I will raise them on the last day.
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Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
“Pitiful” doesn’t quite describe him....”pathetic” might be a better word. Like Adam he knows that there is no way for him to avoid the punishment that God has told him is coming.
The demons pleaded with Jesus not to send them away into the abyss....so they know what’s coming.....imagine living on death row...? What a waste of life....and by your own choice.
Makes us wonder what on earth they were thinking when they joined satan in rebellion....?
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soberxp
Well-Known Member
Jealousy, anger, pride, ignorance, and greed can all lead to rebellion.
I still feel sorry for him, because he was made to be cunning, which made him such a character, so go back to the furnace and remake it again.
Dave Watchman
Active Member
Sorry Marty, this is only addressing those who eat His flesh and drink His Blood. Jesus was speaking of a Salvific "last day".
This "last day" = the "last day" of Salvation.
This "last day" is a specific "last day". This "last day" is not the last day of the tribulation. This "last day" is not the last day of the world. This "last day" is not the day that the elements will burn with fervent heat.
None of this will harmonize with what the Amils, or the Dispensationals believe. Some Christians think there will be a mixture of translated Saints, and flesh and blood humans who survive the tribulation and repopulate the 1000 year millennium. Because there're mixing up, and attempting to blend the Old Testament end times with Daniel and Revelation.
When Jesus appears again, all of His People from all of earth's history are raised up on the "last day" for salvation. That's it. After that "last day", there's not other day for a resurrection to life, only a resurrection to death after the thousand years are finished. Those who are alive but not saved when Jesus appears, are killed. And the birds gorge themselves with their flesh.
Then we go back with Jesus to assist in the sorting out of the dead for a thousand years at Jesus' Father's House.
Or did you not hear that the Saints will judge the dead?
"Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if the world is to be judged by you, are you incompetent to try trivial cases?
When Jesus comes back it's going to be like the Old Bar Tender says at closing time: "you might not have to go Home, but you can't stay here".
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
YES, i know the difference between soul and spirit.
Solomon went out to search the things that pertain to this earthly life and he was limited in knowledge and understanding concerning the spirit realm.
GOOD NEWS = the LORD Jesus Christ = "a GREATER then Solomon is Here"
Listen to the Master and your Creator who says: "the rich man died and now is in torment cried out "father Abraham........"
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
YES, and this is just the Beginning of MORE to Come = 1 John 3:1-3
Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not. 2Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 3And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
JESUS asks us: "How long is your life?" "It is a vapor that appears for a moment and then is gone(physical on earth life)"
Hebrews 12:1-2
Therefore we also, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which so easily ensnares us, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us,
looking unto Jesus, the Author and Finisher of our faith, who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
How the Gospel is applied here and now in our hearts is to prepare us for the NEXT LEVEL of LIGHT = 1 John 3:1-3
1Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not. 2Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 3And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
Here is how we know Rev ch 19 is literal
a.) Gospel = Matt 13:36-43
Then Jesus sent the multitude away and went into the house. And His disciples came to Him, saying, “Explain to us the parable of the tares of the field.”
37He answered and said to them: “He who sows the good seed is the Son of Man. 38The field is the world, the good seeds are the sons of the kingdom, but the tares are the sons of the wicked one. 39The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels. 40Therefore as the tares are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age. 41The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice lawlessness, 42and will cast them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth. 43Then the righteous will shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears to hear, let him hear!
b.) 2 Thess 2:5-12
5Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
Satan is not pathetic! But his hope to dethrone God is!!!
Be careful - Jude 1:8-10
Likewise also these dreamers defile the flesh, reject authority, and speak evil of dignitaries.
Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses,
dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”
But these speak evil of whatever they do not know; and whatever they know naturally, like brute beasts, in these things they corrupt themselves.
Speculation doesn't cut it. So what Scriptures prove what you are alleging?
There cannot be a mark in the meantime nor in the past until all of the following is fulfilled first.
