If the punishment for sin is eternal conscious torment, did Jesus pay the price?

[St. SteVen]

How can the cost of sin be MORE than what Jesus paid for it?

Same question concerning Annihilationism.
If the punishment for sin is complete destruction, did Jesus pay the price?

[

 

[Dan Clarkston]

How can the cost of sin be MORE than what Jesus paid for it?

Same question concerning Annihilationism.
If the punishment for sin is complete destruction, did Jesus pay the price?

God's Kingdom works on the seedtime harvest principle.

Mark 4:26
the kingdom of God, as if a man should cast seed into the ground;

Gal 6:7,8 tells us that if we sow to the flesh (sin) we shall reap corruption

As such those who sin and don't confess / repent to come back to the Lord will reap the devil's reward

This is because hell was created for satan and his angels (Matthew 25:41)

Even though Jesus paid the price for people to be able to escape hell, if they live in sin rather then abide in Christ they will get the reward of their father the devil and will spend eternity suffering with him in the eternal flames which are never quenched.

Those that cannot grasp how the Kingdom of God functions will not be unable to understand.

 

[MatthewG]

Im happy to know sins are paid for, are you not?

Oh yeah, you gotta also go on not sinning.

Bummer. Darn it Jesus, you got me locked up there.


~This whole post is satire.

 

[Windmill Charge]

How can the cost of sin be MORE than what Jesus paid for it?

Same question concerning Annihilationism.
If the punishment for sin is complete destruction, did Jesus pay the price?

[

An infinite God paid the price for a finite amount of sin. The cost of sin cannot out weigh the price that was paid.

 

[Hillsage]

If the punishment for sin is eternal conscious torment, did Jesus pay the price?​

How can the cost of sin be MORE than what Jesus paid for it?

If the TITLE of this thread is the question, then the answer is NO! Jesus is not suffering eternal conscious torment.

Same question concerning Annihilationism.
If the punishment for sin is complete destruction, did Jesus pay the price?

Same logical answer, for the same logical reason.

 

[Behold]

How can the cost of sin be MORE than what Jesus paid for it?

Jesus's sacrifice is an over-payment for sin.

See, His blood atonement is for the sin of the WORLD. (John 3:16......"for God so loved the WORLD">..........so that is everyone, all the time.......and God's Son's Blood takes care of their sin....= one Believer at a time.

This is why the verse says......>>"many will be made righteous'.......

It could be EVERYONE........but not everyone will believe before they die........but many have believed since The Cross was raised and are "made righteous"...... And tomorrow many more will believe, and all those who didnt believe and died all entered Hell wishing they had believed.

 

[Jack]

If the punishment for sin is eternal conscious torment, did Jesus pay the price?​

Yeah, for believers, not Bible attackers!

 

[Hillsage]

Im happy to know sins are paid for, are you not?

Very happy to know that.

Oh yeah, you gotta also go on not sinning.

You gotta go on not sinning, for what? For the 'eternal' consequence of sin, which was paid for by Jesus on the cross, for all?

Or do you have to 'not go on sinning', for the 'temporal' consequence of sin here and now? Sin where , as a believer, you will still 'reap what you sow' "on earth", on this side of glory.

Bummer. Darn it Jesus, you got me locked up there.

If the baptism of John was for the forgiveness of sins;
MAR 1:4 John the Baptist appeared in the wilderness preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.

And Jesus could forgive them also;
MAT 9:6 But that you may know that the Son of man has authority on earth to forgive sins" -- he then said to the paralytic -- "Rise, take up your bed and go home."

~This whole post is satire.

Please don't go post-al on me, with your 'non satire' answer for me asking a question;

Why did Jesus still have to die on the cross for the forgiveness of sins?

 

[Jack]

Please don't go post-al on me, with your 'non satire' answer for me asking a question;

Why did Jesus still have to die on the cross for the forgiveness of sins?

Leviticus 17:11 It is the blood that makes atonement for the soul.

 

[Hillsage]

Leviticus 17:11 It is the blood that makes atonement for the soul.

I am coming from the NT and the NEW COVENANT. You never dealt with my NT verses OR with the TEMPORAL vs ETERNAL forgiveness point I was addressing with them. Please do that, next time.

And as for your OT/old covenant scripture above. Read the verse IN CONTEXT as to who it even applied to.

LEV 17:10 "If any man of the house of Israel or of the strangers that sojourn among them eats any blood, I will set my face against that person who eats blood, and will cut him off from among his people.

I don't believe that old covenant verse applies to anyone today. Thank you Jesus.

HEB 9:12* and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, He entered the holy place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption.

Temporal atonement is all that the Old covenant ever gave "the house of Israel". That's why the house of Israel was to provide the blood of animals from one temporal year to the next.

