IF YOU THINK YOU HAVE TO KEEP THE SABBATH THEN CONSIDER THIS

[HealthyShape]

It is a mistake. One you just made.

It takes a lot of effort for you and those who hold your errant opinion and whom Jesus tells us,shall be called the least in Heaven ,for trying repeatedly to lead Christians from respect for and obedience to the laws of God.

It takes great effort on your part as well to personally ignore the scriptural fact that Jesus showed the people how to keep the Sabbath,and after his ascension,his Apostles kept the Sabbath as Jesus taught.

Great effort? Just quoting some few verses from the Old Testament and from the New Testament. Very little effort.

How exactly did Jesus show the people how to keep the Sabbath? Be specific. Because if something, gospels are full of records that He did not keep it.

 

[HealthyShape]

I have expressed it all along you claim Jesus destroyed the temple. Here is what I am asking for.............what scripture says Jesus destroyd the temple or Jesus said he would destroy the temple.

I gave you all the verses that are enough. I also gave you the testimonies of the Church.

So, it seems to me you have an issue with some logical steps:

Do you believe that the judgement of Israel/Jerusalem/Temple came from God?

Do you believe that Jesus is God?

 

[Soyeong]

Great effort? Just quoting some few verses from the Old Testament and from the New Testament. Very little effort.

How exactly did Jesus show the people how to keep the Sabbath? Be specific. Because if something, gospels are full of records that He did not keep it.

It is by the Law of Moses that we have knowledge of what sin is (Romans 3:20) and it commands to keep the Sabbath holy (Exodus 20:8-11), so the position that Jesus did not keep it holy means that he sinned and is therefore not out Savior while the position that Jesus was sinless means that he set a perfect example for us to follow of how to keep the Sabbath holy. It is contradictory to think that Jesus was correct about it being lawful to heal on the Sabbath and that Pharisees were correct about Jesus breaking the Sabbath by healing on it. It is lawful to heal on the Sabbath, so those Pharisees were incorrect.

 

[Button]

Great effort? Just quoting some few verses from the Old Testament and from the New Testament. Very little effort.

How exactly did Jesus show the people how to keep the Sabbath? Be specific. Because if something, gospels are full of records that He did not keep it.

"Because if something, gospels are full of records that He did not keep it."
That's not true.

And my posting passages from Scripture so to address a specific point should suffice for those who read the Bible. And know the passages and the context.

 

[HealthyShape]

"Because if something, gospels are full of records that He did not keep it."
That's not true.

Just read the New Testament. Whenever Sabbath is discussed, it is always associated with some conflict because Jesus did not observe it.

And my posting passages from Scripture so to address a specific point should suffice for those who read the Bible. And know the passages and the context.

I have no idea what answer is this. What exactly are we supposed to do and not to do on Sabbath, in our countries and in the modern era? Quote the commanded and forbidden things, explicitly. No guesses.

 

[HealthyShape]

It is by the Law of Moses that we have knowledge of what sin is (Romans 3:20)

In our era, it is conscience and/or the Holy Spirit.

and it commands to keep the Sabbath holy (Exodus 20:8-11)

It commands hundreds of things and none are commanded to us today, because the Law of Moses is not for us.

the position that Jesus did not keep it holy means that he sinned

Unless
1. He lived in the era in which the Law was already being set aside (as explicitly mentioned several times in the New Testament)
2. He was God and so greater than the temple and than the priests and so excluded from observing the Sabbath (as He argued so several times) and with authority to dismiss or add anything He wanted (as He did with divorce, with hating the enemies, with unclean things, with talking to Samaritans etc.)

he set a perfect example for us to follow of how to keep the Sabbath holy.

I do not know why you still claim this. There is no example for us how to keep the Sabbath, that is why you have no specific answers for me regarding any details. Just some vague guesses.

so those Pharisees were incorrect.

Jesus said to His contemporaries to obey Pharisees, because they sat in the seat of authority of Moses. So, this theory will not get you anywhere. Jesus criticized Pharisees for being hypocrites and for being evil in their hearts, He did not reject their official religious authority.

