Unity of the faith - at what cost?

[David in NJ]

@amigo de christo
View attachment 52795

THIS IS AWESOME

TRUTH = How GREAT a GIFT

 

[amigo de christo]

You are confusing heresy... such as Calvinism, and Universalism, and Mormonism, and JW....

See those?
Those are not "doctrines'". those are HERESIES... and when those are treated as if they are CHRISTIANITY, then those who believe this, are deceived.
So, its not a "doctrine" problem, its a Deception problem, whereby false theology has captured billions, since the Cross was raised.

Exactly . its not doctrine , its deceptions of what MEN tried to pass off as doctrine that was and is the problem .
The doctrine of GOD is pure and lovely , the doctrines of men , YEAH therein lies the problem .
But the dark one is using this parital truths to also attack the true doctrine itself . HE does so
in order to unify the decieved to be as one . Cause aint a lamb one gonna sit under that unity of his .
The lie that merges the decieved to be as one grows daily and by the hour .
But no lamb shall buy that lie for JESUS has the sheep .

 

[IronMaiden]

Exactly . its not doctrine , its deceptions of what MEN tried to pass off as doctrine that was and is the problem .
The doctrine of GOD is pure and lovely , the doctrines of men , YEAH therein lies the problem .
But the dark one is using this parital truths to also attack the true doctrine itself . HE does so
in order to unify the decieved to be as one . Cause aint a lamb one gonna sit under that unity of his .
The lie that merges the decieved to be as one grows daily and by the hour .
But no lamb shall buy that lie for JESUS has the sheep .

Amen, brother. Jesus has the sheep
… and He even goes after the lost sheep!

 

[amigo de christo]

Because they ENVIED Him....and Because Jesus said...>> "You are of YOUR FATHER the DEVIL".

And also because Jesus stated that He is Equal to God.......>"Before Abraham was, I AM"

"I AM" is the Name God gave to Moses, when Moses asked Him...>>"what is your name"..

So, these religious prided filled Pharisees, heard Jesus say.........>"I AM" regarding Himself.

So, ALL of of that, and more, is why they wanted Him Dead.

Well the HARLOT is envious too . Believing herself to hold the keys
and that the inheritance IS HERS . sound familiar do it .
She desires naught but power and influence and to be seen and worshipped of man .
This is why she has long led in interfaith . She desires power over all and has invented
a religoin she calls love wherein all the decieved shall merge as one under her shade .
Not the lambs my friend . Not the lambs . We sit under CHRIST and when any do speak , we test what is said
against pure sound doctrine . The Shepard has the sheep and He does instruct them of any dangers
and false paths to avoid . THEY HEED HIS VOICE and HE keeps them safe from the lies of men . TRUTH
is within them . The SPIRIT is within The sheep and no lie is of the truth . Who is a liar
He who denies JESUS is the CHRIST . He who believes not , or teaches ITS NOT necessary to have BELIEVED
IN JESUS the CHRIST is a liar and leads all who heed that voice right to perdition .

 

[amigo de christo]

Amen, brother. Jesus has the sheep
… and He even goes after the lost sheep!

YE WERE as sheep going astray , wrote peter ,
JESUS came to gather the sheep . And every word of TRUTH is meat , it is as honey to the taste of a lamb .
JESUS has the sheep and His own are not the hirelings who for gain FLEECE and decieve this people .
The true FEED the sheep and look out one for the other by THAT SAME SPIRIT within them all .
If one does stagger and head off path , THE OTHERS by THE SPIRIT will correct . AS IT IS by the SPIRIT of GOD
which does protect the sheep and keeps them safe .
Many are under the wrong influence of men . Many have either never KNOWN THE WAY
or perhaps some have slipped into a disssumaltion and need to be PULLED OUTTA IT as paul did with barabas and peter himself .
BUT one thing i do know , INTEFAITH and its finding common ground cometh of that which is of anti christ
to lead all to the lie . And what i know is THAT MUST be exposed as any other false teachings of men .
So , by grace i am gonna do all for the good of the people . AS should any lamb , specially as it becomes more and more
seasoned . we got too many who fleece the flocks . few try and really do anything to help edify the people .