Revelation 13:1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed : and all the world wondered after the beast.
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months
Revelation 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth ; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads :
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Do you see all those pronouns in verses 11-17? Who do you think they are meaning? This mark in question is clearly involving worshiping the beast which had the wound by a sword, and did live. One is to believe that this was also the status of the beast throughout it's existence---one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed? Obviously, the deadly wound comes first, then later comes his deadly wound was healed. Obviously, before the time of his deadly wound, and before it is healed, none of the following was already true in the meantime, meaning verses 11-17. Since those verses are involving a beast where one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed.
So, once again, where are your Scriptures, not speculation instead, that prove this same mark of the beast was also in the past? Unless you can provide proof from Scriptures themselves, spare us the speculating of things in the meantime. I don't deny that the beast also existed in the past. But when it did, it obviously didn't initially have a deadly wound. Yet, then eventually it does have a deadly wound. Then eventually that deadly wound is healed, thus Revelation 13 and it's 42 month reign.
Yet, I do deny that a false prophet existed in the past. The false prophet doesn't even come from the same place the beast comes from. It is never said of the false prophet to have had a deadly wound that was healed. It is never said of the false prophet that it is in the pit then ascends out of the pit. The point being. Without the false prophet there can't be this mark in the meantime, unless you are having a hard time comprehending what verses 14-17 are telling us.
Scripture itself places the mark after the beast’s deadly wound is healed and through the actions of the second beast. Therefore, any claim that the mark already existed in the past must first demonstrate from Scripture that both these conditions were met---otherwise, it’s mere speculation
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How does that prove a literal revelation chapter 19?
Matthew 13 is the end of the world in revelation 20
I'm sure that we have gone over this a few times in the past I have provided my view many times
The past saints rose when Jesus died
Matthew 27
51 At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split 52 and the tombs broke open. The bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. 53 They came out of the tombs after Jesus’ resurrection and[e] went into the holy city and appeared to many people.
Thanks for your reply
Our salvation isn't based off of passing a test its based on what Jesus did for us. Our obedience to Jesus is what proves our salvation.
Where do you see in the bible that Armageddon is the war to end all wars? Battles happen after the events of Revelation chapter 16.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Passing a test is what God instituted for man at the very beginning of his existence. The purpose of the two trees in Eden, constituted a test of their obedience. Eating the fruit of one would lead to death, but the other to life. Free will was a gift, but the abuse of it had consequences. They were free to choose their actions, but not free of the results of those actions. Free will had to have limits and God made sure that there was a safety net.
Have you never asked why satan was even there in the garden? What prompted him to plot a takeover of the human race with his own abuse of free will?
Why did God allow the rebels to live? Why did he not just eliminate them and start fresh with another pair of perfect humans?
Does the Bible answer those questions? Yes, it does....but what are your own conclusions about those things? The answers are important if we are to have the big picture.
What is the purpose of Armageddon? What exactly is it that takes place there?
The “battle of Har–Magedon” is the future earth-wide battle in which God’s appointed King, Jesus Christ, will destroy God’s enemies. Among these enemies are “the kings of the entire inhabited earth”, who are mobilized by “expressions inspired by demons” and are gathered together “to the war of the great day of God the Almighty . . . to the place that is called in Hebrew Har–Magedon.” (Rev 16:14, 16) Human armies mobilized against the angelic forces of Jesus Christ....like ants on a railway track trying to stop a locomotive from squashing them out of existence....
The “place” where this war is fought, is not literal...for several reasons.
The name Har–Magedon, rendered “Armageddon” in some Bible translations, means “Mountain of Megiddo”.....There has never been a literal mountain that bears that name.
Furthermore, “the kings of the earth and their armies” could not literally gather in one place, except representatively.
