The Deity of Jesus under attack on this forum.

[Waiting on him]

So you don't believe Jesus is God and you don't believe anything the Bible says.

That's an interesting strategy for someone who professes to be a Christian. I guess you've just made up your own story for how it all works and you go around teaching Christians that what they've learned about God, and Jesus, in their Bibles is wrong and only you have the true version of things.

Do you know who else was very famous for doing that very thing? The Early Roman Catholics who hoarded the Bible to themselves and made it illegal for any common man to have any access to a Bible. They were only allowed to consult a corrupt Priest, or the antichrist Pope, for their spiritual inquiries. And those who did get access to Bibles and went around preaching the Truth to the common man were ridiculed, attacked, silenced and murdered (martyred) for speaking exactly what the Bible says - as it is plainly written.

How is what you're doing any different, APAK?

Was Tertullian Catholic?

 

[Pearl]

Is that an answer, or is it an answer to evade the question? I must admit it is a better answer than to answer a question with another question.

Are you familiar with 1 Peter 3:15?

To God Be The Glory

1 Peter 3:15
But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect,

Did you ask me to give the reason for the hope that I have?

i don't think you did.

 

[JunChosen]

Did you ask me to give the reason for the hope that I have?

i don't think you did

Yes, I did. 1 Peter 3:15 spells it out.

 

[Pearl]

Yes, I did. 1 Peter 3:15 spells it out.

What was your actual question?

To answer: The reason for the hope that I have is that I know Jesus and have been born again. My sins have been forgiven and I am being transformed by the renewing of my mind. I am a new creation in Christ Jesus.

 

[JunChosen]

To answer: The reason for the hope that I have is that I know Jesus and have been born again. My sins have been forgiven and I am being transformed by the renewing of my mind. I am a new creation in Christ Jesus.

Well said. Yet, I have not seen any "Christians" in these forums give the Scripture 1 Peter 3:15 as a reference even after I've referenced the verse..

 

[Johann]

Isn't that what happens when false prophets in ravening wolves come in, in sheep's clothing? [Mat. 7:15-18]

Johann, you are not alone. I, too, am a product with English as a second language. You write much better than I do. But we are in the market place after all therefore, we ought to obey the command of Jesus to bring forth the true Gospel to all nations (to the lost sheep of the house of Israel). Matthew 28:19-20

To God Be The Glory

Amen to that Chosen
J.

 

[Waiting on him]

Amen to that Chosen
J.

Are you for real? Why would you guys continue in this foolishness, it should be obvious by now with all your studies that Jesus never gave you this command?

I do truly believe this is where all false teachings begin, the inability to first understand what a personal pronoun is.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

we ought to obey the command of Jesus to bring forth the true Gospel to all nations (to the lost sheep of the house of Israel). Matthew 28:19-20

Could be problematic since the "church Is Very Divided and Confused, Mixing
Up" law With GRACE, But God Is Gracious, and Provides The:

Bible Answer To Confusing church Bewilderment!

GRACE And Peace...

 

[GodsGrace]

How do you reconcile Romans 3,10 to 11
With Romans 1,19 to about 21??

Not sure what you're saying here @GodsGrace[/QUOTE]
Hi Pearl, sorry for delay, I didn't forget you.

You posted Romans 3:10-11 to show that no one seeks God and no one is righteous.
The reformed faith uses this scripture very much to show total depravity. I don't know if you're reformed.

Romans 1:19-20 states that from the beginning of time all men have known the existence of God and if they choose NOT to worship Him, they have no excuse since He is seen in His creation.

Romans 3:10-11
10as it is written,
“THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE;

11THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS,
THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD;


Romans 1:19-20
19because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.
20For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.

I'd also state that many verses show that God loves persons that seek Him.
If this is so, then it must be believed that we are able to seek God...

Matthew 6:33
But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.

Hebrews 11:6
And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.

