Why hadn't the baptized believers in Samaria received the Holy Spirit?

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Godslittleservant

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One cannot be a Christian without the infilling of the Holy Spirit. That is what is meant by being baptized in the Spirit.

  1. John 14:17
    Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
  2. Romans 8:11
    But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
  3. 1 Corinthians 3:16
    Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

The Spirit on dwelling people was not new. It was teh indwelling of the Spirit that makes the church, the church. The external signs at Pentecost were just a testimony oof the Spirit indwelling believers.

Anmd yes while Philip did preach tpo the Samaritans, it was Peter (with Jiohn) that gave the Spirit as Peter held the keys of the kingdom. Keys open doors and Peter was tasked to open the doors .

Acts 8:14-17​

King James Version​

14 Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)
17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

The book of Acts is a historical transisitional book. From the law to grace and from the Jews alone to Jew and Gentile in one body.

So thigs had to progress . Once the Samaritans received the Holy spirit, all saved subsequently immediately received the Spirit upon salvation.
Okay let me try this again Philip went and preached they believed his words and was baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. In accordance to Gods word when one believes repents and is baptized in the name of Christ one also receives the INDWELLING SPIRIT These people have done that and are now born again Christians.

Now Philip needs to go forth and build more churches as commission so he needs to impart the POWER GIFT of confirming the word to this new church he just established so they can carry out the work of growing this church so he can go forth. Philip even though he had hands laid on him to give his the gift is unable to do the same for this new church therefore he had to call on Peter to lay hands on them so as to give them this power need to confirm the word of God,

2 Things to note out of this passage. 1. the Spirit has two functions one is the indwelling the second is the power of confirming the word in other word the spirit with in and the spirit upon.
the second this to note that the laying on of hands was the only way to receive the power of confirming and not just any hands it had to be by an Apostle
 
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Godslittleservant

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One cannot be a Christian without the infilling of the Holy Spirit. That is what is meant by being baptized in the Spirit.

  1. John 14:17
    Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
  2. Romans 8:11
    But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
  3. 1 Corinthians 3:16
    Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

The Spirit on dwelling people was not new. It was teh indwelling of the Spirit that makes the church, the church. The external signs at Pentecost were just a testimony oof the Spirit indwelling believers.

Anmd yes while Philip did preach tpo the Samaritans, it was Peter (with Jiohn) that gave the Spirit as Peter held the keys of the kingdom. Keys open doors and Peter was tasked to open the doors .

Acts 8:14-17​

King James Version​

14 Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)
17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

The book of Acts is a historical transisitional book. From the law to grace and from the Jews alone to Jew and Gentile in one body.

So thigs had to progress . Once the Samaritans received the Holy spirit, all saved subsequently immediately received the Spirit upon salvation.
I agree the one can not be a christian without the indwelling but the question is how doe the bible teach that get the indwelling for it is promised to all.
 
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St. SteVen

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Okay let me try this again Philip went and preached they believed his words and was baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. In accordance to Gods word when one believes repents and is baptized in the name of Christ one also receives the INDWELLING SPIRIT These people have done that and are now born again Christians.

Now Philip needs to go forth and build more churches as commission so he needs to impart the POWER GIFT of confirming the word to this new church he just established so they can carry out the work of growing this church so he can go forth. Philip even though he had hands laid on him to give his the gift is unable to do the same for this new church therefore he had to call on Peter to lay hands on them so as to give them this power need to confirm the word of God,

2 Things to note out of this passage. 1. the Spirit has two functions one is the indwelling the second is the power of confirming the word in other word the spirit with in and the spirit upon.
the second this to note that the laying on of hands was the only way to receive the power of confirming and not just any hands it had to be by an Apostle
Very good post, thanks.
I just have one comment.

The situation in Samaria was the first time I recall the use of the laying on of hands to impart the Holy Spirit,
which is common now, but have been a first back then.

Seems to me that John and Peter were attempting to fix the problem of those who were baptized that hadn't received an outpouring
as had happened at Pentecost with the 3,000 that had been baptized and HAD received the Holy Spirit outpouring.
 

St. SteVen

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Okay let me try this again Philip went and preached they believed his words and was baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. In accordance to Gods word when one believes repents and is baptized in the name of Christ one also receives the INDWELLING SPIRIT These people have done that and are now born again Christians.
I think I would back up even one step further in the process.
Seems that too much weight is put on the exact words of Peter in Acts 2:38.

The order of events were in close sequence at Pentecost, but in real life, things may move a bit slower.
It was quite a while between when I established a relationship with God and the time of my baptism.
And there wasn't a whole lot to repent from at eight years of age. But I recall having the Spirit right away.
Even prior to my decision, God was speaking audibly to me. Can you hear that without the Spirit's work?

What was your personal experience with this?
 

ElieG12

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The most interesting questions of all are:

1) When did Christians begin to be baptized with holy spirit and who was there that first time?
2) When in the course of time did new Christians stop being baptized with holy spirit and why?

When you answer those two questions, then you will really understand that baptism with holy spirit was a general event ONLY in that stage of Christianism (first century), and later and in modern times it is exclusive to a minority.
 