All the while 'the chosen people' were really only "chosen" for one reason. They were to provide the soul and body bloodline line for the Messiah and the NEW COVENANT. And that gives us Jesus, whose death was for the ETERNAL consequence for sin. The life He LIVED gives us the pattern Son's method for never sinning. please.

@St. SteVen

 

[Jack]

I am coming from the NT and the NEW COVENANT. You never dealt with my NT verses OR with the TEMPORAL vs ETERNAL forgiveness point I was addressing with them. Please do that, next time.

And as for your OT/old covenant scripture above. Read the verse IN CONTEXT as to who it even applied to.

LEV 17:10 "If any man of the house of Israel or of the strangers that sojourn among them eats any blood, I will set my face against that person who eats blood, and will cut him off from among his people.

I don't believe that old covenant verse applies to anyone today. Thank you Jesus.

HEB 9:12* and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, He entered the holy place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption.

Temporal atonement is all that the Old covenant ever gave "the house of Israel". That's why the house of Israel was to provide the blood of animals from one temporal year to the next.

All the while 'the chosen people' were really only "chosen" for one reason. They were to provide the soul and body bloodline line for the Messiah and the NEW COVENANT. And that gives us Jesus, whose death was for the ETERNAL consequence for sin. The life He LIVED gives us the pattern Son's method for never sinning. please.

@St. SteVen

It's all about the Blood!

Matthew 26:28
28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

 

[MatthewG]

Very happy to know that.

You gotta go on not sinning, for what? For the 'eternal' consequence of sin, which was paid for by Jesus on the cross, for all?

Or do you have to 'not go on sinning', for the 'temporal' consequence of sin here and now? Sin where , as a believer, you will still 'reap what you sow' "on earth", on this side of glory.


If the baptism of John was for the forgiveness of sins;
MAR 1:4 John the Baptist appeared in the wilderness preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.

And Jesus could forgive them also;
MAT 9:6 But that you may know that the Son of man has authority on earth to forgive sins" -- he then said to the paralytic -- "Rise, take up your bed and go home."



Please don't go post-al on me, with your 'non satire' answer for me asking a question;

Why did Jesus still have to die on the cross for the forgiveness of sins?

I still sin. So... darn. The unforgiveable sin is unbelief, rejecting God, seeing God as evil etc..., denying the spirit of Christ as good. If I have faith to I still sin? Idk... They were all paid for... except one....

 

[Grailhunter]

A lot of people get confused about this.
The Bible tells of a transition from the Old Covenant to the New Covenant.

Some say that there was no salvation in the Old Covenant-Old Testament. And I have said that to but to be more accurate no one could achieve salvation in the Old Covenant.

No one could keep the Mosaic Law. With 613 Mosaic Laws no one could remain sinless. So Jews believed they received their blessing or their punishment in the physical world.

Those in the Old Covenant were not offered Heaven as a reward or Hell as a punishment.

In the Old Covenant sin separated them from Yahweh and it only took one sin. Sacrifices appeased Yahweh’s anger but did not forgive their sins. One of the reasons for the “escape goat” To appease Yahweh’s anger against the nation of Israel.

The definition of sin in the Old Covenant was a transgression against Yahweh. And Yahweh has zero tolerance for sin.

Yeshua’s death on the cross served as the perfect sacrifice. And that did a few things. Grace meant that Yahweh cannot see our sins. Our sins now are between us and Yeshua. The definition of sin in the New Covenant is a transgression against Yeshua and if you ask for forgiveness He is likely to forgive you. Likely? You cannot play Yeshua as a fool. He knows your intent. Yeshua's death on the cross was not to give us a license to sin

Yeshua’s death on the cross removed us from the system of sin and tally of the Old Covenant.

Because Yahweh cannot see our sins we can have a relationship with Yahweh. That is why the veil was torn in two in the temple when Yeshua died on the cross. Luke 23:45 We were no longer separated from Yahweh.

Essentially Yeshua’s death on the cross opened up the gates of Heaven as a reward and Hell as a punishment.

Faith in Yeshua becomes a spiritual conduit for salvation.

The Apostle Paul explained the concepts salvation…Substitution for sin….Redemption from sin…Reconciliation with Yahweh….Propitiation….Justification….Sanctifiction ….Adoption into the family of the Trinity.

 

[MatthewG]

A Reflection on Grace, Conviction, and the Journey of Faith


There is a newness of life available to all who are in Christ (not everyone is a believer 2 Thessalonians 3:2). As Scripture declares, “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come” (2 Corinthians 5:17). This transformation is not earned by moral perfection, but received through faith in Yeshua—the one whom God has sent (John 6:29). It is by His righteousness, not ours, that we are made right with God and become heirs with Him (Romans 8:17).


The Spirit of God now dwells within us, helping us overcome the flesh—not by striving, but by abiding. “Abide in Me, and I in you… for apart from Me you can do nothing” (John 15:4–5). True victory over sin comes not through self-effort, but through surrender to the love of Christ flowing through us.


