Did Jesus claim to be God?

[Peterlag]

If you saw the son did you see the father?

No because nobody ever saw God.

 

[Truthnightmare]

No because nobody ever saw God.

Jesus said…

Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

 

[Davy]

No because nobody ever saw God.

Your Biblical illiteracy reveals the problems of interpretation you are having.


Just Who... do you think the prophet Isaiah saw sitting upon His Throne with the following...

Isa 6:1-10
6 In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple.

2 Above it stood the seraphims: each one had six wings; with twain he covered his face, and with twain he covered his feet, and with twain he did fly.

3 And one cried unto another, and said, "Holy, holy, holy, is the LORD of hosts: the whole earth is full of His glory."

4 And the posts of the door moved at the voice of him that cried, and the house was filled with smoke.

5 Then said I, "Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts."

6 Then flew one of the seraphims unto me, having a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with the tongs from off the altar:

7 And he laid it upon my mouth, and said, Lo, this hath touched thy lips; and thine iniquity is taken away, and thy sin purged.

8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, "Whom shall I send, and who will go for us?" Then said I, "Here am I; send me."

9 And He said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.

10 Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed.
KJV

 

[Truthnightmare]

Please tell this to someone who is remotely interested in anything the “church fathers” wrote, especially in view of the fact that Christ and his apostles foretold that an “apostasy” would overtake Christianity like “weeds” deliberately sown by an enemy in a farmer’s “field” to destroy his crop. They said that it was “already at work” whilst the apostles were still alive, but that they acted as a restraint until it was time to let it grow……it did with a vengeance with the death of the last apostle John at the end of the first century….so anything written after than I take with many grains of salt, as we see “Christianity” degenerate into what eventually became “The Roman Catholic church.“….an ugly counterfeit that did not resemble what Christ began at all. All false Christianity grew from the trunk of that corrupted, power hungry ‘tree’. Christ has never set foot in that building or in any of the buildings that teach her lies. (Matt 7:21-23; Matt 15:7-9)

Here is the text.

ὅτι τρεῖς εἰσιν οἱ μαρτυροῦντες εν τῷ οὐρανῷ, ὁ πατήρ, ὁ λόγος, καὶ τὸ Ἅγιον Πνεῦμα· καὶ οὗτοι οἱ τρεῖς ἕν εἰσι.

It does not say “agree” l

 

[Aunty Jane]

Seriously….what does this mean? State your point so that all can read your reasoning….this is what debates are for…..

 

[Truthnightmare]

Seriously….what does this means? State your point so that all can read your reasoning….this is what debates are for…..

It means what the scriptures tell us…

1 Timothy 3:16
16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness : God was manifest in the flesh [as Jesus], justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. KJV​

Manifest
Original Word: φανερόω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: phaneroó
Phonetic Spelling: (fan-er-o'-o)
Definition: to make visible, make clear
Usage: I make clear (visible, manifest), make known.

You seem to believe if I buy a gallon of milk, in dark container and pour some in a clear glass that the milk in the clear glass is no longer milk, because it’s not in the dark container anymore… not understanding I poured the milk in the clear glass so you could see it is milk.

 

[Aunty Jane]

It means what the scriptures tell us…



Manifest
Original Word: φανερόω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: phaneroó
Phonetic Spelling: (fan-er-o'-o)
Definition: to make visible, make clear
Usage: I make clear (visible, manifest), make known.

You seem to believe if I buy a gallon of milk, in dark container and pour some in a clear glass that the milk in the clear glass is no longer milk, because it’s not in the dark container anymore… not understanding I poured the milk in the clear glass so you could see it is milk.

Please understand that “God” is not mentioned in that verse……only the trinitarians translations will add it.
It’s talking about “godliness” of which Jesus was the epitome in representing his God and Father.
Why are you concentrating on the wrong word? To make something manifest is to reveal it….it was revealed in Jesus that God was working through him by means of his guiding and empowering spirit.

 

[Truthnightmare]

Please understand that “God” is not mentioned in that verse……only the trinitarians translations will add it.
It’s talking about “godliness” of which Jesus was the epitome in representing his God and Father.
Why are you concentrating on the wrong word? To make something manifest is to reveal it….it was revealed in Jesus that God was working through him by means of his guiding and empowering spirit.

Ok… let’s look at it in a simplistic fashion.

You say, God was working through Jesus correct?
Was Jesus a man?

