Every branch that bears fruit is pruned. - John 15

[Muna]

I have fruit trees.

The very fruitful branches get pruned of half their fruit. This does two things

(a) it prevents the branch from becoming too heavy and breaking, and
(b) it allows the remaining half of the fruit to thrive

If there are too many fruits on a branch, even if it doesn't break, the fruits will all be small, sickly, and not juicy.

Wick Stick, what about here, since you are familar with fruit trees

Jude 1:12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots

 

[Wick Stick]

Wick Stick, what about here, since you are familar with fruit trees

Jude 1:12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots

If your tree doesn't flower and fruit, it's probably malnourished. Feed it some plant food. Alternately, it might be planted in soil with too much clay, making it hard for the roots to absorb anything.

If your tree makes fruits, but they wither before maturing, it may be underwatered, or it may be planted in a place where it gets too much direct sun. I live in Arizona - both of these are likely for me. People elsewhere tell me that it's more likely to overwater than underwater, which can cause root-rot.

I'm not sure those have anything to do with the verse lol.

 

[Muna]

If your tree doesn't flower and fruit, it's probably malnourished. Feed it some plant food. Alternately, it might be planted in soil with too much clay, making it hard for the roots to absorb anything.

If your tree makes fruits, but they wither before maturing, it may be underwatered, or it may be planted in a place where it gets too much direct sun. I live in Arizona - both of these are likely for me. People elsewhere tell me that it's more likely to overwater than underwater, which can cause root-rot.

I'm not sure those have anything to do with the verse lol.

Thanks, I was just asking about the verse

I don't grow fruit tress, but I do grow tomatoes, and peppers, potatoes, carrots, sweet potatoes, onions, garlic, ginger, peanuts, etc. I think Tomatoes are considered a fruit though, but I never needed to prune the ones I opt to grow (at least for the most part) since I mostly grow determinate tomatoes. I refuse to grow indeterminate because I would definitely have to prune them. I always love to get off the hook of ever having to do that. I am grateful for mostly underground things in the garden,

 

[Wick Stick]

Thanks, I was just asking about the verse

I don't grow fruit tress, but I do grow tomatoes, and peppers, potatoes, carrots, sweet potatoes, onions, garlic, ginger, peanuts, etc. I think Tomatoes are considered a fruit though, but I never needed to prune the ones I opt to grow (at least for the most part) since I mostly grow determinate tomatoes. I refuse to grow indeterminate because I would definitely have to prune them. I always love to get off the hook of ever having to do that. I am grateful for mostly underground things in the garden,

We have an herb harden as well... tomatoes, bell peppers, chilis, garlic, basil, thai basil, mint, and rosemary. My wife mostly tends that.

She hates pruning anything. I'm in trouble with her every time I prune anything!

 

[Muna]

We have an herb harden as well... tomatoes, bell peppers, chilis, garlic, basil, thai basil, mint, and rosemary. My wife mostly tends that.

She hates pruning anything. I'm in trouble with her every time I prune anything!

It sure doesnt take much to mess it up

 

[Wick Stick]

It sure doesnt take much to mess it up

To be fair, I did make our Moringa tree very ugly last year. Best crop of pods we've ever got though!

 

[quietthinker]

A point that stood out to me from Sunday's sermon this week.

- Are you being pruned?
- What good fruit are you producing?
- Why are you being pruned?
- What does being pruned look like from a practical view?
- What gets pruned (cut away) and what is left?

John 15:1-2 NIV
“I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener.
2 He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit,
while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes[a]
so that it will be even more fruitful.

/

Ahhhh, the pruning! The awareness that self is at the centre of all my choices....even those I think are honourable....nay, in particular those I think are honourable. Ouch!
Being such a klutz is embarrassing mostly because for such a long time it has gone unnoticed.

The awareness started with realising that dishing out advice as if it were others who needed it was primary blocker of insight. Now I get pissed when I see others dishing out unasked for advice.

