Explain Revelations So Even I Can Understand It

[ScottA]

God is Who has the grudge with those who want to deny that today, on this earth, is NOT His Kingdom, not yet without Him being here.

John 18:36
36 Jesus answered, "My kingdom is not of this world: if My kingdom were of this world, then would My servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is My kingdom not from hence."
KJV

The only Kingdom that is already manifest involving Lord Jesus is His spiritual Kingdom through His Church here on earth. His PHYSICAL Kingdom won't happen until He returns to this earth.

Moreover, pushing the lie that Christ's Kingdom has already come here on earth today deceives the gullible into not preparing for the coming "great tribulation" Lord Jesus warned for the very end of this world. That will involve a pseudo-Christ being setup as God in Jerusalem in a rebuilt Jewish temple, just as He and Apostle Paul showed us for the end of this world. And the orthodox Jews in Jerusalem today already have all the materials to build it, even temple artifacts on display for usage in it. And you think that is being done under the Name of Jesus Christ? Absolutely not!

Thus the ideas you are pushing shows gross deception. You might want to get back to the actual written Word of God instead of playing religion with those deceivers that taught you that junk in your post.

Indeed, Jesus' kingdom is not of this world. However, the kingdom has [already] come:

Matthew 12:28
"But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, surely the kingdom of God has come upon you."​

You also speak of "His PHYSICAL Kingdom" which is not according to the scriptures. "What you sow, you do not sow that body that shall be, but mere grain—" "There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body." And because we know that "God is spirit" and his kingdom to which Jesus has ascended to is also, a "PHYSICAL Kingdom" is not promised. Granted, living in the flesh does not give one a proper perspective.

So, you see, I am not "pushing" my own "ideas", but discerning what is written spiritually (as well as quoting it)...as we who are of Christ and God ought to.

 

[Truth7t7]

Indeed, Jesus' kingdom is not of this world. However, the kingdom has [already] come:

Matthew 12:28
"But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, surely the kingdom of God has come upon you."​

You also speak of "His PHYSICAL Kingdom" which is not according to the scriptures. "What you sow, you do not sow that body that shall be, but mere grain—" "There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body." And because we know that "God is spirit" and his kingdom to which Jesus has ascended to is also, a "PHYSICAL Kingdom" is not promised. Granted, living in the flesh does not give one a proper perspective.

So, you see, I am not "pushing" my own "ideas", but discerning what is written spiritually (as well as quoting it)...as we who are of Christ and God ought to.

Jesus Christ maintains a tangible physical body of flesh and bone, that are physical food on this earth, a body that maintains the physical scars of Calvary

The Lords body as seen below is eternal, and is currently maintained in heaven, awaiting the second coming

Luke 21:34-43KJV
34 Saying, The Lord is risen indeed, and hath appeared to Simon.
35 And they told what things were done in the way, and how he was known of them in breaking of bread.
36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.
37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.
38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?
39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.
40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet.
41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat?
42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.
43 And he took it, and did eat before them.

 

[Davy]

Just as those did in the history I referred to, you also have a great misunderstanding of how the things of prophecy are fulfilled. But I don't have time to go into it at the moment, so I'll come back later to address the points you have made.

My spiritual eyes and ears were opened by my Heavenly Father and His Son a long time ago, and is not something you have the authority to judge, seeing that you cannot even stay in His Word as written.

 

[Davy]

Indeed, Jesus' kingdom is not of this world. However, the kingdom has [already] come:

Matthew 12:28
"But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, surely the kingdom of God has come upon you."​

That above is definitely double-speak. At one point you say Christ's Kingdom is not of this world, and then you say it had already come and is now here on earth. You're not even paying attention to the words that come out of your own mouth.

You also speak of "His PHYSICAL Kingdom" which is not according to the scriptures.

That above statement is a flat out lie... against God's written Word.

Matt 19:27-28
27 Then answered Peter and said unto Him, "Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed Thee; what shall we have therefore?
28 And Jesus said unto them, "Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed Me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of His glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel."
KJV

What you just did was call Lord Jesus a liar, because that above Scripture He said is just the opposite of what you said.