 

[Fred J]

Do you beleive you are indwelt by Jesus? Spirit of Christ?

Those who are born of the Holy Spirit are spirit.

Only the Holy Spirit dwell in us, even Himself represents Jesus in us.

While, Jesus with His spirit bodily reside in Heaven beside the FATHER, as Great High Priest for the church.

 

[Spyder]

I think the who process of creating a lie, repeating it incessantly, and threatening those who don't accept are very effective methods in establishing false doctrines. The Apostle Paul warned Timothy to expect that:

1 Ti 3:15–4:5 Great indeed, we confess, is the mystery of godliness: He was manifested in the flesh, vindicated by the Spirit, seen by angels, proclaimed among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory. Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons, through the insincerity of liars whose consciences are seared, who forbid marriage and require abstinence from foods that God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, for it is made holy by the word of God and prayer.

The work of those we call the Early Church Fathers is one of Satan's greatest successes in that regard.

Except for those who have never accepted it and have been tortured or killed for refusing.

Even today, the belief in the dogma of the Trinity effectively turns Yahweh God into a liar and deceiver. They think that Yeshua was God in drag fooling people on Earth to believe He is just a man who could be obedient and even die. To think he is actually God means that He could not die so that whole crucifixion thing was a sham perpetrated on us and was no great loss to Yeshua. His surviving in the desert under the temptation of Satan was just playing a skit intended to provide an example of how Christians were to live. In short, believing Yeshua to be God is an insult to the work that Yeshua did and a sin against Yahweh as it violated Yahweh's commandment to have no other gods before Him. Well, that is, unless we are going to believe that God created another God which He never told us about. Oh, wait a minute, that He created two more Gods, right? That's because, since 60 years later another council said the God's spirit is another God. You know, the same Yahweh God that we proclaim never changes, right?

The fact is that the mantra of the Trinity has rendered Christianity an ineffective theology that has since failed, sinned, split, and denied the purpose for which Yeshua was born. Think about it, are we willing to keep committing the sin of having another god before Yahweh?

 

[TonyChanYT]

One need only study Bowman's Biblical Outline on the Trinity I posted a few times now.

See
https://www.reddit.com/r/BibleVerseCommentary/comments/tcvci6

 

[Peterlag]

Your Biblical illiteracy reveals the problems of interpretation you are having.


Just Who... do you think the prophet Isaiah saw sitting upon His Throne with the following...

Isa 6:1-10
6 In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple.

2 Above it stood the seraphims: each one had six wings; with twain he covered his face, and with twain he covered his feet, and with twain he did fly.

3 And one cried unto another, and said, "Holy, holy, holy, is the LORD of hosts: the whole earth is full of His glory."

4 And the posts of the door moved at the voice of him that cried, and the house was filled with smoke.

5 Then said I, "Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts."

6 Then flew one of the seraphims unto me, having a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with the tongs from off the altar:

7 And he laid it upon my mouth, and said, Lo, this hath touched thy lips; and thine iniquity is taken away, and thy sin purged.

8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, "Whom shall I send, and who will go for us?" Then said I, "Here am I; send me."

9 And He said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.

10 Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed.
KJV

Isa 6:1-10
6 In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple.

God showed him a vision. He did not literally see something real. It was a vision given by revelation. Moses asked God if he could see him. And God said if you did you would die. I have to assume that He would be lethal for a human to see. Perhaps to much energy.

 

[Peterlag]

Jesus said…

Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

The Bible says that Jesus Christ is the “image of God” Colossians 1:15; 2 Corinthians 4:4). If Christ is the image of God, then he cannot be God because a person cannot be himself and an image of himself at the same time. Jesus can be called the “image” of God because he always did the will of God, and because he was the image of God is why he could say you had seen the Father if you had seen him.

 

[GracePeace]

There you go again, making me think! I do find joy in your posts, as I love studying in hopes of having better understanding. You always make good points regarding scripture.

The answer is "YES," I am aware of the differences in worship, but you are the first I know to explain it that way. As you caused me to have to go look at scripture again (I enjoy that.), I'd like to point out a few passages that should be considered. First, we know that Yeshua was born as the Son of God, and that He came with multiple purposes as revealed in His High Priestly Prayer and many Old Testament prophets revealed. Yes, He was a man, but now He is a spirit. God gave Him authority on earth during His ministry and was given authority in Heaven and on Earth at His ascension. Perhaps we can see two different conditions based on His earthly work and now His heavenly work.