 

[Button]

Just read the New Testament. Whenever Sabbath is discussed, it is always associated with some conflict because Jesus did not observe it.

The mistake you made there is telling me to read what you clearly have not.
I have to say,those who appear to join these type forums just to inject Bolderdash into discussions related to the Bible and the teachings of Jesus are obviously not just pathetic. They're lazy too.

They don't respect the Bible. Which is why they do this. However,that disrespect appears so entrenched as to preclude them from even doing ankeyword search for any one topic in Hermeneutics.

When they lie about Jesus and his observation of Sabbath as he taught and exampled it, they show their hand.
The left one.
For example:

I have no idea what answer is this. What exactly are we supposed to do and not to do on Sabbath, in our countries and in the modern era? Quote the commanded and forbidden things, explicitly. No guesses.

See?

 

[HealthyShape]

The mistake you made there is telling me to read what you clearly have not.
I have to say,those who appear to join these type forums just to inject Bolderdash into discussions related to the Bible and the teachings of Jesus are obviously not just pathetic. They're lazy too.

They don't respect the Bible. Which is why they do this. However,that disrespect appears so entrenched as to preclude them from even doing ankeyword search for any one topic in Hermeneutics.

When they lie about Jesus and his observation of Sabbath as he taught and exampled it, they show their hand.
The left one.
For example:

See?

A completely useless post. You just went on some kind of a religious rant, but there is nothing answerable or actionable in it.

 

[FaithWillDo]

Here is something to consider if you think you are commanded to keep the sabbath.
[Exodus 20:8 KJV] "Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy."
[Exodus 20:9 KJV] "Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:"
[Exodus 20:10 KJV] "But the seventh day [is] the sabbath of the LORD thy God: [in it] thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that [is] within thy gates:"...............Outside of emergencies do you refrain from any form of labor? Outside of emergencies do you rely on someone laboring to meet your needs? You do realize that verse 10 says you don't make servants work either. I guess you can claim to keep the ten commandments if you revise and spiritualize them so you can declare you do.

Doug,
The law of keeping the Sabbath Day has NOT been abolished. However, many believers have a very mistaken understanding of how converted believers keep the Sabbath Day.

I'll explain:

For a person to be acceptable to God, we must trust in Him to direct our lives and the paths that we take. This mindset is called FAITH.

David was acceptable to God because of his great faith - even though he still sinned in other areas.

The physical keeping of the Sabbath Day foreshadowed the faith that God would give to all mankind via the Holy Spirit under the New Covenant. Under the New Covenant, the Sabbath Day law is fulfilled when a believer is baptized by the Holy Spirit and begins walking by faith. This is accomplished by Christ's work of "conversion". Conversion occurs when Christ gives a person the Early and Latter Rains of the Holy Spirit, followed by His judgment. For converted believers, having faith and walking by that faith happens automatically and requires no work from themselves to follow the law. Why? Because the Holy Spirit within them does all the work.

Phil 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

In this way, a converted believer keeps the Sabbath Day law. The physical keeping of the Sabbath by observing one day a week is then no longer required because a converted believer will rest from their work 24/7.

Because this is how a converted believer keeps the Sabbath Day, Paul said this:

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves (referring to their faith): it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

And this:

Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works (24/7), as God did from his (on the 7th day).

Joe

 

[Soyeong]

Doug,
The law of keeping the Sabbath Day has NOT been abolished. However, many believers have a very mistaken understanding of how converted believers keep the Sabbath Day.

I'll explain:

For a person to be acceptable to God, we must trust in Him to direct our lives and the paths that we take. This mindset is called FAITH.

David was acceptable to God because of his great faith - even though he still sinned in other areas.

The physical keeping of the Sabbath Day foreshadowed the faith that God would give to all mankind via the Holy Spirit under the New Covenant. Under the New Covenant, the Sabbath Day law is fulfilled when a believer is baptized by the Holy Spirit and begins walking by faith. This is accomplished by Christ's work of "conversion". Conversion occurs when Christ gives a person the Early and Latter Rains of the Holy Spirit, followed by His judgment. For converted believers, having faith and walking by that faith happens automatically and requires no work from themselves to follow the law. Why? Because the Holy Spirit within them does all the work.