1 Chronicles 16:11
Seek the Lord and his strength; seek his presence continually!

Proverbs 8:17
I love those who love me, and those who seek me diligently find me.

Jeremiah 29:13
You will seek me and find me, when you seek me with all your heart.

Deuteronomy
But from there you will seek the Lord your God and you will find him, if you search after him with all your heart and with all your soul.

 

[GodsGrace]

Was Tertullian Catholic?

Yes. All early Christians were Catholic.

 

[GodsGrace]

If you don't believe, you don't believe.

Pearl, Romans 3:10-11 is speaking to the fact that when we come into this word without the light, the truth, and the salvation from God an his Son, no one is righteous and no one understands or seeks God to want this righteousness. The light shines into the darkness to bring the righteousness of God through his Son, and the darkness of the fallen natural world did not understand it to even recognize it. (John 1:10 - He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him.)

And then as you asked in you r later post with @GodsGrace, in Romans 1:19-22: The Law did not bring righteousness, it made folks aware of their sin and unrighteousness that separated them from God. The true faith to believe in the Son of God, Yahshua/ Jesus the Messiah, in their heart, brings righteousness and a renewal of life of the light of God.[/QUOTE]
Apak, I wouldn't interprety Romans 1:19-20 as you have.

I just wrote this on post 345: (in answer to Pearl)
********************************************************************************************


You posted Romans 3:10-11 to show that no one seeks God and no one is righteous.
The reformed faith uses this scripture very much to show total depravity. I don't know if you're reformed.

Romans 1:19-20 states that from the beginning of time all men have known the existence of God and if they choose NOT to worship Him, they have no excuse since He is seen in His creation.

Romans 3:10-11
10as it is written,
“THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE;

11THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS,
THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD;


Romans 1:19-20
19because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.
20For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.

I'd also state that many verses show that God loves persons that seek Him.
If this is so, then it must be believed that we are able to seek God...

Matthew 6:33
But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.

Hebrews 11:6
And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.

1 Chronicles 16:11
Seek the Lord and his strength; seek his presence continually!

Proverbs 8:17
I love those who love me, and those who seek me diligently find me.

Jeremiah 29:13
You will seek me and find me, when you seek me with all your heart.

Deuteronomy
But from there you will seek the Lord your God and you will find him, if you search after him with all your heart and with all your soul.

 

[GodsGrace]

I think we will leave it there

YOU could leave it there if you wish to...
Problem is I'm not really speaking to you personally...I'm addressing everyone on this thread and anyone that wishes to reply.
That's how forums function. Oh, and let's not forget those that are reading along and hearing some odd stuff...I'm speaking to them too.

Here is what you said:
Those ministers didn't run around wishing to criticise people for standing on Jesus words. You actually have people on these websites that question whether you can be a christian or not because you stand on the plain words of Christ when he walked this earth. At best, that is gross immaturity.

These are the odd ministers you've heard that do not preach that Jesus is God.
I happen to be one of people you mention that are on these websites that happens to believe that you cannot make up your own rules for HOW TO BE A CHRISTIAN.

Some with brains sharper than ours have already done that.
You can accept it or not...but if you do not accept it, then you are NOT a Christian.
Maybe you're a JW,,,or some other type of religion...but not Christian.
To claim to be Christian you must accept that Jesus is God.

We do not get to make up our own individual ideas.

Just because you don't understand something does not mean it doesn't exist.
Scientists don't know or understand gravity...but we know it exists.

The Trinity happens to be easy to understand...we just make it difficult.
If you know the Old and New Testaments you find the Father, the Second Person (the Son) and the Holy Spirit throughout.

 

[stephen64]

To claim to be Christian you must accept that Jesus is God.

.

So in your view, if I stand on the plain words of Christ when he walked this earth I am condemned to hell.
Thank goodness I only find such absurd nonsense on the internet

 

[GodsGrace]

The 'spiritual maturity' idea originates from an old Communist strategy of 1958 designed in overtaking western Churches.