 

[Wrangler]

Indeed, Jesus' kingdom is not of this world. However, the kingdom has [already] come:

Mat 12:28
"But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, surely the kingdom of God has come upon you."

That above statement is a flat out lie... against God's written Word.

Matt 19:27-28
27 Then answered Peter and said unto Him, "Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed Thee; what shall we have therefore?
28 And Jesus said unto them, "Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed Me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of His glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel."
KJV

Oy vey. 2 people who claim to have a grip on Revelation are sharply disagreeing about God's Kingdom and one is calling the other a liar!

Davy, it seems to me that ScottA is quoting Scripture @ Mat 12:28. Not sure how you can say its against God's written Word. However, I see your tactic is to displace his verses with those you prefer - 19:27-28. I'd like to hear your analysis of Mat 12:28 as it pertains to the topic at hand. Thanks!

 

[ScottA]

Jesus Christ maintains a tangible physical body of flesh and bone, that are physical food on this earth, a body that maintains the physical scars of Calvary

The Lords body as seen below is eternal, and is currently maintained in heaven, awaiting the second coming

Luke 21:34-43KJV
34 Saying, The Lord is risen indeed, and hath appeared to Simon.
35 And they told what things were done in the way, and how he was known of them in breaking of bread.
36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.
37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.
38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?
39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.
40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet.
41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat?
42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.
43 And he took it, and did eat before them.

You (and many) confuse Jesus' resurrection from death to life in the flesh with his ascension. Indeed, Jesus rose bodily proving his victory over death in heaven and earth. But there is no resurrection of the dead that includes flesh and blood inheriting the kingdom of God.

"Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption." 1 Corinthians 15:50​

 

[ScottA]

My spiritual eyes and ears were opened by my Heavenly Father and His Son a long time ago, and is not something you have the authority to judge, seeing that you cannot even stay in His Word as written.

I refer you then to the scriptures:

Isaiah 42:19
"Who is blind but My servant, Or deaf as My messenger whom I send? Who is blind as he who is perfect, And blind as the Lord’s servant?"
​

Revelations belong to God.

 

[ScottA]

That above is definitely double-speak. At one point you say Christ's Kingdom is not of this world, and then you say it had already come and is now here on earth. You're not even paying attention to the words that come out of your own mouth.

Those are Jesus' words.

That above statement is a flat out lie... against God's written Word.

Matt 19:27-28
27 Then answered Peter and said unto Him, "Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed Thee; what shall we have therefore?
28 And Jesus said unto them, "Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed Me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of His glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel."
KJV

What you just did was call Lord Jesus a liar, because that above Scripture He said is just the opposite of what you said.

What you say of me, you have said of him.

 

[Truth7t7]

You (and many) confuse Jesus' resurrection from death to life in the flesh with his ascension. Indeed, Jesus rose bodily proving his victory over death in heaven and earth. But there is no resurrection of the dead that includes flesh and blood inheriting the kingdom of God.

"Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption." 1 Corinthians 15:50​

Jesus maintains a body of flesh and bone, not flesh and blood Luke 24:39

The eternal kingdom in the New Heaven and Earth will be tangible with houses built, vineyards planted, fruit eaten, animals restored to the garden of eden, eating tangible food together without killing

Isaiah 65:17-25KJV
17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
18 But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.
19 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.
20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.
21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
22 They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.
23 They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the Lord, and their offspring with them.
24 And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.
25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the Lord.

 

[ScottA]

Jesus maintains a body of flesh and bone, not flesh and blood

The eternal kingdom in the New Heaven and Earth will be tangible with houses built, vineyards planted, fruit eaten, animals restored to the garden of eden, eating tangible food together without killing

Isaiah 65:17-25KJV
17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
18 But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.
19 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.
20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.
21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
22 They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.
23 They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the Lord, and their offspring with them.
24 And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.
25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the Lord.

You are struggling with the confusion placed on all language by God at Babel.

Have you not also read that "the life of the flesh is in the blood?"

Leviticus 17:11
For the life of the flesh is in the blood, and I have given it to you upon the altar to make atonement for your souls; for it is the blood that makes atonement for the soul.’
​

It is the inability to reconcile all scripture that results in such error.