Phil 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

In this way, a converted believer keeps the Sabbath Day law. The physical keeping of the Sabbath by observing one day a week is then no longer required because a converted believer will rest from their work 24/7.

Because this is how a converted believer keeps the Sabbath Day, Paul said this:

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves (referring to their faith): it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

And this:

Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works (24/7), as God did from his (on the 7th day).

Joe

God is trustworthy, therefore His instructions are also trustworthy (Psalm 19:7), so the way to trust in God is by obediently trusting in His instructions and it would be contradictory for someone to think that we should trust in God but not in His instructions. So the positions that God should not be trusted when it comes to keeping the 7th day holy is the opposite of trusting in God. The Spirit has has the role of leading us in truth (John 16:13), the Spirit has the role of leading us to bey God's instructions (Ezekiel 36:26-27), and God's instructions are truth (Psalm 119:142), but the Spirit does not have the role of leading us away from obeying what God has instructed. The New Covenant does not involve rejecting God's instructions, but rather it involves God putting them in our minds and writing them on our hearts (Jeremiah 31:33).

If we did on every day what God wants us to do on the Sabbath, then we would do no work, but God also wants us to work on the other six days. In Hebrews 3:18, they did not enter into God's rest because of their disobedience, and in Ezekiel 20:13, it specifically mentions that they greatly profaned God's Sabbaths, so someone should not think that they can enter into God's rest while having the same disobedience that prevented the Israelites from entering into God's rest. In Hebrews 4:9-11, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God, we should rest from our work as God rested from His work, and we should be careful to enter into that rest so that no one might fall away by the same sort of disobedience, so we should continue follow Christ's example of keeping the 7th day holy.

 

[Button]

God is trustworthy, therefore His instructions are also trustworthy (Psalm 19:7), so the way to trust in God is by obediently trusting in His instructions and it would be contradictory for someone to think that we should trust in God but not in His instructions. So the positions that God should not be trusted when it comes to keeping the 7th day holy is the opposite of trusting in God. The Spirit has has the role of leading us in truth (John 16:13), the Spirit has the role of leading us to bey God's instructions (Ezekiel 36:26-27), and God's instructions are truth (Psalm 119:142), but the Spirit does not have the role of leading us away from obeying what God has instructed. The New Covenant does not involve rejecting God's instructions, but rather it involves God putting them in our minds and writing them on our hearts (Jeremiah 31:33).

If we did on every day what God wants us to do on the Sabbath, then we would do no work, but God also wants us to work on the other six days. In Hebrews 3:18, they did not enter into God's rest because of their disobedience, and in Ezekiel 20:13, it specifically mentions that they greatly profaned God's Sabbaths, so someone should not think that they can enter into God's rest while having the same disobedience that prevented the Israelites from entering into God's rest. In Hebrews 4:9-11, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God, we should rest from our work as God rested from His work, and we should be careful to enter into that rest so that no one might fall away by the same sort of disobedience, so we should continue follow Christ's example of keeping the 7th day holy.

I think when the Apostles honored the Sabbath after Jesus ascension , the day of rest God made for us,that says it all.

Many are misled. They reject God's gift.

 

[FaithWillDo]

God is trustworthy, therefore His instructions are also trustworthy (Psalm 19:7), so the way to trust in God is by obediently trusting in His instructions and it would be contradictory for someone to think that we should trust in God but not in His instructions. So the positions that God should not be trusted when it comes to keeping the 7th day holy is the opposite of trusting in God. The Spirit has has the role of leading us in truth (John 16:13), the Spirit has the role of leading us to bey God's instructions (Ezekiel 36:26-27), and God's instructions are truth (Psalm 119:142), but the Spirit does not have the role of leading us away from obeying what God has instructed. The New Covenant does not involve rejecting God's instructions, but rather it involves God putting them in our minds and writing them on our hearts (Jeremiah 31:33).

