Abiding In Christ Necessary for Eternal Life

[Eternally Grateful]

Nobody is thinking Christians cannot fall into unbelief. But they can't fall out of their new birth and be cut off from God.

John makes this clear in his first epistle

they went out from us, but they were never of us, for if they were truly of us, they never would have departed. But they departed to show they were never of us.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I do not know why we have so many Christians who believe the entire Bible is written directly to them, the Church of God. There is nothing in the Bible to indicate such thinking, and I would like to add nothing could be further from the truth. It's true the Word of God was written for everyone for all time, and it's for our learning because it contains what everyone should know. That does not mean every part of it is addressed to everyone in this time, because the subject matter was written either to the Jews, to the Gentiles, or to the Church of God (1 Corinthians 10:32).

What is written directly to the Jews, belongs to and is for the Jews. What is written directly to the Gentiles, belongs to and is for the Gentiles. What is written directly to the Church of God, belongs to and is for the Church of God. What does God mean when He tells us that the visions shown to Isaiah was concerning Judah and Jerusalem? It was not addressed to us or written concerning us, but it was addressed to and concerning Judah and Jerusalem. It would be dishonest for the Church of God to interpret to the Church of God what God said concerns Israel.

Yet they want to make it about us. Not about them.

The hatred of the jew even in the church blows my mind.. Even if they were not chosen for a purpose. God tells us to love everyone..

 

[Eternally Grateful]

He's talking to Gentiles. And not Christians...

13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

Yes, He is speaking to a group of people not induviduals.

He spoke of them, as blind in part, and as natural branch which was cut off.

He spoke of Gentiles as unnatural branch and we were grafted in

and he told us not to be so proud. Because we some how made it, and Israel lost it. And he tells us flat out that we will lose it. And they will get it back. He even tells us when “the fullness of the gentile is complete”

Now the only question is, when will this take place..

 

[GracePeace]

John makes this clear in his first epistle

they went out from us, but they were never of us, for if they were truly of us, they never would have departed. But they departed to show they were never of us.

He says that because they're blotted out, their righteousness of faith is not remembered, so that it is as though they were never saved in the first place. Again, your God changes, mine still blots people out of His Book.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It was already on the move very early on . John was warning about a man who LOVED to have the pre emience
and was already kicking out folks . IT came in quite fast . PRE EMIENECE , men loving to be exalted .
Paul had warned too and did others that they would come in amongst them and lead many astray .
The RCC was able to come into power , the entity that exalts man and giveth man the pre eminence .
As leaders later would be called popes , most holy father , most holy reverand just loving that same pre emeinence
that ol diotrepehes had so loved . The problem is the leaven just took over a lot . and within short time
a state religoin would be born that had completely changed and would throughout the centuries get worse and worse and worse .

Amen

the worse thing that brought to the gospel. And which sadly passed to many of her offspring, is the thought that salvation was a process. It was not a gift per se that was given to you and all you had to do was recieve it. You had to receive it through what they call “works of faith” or “faith working in love” (I think this is what they call them) The works of faith (water baptism, Confession, Penance, The Eucharist etc etc) are required for salvation.it is through the works of faith that we are saved. This they can say they do teach we are saved by Grace through faith.

 

[mailmandan]

John makes this clear in his first epistle

they went out from us, but they were never of us, for if they were truly of us, they never would have departed. But they departed to show they were never of us.

Take special note of - "for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us."

 

[Eternally Grateful]

He says that because they're blotted out, their righteousness of faith is not remembered, so that it is as though they were never saved in the first place. Again, your God changes, mine still blots people out of His Book.

Where do you come up with this stuff? Do you make it up. Or were you taught this?

So you’re saying he said they were NEVER OF US. (Not only once but twice)

But he did not really mean it, we are to somehow twist what John said, and understand it really means that it was if they were never of us. As though they were never saved in the first place but they really were?

Sorry, I can not pull imaginary things out of a text to make it fit my belief system.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Take special note of - "for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us."

Amen,

You do not pull things out of a text that are not there..

 

[GracePeace]

Where do you come up with this stuff? Do you make it up. Or were you taught this?

