Is God outside of time?

[Saint of God]

All i know is that it is TIME TIME TIME to PRAISE THE GLORIOUS LORD .
So let all who name the name of Christ praise and thank the LORD .

Yep, that is the best way to look at it...

 

[Saint of God]

Time is a fourth spatial dimension and part of creation. God is not part of creation, but entered creation, so yes, the immortal invisible God existed before time and outside of time. However, since He desired us to know Him and love Him, He entered time in the person of His Holy Spirit and in the person of His Son. The Bible agrees with this in chapter 1 of Genesis. The first day was the beginning of time. There was no time before the creation.

The creation of lights is the beginning of measuring time for man... We don't know how God measures his time.
Genesis 1:14
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
Psalm 90:4
For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.
2 Peter 3:8
But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

 

[dev553344]

I have heard the argument that God is necessarily outside of time. Is this true?

If we define "time" as a measurement of change (so that we can say something is in the past, is presently happening, or will happen), then God cannot be outside of time. If God was outside of time, he would not be capable of change (for if he did, then he would be in time.) If God cannot change, God cannot create for an action of will requires moving from a state of non-will to will, which requires time (because it is a change.) If God cannot create, he cannot be the creator of the universe.

However, if God is inside of time, then he also cannot be the creator of the universe for time has not always existed, meaning there must be a being greater than God making God not God.

I've always thought time was created by God so that we can learn from the past moving forward.

 

[Saint of God]

One of the few things I remember from my college physics class is that space and time are interconnected and referred to as a singular entity “space-time”. Theologically, I would conclude pretty confidently that space-time is God’s creation. I would be less confident in stating that God was outside space-time (transcendent) or inside space-time (immanent) or both. Acts 17:28 “For in him we live, and move, and have our being” argues for immanence. Isaiah 46:10 “Declaring the end from the beginning, And from ancient times things which have not been done…” would argue for transcendence. I’d say both.

That is funny, where does God mention space-time in the scriptures? Is Einstein your God? Time is a concept, it is not tangible you cannot connect it to anything... The movement of the sun is what men use to quantify time. It is divided into nanoseconds and compiled into eons for measurement purposes. It is not something that you can put in your shopping bag and go home with. It cannot be stopped. It cannot be shrunken. It cannot be sped up.

 

[Saint of God]

I've always thought time was created by God so that we can learn from the past moving forward.

God created the sun... we assume time from the movement of the sun.
Genesis 1:14
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

 

[dev553344]

God created the sun... we assume time from the movement of the sun.
Genesis 1:14
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

Temporal time passes for the mind. It is relative to the person. This is why sometimes time passes slowly and time passes faster. But yes there is universal time.

 

[lforrest]

That is funny, where does God mention space-time in the scriptures? Is Einstein your God? Time is a concept, it is not tangible you cannot connect it to anything... The movement of the sun is what men use to quantify time. It is divided into nanoseconds and compiled into eons for measurement purposes. It is not something that you can put in your shopping bag and go home with. It cannot be stopped. It cannot be shrunken. It cannot be sped up.

It can't be stopped, unless the Lord is wanting a bunch of enemies killed. Joshua 10:12-14

 

[Lambano]

That is funny, where does God mention space-time in the scriptures? Is Einstein your God? Time is a concept, it is not tangible you cannot connect it to anything...

Cut the crap, will you?

It's a scientist's calling to figure out how God's creation runs.

 

[Jay Ross]

Birth is an event and death is an event... An event is something that happens. Are you saying that births and deaths do not happen?

A person's life starts with a birth, and ends with a death where there are no time constraints before or after that person's life. It is a bit like a race between two points in space, the start and the finish of that race between the two points has no time constraints or measurement.

It is a bit like the measurement of a year. There is no measurement of time before the start of that year, just as there is no measurement of time after the end of the year. It is a bit like a line, it has length but no width and therefore no area. A line is used to define an area which has a length and a breadth, if the area is considered to be a rectangle, but the line which defines the boundary of that rectangle has no area that is included within the measurement of the rectangle's area.

The Hebrew understanding of time is that when the time period ends, then time vanishes, and time no longer exists outside of that defined time period. Time is either infinite or finite, it cannot be both. A point in time cannot be measured. It has no time associated with that point in time.

This may seem to you to be nothing but foolishness but for God it is not foolishness, it means that people can understand complex phenomena, which is something that is observed to happen or exist. One such complex idea is that God loves us, yet many people have never seen the existence of God to be able to qualify the understanding that God loves us.

While ever we try to remain within a certain phenomenon, we will not be able to see that phenomenon unless we allow ourselves to step outside of that phenomenon. Ii is a bit like the expression, "A person cannot see the forest because of the trees." To be able to see the forest, we must move outside of all of the trees that we can see to actually see the forest for what it is, otherwise all that we are seeing are the trees that we can see within the forest.

It seems to me that you want to have an argument with other members without being able to step outside of your own argument with yourself.

You want to use the Keep It Simple Stupid principle yet what you are wanting to define is far more complex than just simple.

Good bye,

 

[Saint of God]

A person's life starts with a birth, and ends with a death where there are no time constraints before or after that person's life. It is a bit like a race between two points in space, the start and the finish of that race between the two points has no time constraints or measurement.

bro you said life and death are non-events. You are yet to prove it.

It is a bit like the measurement of a year. There is no measurement of time before the start of that year, just as there is no measurement of time after the end of the year. It is a bit like a line, it has length but no width and therefore no area. A line is used to define an area which has a length and a breadth, if the area is considered to be a rectangle, but the line which defines the boundary of that rectangle has no area that is included within the measurement of the rectangle's area.