 

[Marvelloustime]

Exactly . its not doctrine , its deceptions of what MEN tried to pass off as doctrine that was and is the problem .
The doctrine of GOD is pure and lovely , the doctrines of men , YEAH therein lies the problem .
But the dark one is using this parital truths to also attack the true doctrine itself . HE does so
in order to unify the decieved to be as one . Cause aint a lamb one gonna sit under that unity of his .
The lie that merges the decieved to be as one grows daily and by the hour .
But no lamb shall buy that lie for JESUS has the sheep .

@amigo de christo

 

[St. SteVen]

The call for doctrinal unity has gone out across the centuries.
Are we there yet? (not by a long shot)

Where is the problem?
Perhaps it is in the assumption that the unity of the faith is doctrinal unity.

- Can there be unity of the faith that overlooks doctrinal differences?
- Does the Body of Christ have room for differing views on doctrine?
- What would the church look like if we didn't label differing views as BAD or FALSE doctrines?
- Is a differing view "unbiblical" simply because it doesn't agree with our own biblical position?
- Can two opposing views BOTH be biblical, if there is biblical evidence to support each view?

[

 

[BarneyFife]

The call for doctrinal unity has gone out across the centuries.
Are we there yet? (not by a long shot)

Where is the problem?
Perhaps it is in the assumption that the unity of the faith is doctrinal unity.

- Can there be unity of the faith that overlooks doctrinal differences?
- Does the Body of Christ have room for differing views on doctrine?
- What would the church look like if we didn't label differing views as BAD or FALSE doctrines?
- Is a differing view "unbiblical" simply because it doesn't agree with our own biblical position?
- Can two opposing views BOTH be biblical, if there is biblical evidence to support each view?

[

The problem—at least, among brethren who are inclined to work toward unity at all—has traditionally been about deciding on what constitutes "essential" and "non-essential" points of doctrine and also what types of activity/collaboration are being considered as an object of unity.

Some might draw a red line at points of doctrine regarding the science of redemption itself; others might consider views about the nature of the Godhead as paramount for associating with other Christians.

Some might be comfortable collaborating with believers of widely differing views on a project involving feeding the poor, but not so much on having a potluck dinner together.

These are just crude examples.

But the degree of the problem is generally commensurate with a lack of willingness to submit to the leading of the Holy Spirit although most will argue, often almost unwittingly, that the problem is entirely a product of false teaching, in general, or even a lack of intelligence.

Few there be, indeed, that are ready to have their views about even the smallest matters of faith questioned or critiqued without exhibiting the telltale, bitter fruit of an unregenerate heart.

 

[David in NJ]

The problem—at least, among brethren who are inclined to work toward unity at all—has traditionally been about deciding on what constitutes "essential" and "non-essential" points of doctrine and also what types of activity/collaboration are being considered as an object of unity.

Some might draw a red line at points of doctrine regarding the science of redemption itself; others might consider views about the nature of the Godhead as paramount for associating with other Christians.

Some might be comfortable collaborating with believers of widely differing views on a project involving feeding the poor, but not so much on having a potluck dinner together.

These are just crude examples.

But the degree of the problem is generally commensurate with a lack of willingness to submit to the leading of the Holy Spirit although most will argue, often almost unwittingly, that the problem is entirely a product of false teaching, in general, or even a lack of intelligence.

Few there be, indeed, that are ready to have their views about even the smallest matters of faith questioned or critiqued without exhibiting the telltale, bitter fruit of an unregenerate heart.

Very True @BarneyFife and @St. SteVen

JESUS concluded that the biggest blockade toward unity is inside a man's head/heart = Matthew 18:1-3

At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Who then is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”

2Jesus invited a little child to stand among them. 3“Truly I tell you,” He said, “unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4Therefore, whoever humbles himself like this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
5And whoever welcomes a little child like this in My name welcomes Me.

Denominations will not 'take to heart' these words of Truth

 

[St. SteVen]

Few there be, indeed, that are ready to have their views about even the smallest matters of faith questioned or critiqued without exhibiting the telltale, bitter fruit of an unregenerate heart.