On Earth, Yeshua said:

Lk 6:46 “Why do you call me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do what I tell you?

Jn 14:15 “If you love me, you will keep my commandments.

Jn 4:22–24 But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him. God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”

That being said, I find no passages where Yeshua asked for worship - only obedience.

There are passages that speak of those who worshipped him on Earth:

Mt 2:10–11 When they saw the star, they rejoiced exceedingly with great joy. And going into the house, they saw the child with Mary his mother, and they fell down and worshiped him (using prosekynēsan}

Mt 14:30–33 Jesus immediately reached out his hand and took hold of him, saying to him, “O you of little faith, why did you doubt?” And when they got into the boat, the wind ceased. And those in the boat worshiped him, saying, “Truly you are the Son of God.” (again prosekynēsan)

The words change when Paul spoke of worship:

Ro 12:1 I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. (using latreian: to perform the sacred services (see ἐπιτελέω, 1), spoken of the priests, Hebrews 9:6; universally, of any worship of God, ἡ λογικη λατρεία, Romans 12:1)

Then we have the after-ascension times:

Php 2:8–11 And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Seems here that the bowing for Yeshua is for the glory of the Father.

The most striking reference in the most confusing book, we find:

Re 5:6–12 And between the throne and the four living creatures and among the elders I saw a Lamb standing, as though it had been slain, with seven horns and with seven eyes, which are the seven spirits of God sent out into all the earth. And he went and took the scroll from the right hand of him who was seated on the throne. And when he had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. And they sang a new song, saying, “Worthy are you to take the scroll and to open its seals, for you were slain, and by your blood you ransomed people for God from every tribe and language and people and nation, and you have made them a kingdom and priests to our God, and they shall reign on the earth.” Then I looked, and I heard around the throne and the living creatures and the elders the voice of many angels, numbering myriads of myriads and thousands of thousands, saying with a loud voice, “Worthy is the Lamb who was slain, to receive power and wealth and wisdom and might and honor and glory and blessing!”

Does this indicate "worship?" It seems to me that it does.

When I say worthy to be praised, after being confined to English as I have learned it; there is wiggle room. I do NOT worship Yeshua as God because He is not. I have not replaced Yahweh with His Son.

What do you make of the fact that Jesus says that true "worshipers" (proskynētai) will "worship" (proskynēsousin) the Father, and that this is the "worship" (prosekynēsen) that is offered Jesus?

 

[The Learner]

Trinitarianism in the Church Fathers

Whether the earliest Church Fathers believed in the Trinity or not is a subject for debate. Some of the evidence used to support an early belief in the Trinity are triadic statements (referring to the Father, Son and Holy Spirit) from the New Testament and the Church Fathers. The view that the...

encyclopedia.pub

Did the Early Church invent the Trinity? | The Sacred Faith: Timeless Truths for Modern Minds

The doctrine and concept of the Trinity is encapsulated in Matthew 28:19, where Jesus instructs the apostles: “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit”. John, who was very close to Jesus and obviously ...

thesacredfaith.co.uk

Chapter 7. Concerning Baptism. And concerning baptism, baptize this way: Having first said all these things, baptize into the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, in living water. But if you have no living water, baptize into other water; and if you cannot do so in cold water, do so in warm. But if you have neither, pour out water three times upon the head into the name of Father and Son and Holy Spirit. But before the baptism let the baptizer fast, and the baptized, and whoever else can; but you shall order the baptized to fast one or two days before. (Roberts-Donaldson translation; italic emphasis ours)

The Didache​

“After the foregoing instructions, baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, in living [running] water. If you have no living water, then baptize in other water, and if you are not able in cold, then in warm. If you have neither, pour water three times on the head, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Before baptism, let the one baptizing and the one to be baptized fast, as also any others who are able” (Didache 7:1 [A.D. 70]).

Tatian the Syrian​

“Then said Jesus unto them, ‘I have been given all authority in heaven and earth; and as my Father has sent me, so I also send you. Go now into all the world, and preach my gospel in all the creation; and teach all the peoples, and baptize them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit’ [Matt. 28:18-19]” (The Diatesseron 55 [A.D. 170]).