God knows our hearts intimately. He sees when we harbor bitterness, when we wish harm upon others, or when we act out of pride or anger. Yet He does not condemn us—He invites us to come boldly before His throne of grace (Hebrews 4:16), to confess, to be cleansed, and to be renewed. “If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness” (1 John 1:9).


There are two commands that remain central: to believe in the One God has sent (John 6:29), and to love our neighbor as ourselves (1 John 4:7; Matthew 22:39). These are not burdens, but invitations into divine relationship and community.


I do not fixate on sin, nor do I preach condemnation. The Spirit convicts each person according to their walk. “Let each be fully convinced in his own mind” (Romans 14:5). We are not given a license to sin, nor are we called to judge without mercy. “Judgment without mercy will be shown to anyone who has not been merciful. Mercy triumphs over judgment” (James 2:13).


Some matters—like the use of THC for pain, drinking a beer, or even struggling with lust—are complex. Not all things are inherently sinful, but not all things are beneficial (1 Corinthians 10:23). Habitual indulgence, however, can enslave. Whether it be substance, hatred, or desire, we must not be mastered by anything. Instead, we go to the Master—Yeshua—and ask for help by the Spirit. “All things are lawful for me, but I will not be dominated by anything” (1 Corinthians 6:12).


God is not angry with you. He loves you deeply. He shows no favoritism (Romans 2:11), and He desires that all come to repentance (2 Peter 3:9). Beware of teachings that demand moral perfection as a condition for salvation. That is not the gospel—it is manipulation. Salvation is a gift, not a performance. “For by grace you have been saved through faith… not a result of works, so that no one may boast” (Ephesians 2:8–9).


So walk in grace. Be honest with Yahavah. Let the Spirit guide you. And remember: you are loved, you are known, and you are never alone.

 

[Jack]

So walk in grace. Be honest with Yahavah. Let the Spirit guide you. And remember: you are loved, you are known, and you are never alone.

Did you ever find "Yahavah" in the Bible? No?

 

[Dan Clarkston]

I don't believe that old covenant verse applies to anyone today. Thank you Jesus.

You believe wrong...

The Council of Jerusalem in Acts 15 we see how the Holy Spirit led the Apostles to conclude that gentile converts to Christianity were not obligated to keep most of the rules prescribed to the Jews by the Mosaic Law, such as Jewish dietary laws and the rules concerning circumcision of males. The Apostles were led by the Lord to retain the prohibitions on eating blood, meat containing blood, and meat of animals that were strangled, and on fornication and idolatry.

Under the New Covenant eating blood is sinful behavior... but let's not let what God says in His Word get in the way of what we believe b

 

[St. SteVen]

Under the New Covenant eating blood is sinful behavior... but let's not let what God says in His Word get in the way of what we believe b

It seems that the Apostles were in error.
One is either under the law or they are not.

Galatians 3:23-25 NIV
Before the coming of this faith,[a] we were held in custody under the law,
locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed.
24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith.
25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

[ cc: @Hillsage

 

[Dan Clarkston]

It seems that the Apostles were in error.

OK so this is in God's Word having been inspired by the Holy Spirit to be put in to God's Word.

What you are actually saying is that.... the Lord is in error.

What you do not realize is under the New Covenant we are under the Law of Christ which includes God's moral law
Jesus is the High Priest over the New Covenant and HE decided that God's moral law is included under the New Covenant as God's moral law was in place long before the levitical law was ever given thru Moses

Those being led by the Holy Spirit will not engage in eating blood, meat containing blood, and meat of animals that were strangled, and on fornication and idolatry. The Council of Jerusalem in Acts 15 was led by the Lord and is under the Law of Christ.

If you are going to claim it's OK to eat blood, then you also concede that you believe fornication and idolatry are not sins either.

 

[Jack]

OK so this is in God's Word having been inspired by the Holy Spirit to be put in to God's Word.

What you are actually saying is that.... the Lord is in error.

That's stevie alright!

What you do not realize is under the New Covenant we are under the Law of Christ which includes God's moral law
Jesus is the High Priest over the New Covenant and HE decided that God's moral law is included under the New Covenant as God's moral law was in place long before the levitical law was ever given thru Moses

Those being led by the Holy Spirit will not engage in eating blood, meat containing blood, and meat of animals that were strangled, and on fornication and idolatry. The Council of Jerusalem in Acts 15 was led by the Lord and is under the Law of Christ.

If you are going to claim it's OK to eat blood, then you also concede that you believe fornication and idolatry are not sins either.

 

[Jack]

It seems that the Apostles were in error.

Nothing new. The Bible nearly always seems to be errors to you stevie.

One is either under the law or they are not.

Galatians 3:23-25 NIV
Before the coming of this faith,[a] we were held in custody under the law,
locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed.
24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith.
25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

[ cc: @Hillsage