If we did on every day what God wants us to do on the Sabbath, then we would do no work, but God also wants us to work on the other six days. In Hebrews 3:18, they did not enter into God's rest because of their disobedience, and in Ezekiel 20:13, it specifically mentions that they greatly profaned God's Sabbaths, so someone should not think that they can enter into God's rest while having the same disobedience that prevented the Israelites from entering into God's rest. In Hebrews 4:9-11, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God, we should rest from our work as God rested from His work, and we should be careful to enter into that rest so that no one might fall away by the same sort of disobedience, so we should continue follow Christ's example of keeping the 7th day holy.

Dear Soyeong,
The Old Covenant was given to prove to Israel that man is NOT capable of obeying God's law. Only Jesus Christ is able to perfectly keep the law. For anyone else to keep the law, Christ must be living within them so that He keeps the law for them. This is the basis of our salvation. Christ is the one who gives a person their will and ability to follow the law. Without Christ, a person will always fail and it only takes ONE failure for the penalty of sin (death) to apply.

When Christ keeps the law from within a person, the person will have ceased from their own labors of trying to follow the law. When this happens, the person will be keeping the Sabbath Day law seven days a week and will have entered into the rest of Christ. This is what it means to be faithful. Walking by faith is the spiritual fulfillment of the physical Sabbath Day law. For a person to walk by faith, Christ will be the one who is causing it to happen. Mankind has NO WORKS of their own to contribute to their own salvation. Christ is the one who is responsible for our salvation and is the one who will do all the work.

When a babe in Christ (Early Rain only) believes that they must rest one day a week but work the other six days, it represents that they have mixed the Old Wine (Old Covenant) with the New Wine (New Covenant). When they do this mixing of works with faith, it will bite them like a serpent and they will fall from grace.

Prov 23:26 My son, give me thine heart, and let thine eyes observe my ways. 27 For a whore is a deep ditch; and a strange woman is a narrow pit. 28 She also lieth in wait as for a prey, and increases the transgressors among men. 29 Who hath woe? who hath sorrow? who hath contentions? who hath babbling? who hath wounds without cause? who hath redness of eyes? 30 They that tarry long at the wine; they that go to seek mixed wine. 31 Look not thou upon the wine when it is red (Old Wine), when it giveth his color in the cup, when it moves itself (man’s works) aright. 32 At the last it bites like a serpent, and stings like an adder.

Joe

 

[Button]

Doug,
The law of keeping the Sabbath Day has NOT been abolished. However, many believers have a very mistaken understanding of how converted believers keep the Sabbath Day.

I'll explain:

For a person to be acceptable to God, we must trust in Him to direct our lives and the paths that we take. This mindset is called FAITH.

David was acceptable to God because of his great faith - even though he still sinned in other areas.

The physical keeping of the Sabbath Day foreshadowed the faith that God would give to all mankind via the Holy Spirit under the New Covenant. Under the New Covenant, the Sabbath Day law is fulfilled when a believer is baptized by the Holy Spirit and begins walking by faith. This is accomplished by Christ's work of "conversion". Conversion occurs when Christ gives a person the Early and Latter Rains of the Holy Spirit, followed by His judgment. For converted believers, having faith and walking by that faith happens automatically and requires no work from themselves to follow the law. Why? Because the Holy Spirit within them does all the work.

Phil 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

In this way, a converted believer keeps the Sabbath Day law. The physical keeping of the Sabbath by observing one day a week is then no longer required because a converted believer will rest from their work 24/7.

Because this is how a converted believer keeps the Sabbath Day, Paul said this:

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves (referring to their faith): it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

And this:

Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works (24/7), as God did from his (on the 7th day).

Joe

Keeping the Sabbath isn't a work.

God did not make the Sabbath for man.

It is a gift.
God made man for the Sabbath.

Origin

Old English sabat, from Latin sabbatum, via Greek from Hebrew šabbāṯ, from šāḇaṯ ‘to rest’.

 

[Soyeong]

Dear Soyeong,
The Old Covenant was given to prove to Israel that man is NOT capable of obeying God's law.

Nowhere does the Bible say that, but rather it states the opposite. In Romans 10:5-8, Paul referred to Deuteronomy 30 as the word of faith that we proclaim in regard to the righteousness that is by faith proclaiming that the Law of God is not too difficult for us to obey and that obedience to it brings life and a blessing while disobedience brings death and a curse, so choose life! Moreover, there are many example of people in the Bible who did keep the law, such as with those in Joshua 22:1-3, Luke 1:5-6, Revelation 14:12, and Revelation 22:14.