The below is from ex-FBI agent Cleon Skousen's 1958 book The Naked Communist, where he listed 45 strategic points the Soviet Communists developed as disinformation upon the western nations. Those 45 points were entered into the U.S. Congressional Record in 1963 (see The 45 Communist Goals - Congressional Record 1963).

"27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with “social” religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity, which does not need a “religious crutch.”


What's the idea of "social religion" vs. "revealed religion"?

The idea of "social religion" is about leaven doctrines from men ADDED to The Bible. Like the above explains, it is more about "intellectual maturity" instead of the actual revelations from God in His Word. And of course, God's revelations of His Truths within His Word is what the Communists and Leftists want to destroy.

Good and informative post!

I happen to remember all this. Well, not from 1958 but pretty close.
And, by jove, it worked !!
The US has been ruined from the inside out...just as the plan stated. Including the Christian faith, as you've stated.

I find that Christianity is being diluted.
Jesus said whoever is ashamed of Him, He also will be ashamed of him before the glory of God.
Mark 8:38

 

[GodsGrace]

He absolutely said that he went to seminary.

Goes to show his level of sincerity.

Not calling him a liar or anything, but liars have a really hard time keeping track of their lies.

"Scratch a lie, find a thief."

And "the thief only comes to steal, kill and destroy."
John 10:10

Their father is the father of lies himself.

Light shines in the darkness and the darkness cannot withstand it.

Thanks Gen.
I though the other poster did state he went to seminary...

 

[GodsGrace]

So in your view, if I stand on the plain words of Christ when he walked this earth I am condemned to hell.
Thank goodness I only find such absurd nonsense on the internet

It's not easy speaking to you S.

First of all, I never stated you're going to hell.
This is a decision God must make, not me. And very happy about that.

Second, this is not nonsense found on the internet.
Any CHRISTIAN church you go to will advise you that Jesus is God in the flesh. In the flesh. If they don't teach this, it is NOT a Christian church.

Third, I don't know what words of Jesus you're talking about....perhaps you don't understand what He said??
Could you post a verse or two? I know I came here late in the thread.

 

[farouk]

It's not easy speaking to you S.

First of all, I never stated you're going to hell.
This is a decision God must make, not me. And very happy about that.

Second, this is not nonsense found on the internet.
Any CHRISTIAN church you go to will advise you that Jesus is God in the flesh. In the flesh. If they don't teach this, it is NOT a Christian church.

Third, I don't know what words of Jesus you're talking about....perhaps you don't understand what He said??
Could you post a verse or two? I know I came here late in the thread.

@GodsGrace I agree that sometimes it can be hard to exchange views when the response gets personalized; there is a virtue indeed in simply quoting Scripture relevantly.

 

[stephen64]

It's not easy speaking to you S.

First of all, I never stated you're going to hell.
.

So you believe people who are not Christians will go to Heaven?
Which denominations would that be?
The plain words of Jesus:
Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent. John17:3
The Father is greater than I John14:28
The Father is greater than all John 10:29
Jesus said there is no way to the Father but through him. So, who can get to Heaven if they are not a christian? But I happily rephrase
You believe I cannot be a christian if I stand on the plain words of Christ when he walked this earth
I'm grateful I do not hear such absurd nonsense outside of the internet

 

[stephen64]

@GodsGrace I agree that sometimes it can be hard to exchange views when the response gets personalized; there is a virtue indeed in simply quoting Scripture relevantly.

Are you comfortable with believing a person cannot be a christian if they stand on the plain words of Christ when he walked this earth?

 

[farouk]

Are you comfortable with believing a person cannot be a christian if they stand on the plain words of Christ when he walked this earth?

Firstly, if you look at my posts - your question is direct about me - you will see where I stand as regards the words recorded in Scripture.

Secondly, I think your question is loaded to leave me supposedly with believing only whatever conclusion you have already come to, as my only option. (I must confess I have not read all the posts here lately on this thread.)