So you’re saying he said they were NEVER OF US. (Not only once but twice)

But he did not really mean it, we are to somehow twist what John said, and understand it really means that it was if they were never of us. As though they were never saved in the first place but they really were?

Sorry, I can not pull imaginary things out of a text to make it fit my belief system.

I ask God when I find difficulties in the Bible.

Your solution to the irreconcilable doctrines is to say "God used to do those things but my God changes--He's not the same yesterday today and forever".

Yes, their righteousness of faith is not remembered before God, so the spiritually minded person thinks and speaks accordingly.

 

[Peterlag]

John makes this clear in his first epistle

they went out from us, but they were never of us, for if they were truly of us, they never would have departed. But they departed to show they were never of us.

We don't know who that group was. I have a guess it might have been the belief system called Gnosticism was taking root in Christianity at the time the book of John was being written that taught there was a supreme and unknowable Being, which they designated as the "Monad." The Monad produced various gods, who in turn produced other gods, and one of these gods called the "Demiurge" created the earth and then ruled over it as an angry, evil and jealous god. Gnostics believe this evil god was the god of the Old Testament who is called "Elohim" and so the Monad had to send another god known as the "Christ" to bring special knowledge to mankind and free them from the influence of the evil Elohim. And this is why the gnostics do not seek salvation from repenting of their sin (but rather from the ignorance of which sin is a consequence) that they believe the evil creator God and his angels caused. They emphasize salvation of select humans from bodily existence through their awakening to the knowledge of their original divine identity. I believe the Apostle John had them on his mind when he wrote the Epistle of 1 John saying you must realize you have sin and repent. John was not talking to the already saved Christian as the Catholics would like you to believe.

 

[Zao is life]

The Scripture won't change just because someone complains that they think it is "works"; the Scripture stands there, unmoved, saying the same as it has always said: you abide by obeying, and you're supplied with the Spirit if you abide, and you're not supplied with the Spirit if you don't abide because of idolatry.

Agree. And loving the brethren (through actions) is the works James was talking about (James 1:26-27; James 2:1-9).

Those are the works he was talking about when he said faith without works is dead. It's the small things, not big things.

 

[GracePeace]

Take special note of - "for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us."

This should be believed and said about all those who are in Christ--and, then, if anyone is "blotted out", it no longer applies, because they are accounted as having never been in Christ in the first place, so it's perfectly consistent.

 

[Zao is life]

Some acknowledge that it is possible for a believer to fail to remain in Christ, but they want to deny it is an issue on which eternal life hinges.

You are commanded to remain in Him to continue being supplied with His Spirit;
we only remain in Him by obeying His commands (1 Jn 3:23,24).

If we say we think we are going to be saved while disobeying, and not receiving the eternal life, that's not sound doctrine, is it?

1 John 2
28And now, little children, abide in him, so that when he appears we may have confidence and not shrink from him in shame at his coming.

1 John 3
23This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
24The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him.
We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

1 John 5
21Little children, keep yourselves from idols.

So, what makes the little children not abide in Christ? Idolatry. Sin. There are two different forms of the idolatry--not remaining in faith in the Son (eg, as the Galatians, who went after "another Gospel", and "deserted Him Who calls you in the grace of Christ" (Gal 1:6)), and the other would be the "idolatry" of failing to love others (ie, by not walking in faith, whereby God's righteousness is revealed (Ro 1:5,16,17), leading to "condemnation" (Ro 14:23)).

Out of my own copy of the Bible. Agreed. This is why Jesus said if we abide in Him (the Vine) we will produce His fruit. The fruit of the Spirit. If we don't abide in Him, we become cast off as branches, and are worthy only of being burned.

 

[GracePeace]

Out of my own copy of the Bible. Agreed. This is why Jesus said if we abide in Him we will produce His fruit. The fruit of the Spirit. If we don't abide in Him, we become cast off as branches, and are worthy only of being burned.

So simple--no self delusional Olympic level mental gymnastics needed. Self-explanatory.

 

[GracePeace]

Agree. And loving the brethren (through actions) is the works James was talking about (James 1:26-27; James 2:1-9).

Those are the works he was talking about when he said faith without works is dead. It's the small things, not big things.