What? A religious tosser! How can I ever absorb the good news when I'm persuaded others need it more than I do because I know it? Yes, the splinter in your eye is always so much bigger than anything I perceive in mine, therefore it is my duty to point it out to you.
Did I say religious tosser? So then, what have I got to share? Perhaps its the understanding that I fade into insignificance when the
Glory of Jesus is put back into focus....and His Glory becomes my testimony!

 

[Hiddenthings]

Ahhhh, the pruning! The awareness that self is at the centre of all my choices....even those I think are honourable....nay, in particular those I think are honourable. Ouch!
Being such a klutz is embarrassing mostly because for such a long time it has gone unnoticed.

The awareness started with realising that dishing out advice as if it were others who needed it was primary blocker of insight. Now I get pissed when I see others dishing out unasked for advice.

What? A religious tosser! How can I ever absorb the good news when I'm persuaded others need it more than I do because I know it? Yes, the splinter in your eye is always so much bigger than anything I perceive in mine, therefore it is my duty to point it out to you.
Did I say religious tosser? So then, what have I got to share? Perhaps its the understanding that I fade into insignificance when the
Glory of Jesus is put back into focus....and His Glory becomes my testimony!

The use of profanity doesn't add any weight to your message, in fact, it only detracts from it. Don’t take offense, I won’t remove it from your eye. You’re more than capable of doing that yourself.

You don’t need to remind me how easily the eye spots the faults of others without pausing to consider its own. I suppose as long as I haven’t used the word "tosser" in my posts, I’m safe from hypocrisy, or maybe not entirely.

Afterall, I did call some of the forum members dinosaurs in another tread!...albeit in jest!

 

[St. SteVen]

The very fruitful branches get pruned of half their fruit.

How do you decide which half?
Extra points for a spiritual insight. Thanks.

[

 

[Wick Stick]

How do you decide which half?
Extra points for a spiritual insight. Thanks.

[

I try to take the ones that are mostly likely to become sunburnt.

 

[St. SteVen]

I try to take the ones that are mostly likely to become sunburnt.

Perhaps God does the same for us?

[

 

[Wick Stick]

Perhaps God does the same for us?

[

So, sometimes God causes our endeavors to be abruptly cut short, because He knew that in the end they would be stymied by some external force beyond our control?

Am I over-extended the metaphor correctly?

 

[St. SteVen]

So, sometimes God causes our endeavors to be abruptly cut short, because He knew that in the end they would be stymied by some external force beyond our control?

Perhaps "cut short" is the wrong way to look at it? (although that does sound like pruning.
I'm thinking redirecting our energies, like you do with the pruning.
But there may indeed be some circumstances, unforeseen by us, to steer around.

Am I over-extended the metaphor correctly?

Is there a correct way to over-extend metaphors? - LOL

I recall something that happened with me many years ago.
It may have been SELF-pruning. I call it the 80/20 rule.

If you are a willing servant at church you will loaded up with work.
Basically 20% of the people do 80% of the work.
Those who say "yes" get asked to help ALL the time.

This causes burnout. I had to learn how to say "No".

[

 

[MatthewG]

I've been cut down and back many times.

 

[soberxp]

Wick Stick, what about here, since you are familar with fruit trees

Jude 1:12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots

Maybe about the second death.

I always wonder if there is second death then there will be second life before it.

But I think that would upset a lot of folks.

 

[Muna]

I was digging through some older studies, and this one was one I was swishing this one around using a multitude of other scriptures showing similar things (having crossed checking it every which way) so I figured I would post it here for anyone who might be interested (Since it is on topic)

And please forgive the ((( perenthesis ))) I typically use them to emphasize things which are helpful when studying and I would typically go back and delete them to post nowadays, but there is too many to be bothered with. If those are too distracting just pretend I am not here (scroll past me) I understand.

It's too long, I needed to divide the post up

Starting here....

Christ Jesus (The Vine) and (( ye are )) the branches

John 15:5 (( I am )) the vine,
(( ye are )) the branches:

The True Vine

John 15:1 (( I am )) the true vine,
and (( my Father)) is the husbandman.