Great post, thanks.
Seems to me that the lower we set the bar,
the more opportunity there is for accepting one another. (unity)
You and I are miles apart on some of the doctrine that is critical to our beliefs.
But we put that aside to maintain our relationship.

[

 

[David in NJ]

Great post, thanks.
Seems to me that the lower we set the bar,
the more opportunity there is for accepting one another. (unity)
You and I are miles apart on some of the doctrine that is critical to our beliefs.
But we put that aside to maintain our relationship.

[

Helping out those who are in harms way(poverty, hunger, nakedness, sickness, war) is the Way to 'lower the bar' of ourselves and 'raise the bar' of Christ.

Add the Gospel to the 'good works' and you have "Thy will being done on earth as it is in Heaven".

Good works = man to man
Gospel = God to man

JESUS Says: "On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets"

 

[BarneyFife]

Great post, thanks.
Seems to me that the lower we set the bar,
the more opportunity there is for accepting one another. (unity)
You and I are miles apart on some of the doctrine that is critical to our beliefs.
But we put that aside to maintain our relationship.

[

What relationship?
You never call me!

 

[St. SteVen]

What relationship?
You never call me!

Sounds like my Mom.
"You never call, you never write; what am I going to do with you?"

[

 

[Lambano]

But the degree of the problem is generally commensurate with a lack of willingness to submit to the leading of the Holy Spirit although most will argue, often almost unwittingly, that the problem is entirely a product of false teaching, in general, or even a lack of intelligence.

Barney, when I see this, I have to ask, "Why should it be this way? Why ISN'T the Holy Spirit leading us toward unity? Are we assuming something about the Holy Ghost's job description that just isn't true?"

Anyway, something is broken, and I don't know how to fix it.

 

[St. SteVen]

Barney, when I see this, I have to ask, "Why should it be this way? Why ISN'T the Holy Spirit leading us toward unity? Are we assuming something about the Holy Ghost's job description that just isn't true?"

This may be part of the problem.
Lately I see Christians quoting the scripture below as their
understanding of the ministry of the Holy Spirit.

John 16:7-11 NIV
But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away.
Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.
8 When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong
about sin and righteousness and judgment:
9 about sin, because people do not believe in me;
10 about righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer;
11 and about judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned.

[

 

[Lambano]

This may be part of the problem.
Lately I see Christians quoting the scripture below as their
understanding of the ministry of the Holy Spirit.

John 16:7-11 NIV
But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away.
Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.
8 When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong
about sin and righteousness and judgment:
9 about sin, because people do not believe in me;
10 about righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer;
11 and about judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned.

[

You cut off the quotation two verses too soon:

But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. (John 16:13 NASB)

But it ain't happening. How many times have you seen people here claim to have been led into the Truth with a capital "T" - while vehemently disagreeing with (and calling some nasty names) a bunch of other people who also claim to have been led into the Truth.

This place isn't healthy for me. It's making me cynical about all truth claims.

 

[David in NJ]

This may be part of the problem.
Lately I see Christians quoting the scripture below as their
understanding of the ministry of the Holy Spirit.

John 16:7-11 NIV
But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away.
Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.
8 When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong
about sin and righteousness and judgment:
9 about sin, because people do not believe in me;
10 about righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer;
11 and about judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned.

[

Did JESUS err here???

@Lambano

Could the unity of the Spirit be in the Spirit ITSELF???

 

[Lambano]

Did JESUS err here???

@Lambano

Could the unity of the Spirit be in the Spirit ITSELF???

Could you elaborate?

 

[David in NJ]

Could you elaborate?

Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
14For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. 16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Could the "Unity" be from God's Perspective Above???

 

[St. SteVen]

You cut off the quotation two verses too soon:

But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. (John 16:13 NASB)

That's my point.
The typical view of the Holy Spirit that I have observed of late is focusing on verse eight.
Believers think they are being led by the Spirit while they "prove everyone wrong".

John 16:8 NIV
When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong
about sin and righteousness and judgment:

[