Can we ever stop sinning or be perfect?

[Wynona]

I want to answer this question with only Scripture.


1 Peter 4:1-3

Therefore, since Christ suffered [a]for us in the flesh, arm yourselves also with the same mind, for he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, 2 that he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh for the lusts of men, but for the will of God. 3 For we have spent enough of our past lifetime in doing the will of the Gentiles—when we walked in lewdness, lusts, drunkenness, revelries, drinking parties, and abominable idolatries.


1 John 3:6

6 Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him.


1 Corinthians 15:34

34 Awake to righteousness, and do not sin; for some do not have the knowledge of God. I speak this to your shame.


Can we be perfect?


Matthew 5:48

48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.


Genesis 6:9

9 This is the genealogy of Noah. Noah was a just man, [a]perfect in his generations. Noah walked with God.


Hebrews 6:1

6 Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to [a]perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God,


John 17:23

23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.


Colossians 1:28

28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.


Colossians 3:14

14 But above all these things put on love, which is the bond of perfection.


James 1:4

But let patience have its perfect work, that you may be [a]perfect and complete, lacking nothing.


1 John 2:5

5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him.


Revelation 3:2

2 Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die, for I have not found your works

 

[Lambano]

Can we ever stop sinning or be perfect?

And looking at them, Jesus said to them, “With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.” (Matthew 19:26)

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. (1 John 1:8-10)

The Bible exhorts us over and over to strive to master the sin lurking within us (Genesis 4:7). I don't think anybody will disagree with that. Whether we are successful in our striving isn't the point. Trusting God's love and forgiveness while we strive is more important than whether or not we succeed.

For we walk by trust, not by sight (2 Corinthians 5:7)

But the righteous one will live by trust. (Habakkuk 2:6)

 

[Davy]

Matt 5:48
48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father Which is in heaven is perfect.
KJV

In the Traditional Greek text, Jesus commanded us to be perfect, not that we already are perfect.

The word "perfect" is a Greek word (teleois) which means of moral and mental character. So He wasn't saying we could be just like Him perfect without sin.

And in Genesis 6 with Noah, his being perfect was pointing to his "generations", which means bloodline.

And in Galatians 5, Apostle Paul defined 2 types of walks, one according to the flesh, and the other walking by The Spirit. He showed that we become dead to the law only IF... we walk by The Spirit. That IF means a condition by which way we walk.

Gal 5:16-25
16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
KJV


That kind of preaching that Paul did with brethren that fell away to walking by their flesh is still the kind of preaching needed in MANY Churches today. By the false doctrines of the devil being followed by many Churches today it has become obvious what the false 'you cannot sin anymore' doctrine of the devil has done to those type of Churches.

 

[MatthewG]

Your flesh will alway fail, at least at some point in life.

If it didn’t then you might become to prideful (which can happen spiritually (spiritual pride) ands it’s not good), if you don’t stay humble before God.

That’s my two cents, try not to put confidence in your flesh and allow the spirit of Christ to come forth by supplications and prayers.

Just remember when you do fail, Gods not angry with, and he is ready to help you instead, talk to him about it.

 

[Episkopos]

In Him is no sin...

When we enter INTO Christ we put on His perfection. We walk as He walked. Of course, very few will do this. Jesus said that few would enter into the narrow way and walk the narrow path.

Any unbeliever can claim to be in their own sinful strength. That's true. As long as we are not PERSONALLY covered by grace...we will sin. When we sin it shows we are still under the law. What law? The law of sin and death. Being under grace means we are covered by God's righteousness. His righteousness is not filthy like ours....unlike what many falsely claim.

This has to do with being saved FROM sin...not about inheriting eternal life which is an entirely different subject.

 

[Brakelite]

When discussing this topic one has to sift through what people actually mean by "free from sin". Do they mean forensically free from sinning, actually stopped sinning, or free as in an accounting entry in heaven, indiscernible by those living around them?
Or is it both, the forensic evidence becoming clear as the individual exercises his faith in the accountant?

 

[mailmandan]

In Him is no sin...