“The place” must therefore refer to the condition or world situation into which earth’s political rulers and their supporters are led—one of opposition to the true God and to his “armies that were in heaven” under the military command of the “King of kings and Lord of lords,” Jesus Christ. (Rev 19:14, 16)
This is a battle fought on earth, but between the forces of evil under the devil’s control (both human and demonic) and the angelic forces under Christ. This is “the war of the great day of God the Almighty”.
No Christian will be fighting this war....the words of Jahaziel, when Israel were threatened by the massive Assyrian army coming against them will prove true again.....“Ye shall not need to fight in this battle: set yourselves, stand ye still, and see the salvation of Jehovah with you”. (2 Chron 20:17 ASV)
Similarly, at Isa 26:20, God says of that coming time: “Go, My people, come into your chambers and close your door about you; hide for but a moment, until the wrath passes.”
Zephaniah also urges his people.....“before the decree bring forth, before the day pass as the chaff, before the fierce anger of Jehovah come upon you, before the day of Jehovah’s anger come upon you. Seek ye Jehovah, all ye meek of the earth, that have kept his ordinances; seek righteousness, seek meekness: it may be ye will be hid in the day of Jehovah’s anger.” (ASV)
There is only one “day of Jehovah’s anger”....one that has been brewing since the rebellion in Eden.
The connection to the ancient Israelite city of Megiddo becomes obvious with a little research.
Strategically located to the east of Mount Carmel, Megiddo dominated major trade and military routes of the day. It was also the site of decisive battles. By linking Megiddo to God’s coming war, the Bible assures us that God, through his Son, will completely conquer all opposing forces.
The “war of Har–Magedon” will rid the earth of all corruption and wickedness. It will open the way for the most glorious era in all human history. (Rev 21:1-4) Under the loving oversight of God’s Kingdom, the earth will be transformed into a paradise in which righteous ones, (Armageddon survivors as well as all the resurrected dead) will live forever. It will be a complete restoration of God’s original purpose for the earth and mankind upon it. (Psalm 37:29; Isa 55:11)
This is what makes logical sense to me...the big picture has never changed.
God had it all sorted back in the garden. Genesis is where it started...Revelation is where it ends for the sinful human race under satan’s rulership. (1 John 5:19)
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Actually satan is self made.....he was created perfect, just like all his brother angels...but he chose to abuse his free will and he wanted to take advantage of these lower, less powerful beings to make himself a god and to hijack their worship for himself. He was the one who wanted “to be like God”.
Satan wasn’t a literal snake, but used one as a disguise to tempt the woman so that she in turn would be bait for the man, who was his real target. Had the devil approached Adam first, I believe the outcome would have been very different. Why do you think that sin came into the world through the man and not the woman? (1 Tim 2:13-14; Rom 5:12) What if Adam had refused to join her?
Don’t waste your pity on this wilful defector. As God will not waste his pity on him or those who have been led down the dark path he created, not only for humankind, but for the multitude of angels that he managed to sway to his side of the issue.
This is the broad base of the lesson we have all been subjected to.....this is where disobedience leads. Would we ever want to go here again? Been there...done that...never going there again!!!
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
Genesis is the Foundation for a literal 1,000 years.
Revelation ch20 confirms Genesis ch5
soberxp
Well-Known Member
Is it like the case of Korah's rebellion? However, I always think this is a story made up by Catholicism. Satan is a serpent, a cunning serpent—he was created cunning, not self-formed. If he had truly created cunning by himself, he would indeed possess a degree of power As God. Yet I have never believed this argument.
I hold that in the Bible, when Lucifer is metaphorically referred to as the cherub who guarded the Ark of the Covenant, it is speaking of the importance of marriage, and the interdependent relationship between family and the nation. A ruler who cannot guard family well cannot guard his nation well either; similarly, one who cannot guard his nation well cannot guard family well. This is a perspective in Chinese culture—though the wording may differ, the meaning is the same. Therefore, I do not believe that passage of Scripture describes a real angelic rebellion or anything of that kind.
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