Hippolytus​

“When the one being baptized goes down into the water, the one baptizing him shall put his hand on him and speak thus: ‘Do you believe in God, the Father Almighty?’ And he that is being baptized shall say: ‘I believe.’ Then, having his hand imposed upon the head of the one to be baptized, he shall baptize him once. Then he shall say: ‘Do you believe in Christ Jesus . . . ?’ And when he says: ‘I believe,’ he is baptized again. Again shall he say: ‘Do you believe in the Holy Spirit and the holy Church and the resurrection of the flesh?’ The one being baptized then says: ‘I believe.’ And so he is baptized a third time” (The Apostolic Tradition 21 [A.D. 215]).

Tertullian​

“After his resurrection he promises in a pledge to his disciples that he will send them the promise of his Father; and lastly, he commands them to baptize into the Father and the Son and the Holy Ghost, not into a unipersonal God” (Against Praxeas 26 [A.D. 216]).

Origen​

“The Lord himself told his disciples that they should baptize all peoples in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit . . . for indeed, legitimate baptism is had only in the name of the Trinity” (Commentary on Romans 5:8 [A.D. 248]).

The Acts of Xantippe and Polyxena​

“Then Probus . . . leapt into the water, saying, ‘Jesus Christ, Son of God, and everlasting God, let all my sins be taken away by this water.’ And Paul said, ‘We baptize thee in the name of the Father and Son and Holy Ghost.’ After this he made him to receive the Eucharist of Christ” (Acts of Xantippe and Polyxena 21 [A.D. 250]).

Cyprian of Carthage​

“He [Jesus] commanded them to baptize the Gentiles in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. How then do some say that though a Gentile be baptized . . . never mind how or of whom, so long as it be done in the name of Jesus Christ, the remission of sins can follow—when Christ himself commands the nations to be baptized in the full and united Trinity?” (Letters 73:18 [A.D. 253]).

Eusebius of Caesarea​

“We believe . . . each of these to be and to exist: the Father, truly Father, and the Son, truly Son, and the Holy Ghost, truly Holy Ghost, as also our Lord, sending forth his disciples for the preaching, said, ‘Go teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.’” (Letter to the People of His Diocese 3 [A.D. 323]).

Cyril of Jerusalem​

“You were led by the hand to the holy pool of divine baptism, as Christ was carried from the cross to this sepulcher here before us [the tomb of Jesus at Jerusalem]. And each of you was asked if he believed in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. And you confessed that saving confession, and descended three times into the water, and again ascended, and in this there was suggested by a symbol the three days of Christ’s burial” (Catechetical Lectures 20:4 [A.D. 350]).

Athanasius​

“And the whole faith is summed up, and secured in this, that a Trinity should ever be preserved, as we read in the Gospel, ‘Go ye and baptize all the nations in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost’ (Matt. 28:19). And entire and perfect is the number of the Trinity (On the Councils of Arminum and Seleucia 2:28 [A.D. 361]).

Basil the Great​

“The Holy Spirit, too, is numbered with the Father and the Son, because he is above creation, and is ranked as we are taught by the words of the Lord in the Gospel, ‘Go and baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost.’ He who, on the contrary, places the Spirit before the Son, or alleges him to be older than the Father, resists the ordinance of God, and is a stranger to the sound faith, since he fails to preserve the form of doxology which he has received, but adopts some newfangled device in order to be pleasing to men” (Letters 52:4 [A.D. 367]).

Ambrose of Milan​

“Moreover, Christ himself says: ‘I and the Father are one.’ ‘One,’ said he, that there be no separation of power and nature; but again, ‘We are,’ that you may recognize Father and Son, forasmuch as the perfect Father is believed to have begotten the perfect Son, and the Father and the Son are one, not by confusion of person, but by unity of nature. We say, then, that there is one God, not two or three gods” (The Faith 1:1[9–10] [A.D. 379]).

Gregory of Nazianz​

“But not yet perhaps is there formed upon your soul any writing good or bad; and you want to be written upon today. . . . I will baptize you and make you a disciple in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost; and these three have one common name, the Godhead” (Orations 40:45 [A.D. 380]).

Jerome​

“Seeing that a man, baptized in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Ghost, becomes a temple of the Lord, and that while the old abode is destroyed a new shrine is built for the Trinity, how can you say that sins can be remitted among the Arians without the coming of the Holy Ghost? How is a soul purged from its former stains which has not the Holy Ghost?” (Dialogue Against the Luciferians 6 [A.D. 382]).