Unless we lay down our life in the flesh, life cannot be taken up again. But it would appear that you are trying to hold on to it.

 

[marks]

What doublespeak. Sad attempt to invoke KJV type language.

Wherewith we have endeavored to speak in the same manner as some who speak according to such, let us go on to a full understanding that even this speech, though with a show of wisdom and wonder, lies fallow as the ground which receives not the rain, nor the refreshing brought forward through the abundance of clear speech, as it's call goes throughout the world.

Much love!

 

[Truth7t7]

You are struggling with the confusion placed on all language by God at Babel.

Have you not also read that "the life of the flesh is in the blood?"

Leviticus 17:11
For the life of the flesh is in the blood, and I have given it to you upon the altar to make atonement for your souls; for it is the blood that makes atonement for the soul.’
​

It is the inability to reconcile all scripture that results in such error.

Unless we lay down our life in the flesh, life cannot be taken up again. But it would appear that you are trying to hold on to it.

You have a hard time understanding that the Eternal kingdom in the new heaven and earth is tangible, houses, vineyards, animals, and food

You project the eternal kingdom as spirits floating around with harps and long hair "Wrong"

You have been shown the Eternal kingdom in Isaiah 65:17-24, we will see it again below in Ezekiel, the river and tree of life, fishermen, fishing nets, and multitudes of fish, fruit on the tree of life for "Food" to eat, in a tangible kingdom

Ezekiel 47:6-12KJV
6 And he said unto me, Son of man, hast thou seen this? Then he brought me, and caused me to return to the brink of the river.
7 Now when I had returned, behold, at the bank of the river were very many trees on the one side and on the other.
8 Then said he unto me, These waters issue out toward the east country, and go down into the desert, and go into the sea: which being brought forth into the sea, the waters shall be healed.
9 And it shall come to pass, that every thing that liveth, which moveth, whithersoever the rivers shall come, shall live: and there shall be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters shall come thither: for they shall be healed; and every thing shall live whither the river cometh.
10 And it shall come to pass, that the fishers shall stand upon it from Engedi even unto Eneglaim; they shall be a place to spread forth nets; their fish shall be according to their kinds, as the fish of the great sea, exceeding many.
11 But the miry places thereof and the marishes thereof shall not be healed; they shall be given to salt.
12 And by the river upon the bank thereof, on this side and on that side, shall grow all trees for meat, whose leaf shall not fade, neither shall the fruit thereof be consumed: it shall bring forth new fruit according to his months, because their waters they issued out of the sanctuary: and the fruit thereof shall be for meat, and the leaf thereof for medicine.

 

[ScottA]

You have a hard time understanding that the Eternal kingdom in the new heaven and earth is tangible, houses, vineyards, animals, and food

You project the eternal kingdom as spirits floating around with harps and long hair "Wrong"

I have said nothing of the sort, nor do I have a hard time with it. But what you have said is of the flesh.

 

[Truth7t7]

I have said nothing of the sort, nor do I have a hard time with it. But what you have said is of the flesh.

As seen below, the Lord and Angel's appeared to Abraham, he desired to was the Lords feet, he prepared them a tangible meal on this earth and they ate

Yes that seen below is Jesus Christ prior to his earthly ministry, in a tangible body on earth that ate physical food, and Jesus wasn't a vegetarian

Genesis 18:1-8KJV
1 And the Lord appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;
2 And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground,
3 And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in thy sight, pass not away, I pray thee, from thy servant:
4 Let a little water, I pray you, be fetched, and wash your feet, and rest yourselves under the tree:
5 And I will fetch a morsel of bread, and comfort ye your hearts; after that ye shall pass on: for therefore are ye come to your servant. And they said, So do, as thou hast said.
6 And Abraham hastened into the tent unto Sarah, and said, Make ready quickly three measures of fine meal, knead it, and make cakes upon the hearth.
7 And Abraham ran unto the herd, and fetcht a calf tender and good, and gave it unto a young man; and he hasted to dress it.
8 And he took butter, and milk, and the calf which he had dressed, and set it before them; and he stood by them under the tree, and they did eat.