When we enter INTO Christ we put on His perfection. We walk as He walked. Of course, very few will do this. Jesus said that few would enter into the narrow way and walk the narrow path...

So you are saying that 'sinless perfection' is the narrow path and any Christian who falls short of sinless perfection is on the broad path and will not be saved? Are you claiming to be one of the few who have lived a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time? (exactly as Jesus lived) Is that what you have placed your faith in for salvation? Sinless performance?

 

[mailmandan]

Your flesh will alway fail, at least at some point in life.

If it didn’t then you might become to prideful (which can happen spiritually (spiritual pride) ands it’s not good), if you don’t stay humble before God.

That’s my two cents, try not to put confidence in your flesh and allow the spirit of Christ to come forth by supplications and prayers.

Just remember when you do fail, Gods not angry with, and he is ready to help you instead, talk to him about it.

Those who believe they live a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time (exactly as Jesus lived) are suffering from a terminal case of self righteousness. (1 John 1:8-10)

 

[WalkInLight]

Is this within the gift of God?

When addressing this question some will say, I am cleansed from the past sin, and am now righteous in Christ.
But what about unknown sin, things that are unresolved but hidden from the individual.
And what about circumstancial sin, ie life is easy so its easy to say I do not sin, but under pressure, taking what
is not yours, hurting others etc. suddenly becomes very real.

So is righteousness achieved because things are protected, but failed once difficulties arise.
Some use the term perfect to mean in every and any situation the right responses are taken.

Being honest and an emotional being with limited human systems we can project but never know.
Some call sin breaking any rules set in the environment of an individual. So walking on the grass which says on
a sign do not walk on the grass is sin.

Paul says no sabbath is binding on a believer unless they choose to celebrate it, at which point their faith has made
it sin not to honour it. So you get into the area of creating our own rules and then honouring them and using that
as a defining idea for what sin is. OCD comes close to describing this behaviour.

Paul uses the argument that walking in love towards all is the essence of the law, and by so walking we fulfill the law.
Paul was careful not to say he was perfect, but rather left it to God to declare.

My heart would declare we do not desire to be sinless but rather to love and understand others in the light Jesus gives.
By loving we walk sinlessly though for some even to say such a thing is possible is a lie. Their conscience and their emotions
declare this cannot be true, which in their case is true as their conscience is reminding them of unresolved issues they
have and then projecting this on to everyone else.

How can I judge my own walk? Is there such a thing where I could be objective? I think not, but I can choose to seek
to love and encourage all who I meet, and remove that which causes problems, which is fulfilling our calling in Jesus.

The counter approach is to walk in sin, to push only ones own benefit and to do harm to others, is clearly not walking
in love or Jesus.

 

[MatthewG]

Hello Mailmandan,

Even Paul himself did not claim to be perfected, he continued on in hopes to obtain the rising of the dead (which is a different resurrection than the normal one), and He had more confidence to put in his flesh than anyone else. However he stated we are the circumcision (of the heart), who by the Spirit are serving God, and glorifying in Christ Jesus, and in the flesh having no trust. Also pressing forward to the Prize high calling. So those who quote Jesus and saying be perfect like my Father in heaven are gonna have a hard time if they aren’t allowing Jesus who is the bearer of perfection to move within them by and through the Spirit.

Philippians 3.

 

[Robert Gwin]

I want to answer this question with only Scripture.


1 Peter 4:1-3

Therefore, since Christ suffered [a]for us in the flesh, arm yourselves also with the same mind, for he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, 2 that he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh for the lusts of men, but for the will of God. 3 For we have spent enough of our past lifetime in doing the will of the Gentiles—when we walked in lewdness, lusts, drunkenness, revelries, drinking parties, and abominable idolatries.


1 John 3:6

6 Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him.


1 Corinthians 15:34

34 Awake to righteousness, and do not sin; for some do not have the knowledge of God. I speak this to your shame.


Can we be perfect?


Matthew 5:48

48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.


Genesis 6:9

9 This is the genealogy of Noah. Noah was a just man, [a]perfect in his generations. Noah walked with God.


Hebrews 6:1

6 Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to [a]perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God,


John 17:23

23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.


