1 Thessalonians 5:2-3 is not talking about world peace and safety

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Douggg

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2020
5,490
439
83
77
Memphis
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Douggg, will you stop the nonsense in your posts which are not Biblical. Your above quoted example demonstrates your nonsense where your understanding of the Scriptures is very suspect.

The Hebrew root word H:1755 has the meaning of age, generation and both English words have been used when translating Hebrew words that have the root word H:1755 embedded within the variations of the Root word.

Your reliance upon the modern meaning of English words is your downfall.
Jay, quote the chapter and verse in the bible that have the terms "fifth age", "third age", in them.
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
9,365
3,484
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
Jay, quote the chapter and verse in the bible that have the terms "fifth age", "third age", in them.

Douggg can you quote the passage where Satan is cast into the Lake of fire 1,000 years after the Beast and the False Prophet were cast in the Bottomless Pit. You have arrived at this understanding through your logic and understanding of the scriptures. Your logic has added another 1,000 years to God's timeline as to when the Final Judgement will occur.

You have also forgotten to apply Isaiah 24:21-22 to your understanding of the End Times. It tells us that the Heavenly hosts, i.e. Satan, the Beast(s) and the Little Horn as well as the judged kings of the earth all entered the Bottomless Pit at the same time to wait for many days the time of their punishment.

Douggg how long was God's Sabbath day of rest? Was it seven 24 hr days or was it a generation/age that was 1,024 years in duration? Scripture is not clear on how long God's Sabbath Day of Rest was, but the story line in Genesis suggests that it was around 1,024 years in duration. But you need ears to hear and eyes to see that this is so.

Dougggg are your assumptions based on God's truth or is it simple the workings of your mind?
 

Douggg

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2020
5,490
439
83
77
Memphis
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Douggg can you quote the passage where Satan is cast into the Lake of fire 1,000 years after the Beast and the False Prophet were cast in the Bottomless Pit. You have arrived at this understanding through your logic and understanding of the scriptures. Your logic has added another 1,000 years to God's timeline as to when the Final Judgement will occur.

You have also forgotten to apply Isaiah 24:21-22 to your understanding of the End Times. It tells us that the Heavenly hosts, i.e. Satan, the Beast(s) and the Little Horn as well as the judged kings of the earth all entered the Bottomless Pit at the same time to wait for many days the time of their punishment.

Douggg how long was God's Sabbath day of rest? Was it seven 24 hr days or was it a generation/age that was 1,024 years in duration? Scripture is not clear on how long God's Sabbath Day of Rest was, but the story line in Genesis suggests that it was around 1,024 years in duration. But you need ears to hear and eyes to see that this is so.

Dougggg are your assumptions based on God's truth or is it simple the workings of your mind?
Jay, if you cannot answer "quote the chapter and verse in the bible that have the terms "fifth age", "third age", in them."...
then just say - no, I can't.
 

Spiritual Israelite

Well-Known Member
Apr 13, 2022
16,902
6,853
113
Midwest
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Spiritual Israel, it seems to me that it is you who is very confused.
You come across as VERY confused in every post you make. I'm not confused at all. I'm not the one who said that a season is 1,000 years, which is utterly ridiculous. You have no scriptural support for that opinion just as you have no scriptural support for any of your opinions.

I have been consistent over the years, that I have been on this forum, that a season has a duration of 1,000 years and that the little while period/time has a duration of 24 years.
Where do you get that from besides your imagination?

Now there will be seven ages before the start of the Age of Eternity.
Where do you get this from? You need to get your beliefs from scripture, not your imagination. Your beliefs are foolish.
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
9,365
3,484
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
You come across as VERY confused in every post you make. I'm not confused at all. I'm not the one who said that a season is 1,000 years, which is utterly ridiculous. You have no scriptural support for that opinion just as you have no scriptural support for any of your opinions.

Daniel 7:12: - 12As for the rest of the beasts, their dominion was removed, but they were granted an extension of life for a season and a time.

Revelation 20:1-3: -
1 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, having the key to the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. 2 He laid hold of the dragon, that serpent of old, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; 3 and he cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal on him, so that he should deceive the nations no more till the thousand years were finished. But after these things he must be released for a little while.

Can you join the dots now?

Where do you get that from besides your imagination?

Where do you get this from? You need to get your beliefs from scripture, not your imagination. Your beliefs are foolish.

Personal attack of a person is a last resort false argument.
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
9,365
3,484
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
Jay, if you cannot answer "quote the chapter and verse in the bible that have the terms "fifth age", "third age", in them."...
then just say - no, I can't.

I already did quote the scriptures which tells us that there is no additional 1000 years period where Satan is then locked up in the Bottomless Pit after the beast and the False prophet are dispatched into the Lake of Fire.

When you can provide Biblical evidence to support your claims then I will answer your question.
 

Douggg

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2020
5,490
439
83
77
Memphis
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Douggg can you quote the passage where Satan is cast into the Lake of fire 1,000 years after the Beast and the False Prophet were cast in the Bottomless Pit
The beast and the false prophet will not be not cast into the Bottomless Pit. They will be cast into the lake of fire.