There are two kinds of branches

John 15:2a Every branch (( in me ))
that (( beareth not )) fruit (( he taketh away ))

And these branches

John 15:2b .and every branch (( that beareth )) fruit, (( he purgeth ))
it that it may (( bring forth more fruit ))

John 15:5 (( I am )) the vine,
(( ye are )) the branches:
He that abideth (( in me )) and I (( in him ))
the same (( bringeth forth )) much fruit
for (( without me )) ye can do nothing.

Speaking of them in terms of dealing with those (branches) in Christ (the Vine) which actually bear the fruit of the Spirit & the purging/pruning of those (branches) who are in him (and known by their fruits) he says,

John 15:8 (( Herein )) is my Father glorified,
(( that ye bear )) much fruit;
so shall ye be (( my disciples ))

John 5:4 Abide (( in me )) and I (( in you )).
As (( the branch )) cannot (( bear fruit )) of itself,
(( except it )) abide in (( the vine ))
no more (( can ye )) except ye (( abide in )) me.

John 15:6 If (( a man )) abide not (( in me )) he is cast forth (( as a branch )) and is (( withered )) and men gather (( them )), and cast (( them )) into the fire, (( and they )) are burned.
( Same theme as shown in Mat 7:20, Heb 6:8, Mat 13:40-42 )

John 15:7 If ye (( abide in )) me,
and my words (( abide in )) you,
ye shall ask (( what )) ye will,
and it shall be (( done unto )) you.

A man/ branch cannot bear fruit ( of itself alone) but by abiding in Christ (the Vine ) which is both abiding in him and is doctrine (2 John 1:9, John 15:5, & 7, 1 John 3:24 ) which was not his own but His that sent him.

That which beareth not fruit (which is only by Jesus Christ) but is rejected

Heb 6:8 But that (( which beareth )) thorns and briers (( is rejected ))
and is nigh unto cursing (( whose end )) is to be burned.
(Same themes as is shown in Mat 7:20 John 15:6, Mat 13:40-42)

Of false prophets who are not abiding in the Lord Jesus Christ

Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come (( to you )) in sheep's clothing, but (( inwardly )) they are (( ravening )) wolves.

Mat 7:16 Ye shall (( know them )) by their fruits.

Fruits come by the Father's choice Vine, by abiding in Jesus Christ (even in Him and His words)

Then he asks,

Do men gather grapes (( of thorns )),
or figs (( of thistles ))?

Mat 7:17 Even so (( every good )) tree bringeth forth good fruit;
but a (( corrupt tree )) bringeth forth evil fruit.

Mat 7:18 A (( good tree )) cannot bring forth evil fruit,
neither can a (( corrupt tree)) bring forth good fruit.

Mat 7:19 (( Every tree )) that (( bringeth not forth )) good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
(Same theme Heb 6:8, & John 15:6, Mat 13:40-42 )

Mat 7:20 Wherefore by (( their fruits )) ye shall (( know )) them.

Again, he says

Mat 7:16 Ye shall (( know them )) by their fruits.

Do men gather grapes (( of thorns )) , or figs (( of thistles? ))

And in Hebrews it is also written

Heb 6:8 But that (( which beareth )) ""thorns and briers"" (( is rejected ))

Rejected (( is castaway )) even reprobate

Same common theme between these.

Whether they be branches which bear not fruit, or trees without the same, or that which beareth thorns and briers (in contrast) it's reprobate

Continued in next post

 

[Muna]

Continued from my last post



The whole verse here

Heb 6:8 But that (( which beareth )) thorns and briers (( is rejected ))
and (( is nigh unto )) cursing (( whose end )) is to be burned.
( Same themes as is shown in Mat 7:19, Mat 13:40-42 John 15:6 )

Mat 7:19 (( Every tree )) that (( bringeth not forth )) good fruit is hewn down, (( and cast into )) the fire.
( Same themes as is shown in Heb 6:8, John 15:6, Mat 13:40-42 )

John 15:6 If (( a man )) abide not (( in me )) he is cast forth (( as a branch )) and is (( withered )) and men gather (( them )) and cast (( them )) into the fire, (( and they )) are burned.
(Same themes as is shown in Heb 6:8, and Mat 7:19, Mat 13:40-42 )

In Heb 6:8 That which is bearing thorns and briers which is rejected (whose end is to be burned) and Mat 7:19 Shows that which bears no good fruit hewn down and cast into the fire. And in John 15:6 of the branches not abiding, withered and cast into the fire and they are burned. Lastly, in Mat 13: 40-42 of the tares gathered and burned in the fire in the end of the world

The good seed (the children of God)
and the tares ( the children of the wicked one)
which grow together

Mat 13:40 As therefore (( the tares )) are gathered (( and burned )) in the fire;
so shall it be in the end of this world.

