"The word was a god"?
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ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
Keiw
Well-Known Member
Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
.
Many of the Jehovah's Witnesses going door-to-door throughout the world
are honestly, and sincerely, wanting to enter the kingdom of God on Earth;
which is why I'm convinced that normal Christians really ought to know
something about "hope" as it's depicted in the New Testament before
engaging JWs in a conversation about the kingdom.
• 1Pet 3:15 . . Always be ready to make a defense before everyone that
demands of you a reason for the hope in you,
The New Testament Greek word for "hope" in Peter's instructions is elpis (el
pece') which means to anticipate (usually with pleasure) and to expect with
confidence. Note the elements of anticipation, expectation, and confidence.
In other words: elpis hope is a know-so hope rather than a cross your
fingers hope.
So, unless someone knows for proof-positive, beyond even the slightest
glimmer of sensible doubt, that they have a passport to the kingdom of God
locked in and irrevocable; then of course it is impossible for them to comply
with Peter's instructions seeing as they would not yet have the kind of hope
about which he wrote.
• Rom 12:12 . . Rejoice in the hope.
When people are praying for the best, while in the back of their mind
dreading the worst, they have absolutely no cause for rejoicing; but they do
have plenty of cause to fear the unknown.
Elpis hope is one of the three primary elements of Christianity. (1Cor 13:13)
It's also a calling. (Eph 4:4)
When people are lacking the kind of hope described by the Greek word elpis,
then I believe it's safe to assume 1) God has not yet called them, 2) they have
refused His call and/or 3) they're not on His list of viable candidates.
_
Many of the Jehovah's Witnesses going door-to-door throughout the world
are honestly, and sincerely, wanting to enter the kingdom of God on Earth;
which is why I'm convinced that normal Christians really ought to know
something about "hope" as it's depicted in the New Testament before
engaging JWs in a conversation about the kingdom.
• 1Pet 3:15 . . Always be ready to make a defense before everyone that
demands of you a reason for the hope in you,
The New Testament Greek word for "hope" in Peter's instructions is elpis (el
pece') which means to anticipate (usually with pleasure) and to expect with
confidence. Note the elements of anticipation, expectation, and confidence.
In other words: elpis hope is a know-so hope rather than a cross your
fingers hope.
So, unless someone knows for proof-positive, beyond even the slightest
glimmer of sensible doubt, that they have a passport to the kingdom of God
locked in and irrevocable; then of course it is impossible for them to comply
with Peter's instructions seeing as they would not yet have the kind of hope
about which he wrote.
• Rom 12:12 . . Rejoice in the hope.
When people are praying for the best, while in the back of their mind
dreading the worst, they have absolutely no cause for rejoicing; but they do
have plenty of cause to fear the unknown.
Elpis hope is one of the three primary elements of Christianity. (1Cor 13:13)
It's also a calling. (Eph 4:4)
When people are lacking the kind of hope described by the Greek word elpis,
then I believe it's safe to assume 1) God has not yet called them, 2) they have
refused His call and/or 3) they're not on His list of viable candidates.
_
Last edited:
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Jesus is not referred to in John’s Gospel until v14.
Read Ps 82. Regarding anything being a god, humans who are lawmakers and judges are in the category of biblically recognized gods. Obviously, the Bible is highly figurative. If God’s word does not have the authority of law, not sure whose words would.
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
God never became flesh in John’s gospel, only his words. Don’t let the figurative language confuse you.
If you read Deut 18:15-18, it will be clear that words of God were said by a servant chosen by God. This chosen servants name is Jesus.
The servant of God is not God.
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
as it says, that there are TWO distinct Persons, the Father and Jesus Christ, Who are equally GOD
Webers_Home
Well-Known Member
.
• John 1:1a . . In the beginning was the Word
The Greek translated "word" in that verse is logos (log'-os) which is
somewhat ambiguous. One of its meanings pertains to vocal expression;
for example:
• Gen 1:3 . . God said: Let there be light
So the cosmos-- all of its forms of life, matter, and energy --came into
existence by means of God's voice, viz: by means of His speech.
