

 

[post]

Except the commentary I posted places that passage in history not future prophesy.

lol as though your hand-selected commentaries can't possibly be wrong?