Mat 13:41 The Son of man shall send forth (( his angels )),
and they shall (( gather out )) of his kingdom (( all things ))
that offend and (( them )) which (( do iniquity ))

Mat 13:42 And shall (( cast them )) into a furnace of fire:
there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Again as Jesus said,

John 15:8 (( Herein )) is my Father glorified,
(( that ye bear )) much fruit;
so shall ye be (( my disciples ))

These then are

Phil 1:11 (( Being filled )) with the fruits (( of righteousness ))
which are by (( Jesus Christ )),
(( unto )) the glory and praise of God.

Ephes 5:9 For the fruit (( of the Spirit )) is in all goodness
and righteousness and truth (Gal 5:22)

The manifestation of the Sons of God is in doing righteousness (1 John 3:10)
verses the other

1 John 2:29 If ye know that (( he is )) righteous, ye know that
every one that (( doeth )) righteousness is born of him.

If you know he is righteous those who are born of him would have like-fruits
(or the fruits of righteousness) which are by His Spirit

1John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you:
he that (( doeth )) righteousness (( is )) righteous, (( even as )) he is righteous.

As Jesus said, it enough for the disciple that he be as his master

The fruits of righteousness which are by Jesus Christ are to be manifested in the children of God

Whether its a picture of a Husbandman a branch and a Vine or the Spirit of adoptionin the household of a Father with a sons, between both show the same common themes of pruning's/or purging's/ branches cast forth and/or chastisements or castaways (as far as fruitfulness goes) which relies on our abiding in Jesus Christ. In the one a person can be as grafted in, and in the other adopted into the household of God other but in both its by one Spirit (that we partake of) by abiding in Him that we become more fruitful. And that, as by the Husbandman's/ or Fathers prunings/ chastisements/ or corrections that the peaceable fruits it works in those who are exercised therein.

John 15:1 (( I am )) the true vine,
and (( my Father )) is the husbandman.

John 15:2 Every branch (( in me )) that (( beareth not )) fruit
(( he taketh away ))

and every branch (( that )) beareth fruit,

(( he purgeth it )) that it may bring forth (( more fruit )).

The Father of spirits (Heb 12:9)

As the branches are men (even as ye are the branches) is speaking of them in terms of dealing with those in Christ (the Vine) to bear fruit as by the Spirit through the purging/pruning/chastening of those (as sons of God) in Jesus Christ and as by their fruits ye shall recognize the same.

We are not to be discouraged by such, for it says,

Heb 12:7 If ye endure (( chastening )) God dealeth with you (( as with sons )) for what son is he whom the father (( chasteneth not ))?

Through belief in God's only begotten Son we are adopted into (even grafted into) the family (tree) or into the Vine/Christ. We having been received of God in Christ (his beloved) and as we ourselves continue in abiding in Christ (and even in him and his words/doctrine) we will bear the fruits of righteousness by the Spirit Christ.

Both pictures show corrections to the same end (as far as bearing more fruit) whether its shown as pruning as far the Vine or the chastisement of a Son in the house of his Father. Who tends to our growth and fruitfulness as we abide in Jesus Christ. Being a partaker of the righteousness by faith (and being so filled by the Spirit) and manifestly declared as the children of God according to the same.

Father and the sons of God and their chastening

Heb 12:11 Now (( no chastening )) for the present seemeth to be joyous, (( but grievous )): nevertheless afterward (( it yieldeth )) the peaceable (( fruit of )) righteousness unto them which are (( exercised thereby )).

Bastards (which be not sons) would appear to be as the branches taken away being without chastisement (or no purging/ pruning as is received by the branches which actually do bear fruit.