Here are the verses...

Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

then...

Revelation 20
:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit,
and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

then, after the thousand years are expired....

Revelation 20:7
And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

then, after Satan's final deception of the nations....

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
 

Douggg

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2020
5,490
439
83
77
Memphis
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
You have also forgotten to apply Isaiah 24:21-22 to your understanding of the End Times. It tells us that the Heavenly hosts, i.e. Satan, the Beast(s) and the Little Horn as well as the judged kings of the earth all entered the Bottomless Pit at the same time to wait for many days the time of their punishment.
The text does not say "bottomless" pit in Isaiah 24:21-22. The pit in those verses is referring to "hell".

Since the preceding verses of Isaiah 24:19-20 is about the destruction of this current earth, which will take place in Revelation 20:11, the pit in Isaiah 24:21-22 is referring to hell. hell being referred to in Isaiah 24:22 as a prison that there is no escape.

At the time of the Great White Throne judgment in Revelation 20:11-15, hell will deliver up it's dead it says in the text of Revelation 20:13.

Revelation 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

So, the fallen angels and the wicked kings of the earth at the Great White Throne judgement will be cast into the lake of fire.

hell, the prison, itself, will be cast into the lake of fire as well.

Revelation 20:
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
 

Douggg

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2020
5,490
439
83
77
Memphis
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
I already did quote the scriptures which tells us that there is no additional 1000 years period where Satan is then locked up in the Bottomless Pit after the beast and the False prophet are dispatched into the Lake of Fire.
What post of yours ?

Also, you have yet to admit that the terms "third age", "fifth age", etc are not terms found in the bible.
 

Davidpt

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2023
2,512
797
113
68
East Texas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Douggg can you quote the passage where Satan is cast into the Lake of fire 1,000 years after the Beast and the False Prophet were cast in the Bottomless Pit. You have arrived at this understanding through your logic and understanding of the scriptures. Your logic has added another 1,000 years to God's timeline as to when the Final Judgement will occur.

You have also forgotten to apply Isaiah 24:21-22 to your understanding of the End Times. It tells us that the Heavenly hosts, i.e. Satan, the Beast(s) and the Little Horn as well as the judged kings of the earth all entered the Bottomless Pit at the same time to wait for many days the time of their punishment.

Douggg how long was God's Sabbath day of rest? Was it seven 24 hr days or was it a generation/age that was 1,024 years in duration? Scripture is not clear on how long God's Sabbath Day of Rest was, but the story line in Genesis suggests that it was around 1,024 years in duration. But you need ears to hear and eyes to see that this is so.

Dougggg are your assumptions based on God's truth or is it simple the workings of your mind?

If Revelation 19 records that the beast and false prophet are cast into the LOF at that time, why then do you have both of them being cast into the bottomless pit instead?

Isaiah 24:21 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall punish the host of the high ones that are on high, and the kings of the earth upon the earth.
22 And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited.


How can verse 22 be including the beast and false prophet being gathered together with them, and they too being gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited, when Revelation 19:20 proves otherwise?

Revelation 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.
 

Davidpt

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2023
2,512
797
113
68
East Texas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The text does not say "bottomless" pit in Isaiah 24:21-22. The pit in those verses is referring to "hell".

That sounds like something an Amil would argue, that since Isaiah 24 doesn't mention the bottomless pit, therefore, the bottomless pit can't be meant. Yet Revelation 20 mentions the bottomless pit. It's called interpreting Scripture with Scripture. You might argue that Revelation 20 only records satan being cast into the pit, and not anyone else as well. Except this ignores what it means to be visited.

Some examples of being visited.

Ezekiel 38:8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land [that is] brought back from the sword, [and is] gathered out of many people, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste: but it is brought forth out of the nations, and they shall dwell1 safely all of them.

Luke 19:44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.


As can be seen, it has zero to do with something such as the great white throne judgment.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jay Ross

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
9,365
3,484
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
The beast and the false prophet will not be not cast into the Bottomless Pit. They will be cast into the lake of fire.

Thanks for your catch on my slip up. I have now gone back and corrected my error.

Here are the verses...

Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

then...

Revelation 20
:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit,
and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

Douggg you are ignoring Isaiah 24L21-22 which explicitly tells us that Satan, the best, the Little Horn and the Kings of the earth are all judged at the same time, and they are collected together to be imprisoned for many days to await the time of their punishment.

So in Revelation 20:1-3 we are told that Satan is bound and imprisoned in the Bottomless pit, which incidentally we are also told in Isaiah 24:21-22 where we are told that all of the judged entities are imprisoned in the pit at the same time.

Then at the beginning of the little while the Bottomless Pit is unlocked the beast and the Little Hor/False Prophet the kings of the earth and Satan all come out of the pit/the abyss and initially the Beast and the Little Horn are captured at the end of the Little While Period by Christ and dispatched into the Bottomless pi after which Satan is then captured and also dispatched into the Lake of Fire.