Colossians 1:28

28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.


Colossians 3:14

14 But above all these things put on love, which is the bond of perfection.


James 1:4

But let patience have its perfect work, that you may be [a]perfect and complete, lacking nothing.


1 John 2:5

5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him.


Revelation 3:2

2 Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die, for I have not found your works

Not at this time, but one day that will be the case maam. I would post the passages, but you already know them, and you know the Bible does not contradict itself, so how does these passages harmonize with all have sinned?

 

[Michiah-Imla]

the false 'you cannot sin anymore' doctrine of the devil has done to those type of Churches.

So it’s @Davy vs the Holy Bible.

“Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin… and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil...” (1 John 3:9-10)

And the winner by KO is the Holy Bible!

You lose @Davy

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Your flesh will alway fail, at least at some point in life.

Why are you still in the corrupt old man?

“But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.” (Romans 8:9)

“For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.” (Romans 7:5)

“…reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord. Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.” (Romans 6:11-12)

This is the Prescription.

Take your meds.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Those who believe they live a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time (exactly as Jesus lived) are suffering from a terminal case of self righteousness. (1 John 1:8-10)

What they are actually SUFFERING from is flesh affliction by reason of starving it of it’s desires.

“…for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin; That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.” (1 Peter 4:1-2)

@mailmandan stop living in the flesh to the lusts of men. Live for the will of God.

I know you’ve believed a lie for a looong time, but I still believe miracles can happen.

 

[WalkInLight]

Paul summarizes our dilemma very well

Aim for perfection, listen to my appeal, be of one mind, live in peace. And the God of love and peace will be with you.
2 Cor 13:11

The whole of the temple is about cleansing and forgiveness through offering sacrifices.
The Lord did not demand perfection from Israel just honesty and resolving sin when it arose.

The spirit is willing, but the body is weak.
Matt 26:41

This shows were we are most of the time. A slow progress to see the light, to learn what loving behaviour is and
to work it into our lives. As a work of transformation, only at the end is the final work seen and understood.

A long walk is done one step at a time. Each step appears like nothing, except when put together a long journey
is covered. So individually we can see how far we have come and how far still to go, but none are to judge.

If we lose the light and get lost, all the work is forgotton. The letters to the seven churches in revelation is all about
overcoming and continuing, not that they had arrived but that challenges were always ahead.

 

[Wynona]

Your flesh will alway fail, at least at some point in life.

Hello friend,

We get old. We might spill some milk. But when we become believers, we don't have to be moral failures anymore.

, try not to put confidence in your flesh

I hear this a lot. Maybe you could tell me exactly what this means, in your own words.

Im assuming you mean, don't put any confidence in your ability to stop sinning. Does this mean that I need to put more confidence in God to keep me from sin or that I should give up trying not to sin altogether because in trying not to sin, Ive misplaced my confidence?

If it didn’t then you might become to prideful (which can happen spiritually (spiritual pride) ands it’s not good), if you don’t stay humble before God.

Pride is a sin. If we didn't sin, we'd be humble. Jesus didn't sin and he was humble. Why would we need sin to make us humble when we have the Spirit of God?

Always good to hear from you, Brother.

 

[MatthewG]

Hello friend,

We get old. We might spill some milk. But when we become believers, we don't have to be moral failures anymore.

Sure I do not mind sharing with you. When a person becomes a believers the person now will have a new nature with-in them which was dead prior. There is a constant a battle between the flesh and spirit. This is something that should be considered, by reading what Paul had wrote to the Galatians and it is noted as by Paul which you will come to in Romans chapter 7 when you are reading that there is nothing good that comes from our flesh.

Does that mean we can do good and nice things to people ? Yes a person can. However there is something more that comes through us and out of us when a person makes the decision to allow the Holy Spirit of God, and the Spirt of Christ to come in and through them which is totally of spiritual nature rather than our natural fleshly nature. This would bring forth more glorifying to God in the things which He does in and through us, by abiding in the Lord Yeshua, as noted in John 15.

