Why are Bible scholars leaving Christianity?

[GeneZ]

Wait a second....

Healing was not listed as a temporary gift.

Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; ​

where there is knowledge, it will pass away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when completeness ​

comes, what is in part disappears. When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. ​

When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then ​

we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.​

1 Corinthians 13:8-12

 

[Grailhunter]

LOL I have never met a worldly Theologian. You guy just think you have to be stupid to be a Christian. So weird.

 

[St. SteVen]

Not healed, whom he attempted to heal?


You asked me for Scripture ?
I gave some...

Where is yours, please?

.

Here you go.
Jesus in His own hometown.

Matthew 13:58 NIV
And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith.

 

[GeneZ]

Here you go.
Jesus in His own hometown.

Matthew 13:58 NIV
And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith.

Those were unbelievers.....

 

[St. SteVen]

Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

Has knowledge passed away?

If the prophecies and tongues are gone, so should knowledge have passed away.

 

[St. SteVen]

Those were unbelievers.....

It prevented miracles.
Just like those who agree with you.

There are very few miracles in the west because of those who claim that miracle gifts have gone away.
Miracles are rampant in the east where they believe in them.

Miracles Across the Map: Stories of Healing, Protection, and God’s Power

The Global Missions office has a unique window into the miraculous ways God works in and through Open Bible churches around the world. Here we share four powerful, real-life testimonies of God’s healing, protection, and divine intervention from different corners of the globe: Nicaragua, Cuba...

openbiblemessage.org

 

[GeneZ]

Has knowledge passed away?

If the prophecies and tongues are gone, so should knowledge have passed away.

From what I understand... The "Gift" of knowledge was not simply acquiring knowledge through learning.
It was a supernatural imparting.
For they were yet without the means for gaining the needed knowledge which took time to build up and have on record.

 

[St. SteVen]

From what I understand... The "Gift" of knowledge was not simply acquiring knowledge through learning.
It was a supernatural imparting.
For they were yet without the means for gaining the needed knowledge which took time to build up and have on record.

In that case it would be a word of knowledge, or a word of wisdom. A supernatural imparting, as you noted.
Are you saying that a word of knowledge is a gift that has ceased? What about a word of wisdom?

Gifts "of guidance" are listed as part of the Body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:7-8 NIV
Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good.
8 To one there is given through the Spirit a message of wisdom, to another
a message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit,

1 Corinthians 12:27-28 NIV
Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it.
28 And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets,
third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping,
of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues.

 

[GeneZ]

In that case it would be a word of knowledge, or a word of wisdom. A supernatural imparting, as you noted.
Are you saying that a word of knowledge is a gift that has ceased? What about a word of wisdom?

Gifts "of guidance" are listed as part of the Body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:7-8 NIV
Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good.
8 To one there is given through the Spirit a message of wisdom, to another
a message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit,

1 Corinthians 12:27-28 NIV
Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it.
28 And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets,
third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping,
of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues.

What about this?
And, what about that?

What about taking a break???

What has the ratio been between actual answers?
And, just dragging only into more questions?

I learn from an excellent teacher.
This stuff is just boring and lifeless.

Wasted time.

 

[marks]

Yes.

Bcause I haven't read his book and I'm not familiar with his experiences, I merely posted it to allow those who don't know about it to get a glimpse of it.


His question is very important and it is a problem that many people face. I think many people will have the same problem as him, including myself in the past.


But now his issues are not problems for me. I can easily reconcile these conflicting matters.

Be careful with that AI, it's an insidious liar.

Much love!

 

[GeneZ]

In that case it would be a word of knowledge, or a word of wisdom. A supernatural imparting, as you noted.
Are you saying that a word of knowledge is a gift that has ceased? What about a word of wisdom?

Gifts "of guidance" are listed as part of the Body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:7-8 NIV
Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good.
8 To one there is given through the Spirit a message of wisdom, to another
a message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit,

1 Corinthians 12:27-28 NIV
Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it.
28 And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets,
third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping,
of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues.

What was the original intent and purpose for tongues (meaning, different languages)?

 

[St. SteVen]

What was the original intent and purpose for tongues (meaning, different languages)?

Original?
Are you attempting to limit the use of tongues to the outpouring at Pentecost? (#5 in the list below)

Five Uses of Tongues
1) Personal prayer language (speaking to God) See Acts 1:5, 1 Corinthians 14:2 and Acts 19:6
2) Intercessory prayer language (prayer in the Spirit) See Romans 8:26
3) Congregational message (preferably with interpretation) 1 Corinthians 14
4) Worship language (singing in tongues) See 1 Corinthians 14:15
5) Evangelistic language (language of the hearers) Like the outpouring at Pentecost. See Acts 2

Personal prayer language (speaking to God) See Acts 1:5, 1 Corinthians 14:2 and Acts 19:6
Typically recognized as the initial evidence of the Baptism with the Holy Spirit.
A personal prayer language is a precious ability to speak with God whenever you want.
Not that you need tongues to speak to God, but tongues takes it to a new level.
And tongues is the entrance to many other gifts of the Holy Spirit.
Those in the church in Corinth were tongues-speakers.
They were ready to understand and receive all the gifts.

Intercessory prayer language (prayer in the Spirit) See Romans 8:26
Similarly, the ability to speak in tongues is useful in praying for others.
Allow the Spirit to speak and pray the perfect prayer for the situation.