Now The Book of Revelation jumps back and forth in its explanation of what will happen during the End Times. and Rev 20 does not follow chronologically Revelation 19 as you are insisting. A plain reading of the Book of revelations would not agree with you in any way shape or form.

then, after the thousand years are expired....

Revelation 20:7
And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

then, after Satan's final deception of the nations....

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

In Rev 17: 8: - 8The beast that you saw—it was, and now is no more, but is about to come up out of the Abyss and go to its destruction. And those who dwell on the earth whose names were not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world will marvel when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet will be

Isaiah 24:21-22 tells us when this will happen.

Douggg,

Goodbye
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
9,365
3,484
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
The text does not say "bottomless" pit in Isaiah 24:21-22. The pit in those verses is referring to "hell".

Since the preceding verses of Isaiah 24:19-20 is about the destruction of this current earth, which will take place in Revelation 20:11, the pit in Isaiah 24:21-22 is referring to hell. hell being referred to in Isaiah 24:22 as a prison that there is no escape.

At the time of the Great White Throne judgment in Revelation 20:11-15, hell will deliver up it's dead it says in the text of Revelation 20:13.

Revelation 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

So, the fallen angels and the wicked kings of the earth at the Great White Throne judgement will be cast into the lake of fire.

hell, the prison, itself, will be cast into the lake of fire as well.

Revelation 20:
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

You know that your post basically agrees with what I have posted.
Fancy that.

Goodbye
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
9,365
3,484
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
What post of yours ?

Also, you have yet to admit that the terms "third age", "fifth age", etc are not terms found in the bible.

Douggg what is the point of giving you scripture verses because, I have quoted Biblical verses and you deny what they are telling us because you have explained away what I have provided by your fanciful explanations which history readily supports.

Goodbye
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
9,365
3,484
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
If Revelation 19 records that the beast and false prophet are cast into the LOF at that time, why then do you have both of them being cast into the bottomless pit instead?

Isaiah 24:21 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall punish the host of the high ones that are on high, and the kings of the earth upon the earth.
22 And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited.


How can verse 22 be including the beast and false prophet being gathered together with them, and they too being gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited, when Revelation 19:20 proves otherwise?

Revelation 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Do I really have to start with the basics that the four winds of heaven are the beasts controlling manifestation of themselves in the sea that they stir up to do their biddings.

Perhaps you should consider checking and reviewing the interlinear of the Hebrew and Greek text to see if you too actually agree with the particular translations that you are quoting.


Shalom
 

Douggg

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2020
5,490
439
83
77
Memphis
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Douggg what is the point of giving you scripture verses because, I have quoted Biblical verses
Jay, you have not quoted any Bible verses that have the words "third age", fifth age", in the text.

Jay, what is your source of those terms ? Are you basing those on some individual's or group's teachings ? If so, who ?

A search for the words "third age" in the kjv gives this result.

same for "fifth age"...
 
Last edited:

Douggg

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2020
5,490
439
83
77
Memphis
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Then at the beginning of the little while the Bottomless Pit is unlocked the beast and the Little Hor/False Prophet the kings of the earth and Satan all come out of the pit/the abyss and initially the Beast and the Little Horn are captured at the end of the Little While Period by Christ and dispatched into the Bottomless pi after which Satan is then captured and also dispatched into the Lake of Fire.
Jay, no-one comes out of the bottomless pit prison for the little season (Revelation 20:3), but Satan.

Revelation 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
9,365
3,484
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
Jay, you have not quoted any Bible verses that have the words "third age", fifth age", in the text.

Jay, what is your source of those terms ? Are you basing those on some individual's or group's teachings ? If so, who ?

A search for the words "third age" in the kjv gives this result.

same for "fifth age"...

Douggg, it is sad that you have used just one translation, i.e. the KJV, to search for the word "AGE" when you should be searching the Hebrew text for Hebrew words that when translated have the meaning of "age" or "generation." The same is true when searching the Greek texts as well.

If the contextual; accuracy of our translations bears no relationship to the context of the original language that our translations contain, then our translation are misleading.

Now the "Day of the Lord," "this 'generation'" and an "age" Biblically all have the same duration of 1,025 solar years.

However, your misunderstanding of Biblical concepts is showing when you demand a particular word be found anywhere else in scripture. This is really only false reasoning on your part when the various translations do not always agree on the words that should ne used.

Goodbye
 

Jay Ross

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2011
9,365
3,484
113
QLD
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
Jay, no-one comes out of the bottomless pit prison for the little season (Revelation 20:3), but Satan.

Revelation 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

Douggg, the above is simply just your flawed reasoning.

You have ring fenced Rev 20:1-3, 7-10 and ignored other scriptural passages which provide more information associated with the event taking place in the End Times.

People have given up in trying to correct your false understandings.
 

Douggg

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2020
5,490
439
83
77
Memphis
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
However, your misunderstanding of Biblical concepts is showing when you demand a particular word be found anywhere else in scripture.
Jay, what is your definition for each of these age terms you have created....
first age ?
second age ?
third age ?
fourth age ?
fifth age?
sixth age?
seventh age?