Gregory of Nyssa​

“And we, in receiving baptism . . . conceal ourselves in [the water] as the Savior did in the earth: and by doing this thrice we represent for ourselves that grace of the resurrection which was wrought in three days. And this we do, not receiving the sacrament in silence, but while there are spoken over us the names of the three sacred persons on whom we believed, in whom we also hope, from whom comes to us both the fact of our present and the fact of our future existence” (Sermon For the Day of Lights [A.D. 383]).

Augustine​

“Baptism in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost has Christ for its authority, not any man, whoever he may be; and Christ is the truth, not any man” (On Baptism, Against the Donatists 4:24 [57] [A.D. 400]).

“O Lord our God, we believe in you, the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. For the truth would not say, ‘Go, baptize all nations in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,’ unless you were a Trinity” (The Trinity 15:28[51] [A.D. 408]).

Theodoret of Cyr​

“And what need is there of many words, when it is possible to refute falsehood in few? We provide that those who year by year come up for holy baptism should carefully learn the faith set forth at Nicaea by the holy and blessed Fathers; and initiating them as we have been bidden, we baptize them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost, pronouncing each name singly” (Letters 145 [A.D. 444]).

Above are authoritive Historical sources to show that the early church believed in the Trinity. Also, the early fathers were taught by the Apostles. John had disciples among them.

 

[The Learner]

There's no lie from me. It's not taught anywhere. Look at your post above. You're using pieces (in your case 4 different sections of Scripture) that are statements scattered all over the New and Old Testament.

There has never been a teaching on it anywhere in the Bible. The Jews never saw it anywhere in the entire Old Testament nor anyone in the New Testament ever taught it. The Catholics who invented this nonsense have used only about 8 verses that they have to piece together from statements that are scattered all over the New Testament. One should think if such nonsense was true and important that it would have been taught by someone. And it is not. Only in the minds of Catholics who cannot explain it.

Too long to copy and paste: print it and do the study: https://www.calvarychapelboston.com/Biblical Basis Trinity Bowman.pdf

 

[The Learner]

The book of Matthew states Jesus had the ability to forgive sins. It does not say anything about God.

Matthew 9:6
But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins,

Matthew 9

Easy-to-Read Version

​

Jesus Heals a Crippled Man​

9 Jesus got into a boat and went back across the lake to his own town. 2 Some people brought to him a man who was paralyzed and was lying on a mat. Jesus saw that these people had much faith. So he said to the paralyzed man, “Young man, you will be glad to hear this. Your sins are forgiven.”
3 Some of the teachers of the law heard what Jesus said. They said to themselves, “What an insult to God for this man to say that!”
4 Jesus knew what they were thinking. So he said, “Why are you thinking such evil thoughts? 5-6 The Son of Man has power on earth to forgive sins. But how can I prove this to you? Maybe you are thinking it was easy for me to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven.’ There’s no proof that it really happened. But what if I say to the man, ‘Stand up and walk’? Then you will be able to see that I really have this power.” So Jesus said to the paralyzed man, “Stand up. Take your mat and go home.”
7 The man stood up and went home. 8 The people saw this and they were amazed. They praised God for letting someone have such power.

Psalm 79:9
Our God and Savior, help us! That will bring glory to your name. Save us and forgive our sins for the good of your name.

Luke 5:21
The Jewish teachers of the law and the Pharisees thought to themselves, “Who is this man who dares to say such things? What an insult to God! No one but God can forgive sins.”

 

[The Learner]

No because nobody ever saw God.

This is the close to that.

John 1:18
No one has ever seen God. The only Son is the one who has shown us what God is like. He is himself God and is very close to the Father.

John 14:7-9

Easy-to-Read Version

​

7 If you really knew me, you would know my Father too. But now you know the Father. You have seen him.”
8 Philip said to him, “Lord, show us the Father. That is all we need.”
9 Jesus answered, “Philip, I have been with you for a long time. So you should know me. Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father too. So why do you say, ‘Show us the Father’?

1 John 1:2
Yes, the one who is life was shown to us. We saw him, and so we can tell others about him. We now tell you about him. He is the eternal life that was with God the Father and was shown to us.

"
In some verses of Scripture, people see God. But, in other verses, it says they cannot see God? Is this a contradiction? It is not if you understand the Trinity and the context of those verses.