These which abideth not cannot of themselves bear fruit and shows the same as cast forth. And so if a branch cannot bear fruit of itself the same would be that which beareth but thorns (and is rejected)

John 15:6 If (( a man )) abide not (( in me )) he is cast forth (( as a branch )) and is (( withered )) and men gather (( them )) and cast (( them )) into the fire, (( and they )) are burned.
(Same theme shown in Heb 6:8, and Mat 7:19, Mat 13:40-42 )

That which is approved wherein the Father (even the husbandman) is glorified through Christ Jesus (the Vine) are the branches bearing much fruit (and that of the Spirit and of righteousness).

You can show it according to the doctrine and abiding also. Even as John said if you don't abide in Christ's doctrine (which was not His own doctrine but the Father's) he hath not God. Since it is by Jesus Christ alone we each come unto the Father.

This could definitely use some more fine tuning, I am not that great with using my own words and I havent looked at this one for quite awhile, but I gave it a look over and thought it would be just fine to post here (maybe a little too long though)

 

[Ronald Nolette]

The same word used here

John 15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away G142 and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

Is used in these

Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken G142 from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

Mat 22:13 Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take G142 him away, G142 and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Mat 24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took G142 them all away; G142 so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Heb 10:9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away G142 the first, that he may establish the second.

Concerning fruit, and that none being present in Luke is shown getting the axe here

Luke 13:7 Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground?
Luke 13:8 And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it:
Luke 13:9 And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after that thou shalt cut it down.

Well as airo has many nuances of meaning, context is key and knowing culture as well.

these are branches that are in Christ! As opposed to those in verse 6:

6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Verse 6 are those not in christ!

Once again vintners when they saw a branch not bearinbg fruit, they would lift it up, place stones under it so it would bear fruit! Grapes grew on the ground back then and dirt could clog the pores and block fruit from growing! Just like the primaary definition says:

1. to raise up, elevate, lift up
   1. to raise from the ground, take up: stones
   2. to raise upwards, elevate, lift up: the hand
   3. to draw up: a fish
2. to take upon one's self and carry what has been raised up, to bear
3. to bear away what has been raised, carry off
   1. to move from its place
   2. to take off or away what is attached to anything
   3. to remove
   4. to carry off, carry away with one
   5. to appropriate what is taken
   6. to take away from another what is his or what is committed to him, to take by force
   7. to take and apply to any use
   8. to take from among the living, either by a natural death, or by violence
   9. cause to cease

 

[Muna]

Well as airo has many nuances of meaning, context is key and knowing culture as well.

these are branches that are in Christ! As opposed to those in verse 6:

6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Verse 6 are those not in christ!

Once again vintners when they saw a branch not bearinbg fruit, they would lift it up, place stones under it so it would bear fruit! Grapes grew on the ground back then and dirt could clog the pores and block fruit from growing! Just like the primaary definition says:

1. to raise up, elevate, lift up
   1. to raise from the ground, take up: stones
   2. to raise upwards, elevate, lift up: the hand
   3. to draw up: a fish
2. to take upon one's self and carry what has been raised up, to bear
3. to bear away what has been raised, carry off
   1. to move from its place
   2. to take off or away what is attached to anything
   3. to remove
   4. to carry off, carry away with one
   5. to appropriate what is taken
   6. to take away from another what is his or what is committed to him, to take by force
   7. to take and apply to any use
   8. to take from among the living, either by a natural death, or by violence
   9. cause to cease

To these Jews who believed on him Jesus said,

John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him,
If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed

So Jesus speaks of the need to continue in his word

Whereas these disciples of Christ are not continuing with Jesus any more

John 6:66 From that time many of his disciples went back,
and walked no more with him.

These were abiding in his teaching for awhile, but the same can similarly be shown here

Luke 8:13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.

 

[St. SteVen]

New topic:

Inspired or inspiring? - The case for biblical inerrancy and inspiration.

What are the best arguments for biblical inerrancy and inspiration? I'm guessing that there is less support for biblical inerrancy than for biblical inspiration. Let's discuss...

www.christianityboard.com

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