Only Jesus Christ is able to perfectly keep the law. For anyone else to keep the law, Christ must be living within them so that He keeps the law for them. This is the basis of our salvation. Christ is the one who gives a person their will and ability to follow the law. Without Christ, a person will always fail and it only takes ONE failure for the penalty of sin (death) to apply.

If we needed to have perfect obedience to the law, then repentance would have no value, so the fact that repentance has value democrats that we are not required to have perfect obedience. The only reason why someone would need to have perfect obedience to the Law of God would if they are going to give themselves to pay for the sins of the world - the rest of us can thankfully have our sins forgiven. The Law of God was never given as something that was to be obeyed apart from Christ.

When Christ keeps the law from within a person, the person will have ceased from their own labors of trying to follow the law. When this happens, the person will be keeping the Sabbath Day law seven days a week and will have entered into the rest of Christ. This is what it means to be faithful. Walking by faith is the spiritual fulfillment of the physical Sabbath Day law. For a person to walk by faith, Christ will be the one who is causing it to happen. Mankind has NO WORKS of their own to contribute to their own salvation. Christ is the one who is responsible for our salvation and is the one who will do all the work.

Christ lived in obedience to the Law of God, so that is also the way that we live when we he is living in us, which includes keeping the 7th day holy. In Matthew 11:28-30, Jesus was inviting people to come to him for rest and to learn from him, not inviting people to come to him for rest instead of learning from his example. By Jesus saying that we would find rest for our souls he was referencing Jeremiah 6:16-19, where the Law of God is described as the good way where we will find rest for our souls. We have find rest for our souls instead of following God's instructions for how to find rest for our souls. In Revelation 14:12, those who kept faith in Christ are the same as those who kept God's commandments, so we can't have faith n Christ instead of keeping God's commandments. God is trustworthy therefore His law is also trustworthy (Psalms 19:7), so the way to trust in God for our salvation is by obediently trusting in His law and it would be contradictory to think that we should trust in God for salvation instead of trusting in His instructions. God has not given any instructions for man for how to do works of our own to contribute to our own salvation, but rather God graciously teaching us to be a doer of His law is how He is giving us His gift of salvation. Works that we do on our own would be works that are completely independent of anything that God has instructed.

When a babe in Christ (Early Rain only) believes that they must rest one day a week but work the other six days, it represents that they have mixed the Old Wine (Old Covenant) with the New Wine (New Covenant). When they do this mixing of works with faith, it will bite them like a serpent and they will fall from grace.

Prov 23:26 My son, give me thine heart, and let thine eyes observe my ways. 27 For a whore is a deep ditch; and a strange woman is a narrow pit. 28 She also lieth in wait as for a prey, and increases the transgressors among men. 29 Who hath woe? who hath sorrow? who hath contentions? who hath babbling? who hath wounds without cause? who hath redness of eyes? 30 They that tarry long at the wine; they that go to seek mixed wine. 31 Look not thou upon the wine when it is red (Old Wine), when it giveth his color in the cup, when it moves itself (man’s works) aright. 32 At the last it bites like a serpent, and stings like an adder.

Joe

The New Covenant still involves following God's law (Jeremiah 31:33, Ezekiel 36:26-27), so I'm not mixing the covenants. The Bible repeatedly connects our works with our faith such as with the examples of faith in Hebrews 11 or with James 2:18 saying that he would show his faith through his works. In Psalm 119:29-30, he wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey His law, and he chose the way of faith by setting it before him, so this has always been the one and only way of salvation by grace through faith, and it would be absurd to think that he wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him how to fall from grace.

 

[FaithWillDo]

Keeping the Sabbath isn't a work.

God did not make the Sabbath for man.

It is a gift.
God made man for the Sabbath.

Origin
View attachment 80572
Old English sabat, from Latin sabbatum, via Greek from Hebrew šabbāṯ, from šāḇaṯ ‘to rest’.

