Reason for The Crusades explained

[Wrangler]

Do you see no difference in the way the Israelites lived and interacted with their enemies in the Hebrew Bible and the way Christians lived and interacted with their enemies in the New Testament?

Consider this: Jesus brings a new way of living.

The NT biblical instruction is not “put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.”

You are falsely equating Hebrew's acting as a corporate nation with early Christians before having the time to become agents in corporation, i.e., a Christian nation.

No where in the OT are believers commanded to sell their cloak to buy a sword. Now, back to the appropriate Bible verse as it pertains to the Crusades, 1 Samuel 15:3
Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy[a] all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”

 

[Matthias]

Imagine this, if you will. The next time you attend a church service your pastor preaches a sermon where he tells you this: “It is your duty as a follower of Jesus to go out and put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.” Kill your enemies. Do it now.”

 

[Matthias]

You are falsely equating Hebrew's acting as a corporate nation with early Christians before having the time to become agents in corporation, i.e., a Christian nation.

Christian nationalism is a spiritual disease. It causes Christians to rationalize killing fellow Christians, as well as non-Christians.

Teaching “You are not following Jesus if you aren’t armed, ready to kill - you are leading poorly instructed Christians to destruction.

No where in the OT are believers commanded to sell their cloak to buy a sword. Now, back to the appropriate Bible verse as it pertains to the Crusades, 1 Samuel 15:3
Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy[a] all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”

I live under New Testament instruction, the teaching of Jesus and the apostles. The Crusaders didn’t obey that instruction.

 

[Matthias]

Whose Side Is Jesus On? Faith, War, and the Danger of Nationalism

When nations claim Jesus to justify war, Christians must ask: whose side is he really on? A reflection on faith, violence, and the danger of nationalism.

christiansforsocialaction.org

 

[Matthias]

I don’t trust AI but I just used it to ask: “Is there any church in the world that teaches “You are not following Jesus if you aren’t armed, ready to kill?”

AI replied:

“Based on current search results, there is no major, mainstream church denomination in the world that officially teaches ‘You aren’t a follower of Jesus if you aren’t armed, ready to kill.’

However, a niche extremist group, often described as a ‘gun-advocating church,’ has promoted a theology that closely mirrors this sentiment.

Here are the details regarding this topic:

• Extremist Views (Rod of Iron Ministries) : A group known as Rod of Iron Ministries, which has acquired land in Tennessee, is known for its advicacy of the Second Amendment as a core part of its faith. Their leader has appeared with a crown of bullets, and members have been known to carry weapons during services. They believe that owning a rifle is a fundamental aspect of their faith for self-defense.

• ’Guns for God’ Mentality : This group often links the use of firearms fir self-defense and protection to the ‘protection of sheep,’ arguing that an armed citizenry can stop evil.

• ’Armed to Protect’ Advocacy : Some smaller, independent, or specifically, American ‘gun carrying’ churches argue that it is a ‘biblical duty’ to protect one’s family and community, including being armed, though they often focus on ‘protecting the innocent’ rather than an active command to be ‘ready to kill’ at all times.

• Contrary Christian Teachings : The vast majority of Christian denominations — including Catholic, Protestant, and Orthodox - teach a message of peace, nonviolence, and ‘turning the other cheek’. Historic Peace Churches, such as Quakers and Mennonites, explicitly reject the use of violence, arguing that it is incompatible with following Jesus.

• Context of Self-Defense : Many conservative churches may defend the right to bear arms or provide armed security, but do not equate carrying a weapon with the condition for veing a follower of Jesus.

In summary, while no large-scale, recognized denimination requires members to be armed and ready to kill as a condition of their faith, a small, fringe movement in the U.S. does promote a ‘rod of iron’ ideology that interprets the Bible as requiring armed readiness.”

Take it for what it’s worth. Please note that I’m not implying nor inferring that any member of Christianity Board has any connection whatsoever with any of the niche extremist / fringe groups mentioned by AI, nor with any other such group or groups not mentioned by AI.