Congregational message (preferably with interpretation) 1 Corinthians 14
This is considered to be the GIFT of tongues. The Holy Spirit delivering a message to the church.
The interpretation of tongues is required to make the message understandable. (edifying)

Worship language (singing in tongues) See 1 Corinthians 14:15
During a worship service, tongues is useful to enter in at a deeper level.

Evangelistic language (language of the hearers) Like the outpouring at Pentecost. See Acts 2
A rare occurrence, but points back to the original outpouring at Pentecost.

 

[GeneZ]

Original?
Are you attempting to limit the use of tongues to the outpouring at Pentecost? (#5 in the list below)

I spoke of intent.
Not its first occurrence.

Paul gives the reason for the gift in 1 Corinthians 14:20-22.

Tongues was to be a sign to unbelieving people of Israel.
Just like God gave unbelieving Pharaoh signs who refused to believe.

 

[St. SteVen]

Tongues was to be a sign to unbelieving people of Israel.
Just like God gave unbelieving Pharaoh signs who refused to believe.

I have written about this in the past.

Cessationism versus Continuationism - The fallacy of "Sign Gifts".

Cessationism claims that the miracle gifts of the Holy Spirit were signs to authenticate the early church. And consequently the miracle gifts disappeared when the Apostles did. Continuationism says that all the gifts were for the church and that all the gifts of the Holy Spirit are still valid...

www.christianityboard.com

Furthermore, tongues serve many practical functions.

Five Uses of Tongues
1) Personal prayer language (speaking to God) See Acts 1:5, 1 Corinthians 14:2 and Acts 19:6
2) Intercessory prayer language (prayer in the Spirit) See Romans 8:26
3) Congregational message (preferably with interpretation) 1 Corinthians 14
4) Worship language (singing in tongues) See 1 Corinthians 14:15
5) Evangelistic language (language of the hearers) Like the outpouring at Pentecost. See Acts 2

Here's another topic that emphasizes the importance of tongues.

Why hadn't the baptized believers in Samaria received the Holy Spirit?

Why hadn't the baptized believers in Samaria received the Holy Spirit? Just to be clear, I do not question whether the believers in Samaria had received the "indwelling" Spirit when they believed. They were missing something else. Acts 8:14-17 NIV When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that...

www.christianityboard.com

What is the Baptism with the Holy Spirit

Luke 3:16 NIV
John answered them all, “I baptize you with[a] water. But one who is more powerful than I will come,
the straps of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie. He will baptize you with[b] the Holy Spirit and fire.

Acts 1:4-5 NIV
... “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about.
5 For John baptized with[a] water, but in a few days you will be baptized with[b] the Holy Spirit.”

Evidence of the Baptism with the Holy Spirit

Acts 2:4 NIV
All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began
to speak in other tongues[a] as the Spirit enabled them.

Acts 2:11 NIV
(both Jews and converts to Judaism); Cretans and Arabs—
we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!”

Acts 10:45-47 NIV
The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that
the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles.
46 For they heard them speaking in tongues[a] and praising God. Then Peter said,
47 “Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water.
They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have.”

Acts 19:6 NIV
When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them,
and they spoke in tongues[a] and prophesied.

 

[GeneZ]

I have written about this in the past.

Cessationism versus Continuationism - The fallacy of "Sign Gifts".

Cessationism claims that the miracle gifts of the Holy Spirit were signs to authenticate the early church. And consequently the miracle gifts disappeared when the Apostles did. Continuationism says that all the gifts were for the church and that all the gifts of the Holy Spirit are still valid...

www.christianityboard.com

Furthermore, tongues serve many practical functions.

Five Uses of Tongues
1) Personal prayer language (speaking to God) See Acts 1:5, 1 Corinthians 14:2 and Acts 19:6
2) Intercessory prayer language (prayer in the Spirit) See Romans 8:26
3) Congregational message (preferably with interpretation) 1 Corinthians 14
4) Worship language (singing in tongues) See 1 Corinthians 14:15
5) Evangelistic language (language of the hearers) Like the outpouring at Pentecost. See Acts 2

Here's another topic that emphasizes the importance of tongues.

Why hadn't the baptized believers in Samaria received the Holy Spirit?

Why hadn't the baptized believers in Samaria received the Holy Spirit? Just to be clear, I do not question whether the believers in Samaria had received the "indwelling" Spirit when they believed. They were missing something else. Acts 8:14-17 NIV When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that...

www.christianityboard.com

What is the Baptism with the Holy Spirit

Luke 3:16 NIV
John answered them all, “I baptize you with[a] water. But one who is more powerful than I will come,
the straps of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie. He will baptize you with[b] the Holy Spirit and fire.

Acts 1:4-5 NIV
... “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about.
5 For John baptized with[a] water, but in a few days you will be baptized with[b] the Holy Spirit.”

Evidence of the Baptism with the Holy Spirit

Acts 2:4 NIV
All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began
to speak in other tongues[a] as the Spirit enabled them.

Acts 2:11 NIV
(both Jews and converts to Judaism); Cretans and Arabs—
we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!”

Acts 10:45-47 NIV
The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that
the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles.
46 For they heard them speaking in tongues[a] and praising God. Then Peter said,
47 “Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water.
They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have.”

Acts 19:6 NIV
When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them,
and they spoke in tongues[a] and prophesied.

Just trying to establish a point of reference...
You must speak in tongues. Or, have friends that do. Correct?

 

[St. SteVen]

Just trying to establish a point of reference...
You must speak in tongues. Or, have friends that do. Correct?

Yes.