Dear Button,
Anything that a person takes credit for doing that they believe earns or entitles them to salvation is a "work". Christ is the Savior and He does all the work of saving mankind. His work is spiritual and He performs it within us. Mankind contributes nothing because they have nothing that they can contribute.

So what is salvation and why can't mankind do anything to earn it or receive it?

Salvation is to be spiritually converted into a child of God who does not sin.

Mankind was created spiritually marred. The flaw in man's spirit is its weakness. It is that weakness that causes mankind to put their own needs over their need to be obedient to God. The Old Covenant of Law was given to reveal this truth to mankind.

The only way to correct mankind's spiritual flaw is for the Holy Spirit to indwell a person. When the Spirit does, it will spiritually strengthen the person. After a person is strengthened, they will put their need to be obedient to God over their own needs. This is the same reason why Jesus never sinned. He had the Spirit without measure. He never put His own needs over His need to be obedient to His Father. He even went to the cross rather than disobey God.

Also, scripture says that Jesus is the Lord of the Sabbath. When Christ enters into a person via the Holy Spirit, the person will rest from their own works of trying to be acceptable to God. Why? Because Christ within us cause the person to "will and to do":

Phil 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

This spiritual change is what the Sabbath Day law foreshadowed. So yes, God made man for the Sabbath Day because God wants us to trust Him and depend upon Him for everything. When we do, we are obeying the Sabbath and are at rest from our labors 24/7. This is what it means to walk by faith and is why the New Covenant is Grace through Faith. Faith is rest and rest is obedience to the Sabbath Day law.

In the end, Christ will see to it that all mankind enters into His rest and receives the salvation He came to freely give mankind. It is all His work to perform.

1John 4:14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the world.

1Tim 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior; 4 who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 6 who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Rom 5:15 But shall not the act of favour be as the offence? For if by the offence of one the many have died, much rather has the grace of God, and the free gift in grace, which is by the one man Jesus Christ, abounded unto the many.

Joe

 

[Button]

Dear Button,
Anything that a person takes credit for doing that they believe earns or entitles them to salvation is a "work".

You don't understand Sabbath.

Sabbath isn't a work. As explained.

Sabbatarians also know that keeping the Sabbath does not save them. They are saved in Christ.
God's gift of Sabbath was God's gift for us.

Just as his grace gifted us with faith and Salvation
After Salvation is when we recognize the gift of Sabbath .

Christ is the Savior and He does all the work of saving mankind. His work is spiritual and He performs it within us. Mankind contributes nothing because they have nothing that they can contribute.

So what is salvation and why can't mankind do anything to earn it or receive it?

Salvation is to be spiritually converted into a child of God who does not sin.

Mankind was created spiritually marred. The flaw in man's spirit is its weakness. It is that weakness that causes mankind to put their own needs over their need to be obedient to God. The Old Covenant of Law was given to reveal this truth to mankind.

The only way to correct mankind's spiritual flaw is for the Holy Spirit to indwell a person. When the Spirit does, it will spiritually strengthen the person. After a person is strengthened, they will put their need to be obedient to God over their own needs. This is the same reason why Jesus never sinned. He had the Spirit without measure. He never put His own needs over His need to be obedient to His Father. He even went to the cross rather than disobey God.

Also, scripture says that Jesus is the Lord of the Sabbath. When Christ enters into a person via the Holy Spirit, the person will rest from their own works of trying to be acceptable to God. Why? Because Christ within us cause the person to "will and to do":

Phil 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

This spiritual change is what the Sabbath Day law foreshadowed. So yes, God made man for the Sabbath Day because God wants us to trust Him and depend upon Him for everything. When we do, we are obeying the Sabbath and are at rest from our labors 24/7. This is what it means to walk by faith and is why the New Covenant is Grace through Faith. Faith is rest and rest is obedience to the Sabbath Day law.

In the end, Christ will see to it that all mankind enters into His rest and receives the salvation He came to freely give mankind. It is all His work to perform.

1John 4:14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the world.

1Tim 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior; 4 who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 6 who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Rom 5:15 But shall not the act of favour be as the offence? For if by the offence of one the many have died, much rather has the grace of God, and the free gift in grace, which is by the one man Jesus Christ, abounded unto the many.