The difference between the works that do not save and the works James refers to is WHO DOES THEM. The fault with the works of the Law is that they are performed by the sinful flesh (Ro 8:3; Gal 3:3), but works of grace by faith ("faith works by love"--"God is love", and is "at work in us to will and do for His pleasure") are performed by God, they are "God's righteousness revealed from faith to faith".

 

[Zao is life]

This thread is all about your belief and your belief only......it’s a one way thread....” Your one way thread”...

This does not say, supplying...once again your own opinion.

This thread is about the Word of Life. Inspired by the Holy Spirit and written by the apostles. You should listen instead of disrupting.

This was my short one-way conversation with you. Not reading your response (if any) You're on ignore now. I don't engage with disruptive people anymore.

 

[GracePeace]

Sorry, I can not pull imaginary things out of a text to make it fit my belief system.

Your entire "system" makes no sense, is riddled with logical fallacies, Scriptural bankruptcy, and explanatory inability.

 

[mailmandan]

This should be believed and said about all those who are in Christ--and, then, if anyone is "blotted out", it no longer applies, because they are accounted as having never been in Christ in the first place, so it's perfectly consistent.

Your eisegesis is not consistent. There are those who hold the view that the book of the living and the Lamb's book of life are two separate books while others believe they are the same book and contain the names of every person who has physical life upon the earth.

Revelation 13:8 indicates that names have been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world. In Psalm 69:28, we read - May they be blotted out of the book of life and not be listed with the righteous.

Revelation 3:5 - "He who overcomes I will never blot out his name from the book of life." The "overcomer" mentioned in this letter to Sardis is the Believer/Christian. Compare this with 1 John 5:4: "Everyone who is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world--our faith.

Certain people read Revelation 3:5 as if God’s pen is poised and ready to strike out the name of any Christian who does not measure up to their personal standards. They read their pre-conceived beliefs into it like this: "If you don't overcome and win the victory through sinless perfection, then you’re going to lose your salvation! But that is NOT what the verse says. Jesus is giving a promise here, not a warning.

 

[Zao is life]

The difference between the works that do not save and the works James refers to is WHO DOES THEM. The fault with the works of the Law is that they are performed by the sinful flesh (Ro 8:3; Gal 3:3), but works of grace by faith ("faith works by love"--"God is love", and is "at work in us to will and do for His pleasure") are performed by God, they are "God's righteousness revealed from faith to faith".

Yes. It's the fruit of the Spirit you are describing and the fruit of the Spirit is not bound to Mosaic law because it fulfills the law.

The fruit of the Spirit is: love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, meekness, self-control; against such things there is no law. (Galatians 5:23).

"Owe no one anything, except to love one another; for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. For: "Do not commit adultery; do not murder; do not steal; do not bear false witness; do not lust;" and if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this word, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." Love works no ill to its neighbor, therefore love is the fulfilling of the law." (Romans 13:8-10).​

 

[GracePeace]

Your eisegesis is not consistent. There are those who hold the view that the book of the living and the Lamb's book of life are two separate books while others believe they are the same book and contain the names of every person who has physical life upon the earth.

Revelation 13:8 indicates that names have been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world. In Psalm 69:28, we read - May they be blotted out of the book of life and not be listed with the righteous.

Revelation 3:5 - "He who overcomes I will never blot out his name from the book of life." The "overcomer" mentioned in this letter to Sardis is the Believer/Christian. Compare this with 1 John 5:4: "Everyone who is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world--our faith.

Certain people read Revelation 3:5 as if God’s pen is poised and ready to strike out the name of any Christian who does not measure up to their personal standards. They read their pre-conceived beliefs into it like this: "If you don't overcome and win the victory through sinless perfection, then you’re going to lose your salvation! But that is NOT what the verse says. Jesus is giving a promise here, not a warning.

I don't care what they hold--Jesus, the Lamb, is God in the OT. Note that in both cases people are blotted out for sinning against Him. Note the connection between righteousness and Life--sinners are blotted out of the book in both cases.

Yeah, Christ says "to the one who overcomes", yet "this is the victory that has overcome... even our faith", so why is Christ saying for those who have already overcome to overcome still? Because people are led away from abiding (which includes faith) by idolatry (1 Jn 5:21).