Are you associated with any of these fringe groups @Wrangler? Does whatever church you are associated with - I invite you to name the church - officially endorse your “You are not following Jesus if you aren’t armed, ready to kill“ teaching? Are they aware that you are publicly teaching this to Christians?

 

[amigo de christo]

Are you associated with any of these fringe groups @Wrangler? Does whatever church you are associated with - I invite you to name the church - officially endorse your “You are not following Jesus if you aren’t armed, ready to kill“ teaching? Are they aware that you are publicly teaching this to Christians?

He is a solider of the political army of the nar realm whose father is trump and mother is paula white .
He had rather die than let go of this . it will be his end my friend if he turns not from it .
The g reat whore sits over many waters . And the sea is full of her ecumeincal cup of which many now drink .
I would flee anything connected to ecumeincalism inclusvism . its all coming DOWN on JESUS day .

 

[amigo de christo]

Imagine this, if you will. The next time you attend a church service your pastor preaches a sermon where he tells you this: “It is your duty as a follower of Jesus to go out and put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.” Kill your enemies. Do it now.”

Soon .
Very soon .
This will be the cry of the ecumenical harlot as her call for crusades begins .
And they will not see sheep as being of GOD either . But of hate and of darkness as they beleive
THEY DO the WILL OF GOD . But it wont be GOD giving them orders my friend .
The dark one , that ol serpent , the devil has not been sleeping . He has long
been infiltrating by means of his ecumeincal whore and her love message and cry for peace .

 

[amigo de christo]

Imagine this, if you will. The next time you attend a church service your pastor preaches a sermon where he tells you this: “It is your duty as a follower of Jesus to go out and put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.” Kill your enemies. Do it now.”

Imagine this . If the next time you go to a church service
you are hearing words that say be on the look out for extremists , those who dont conform .
report them to AUTHORITIES . OH ITS COMING my friend .
Already data b ases are g rowing with names of what they deem as potential terroists . as dangerous ,
as those who wont conform .
To them the most dangerous man known is not the man who sits under TRUMP
NOR is it the man who sits under harris or biden .
NO , its the ONE WHO IS NON POLITICAL and has NO HOPE in govt and politics .
THAT ONE cannot Be BOUGHT and DECIEVED . AND THEY KNOW THIS .
A man WHO TRULY DOES PUT GOD first , IS the one they deem MOST DAN GEOUS OF ALL .
cause it will not bend the knee to the will of their men , their beloved system .
And this is who both the right , like wrangler
and the left like others here , ALSO HATE ABOVE ALL .
Cause we expose BOTH SIDES SINS . The hour cometh when by means of a powerful digital system
And a heavily programmed ecumeincal mind will lead them all
to hear THE FINAL SOLUTION . RID ANYTHING of earth that does not conform to our love god
and its plan for peace . And both sides are already under its sway and its men .

 

[Pavel Mosko]

Would you say that it is a sad thing to see Christians living under Roman rule for centuries until the time of Constantine? Do you think they had “Satan’s boot on your throat”?

Under Nero and the insane emperors yes, but even then some places like Egypt faired pretty well until 280 AD under Diocletian.
By having Satan's boot on your throat I'm talking about stuff like this and worse. You know it is bad when you are forced to live in a garbage dump and make that your profession because of religious restrictions that keep you from higher paid and more sanitary occupations and places to live.

 

[Matthias]

“Remember, ‘Love your enemies’ does not mean ‘have no enemies.’ It means you hope for their repentance even while you resist their evil.” - Dale Partridge

If the pastor is right, killing your enemies to resist their evil isn’t loving your enemies. Dead enemies are unable to repent. Hoping that a slain enemy will repent is futile.

Is he right? Meditate on the pastor’s message.

 

[Wrangler]

In this morning's devotional reading, I came across Proverbs 6:16-17 God hates ... hands that shed innocent blood and I thought of this thread. Notice how it is not a statement of pacifism but justice. There is no hate for doing justice, for shedding blood. There is only hate when this is done to innocence.