Joe

You appear to adhere to lazy easy believerism.

Christ never taught we work to stay saved.

That we are saved is why we do the work God calls us to.

There's a difference.

 

[FaithWillDo]

Nowhere does the Bible say that, but rather it states the opposite. In Romans 10:5-8, Paul referred to Deuteronomy 30 as the word of faith that we proclaim in regard to the righteousness that is by faith proclaiming that the Law of God is not too difficult for us to obey and that obedience to it brings life and a blessing while disobedience brings death and a curse, so choose life! Moreover, there are many example of people in the Bible who did keep the law, such as with those in Joshua 22:1-3, Luke 1:5-6, Revelation 14:12, and Revelation 22:14.


If we needed to have perfect obedience to the law, then repentance would have no value, so the fact that repentance has value democrats that we are not required to have perfect obedience. The only reason why someone would need to have perfect obedience to the Law of God would if they are going to give themselves to pay for the sins of the world - the rest of us can thankfully have our sins forgiven. The Law of God was never given as something that was to be obeyed apart from Christ.


Christ lived in obedience to the Law of God, so that is also the way that we live when we he is living in us, which includes keeping the 7th day holy. In Matthew 11:28-30, Jesus was inviting people to come to him for rest and to learn from him, not inviting people to come to him for rest instead of learning from his example. By Jesus saying that we would find rest for our souls he was referencing Jeremiah 6:16-19, where the Law of God is described as the good way where we will find rest for our souls. We have find rest for our souls instead of following God's instructions for how to find rest for our souls. In Revelation 14:12, those who kept faith in Christ are the same as those who kept God's commandments, so we can't have faith n Christ instead of keeping God's commandments. God is trustworthy therefore His law is also trustworthy (Psalms 19:7), so the way to trust in God for our salvation is by obediently trusting in His law and it would be contradictory to think that we should trust in God for salvation instead of trusting in His instructions. God has not given any instructions for man for how to do works of our own to contribute to our own salvation, but rather God graciously teaching us to be a doer of His law is how He is giving us His gift of salvation. Works that we do on our own would be works that are completely independent of anything that God has instructed.


The New Covenant still involves following God's law (Jeremiah 31:33, Ezekiel 36:26-27), so I'm not mixing the covenants. The Bible repeatedly connects our works with our faith such as with the examples of faith in Hebrews 11 or with James 2:18 saying that he would show his faith through his works. In Psalm 119:29-30, he wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey His law, and he chose the way of faith by setting it before him, so this has always been the one and only way of salvation by grace through faith, and it would be absurd to think that he wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him how to fall from grace.

Dear Soyeong,

You said:
Nowhere does the Bible say that, but rather it states the opposite. In Romans 10:5-8, Paul referred to Deuteronomy 30 as the word of faith that we proclaim in regard to the righteousness that is by faith proclaiming that the Law of God is not too difficult for us to obey and that obedience to it brings life and a blessing while disobedience brings death and a curse, so choose life! Moreover, there are many example of people in the Bible who did keep the law, such as with those in Joshua 22:1-3, Luke 1:5-6, Revelation 14:12, and Revelation 22:14.

Paul supports my statement here:

Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

The Old Covenant of Law was given to the Nation of Israel to be their schoolmaster to lead them to Christ.

The Old Covenant stipulated that as long as the nation obeyed God's law, they would be acceptable to Him. However, the Nation of Israel had no ability to be obedient to God because they were spiritually marred. The temple sacrifices were put in place to put a temporary covering over their sins. Christ came to be the permanent sacrifice. In this way, Christ fulfilled the Old Covenant of Law. But since Christ's sacrifice on the cross did nothing to stop mankind's sinful ways, Christ introduced a new covenant. In that new covenant, Christ will do all the work of making mankind obedient to the laws of God. He does this by spiritually changing mankind by giving each person the free gift of the Holy Spirit. With the Holy Spirit, mankind will be governed by the Spirit and will cease sinning. So yes, the Law of God is not too difficult to obey because Jesus Christ has come and given us the Spirit which causes us to "will and to do". After a person is converted, they will enter into the rest of Christ and will be obeying the Sabbath day law.