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St. SteVen

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The most interesting questions of all are:

1) When did Christians begin to be baptized with holy spirit and who was there that first time?
2) When in the course of time did new Christians stop being baptized with holy spirit and why?

When you answer those two questions, then you will really understand that baptism with holy spirit was a general event ONLY in that stage of Christianism (first century), and later and in modern times it is exclusive to a minority.
Great questions, thanks!
1) Baptism with the Holy Spirit BEGAN at Pentecost. (in general)
2) What was begun at Pentecost has NOT stopped. IMHO
Peter said: "The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off—
for all whom the Lord our God will call.” - Acts 2:39 NIV
 
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St. SteVen

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When you answer those two questions, then you will really understand that baptism with holy spirit was a general event ONLY in that stage of Christianism (first century), and later and in modern times it is exclusive to a minority.
Oops.
This part of the quote suddenly appeared after I answered the post. - LOL
No matter. Do my answers confirm your suspicions? (hopefully not)

Perhaps these BENEFITS are only experienced by a MINORITY now, but that is unfortunate. IMHO
Why do you suppose that is? (that only a minority discovered the Baptism with the Holy Spirit)
 
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St. SteVen

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These are curious points, thanks.
baptism with holy spirit was a general event ONLY in that stage of Christianism (first century),
Why would it be LIMITED to that time?
Peter said: "The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off—
for all whom the Lord our God will call.” - Acts 2:39 NIV
and later and in modern times it is exclusive to a minority.
How could it be ONLY in "that stage" of Christianity and ALSO be "and later and in modern times it is exclusive to a minority"? ???
 

ElieG12

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Great questions, thanks!
1) Baptism with the Holy Spirit BEGAN at Pentecost. (in general)
Good point ... and that implies that following Jesus does not automatically mean receiving the holy spirit. Jesus' followers received from heavens, and later they were laying hands on others (with a few exceptions) so the new ones received it also.
2) What was begun at Pentecost has NOT stopped. IMHO
Peter said: "The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off—
for all whom the Lord our God will call.” - Acts 2:39 NIV
Do you believe that the Catholics who began to apostatize from the truth and commit crimes by the second and third centuries on, were anointed by God with holy spirit?

If your answer is NO, then you have to recognize that there was a time when new Christians were no longer being anointed with holy spirit in general...precisely because the first who received it could no longer lay their hands on anyone, since they were already dead.

When and how did those who say today that they have been baptized on it, receive holy spirit? What proof can they present of that?
 
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ElieG12

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Modern selves-called "Christians" have a very strange idea of what it means to be "anointed by God with his holy spirit"... In their minds it is something common and current in all those who say they believe in Christ and who they accept as " Christians", as if they have the authority to decide that.

Being anointed by God with holy spirit is not just an ordinary act that any believer in Jesus experiences. That event has a very particular meaning; since today there are not apostles to lay hands on anyone, it is done directly by God on certain persons for very specific purposes, and the spiritual improvements and acts in that anointed person positively demonstrate it.

The vast majority of believers in Jesus today are "ordinary" persons who consider themselves to be more than what they really are, and their false beliefs and lifestyle prove it...so there is no way they could have been anointed by God with his holy spirit. Modern general anointing with the holy spirit of God is just wishful thinking.
 
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amigo de christo

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Oops.
This part of the quote suddenly appeared after I answered the post. - LOL
No matter. Do my answers confirm your suspicions? (hopefully not)

Perhaps these BENEFITS are only experienced by a MINORITY now, but that is unfortunate. IMHO
Why do you suppose that is? (that only a minority discovered the Baptism with the Holy Spirit)
I have an answer only most wont like it .
But if we are coming to another jesus etc , DONT EXPECT the BAPTISM OF THE HOLY GHOST .
a lot of folks come to the GIVEME that MONEY prosperity jesus
or to the all inclusive false love many path one , THAT AINT FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST
their faith is rather in what MEN have told them ABOUT JESUS and their jesus sure seems to honor some sins and loves that money etc .
THAT AINT JESUS CHRIST . most have not come TO THE JESUS CHRIST . That is why .
 
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amigo de christo

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Oops.
This part of the quote suddenly appeared after I answered the post. - LOL
No matter. Do my answers confirm your suspicions? (hopefully not)

Perhaps these BENEFITS are only experienced by a MINORITY now, but that is unfortunate. IMHO
Why do you suppose that is? (that only a minority discovered the Baptism with the Holy Spirit)
IF ya coming to JESUS for that BEST LIFE NOW , that FEEL GOOD make me A GOD new age junk .
IT aint JESUS CHRIST . so dont expect the baptism of the HOLY GHOST .
A lotta of folks are coming to another jesus . one that has been created in their own lustful hearts desire .
And that , AINT JESUS CHRIST .
 
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amigo de christo

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If ya JESUS holds that dark rainbow , IT AINT JESUS CHRIST . a lot of folks are being presented another social gospel
version of jesus that AINT JESUS . See the devil knows how to use that name but preach another jesus .
 