1. Has seen
   1. Gen. 17:1, “Now when Abram was ninety-nine years old, the LORD appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am God Almighty; Walk before Me, and be blameless;
   2. Gen. 18:1, “Now the LORD appeared to him by the oaks of Mamre, while he was sitting at the tent door in the heat of the day.”
   3. Exodus 6:2-3, “God spoke further to Moses and said to him, “I am the LORD; 3 and I appeared to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, as God Almighty, but by My name, LORD, I did not make Myself known to them.”
   4. Exodus 24:9-11, “Then Moses went up with Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel, 10and they saw the God of Israel; and under His feet there appeared to be a pavement of sapphire, as clear as the sky itself. 11Yet He did not stretch out His hand against the nobles of the sons of Israel; and they saw God, and they ate and drank.”
   5. Num. 12:6-8, “He said, ‘Hear now My words: If there is a prophet among you, I, the LORD, shall make Myself known to him in a vision. I shall speak with him in a dream. 7 “Not so, with My servant Moses, He is faithful in all My household; 8With him I speak mouth to mouth, Even openly, and not in dark sayings, And he beholds the form of the LORD. Why then were you not afraid To speak against My servant, against Moses ?”
   6. Acts 7:2, “And he [Stephen] said, ‘Hear me, brethren and fathers! The God of glory appeared to our father Abraham when he was in Mesopotamia before he lived in Haran…'”
2. Has not seen
   1. Exodus 33:20, “But He [God] said, “You cannot see My face, for no man can see Me and live!”
   2. John 1:18, “No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.”
   3. John 5:37, “And the Father who sent Me, He has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His form.”
   4. John 6:46, “Not that anyone has seen the Father, except the One who is from God; He has seen the Father.”
   5. 1 Tim. 6:15-16, “He who is the blessed and only Sovereign, the King of kings and Lord of lords, 16who alone possesses immortality and dwells in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see. To Him be honor and eternal dominion! Amen.”

It is evident that God was seen. But, considering the “can’t-see-God” verses, some would understandably argue that there would be a contradiction. One explanation offered is that the people saw visions, dreams, or the Angel of the LORD (Num. 22:22-26; Judges 13:1-21) and not really God Himself. But the problem is that the verses cited above do not say vision, dream, or Angel of the LORD. They say that people saw God (Exodus 24:9-11), that God was seen, and that He appeared as God Almighty (Exodus 6:2-3).

At first, this isn’t easy to understand. God Almighty was seen (Exodus 6:2-3), which means it was not the Angel of the Lord, for an angel is not God Almighty; and at least Moses saw God and not in a vision or dream, as the LORD Himself attests in Num. 12:6-8. If these verses mean what they say, then we naturally assume we have a contradiction. Actually, the contradiction exists in our understanding, not in the Bible, which is always the case with alleged biblical contradictions.

The solution is simple. All you need to do is accept what the Bible says. If the OT people were seeing the Almighty God, yet they not seeing the Father (John 6:46), then who was it? They saw someone else in the Godhead. I suggest that they saw the Word before He became incarnate (John 1:1, 14). In other words, they were seeing the pre-incarnate Jesus.

If God is a Trinity, then John 1:18 is not a problem either because, in John chapter one, John writes about the Word (Jesus) and God (the Father). In verse 14, it says the Word became flesh. In verse 18, it says no one has seen God. Since Jesus is the Word, God then refers to the Father. This is typically how John writes of God: as a reference to the Father. We see this verified in Jesus’ own words in John 6:46, where He said that no one has ever seen the Father. Therefore, Almighty God was seen, but it was not the Father. It was Jesus before His incarnation. There is more than one person in the Godhead, and the doctrine of the Trinity must be true."

Has anyone seen God or not?

God was seen in the Old Testament in several places. Almighty God was seen but not the Father. It was Jesus before His incarnation.

carm.org

 

[The Learner]

Contradictions: Face to Face

Can God be seen face to face (Genesis 32:30; Exodus 33:11) or not (Exodus 33:20; John 1:18; 1 John 4:12)?

answersingenesis.org

“I saw God face to face” (Genesis 32:30)

Psalm 110:1

The Lord said unto my Lord, “Sit Thou at My right hand, until I make Thine enemies Thy footstool.”

 

[The Learner]

Has Anyone Seen God?

Some argue that the Bible contradicts itself on whether a person can see God face-to-face—but all biblical data should be considered in context.

answersingenesis.org

Has anyone ever seen God? | GotQuestions.org

Has anyone ever seen God? Is it possible to see God and live?

www.gotquestions.org

https://www.calvarychapelboston.com/Biblical%20Basis%20Trinity%20Bowman.pdf