Both Pretribbers and Preterists are clearly wrong that great tribulation begins with the DOTL.
- Thread starter Davidpt
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Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
What he and I are talking about is completely different than what you and I are talking about. He does not agree with your pre-trib dispensationalist beliefs, either.
Yes, you be the best you can be. However... limited... that is.
BHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
Disagreeing with some things does not equate to disagreeing with every thing.
eg I've LIKED some of your previous posts regardless of whether we disagree elsewhere.
Refusing to LIKE simply because you don't agree with that person elsewhere almost sounds like sin to me.
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
In your case, if I was you with your limitations,Yes, you be the best you can be. However... limited... that is.
BHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
When did I say I've done that? Never. I actually do give a like to posts of people like him if they say things I agree with. And he has seen that. And you will see that, too, if you ever say something I agree with.
Ohhhh. Not about me, bunny. That's all you, bunny. Yes, I did mean bunny. LOL!In your case, if I was you with your limitations,
Hey Pin, the ELECT in Matt 24:31, do you believe they are the same group as the SEALED in Eph 4:30 ?
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
Hmmm, I haven't been following yours and SI's conversation, but I'm sure it's been torturous... I'm sorry you've had to endure that; it always is that way when... "conversing" <chuckles> ...with SI, just because he is who he is... <smile> I mean there's just no grace there, which makes you wonder about some things...
Anyway, yeah, I guess the way I'd answer this is, everyone Paul is speaking to ~ which of course is, immediately, the Christians at Ephesus but also includes us by extension ~ is presumably elect and sealed by the Spirit, but this is only a portion of the elect Jesus is speaking of in Matthew 24. The number of the elect has been a certain number of people since God counted them among His elect even before the foundation of the world. But at any given time, either in Paul's day up to today, the number of the sealed is not yet equal to the number of the elect. One day ~ at the end of this age ~the number of the sealed will equal the number of the elect. Understand? The total number of God's elect is what it is... it always has been and always will be. But as of today, people are still being sealed with the Spirit ~ which happens when, individually, people are born again of the Spirit, so one by one, and one day, all God's elect will have been sealed. You see?
Grace and peace to you, Peter.
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rebuilder 454
Well-Known Member
You made the claim.
You could not answer me.
I asked you to show me the last day.
You did not know.
Yet you use it recklessly not knowing what it is.
Then you say I have no truth.
You all there ?
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
David in NJ
Well-Known Member
while you waiting
Watch the video which was provided for from the deadly fruit of pre-trib rapture
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
Yes, there's been so much grace coming from you towards me. Right, buddy? Or not. Your hypocrisy makes me wonder about some things...
Far, far, FAR more than you, We are sinners after all, and human grace certainly falls short of God's. But still, any at all would have been far more than you. Buddy.
Grace and peace to you.
Spiritual Israelite
Well-Known Member
You confuse rebukes of your false teaching with a lack of grace. You expect that everyone here has to walk on egg shells when talking to you while being careful not to offend you. You expect to come on here with your holier than thou attitude and that people will just accept everything you have to say without question. You confuse disagreement and debate with a lack of grace. Scripture teaches to sharply rebuke false teaching and I will not apologize for doing that.
Titus 2:15 Speak these things, exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no one despise you.
Grace doesn't mean to go out of your way to not offend someone and just tell them it's okay if they believe false teaching. No big deal. Carry on with your false teaching.
You probably think that Jesus was lacking in grace when He called the scribes and Pharisees hypocrites repeatedly and said they were a brood of vipers while asking them how they were going to escape the damnation of hell (Matthew 23).
You probably think that Paul was lacking in grace during the following exchange with Peter/Cephas...
Galatians 2:11 When Cephas came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned. 12 For before certain men came from James, he used to eat with the Gentiles. But when they arrived, he began to draw back and separate himself from the Gentiles because he was afraid of those who belonged to the circumcision group. 13 The other Jews joined him in his hypocrisy, so that by their hypocrisy even Barnabas was led astray. 14 When I saw that they were not acting in line with the truth of the gospel, I said to Cephas in front of them all, “You are a Jew, yet you live like a Gentile and not like a Jew. How is it, then, that you force Gentiles to follow Jewish customs?
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Thanks Pin,
Scripture will correct me if I am wrong.
Omniscience - From Adam to Rev, GOD already knows the number who are eternally saved
Do you believe GOD 'elected' who is saved, by random or based on foreknowledge ?
I believe that from Adam to Rev there were 'groups' of elect eg the 144,000.
The 144,000 must be male virgins from the 12 tribes who females in Matt 24:31 can't be
Just like the 'elected' 144,000 are separate group of the 'elect' I believe the Eph 4:30 SEALED are a separate group as are those in Matt 24:31
So for me ELECT = groups of saved believers from Adam to Rev subject to t's & c's for their given 'period'
Agree. Absolutely. This is why we are called His elect.
I don't believe anything God does is random, but it can sure look like that to us. Foreknowledge... so, yes, as Paul says in Romans 8, "those whom He foreknew He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, in order that He might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom He predestined He also called, and those whom He called He also justified, and those whom He justified He also glorified." And I'll just say for now that God's foreknowledge is a very interesting thing, and a very different thing than a lot of people think.
God's elect is spoken of throughout the New Testament as one people. The 144,000 of Revelation 7 and 14 is a number representative of the totality of God's people, His elect; the actual number is far more than 144,000... an innumerable multitude of people from every tongue, tribe, and people group.
Hmmm. Okay. Disagree.
Hmmm. Okay. Disagree.
Hmmm. Okay. Disagree; see above.
"T's and C's"... Hmmm. Not sure what you mean, but no matter. Yes, the elect... God's elect... are all saved believers, all those born again of the Spirit, past, present, and some still future.
Grace and peace to you, Peter.
Not so much, no. The record is clear. And I'm far from the only one who has, um... endured you.
Grace and peace to you.
Thanks again Pin.
Who do you believe are the 144,000 ?
Rev 7:4:8
4And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
5Of the tribe of Juda were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Reuben were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Gad were sealed twelve thousand.
6Of the tribe of Aser were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Nepthalim were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Manasses were sealed twelve thousand.
7Of the tribe of Simeon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Levi were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Issachar were sealed twelve thousand.
8Of the tribe of Zabulon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Joseph were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.
Rev 14:
1. And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Zion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
4. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
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