22 major reasons to abandon the Premil doctrine

[Truther]

...and you will never reign with Christ either.

I teach the reign of Christ on earth per Rev 20.

You oppose it.

You debunk Rev 20.

Bad deal.

 

[Truther]

Ok. I was General Baptist for tears then Independent Baptist. I dont attend any church now.

Great, we can be free thinkers together!

 

[Truther]

You don't know where your millennium is?

It is not here yet.

It will be on this earth when Jesus returns.

 

[covenantee]

I get only this teency part of Heb 8....

Hebrews 10:15-17​

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15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

That's it.

It's better than nothing at all.

I thought you said that you used them all.

What prevents you from getting Hebrews 8:13?

 

[Truther]

What prevents you from getting Hebrews 8:13?

I only get the Part chapter 10 speaks of...

Hebrews 10:15-17​

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King James Version​

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15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.



I am a gentile and not Judah, etc.

You are a gentile also.

You can't steal their unfulilled promise, nor I.

 

[St. Joseph]

Once again, no mention of the Church, therefore in your school of thought, that means the Church is absent. That is what you have been wrongly taught. You are hung by your own noose.

Revelation 12 places the defeat of Satan at the resurrection/ascension, thus refuting your argument: "And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days. And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. Andthe great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night. And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death."

I believe the woman refers to the Israel of Israel (God's true people). The child is Christ. The highlighted part above shows the incarnation and resurrection. The woman is the redeemed Church since Adam. The NT saints are united in Christ with the OT saints. This is a spiritual people not a physical people.

The Lord says to the “seven churches” in Revelation 12:11-17, Philadelphia included, “And they (God’s people) overcame him (the devil) by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death. Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman (God’s people) which brought forth the man child. And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness (the world), into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent (Satan). And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman (God’s people), that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood. And the earth helped the woman (God’s people), and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth (God’s Sovereign protection). And the dragon was wroth with the woman (God’s people), and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

There is no doubt from this passage that the Church is portrayed as the particular focus of the devil’s assaults. However, it is also equally depicted as being the subject of the protection of God and of being kept from the hour of trial that has engulfed the world. No rapture is mentioned to rescue her from the attacks of the enemy, or spare her the tests of this present age. No, the Church is simply sheltered beneath the sovereign hand of God in this battle. The wonderful assurance that is embodied within this reading, although written initially to “the seven churches,” relates also to the Church generally and to a period subsequent to the ascension. Revelation 12:5 describes how Christ “was caught up unto God, and to his throne.” Christ promises the church protection from arrows of the devil in Matthew 16:18, saying, “I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”

The means by which these saints overcome the devil, the world and the flesh during great tribulation is the exact same as that employed by Christians throughout history. Those Christians that carry “the testimony of Jesus” in the tribulation are seen to conquer Satan by “the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony” (Revelation 12:11), again, confirming their sure unitary position within the redeemed Church of Jesus Christ.

And pnce again i dont read novels. Just tell me in a short paragraph. You say i only parrot what im taught. Thats true. Because i believe it to be true. I used to teach against the rapture,but it is so clear now. Why are you scares to hear an opposing view. You just parrot what you were taught as well. By Arnold Murray

 

[Truther]

And pnce again i dont read novels. Just tell me in a short paragraph. You say i only parrot what im taught. Thats true. Because i believe it to be true. I used to teach against the rapture,but it is so clear now. Why are you scares to hear an opposing view. You just parrot what you were taught as well. By Arnold Murray

Oh yeah!

 

[WPM]

I will reign with Christ for 1000 years in this utopian society that He will set up....


11 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:

2 And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord;

3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the Lord: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:

4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth: with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.

5 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.

6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.

7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.

8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.

9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.

10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.

11 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.

12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

It is a figment of your imagination. It will never happen. You have swallowed a lie. The Premil millennium has been portrayed for years as some Edenic arrangement with unparalleled bliss and wholesale submission to righteousness, when in fact it is simply more of the same. Basically, your millennium is just a mirror of our day with sin abounding and the bondage of corruption prospering. You have continued death, decay, sickness, funerals, crying, hatred, strife and wickedness prospers. This all ends with rebellion in history.

 

[covenantee]

I only get the Part chapter 10 speaks of...

Hebrews 10:15-17​

​

King James Version​

​

​

15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.



I am a gentile and not Judah, etc.

You are a gentile also.

You can't steal their unfulilled promise, nor I.

2 Corinthians 1
19 For the Son of God, Jesus Christ, who was preached among you by us, even by me and Silvanus and Timotheus, was not yea and nay, but in him was yea.
20 For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.

Do you think that Christ has not fulfilled the promises?

 

[WPM]

You are likely cursed per Rev 22.

Bad deal.

LOL. You were quoting yourself and cursing yourself. What a joke!

 

[WPM]

And pnce again i dont read novels. Just tell me in a short paragraph. You say i only parrot what im taught. Thats true. Because i believe it to be true. I used to teach against the rapture,but it is so clear now. Why are you scares to hear an opposing view. You just parrot what you were taught as well. By Arnold Murray

Who is Arnold Murray? Never heard of him. I have never read or listened to him. I read the Bible. It is that that exposes your error. You cannot even show us your beliefs in the Bible. You just run when we get to the core of your beliefs.

 

[St. Joseph]

Who is Arnold Murray? Never heard of him. I have never read or listened to him. I read the Bible. It is that that exposes your error. You cannot even show us your beliefs in the Bible. You just run when we get to the core of your beliefs.

I tried to help you understand. Download it. You cant support your belief with scripture.

 

[WPM]

I teach the reign of Christ on earth per Rev 20.

You oppose it.

You debunk Rev 20.

You are likely cursed per Rev 22.

Bad deal.

Where in Rev 20 teaches that Christ will reign on earth after the second coming on a millennial earth?

 

[WPM]

I tried to help you understand. Download it. You cant support your belief with scripture.

I don't listen such error. I embrace truth.

 

[St. Joseph]

Where in Rev 20 teaches that Christ will reign on earth after the second coming on a millennial earth?

Its all through old testament. You cant understand revelation without old testament background. Download it

 

[St. Joseph]

Who is Arnold Murray? Never heard of him. I have never read or listened to him. I read the Bible. It is that that exposes your error. You cannot even show us your beliefs in the Bible. You just run when we get to the core of your beliefs.

Too scared of the truth you threaten to block me. Fine go ahead

 

[WPM]

Its all through old testament. You cant understand revelation without old testament background. Download it

Really? Then give us Scripture - if you are so confident. I will not hold my breath. Just like when you could not show Pretrib in the Bible.

 

[St. Joseph]

Really? Then give us Scripture - if you are so confident. I will not hold my breath. Just like when you could not show Pretrib in the Bible.

Download it

 

[WPM]

Download it

Where in Rev 20 teaches that Christ will reign on earth after the second coming on a millennial earth?

 

[WPM]

Its all You cant understand revelation without old testament background. Download it

Where throughout the Old Testament teaches that Christ will reign on earth after the second coming on a millennial earth?