• 2Pet 3:5 . . By the word of God the heavens existed long ago, and the
earth was formed out of water and by water
• John 1:1b . . and the Word was God.
Now, the thing is: we pretty much have to spell the God in that verse with
upper case so that there's absolutely no mistaking whose speech we're
talking about. If someone wants to say that God's speech is a deity; okay,
but we cannot allow for God's own vocal expressions to be any less divine
than Himself.
NOTE: The Watchtower Society claims the Word is a celestial being named
Michael; which implies that whenever Jehovah speaks, an angel comes flying
out of His mouth.
_
• John 1:1a . . In the beginning was the Word
The Greek translated "word" in that verse is logos (log'-os) which is
somewhat ambiguous. One of its meanings pertains to vocal expression;
for example:
• Gen 1:3 . . God said: Let there be light
So the cosmos-- all of its forms of life, matter, and energy --came into
existence by means of God's voice, viz: by means of His speech.
• 2Pet 3:5 . . By the word of God the heavens existed long ago, and the
earth was formed out of water and by water
• John 1:1b . . and the Word was God.
Now, the thing is: we pretty much have to spell the God in that verse with
upper case so that there's absolutely no mistaking whose speech we're
talking about. If someone wants to say that God's speech is a deity; okay,
but we cannot allow for God's own vocal expressions to be any less divine
than Himself.
NOTE: The Watchtower Society claims the Word is a celestial being named
Michael; which implies that whenever Jehovah speaks, an angel comes flying
out of His mouth.
_
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
1 John 1:1-3 is very clear Who "the Word" is:
That which was from the beginning, that which we have heard, that which we have seen with our eyes, that which we saw, and our hands touched, concerning the Word of life, and the life was revealed, and we have seen, and testify, and declare to you the life, the eternal life, which was with the Father, and was revealed to us; that which we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us. Yes, and our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son, Jesus Christ"
The Greek "Logos" when used for Jesus Christ, is the equivalent to the Aramaic, "Memra", which is used by the Jews in their paraphrases in the 1st century AD. This "Memra" is distinct from "Yahweh", but is Himself also "Yahweh". As in Genesis 1:27, where the Jerusalem Targum reads, "And the Word of the Lord created man in His likeness, in the likeness of the presence of the Lord He created him, the male and his yoke-fellow He created them", where Creation is the Work of "The Word (Memra) of the Lord". And, in 19:24, "And the Word of the Lord Himself had made to descend upon the people
of Sedom and Amorah showers of favour, that they might work repentance from their wicked works. But when they saw the showers of favour, they said, So, our wicked works are not manifest before Him. He turned (then), and caused to descend upon them bitumen and fire from before the Lord from the heavens". The One Yahweh in chapter 18, Who was with Abraham and Sarah, on earth, is in 19:24, "The Word", Who is Jesus Christ.
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
This verse does not refer to Gods chosen servant, despite trinitarians deeply wishing it were so. See John 20:31.
The word became flesh does not mean God became flesh. In your confusing figurative language, how do you rationalize the word being with God if it were literally God?
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
1 Timothy 3:16 in the Original, "God was manifested in the flesh". very clear.
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Manifest, image, reflection, shown. It is very clear such terminology is short of the claim that the manifestation of something is that thing.
There is no such appeal to imagery in ‘For us, there is one God, the Father.’ That’s too clear for trinitarian doctrine.
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
God became flesh, while remaining 100% GOD. You cannot get away from this Great Truth!
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Repeating this distortion of Scripture does not make it true. Deut 18:15-18 does not prophecy God becoming flesh.
Jesus died. This is how we know he is 0% God.
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
Keiw
Well-Known Member
In the Greek lexicons--It clearly shows a difference of what one is being called at John 1:1--2nd line reads And the word( Logos) was with-Ho Theos=The God--last line And the word( Logos) was Theos----not Ho Theos as the true God is called in the second line, clearly showing a difference. A god is correct, carries the meaning--has godlike qualities--God did it all through Jesus( Acts 2:22, 1 Cor 8:5-6) giving Jesus godlike qualities.
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