 

[ScottA]

As seen below, the Lord and Angel's appeared to Abraham, he desired to was the Lords feet, he prepared them a tangible meal on this earth and they ate

Yes that seen below is Jesus Christ prior to his earthly ministry, in a tangible body on earth that ate physical food, and Jesus wasn't a vegetarian

Genesis 18:1-8KJV
1 And the Lord appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;
2 And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground,
3 And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in thy sight, pass not away, I pray thee, from thy servant:
4 Let a little water, I pray you, be fetched, and wash your feet, and rest yourselves under the tree:
5 And I will fetch a morsel of bread, and comfort ye your hearts; after that ye shall pass on: for therefore are ye come to your servant. And they said, So do, as thou hast said.
6 And Abraham hastened into the tent unto Sarah, and said, Make ready quickly three measures of fine meal, knead it, and make cakes upon the hearth.
7 And Abraham ran unto the herd, and fetcht a calf tender and good, and gave it unto a young man; and he hasted to dress it.
8 And he took butter, and milk, and the calf which he had dressed, and set it before them; and he stood by them under the tree, and they did eat.

If you make a case for the Spirit having no limit, including partaking in the things of the flesh, then you are correct. The problem is that you have also made a case for the flesh partaking in the resurrection (inheriting the kingdom of God)--which is not biblical.

 

[TEXBOW]

Just read a thread about war in heaven via Rev 12:7. Though I read revelations 3x, I confess I cannot keep it in my head. I even read a book by a Rabbi who did an excellent analysis of connecting the many figurative passages.

The 1st time I read Revelations, I thought John must have been smoking something strong when he wrote it.

In the thread referenced above, several poster got into the phases of tribulation and that is not made clear to me from the text. Like Nostradamus predictions, passages are written so figuratively, they can be taken to mean nearly anything.

So, can anyone explain this book at a 4th grade level in just a short paragraph or two?

Something that helped me was a free podcast with the late Chuck Smith doing an expository teaching of Revelations. He is a great teacher that explains it clearly. You can also find Chucks teachings on Revelation on Youtube.

 

[Truth7t7]

Something that helped me was a free podcast with the late Chuck Smith doing an expository teaching of Revelations. He is a great teacher that explains it clearly. You can also find Chucks teachings on Revelation on Youtube.

Chuck Smith followed the teachings of John N Darby in dispensationalism in a pre-trib rapture, and dual covenant theology Israel/Church, he falsely taught the book of Revelation is seen in chronological order when its parallel teachings of same events

 

[Truth7t7]

If you make a case for the Spirit having no limit, including partaking in the things of the flesh, then you are correct. The problem is that you have also made a case for the flesh partaking in the resurrection (inheriting the kingdom of God)--which is not biblical.

Scott you use verse50 below as your proof text to claim "Flesh" or a tangible body cannot inherit the kingdom?

The verses below clearly teach there is a natural/mortal body of flesh and a spiritual uncorrupted body that's eternal

Verse 50 below is doing nothing more than teaching that the "Natual/Mortal" corruptible body can't inherit the kingdom, and you interpret this as all tangible bodies "wrong"

The scripture clearly teaches the resurrection of the dead, with Jesus Christ being the firstfruit of the resurrection, in a "Spiritual" uncorruptible body of flesh and bone "Eternal", that are physical flooding this mortal world, that maintained the scars of Calvary

1 Corinthians 15:42-44 & 50KJV
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

 

[TEXBOW]

Chuck Smith followed the teachings of John N Darby in dispensationalism in a pre-trib rapture, and dual covenant theology Israel/Church, he falsely taught the book of Revelation is seen in chronological order when its parallel teachings of same events

Falsely taught according to whom? You?

 

[Truth7t7]

Falsely taught according to whom? You?

Gods words

The final judgement is seen in Revelation 11:18 and Revelation 20:11-15, this alone shows that the book of Revelation is parallel teachings of same events, and not chronological as Chuck Smith and Calvary Chapels teach

Revelation 11:18KJV
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

Revelation 20:11-15KJV
11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.