One thing that has always been obvious to me is the logical implication from the phrase too often used in our society "innocent victim" for it implies the existence of another class of victims; namely, guilty victims. Yes, Muslims were victims of the Crusades, guilty victims, who deserved it.

The same is true of people who don't act prudently. You might be a victim of your own folly but you are a guilty victim. The adage applies, "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me." The Crusaders redeemed their shame after centuries and were no longer fooled by the evil of Islamic Jihad.

 

[Matthias]

In this morning's devotional reading, I came across Proverbs 6:16-17 God hates ... hands that shed innocent blood and I thought of this thread. Notice how it is not a statement of pacifism but justice. There is no hate for doing justice, for shedding blood. There is only hate when this is done to innocence.

One thing that has always been obvious to me is the logical implication from the phrase too often used in our society "innocent victim" for it implies the existence of another class of victims; namely, guilty victims. Yes, Muslims were victims of the Crusades, guilty victims, who deserved it.

The same is true of people who don't act prudently. You might be a victim of your own folly but you are a guilty victim. The adage applies, "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me." The Crusaders redeemed their shame after centuries and were no longer fooled by the evil of Islamic Jihad.

Islamic Jihad doesn’t align with the teaching of Jesus and the Apostles. It is evil.

Please see post #1585.

 

[Matthias]

“We must remember our history … because the Muslims do.

Difficult as it may be to fathom, there was a time when Christians butchered Muslims and Jews in the name of Jesus Christ and declared our own version of jihad, Christian jihad.”

(Ergun Mehmet Caner and Emir Fethi Caner, Christian Jihad, p. 19)

I’ve had this book in my private library for twenty years but haven’t read it. I’m moving it up the ladder in my TBR.

 

[Matthias]

Jesus Messiah commissioned his followers to “go and make disciples,” not ”butcher” our enemies.

 

[Matthias]

Stand your ground against the evil forces of this world

View attachment 83337

Have you read this book? I haven’t. Yet. That is about to change.

 

[Armour of God]

The war against Satan's evil forces

 

[Matthias]

The war against Satan's evil forces

View attachment 83393

“Christian jihad“ -> treat your enemy as your enemy treats you.

Jesus and the Apostles teach a better way.

 

[Matthias]

“One of the most disturbing things I found as I have researched gun violence is that the highest gun-owning demographic in America is Christians. Christians own guns at a higher rate than the general population. Those of us who worship the Prince of Peace on Sunday are the ones who are packing heat. While two-thirds of Americans live unarmed, almost half of Christians own guns - 42 percent. As I discovered that, I became convinced that our gun crisis is not just a political crisis. It is also a spiritual crisis. We can’t love our enemies and simultaneously prepare to kill them.”

(Shane Claiborne, “In guns we trust”)

In guns we trust

The highest gun-owning demographic in America is Christians, making gun violence not just a political crisis, but a spiritual one as well.

wagingnonviolence.org

Compare that with this:

”You are not following Jesus if you aren’t armed, ready to kill.” - Wrangler

You teach that to Christians @Wrangler. I ask again, what is the name of the church you attend? Are the leaders and members of that group aware that you are publicly teaching this to Christians?

While the statistic quoted by Claiborne is dated, 58 percent of Christians don’t even own guns*; the majority of Christians aren’t “armed, ready to kill”.

* It isn’t a sin to own a gun.

 

[Wrangler]

“Christian jihad“ -> treat your enemy as your enemy treats you.

Jesus and the Apostles teach a better way.

You keep denying corporate responsibility and pretending Jesus teachings apply to the State.

1. Love your personal enemies
2. When the State has enemies, you have responsibility to do your part.

It's very simple.

Also, loving ones enemies does not extend to allowing yourself to be victims. This is why Christ's better way includes buying a sword.

 

[Wrangler]

”You are not following Jesus if you aren’t armed, ready to kill.” - Wrangler

You teach that to Christians @Wrangler. I ask again, what is the name of the church you attend? Are the leaders and members of that group aware that you are publicly teaching this to Christians?

Yes. My church has armed men at each doorway. It's very reassuring to know they have my back.