This is just foolishness. a year is a measurement of a number of days which is a measurement of the rotation of the sun... Time is nothing like a line. You cannot hold time or wrap up time as you would a line. You are being silly.

The Hebrew understanding of time is that when the time period ends, then time vanishes, and time no longer exists outside of that defined time period. Time is either infinite or finite, it cannot be both. A point in time cannot be measured. It has no time associated with that point in time.

Sir you cannot see time to claim that it vanishes...You cannot touch time to claim that it exist or not exist. You cannot stop time to claim that it is finite or infinite. Your claims are silly.

This may seem to you to be nothing but foolishness but for God it is not foolishness, it means that people can understand complex phenomena, which is something that is observed to happen or exist. One such complex idea is that God loves us, yet many people have never seen the existence of God to be able to qualify the understanding that God loves us.

God has nothing to do with the rubbish that you are writing.

While ever we try to remain within a certain phenomenon, we will not be able to see that phenomenon unless we allow ourselves to step outside of that phenomenon. Ii is a bit like the expression, "A person cannot see the forest because of the trees." To be able to see the forest, we must move outside of all of the trees that we can see to actually see the forest for what it is, otherwise all that we are seeing are the trees that we can see within the forest.

The person cannot see the forest because the person is blind...

It seems to me that you want to have an argument with other members without being able to step outside of your own argument with yourself.

I don't want to have any argument with anyone. I am just pointing out your folly.

You want to use the Keep It Simple Stupid principle yet what you are wanting to define is far more complex than just simple.

Good bye,

There is nothing complex about time...Time is a concept we use to measure the rotation of the sun.

 

[Saint of God]

Cut the crap, will you?

Why would I cut you?

It's a scientist's calling to figure out how God's creation runs.

God already had people write how his creation runs...

 

[michaelvpardo]

The creation of lights is the beginning of measuring time for man... We don't know how God measures his time.
Genesis 1:14
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
Psalm 90:4
For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.
2 Peter 3:8
But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

God is eternal. Time is entirely irrelevant to the Father. He could change the past now if He wanted to, but everything is exactly as it's supposed to be (we have His word which confirms this.)

The only way God measures time is by looking at His creation. He can see yesterday or the first day, today, and tomorrow or the last day. All of time already exists to God (we only experience the moment we're in, normally.) Time is part of creation.

 

[Saint of God]

God is eternal. Time is entirely irrelevant to the Father. He could change the past now if He wanted to, but everything is exactly as it's supposed to be (we have His word which confirms this.)

Where does scripture say God could change the past if he wanted to? These are the kinds of lies that creep into the church and cause divisions among believers. There is no such teaching in the scripture.

The only way God measures time is by looking at His creation. He can see yesterday or the first day, today, and tomorrow or the last day. All of time already exists to God (we only experience the moment we're in, normally.) Time is part of creation.

That is just amplifying your lies. Do you have any scripture to back up your lies?

 

[amadeus]

Where does scripture say God could change the past if he wanted to? These are the kinds of lies that creep into the church and cause divisions among believers. There is no such teaching in the scripture.

When people have died according to the scripture and then were brought back to life as we may read with both Elijah and Elisha in the OT as well as with Jesus in the NT, is that not changing the past? Is that not making alive that which was dead?

"Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:" John 11:25

 

[michaelvpardo]

Where does scripture say God could change the past if he wanted to? These are the kinds of lies that creep into the church and cause divisions among believers. There is no such teaching in the scripture.

That is just amplifying your lies. Do you have any scripture to back up your lies?

You worship a tiny god of your imagination. I worship the Lord of glory (and I understand special relativity which isn't in the Bible, but nevertheless true.)

 

[Saint of God]

It can't be stopped unless the Lord is wanting a bunch of enemies killed. Joshua 10:12-14

You are funny... You are saying that it can't be stopped, but you are asserting that it stopped. The sun and the moon stopped, the sun and the moon are not time...

 

[Saint of God]

When people have died according to the scripture and then were brought back to life as we may read with both Elijah and Elisha in the OT as well as with Jesus in the NT, is that not changing the past?

No, that is not changing the past... since it does not un-crucify Jesus.

Is that not making alive that which was dead?

making alive that which was dead is not changing the past. Going back and stopping the crucifixion would be changing the past.

"Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:" John 11:25

That has nothing to do with time or changing the past...

 

[Saint of God]

You worship a tiny god of your imagination.

And you worship a false god Einstein.

I worship the Lord of glory (and I understand special relativity which isn't in the Bible, but nevertheless true.)

No, you worship einstein and his lies about special relativity. Einstein say there is space above the earth God says there is water...
How can you worship God and not believe hin?
6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day
9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.
10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

 

[amadeus]

No, that is not changing the past... since it does not un-crucify Jesus.


making alive that which was dead is not changing the past. Going back and stopping the crucifixion would be changing the past.


That has nothing to do with time or changing the past...

So it may not be changing the fact that he died... but, even so, should we limit God by saying He cannot do something because we cannot do it and/or because we cannot conceive of the possibility?

Is not God limited by His own Word? Using the authority He gave to us, do we not limit Him when we choose our way instead of His?

"...And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible." Mark 10:27

 

[michaelvpardo]

And you worship a false god Einstein.

No, you worship einstein and his lies about special relativity. Einstein say there is space above the earth God says there is water...
How can you worship God and not believe hin?
6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day
9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.
10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

I noticed that you skipped the first day in your post. That's because there was no time before the first day. Tell me is the earth flat and square because scripture refers to its corners? Or are the stars all smaller than the sun?

If you're Christian why don't you love Jesus Christ and keep His commandments?