Hello Brethren,
I need some guidance due to something I thought I understood, came to see I was wrong about, and came full circle back to what I originally believed. Here are the things I believe I understand.
1)Yeshua gave his life for the whole world so that his blood would cover our sins upon repentance. True or False? I say true.
2)God does not wish any of us to perish and instructs us to choose life over death. True or False? I say true.
3)Just because Yeshua sacrificed himself for the whole world, does not mean the whole world will be saved. True or False? I say true.
4)God cannot forgive us our sins until we come to the realization that we are sinners and ask for forgiveness. True or False? I say true.
5)If we have to asks God for forgiveness, does it stand to reason that the person who transgressed against us must do likewise?
6)Or is God calling us to a higher standard than He allows for Himself?
7)Yeshua instructed us in a 3 part process concerning those within the church, to first correct the transgressor and upon repentance, we are to forgive and reconcile the relationship. If not, we are to consider the transgressor as a heathen and a publican, otherwise an outsider or sinner. However if that person later has a change of heart, we are to bring them back into the fold. True or False? I say true.
8)All the instructions for forgiveness involve those inside the church, never outside. True or False? I say true, but may be wrong.
9)If #8 is true, where are the passages concerning forgiving those outside the church?
10)All those who were healed by Yeshua sought him out and were healed. I take this to mean an admission of sins on their part of which Yeshua gladly healed them. True or False? I say true, but in all honesty I cannot recall every single encounter so it may be false.
11) Mark 11:24-26 is what is tripping me up and has me going back to my first conclusion. Mark's gospel says: Therefore I say unto you, What things soever you desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them. And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses. But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses." Does this mean we are to forgive everyone that has never sought out our forgiveness or does it mean that someone has sought out our forgiveness, but we refused to give them of that which they sought, like the unjust steward who would not forgive his fellowservant (believer)?
12)If we are to treat unrepentant church members as outsiders, does that mean we still forgive them despite them now being cast outside the fold, or do we only forgive them upon their asking for forgiveness and repentance?
I hate to think that I am playing God one way or the other. I keep coming back to my not having to forgive them unless they ask. As I explained in a post that was also about forgiveness, what happens if I go up to someone outside the church and say "I forgive you." They may become infuriated and say "Forgive me for what? What did I do? Who are you to judge me?" If they are not inside the church, they may not see what they did as wrong and are not convinced of their sin. I can't use the Bible on a non-believer to show them where they transgressed against me if they don't believe in God in the first place. Granted, most people, even outsiders who do not believe in God consciously live by the 5-10th commandments and may seek out forgiveness of which I would gladly oblige them. The problem lies in the ones who do not believe in such a concept as sin. Do I forgive them regardless of whether or not they ask or not forgive them? If God does not want me to forgive outsiders, than I don't want to go against Him, but if he does want me to forgive outsiders where exactly does it say that? I know many of you might point to what Yeshua said upon the cross, but I have to discard that because it is a spurious passage never found in the oldest manuscripts. Thanks for reading and any light you may be able to shed regarding this matter.
I need some guidance due to something I thought I understood, came to see I was wrong about, and came full circle back to what I originally believed. Here are the things I believe I understand.
1)Yeshua gave his life for the whole world so that his blood would cover our sins upon repentance. True or False? I say true.
2)God does not wish any of us to perish and instructs us to choose life over death. True or False? I say true.
3)Just because Yeshua sacrificed himself for the whole world, does not mean the whole world will be saved. True or False? I say true.
4)God cannot forgive us our sins until we come to the realization that we are sinners and ask for forgiveness. True or False? I say true.
5)If we have to asks God for forgiveness, does it stand to reason that the person who transgressed against us must do likewise?
6)Or is God calling us to a higher standard than He allows for Himself?
7)Yeshua instructed us in a 3 part process concerning those within the church, to first correct the transgressor and upon repentance, we are to forgive and reconcile the relationship. If not, we are to consider the transgressor as a heathen and a publican, otherwise an outsider or sinner. However if that person later has a change of heart, we are to bring them back into the fold. True or False? I say true.
8)All the instructions for forgiveness involve those inside the church, never outside. True or False? I say true, but may be wrong.
9)If #8 is true, where are the passages concerning forgiving those outside the church?
10)All those who were healed by Yeshua sought him out and were healed. I take this to mean an admission of sins on their part of which Yeshua gladly healed them. True or False? I say true, but in all honesty I cannot recall every single encounter so it may be false.
11) Mark 11:24-26 is what is tripping me up and has me going back to my first conclusion. Mark's gospel says: Therefore I say unto you, What things soever you desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them. And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses. But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses." Does this mean we are to forgive everyone that has never sought out our forgiveness or does it mean that someone has sought out our forgiveness, but we refused to give them of that which they sought, like the unjust steward who would not forgive his fellowservant (believer)?
12)If we are to treat unrepentant church members as outsiders, does that mean we still forgive them despite them now being cast outside the fold, or do we only forgive them upon their asking for forgiveness and repentance?
I hate to think that I am playing God one way or the other. I keep coming back to my not having to forgive them unless they ask. As I explained in a post that was also about forgiveness, what happens if I go up to someone outside the church and say "I forgive you." They may become infuriated and say "Forgive me for what? What did I do? Who are you to judge me?" If they are not inside the church, they may not see what they did as wrong and are not convinced of their sin. I can't use the Bible on a non-believer to show them where they transgressed against me if they don't believe in God in the first place. Granted, most people, even outsiders who do not believe in God consciously live by the 5-10th commandments and may seek out forgiveness of which I would gladly oblige them. The problem lies in the ones who do not believe in such a concept as sin. Do I forgive them regardless of whether or not they ask or not forgive them? If God does not want me to forgive outsiders, than I don't want to go against Him, but if he does want me to forgive outsiders where exactly does it say that? I know many of you might point to what Yeshua said upon the cross, but I have to discard that because it is a spurious passage never found in the oldest manuscripts. Thanks for reading and any light you may be able to shed regarding this matter.