You said:
If we needed to have perfect obedience to the law, then repentance would have no value, so the fact that repentance has value democrats that we are not required to have perfect obedience. The only reason why someone would need to have perfect obedience to the Law of God would if they are going to give themselves to pay for the sins of the world - the rest of us can thankfully have our sins forgiven. The Law of God was never given as something that was to be obeyed apart from Christ.

Scriptural repentance is a repentance from works. The other side of that coin is faith. The Old Covenant is works based. The New Covenant is based on faith in Christ to do all the works of making us righteous before God. After a person has been converted, they will be governed by the Spirit and will eventually stop sinning once they have matured to a "man of full age". At that time, the person be like Christ and will have perfect obedience. Their obedience comes from the Spirit and not from themselves. That spiritual change is mankind's salvation.

You said:
The New Covenant still involves following God's law (Jeremiah 31:33, Ezekiel 36:26-27), so I'm not mixing the covenants.

You are missing the point I was making. Yes, we are to follow the commandments of God. The Old Covenant is based upon mankind's own ability to follow the Law and the New Covenant is based upon Christ's ability to follow the Law. After a person is converted, Christ will live within them via the Holy Spirit and cause them to "will and to do". This will cause the person to rest from their own works because Christ within them is now doing all the works. When this change occurs within a person, the Sabbath Day law is then spiritually fulfilled within the person. They will then rest 24/7 from their works. A physical rest from work one day a week is no longer necessary.

Consider this scripture again:

Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works (24/7), as God did from his (on the 7th day).

The Sabbath Day is based upon God resting on the seventh day after the six days of His creation work. Paul equates that same day with entering into the rest of Christ. This spiritual change within a person fulfills the physical observance of the Sabbath Day law.

Joe

 

[FaithWillDo]

You don't understand Sabbath.

Sabbath isn't a work. As explained.

Sabbatarians also know that keeping the Sabbath does not save them. They are saved in Christ.
God's gift of Sabbath was God's gift for us.

Just as his grace gifted us with faith and Salvation
After Salvation is when we recognize the gift of Sabbath .



You appear to adhere to lazy easy believerism.

Christ never taught we work to stay saved.

That we are saved is why we do the work God calls us to.

There's a difference.

Dear Button,
Trying to follow the laws of God (like the Sabbath Day law) are works.

And yes, the Sabbath Day is God's gift to mankind. When Christ enters a person, they will rest from their works of trying to make themselves acceptable to God. Christ Himself is the gift of the Sabbath Day. That is why when Christ lives within a person, they are obeying the Sabbath Day and are resting from their works. Christ is doing the works for them. The physical observance of the Sabbath Day prior to a person's conversion is only a foreshadowing of the true gift that will come later.

Joe

 

[Button]

Dear Button,
Trying to follow the laws of God (like the Sabbath Day law) are works.

No.
Is not stealing a work? If you're not a thief are you saved?

Please.
Arguing against morality and thinking the moral laws of God are works,is umbilical.

And yes, the Sabbath Day is God's gift to mankind. When Christ enters a person, they will rest from their works of trying to make themselves acceptable to God. Christ Himself is the gift of the Sabbath Day. That is why when Christ lives within a person, they are obeying the Sabbath Day and are resting from their works. Christ is doing the works for them. The physical observance of the Sabbath Day prior to a person's conversion is only a foreshadowing of the true gift that will come later.

Joe

Good luck with Sophistry.

 

[FaithWillDo]

No.
Is not stealing a work? If you're not a thief are you saved?

Please.
Arguing against morality and thinking the moral laws of God are works,is umbilical.

Good luck with Sophistry.

Dear Button,
"Morality and thinking the moral laws of God" are not works. Trying to follow the laws of God without Christ within you doing it for you is what constitutes "works". That is the difference between the Old and New Covenants. What you are teaching is the mixing of the old and new wine and is what causes a believer to fall from grace.

It is the works of Christ within a person that will give mankind the gift of rest that the Sabbath Day law foreshadows.

Joe