Simply something to consider.

I hear this a lot. Maybe you could tell me exactly what this means, in your own words.

Im assuming you mean, don't put any confidence in your ability to stop sinning. Does this mean that I need to put more confidence in God to keep me from sin or that I should give up trying not to sin altogether because in trying not to sin, Ive misplaced my confidence?

The Confidence in the flesh is where you put God on the back burner for anything that he has provided for you to do by and through the Spirit. You will read in your going through of Romans what I mean here, you will find it in Romans Chapter 8, and perhaps you will understand what I am talking about more thoroughly. What I mean by putting confidence in the flesh is where you glorify in yourself something you did without God being in the mist of it, or (BY THE SPIRIT) (Keyword here you will run across).

Pride is a sin. If we didn't sin, we'd be humble. Jesus didn't sin and he was humble. Why would we need sin to make us humble when we have the Spirit of God?

Always good to hear from you, Brother.

Yes, Pride is a sin, but that doesn't mean you can not be proud l in what you have accomplished (As long it is not boastful infront of others or bringing them down) in the bible you can find where it states that (Galatians), Where it speaks as do not compare yourself to others, just look at your own work to see if there anything you are proud of. That is okay. Allow God to be the one whom you glory in when you are able to overcome obstacles that comes into your life. It is always good to share good things learned in which God helps us be able to accomplish by and through the Holy Spirit.

My only encouragement is this, do not be to hard on yourself. Even today in my flesh there are times I do fail, however I am not whipping my back with a whip, or telling myself that I am not good enough. God and his grace is sufficient for you just as much as it was for Paul.

My hope is that you find this encouraging and may you search the scriptures and that the Holy Spirit will bring you the truths here, though it might be difficult to understand now if I am not very clear which hopefully this was all, may it be a benefit to your walk in Christ, and keep praying and asking God about these things.

 

[marks]

Is this within the gift of God?

All of your post, very well said!

On this question . . . yes, I'm of the mind that God sometimes does in fact give this gift to some. I'm of the mind that it comes as a gift of faith, but I would not be dogmatic about that. Only that God most assuradly can and does give this gift at the times and manner of His intention.

Much love!

 

[Lambano]

I'm assuming you mean, don't put any confidence in your ability to stop sinning. Does this mean that I need to put more confidence in God to keep me from sin or that I should give up trying not to sin altogether because in trying not to sin, I've misplaced my confidence?

On this question . . . yes, I'm of the mind that God sometimes does in fact give this gift to some. I'm of the mind that it comes as a gift of faith, but I would not be dogmatic about that. Only that God most assuredly can and does give this gift at the times and manner of His intention.

Looking at them, Jesus said, “With men it is impossible, but not so with God; for all things are possible with God.” (Mark 10:27)

For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not. For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want. But if I am doing the very thing I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me. (Romans 7:18-20)

I think I am in agreement with Marks that God does indeed give this as a gift, if only for times and seasons. Certainly John Wesley thought so, though he would not claim it for himself. However, God gives the gift to whomever He sovereignly decides to give it. And I strongly suspect the gift is relatively rare.

Unfortunately, I've seen the devastating effects the expectation that if we are saved, we will walk sinless in this life can have on a person's trust. We don't realize how deeply the power of Sin permeates us, and if God doesn't give us that gift, besetting sins and accumulated decades of stumbles can make us question whether God has truly regenerated us, whether God truly intends to save us at all.

I also cannot resist saying that, from what I've seen, so many who claim to be walking sinlessly say so with such obvious pride and lack of compassion for others that I've become cynical about the whole thing.

Now I need to go repent of my cynicism.

 

[Grailhunter]

Some believe that they lead a sinless life.

Some believe that sins are like water on a duck's back for Christians.

Some believe that we sin and Christ will forgive us if we confess, repent, and ask forgiveness.

There are scriptures that can be interpreted to support all three. My motto is be good and do good. You can sin by doing something wrong or not doing something you should. Either way we should keep sin to a minimum. But first, you have to know what the real sins are.