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amigo de christo

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Ps if one has truly come to Christ they would have the Spirit .
PS if you got some goosebumps but the So called spirit you think came upon ya
sure seems to serve the agendas of men and of sin . I GOT REAL BAD NEWS . YE WERNT BAPTIZED by THE HOLY GHOST
and you still in darkness . IF ya jesus is holding up a rainbow and saying
how muslims and all other religoins are fine , that there is no need to confess JESUS
to repent and believe on JESUS CHRIST . I GOT bad news ITS of anti christ . Better watch out is all i can say .
BETTTER test them spirits .
 
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Godslittleservant

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What the problem is and I have tried fruitlessly to show is that most have a false view of what spirit was the promise. the spirit was functioning in two different aspecgts in the early church one was for a purpose which was for power in sign to confirm the word it was not promised to all but to some to do a purpose it followed the church but was not for all individuals but for the chose leaders it is shown to be that way in Mark 16:17-20
17 These signs will accompany those who have believed: in My name they will cast out demons, they will speak with new tongues; 18 they will pick up serpents, and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover."
19 So then, when the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, He was received up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God. 20 And they went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them, and confirmed the word by the signs that followed.]
Acts 1:8 but you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth

That is the spirit upon it came upon to accomplish the task Gods word was being written it need proof that it was Gods word the signs confirmed it was from God

The baptism in Christ name is where one gets the indwelling spirit is has a completely different job it is to help you bear fruit of the spirit it is given through the baptism in Christ name it is not of power gifts but to bear fruit Galatians 5:22,23
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.

It is the spirit that is promised to all as John the baptist had said Matthew 3:11 "As for me, I baptize you with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

Now some point to Acts 1:4 as being the indwelling or the power gift that all were to get but I think it is talking of two sparate times one is the indwelling for all but in verse 8 it is the power for confirming the word that only the Apostles got. Lets read it again
Acts 1:4-8
4 Gathering them together, He commanded them not to leave Jerusalem, but to wait for what the Father had promised, "Which," He said, "you heard of from Me; 5 for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."
6 So when they had come together, they were asking Him, saying, "Lord, is it at this time You are restoring the kingdom to Israel?" 7 He said to them, "It is not for you to know times or epochs which the Father has fixed by His own authority; 8 but you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth."

In reading Acts 2 it only say that the Apostles got the gifts of confirming but all got the indwelling. There are two functions of the spirit and we need to get them correct. When we get them correctly sorted out it will make more sense.
 

St. SteVen

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St. SteVen said:
Great questions, thanks!
1) Baptism with the Holy Spirit BEGAN at Pentecost. (in general)
Good point ... and that implies that following Jesus does not automatically mean receiving the holy spirit. Jesus' followers received from heavens, and later they were laying hands on others (with a few exceptions) so the new ones received it also.
No, that wasn't my point at all. Sorry for the misunderstanding.
I believe that Jesus' followers ALL receive the indwelling Spirit "as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come."

2 Corinthians 1:21-22 NIV
Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us,
22 set his seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come.
 

St. SteVen

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Do you believe that the Catholics who began to apostatize from the truth and commit crimes by the second and third centuries on, were anointed by God with holy spirit?
The crimes weren't anointed. So, they were not ACTING in accordance with the Spirit.

"... God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable." - Romans 11:29 NIV

If your answer is NO, then you have to recognize that there was a time when new Christians were no longer being anointed with holy spirit in general...precisely because the first who received it could no longer lay their hands on anyone, since they were already dead.
My answer was, "Yes.", I suppose.
I don't believe that the laying on of hands is necessary to receive the Holy Spirit. Just ask.

Luke 11:13 NIV
If you then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children,
how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him!”

When and how did those who say today that they have been baptized on it, receive holy spirit? What proof can they present of that?
The evidence of the Baptism with the Holy Spirit is the same today as it was after Pentecost.
In general, the initial evidence of the Baptism with the Holy Spirit is speaking in tongues. But...

We see other evidences in the book of Acts. Prophesying and praising God.
I believe that any manifestation (gift) listed in I Corinthians chapter twelve would be valid evidence.
Some don't manifest right away. I didn't at first. It came with time.
 

St. SteVen

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Modern selves-called "Christians" have a very strange idea of what it means to be "anointed by God with his holy spirit"... In their minds it is something common and current in all those who say they believe in Christ and who they accept as " Christians", as if they have the authority to decide that.

Being anointed by God with holy spirit is not just an ordinary act that any believer in Jesus experiences. That event has a very particular meaning; since today there are not apostles to lay hands on anyone, it is done directly by God on certain persons for very specific purposes, and the spiritual improvements and acts in that anointed person positively demonstrate it.
I agree with what you are saying about an anointing from God. It is given by God for a specific purpose.
In fact it is not just an anointing, it is an anointing FOR something. Anointed to preach, anointed to evangelize, anointed to healing, etc.
 
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St. SteVen

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... they will pick up serpents, and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them...
Should we test that? You go first.

This warning precedes that passage in my NIV translation.

[The earliest manuscripts and some other ancient witnesses do not have verses 9–20.]
 
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