What does it mean to be "born again"?

[Armour of God]

The Bible translations are the "ancient" writings today. In fact over 50k New testament original fragments from 1900 yrs ago are used. A study bible gives accurate data at the time of Pentecost. Why refuse to at least use a study Bible for the material available to you. Is it because you know that it will disagree with your theory of "ancient" practices of water baptism and the baptism of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost?

When I say ancient I'm talking about the early church in the first few centuries after Christ's death. They believed that being born again included baptism of water and spirit.

In regards to bible studies. I use several, from different denominations, not just one, because they give different interpretations and I want to understand them both. You should try that instead of looking at just one view.

The Catholic and Orthodox bible studies have one interpretation, the ancient one from the early church that being born again includes baptism of water and spirit
The Protestant bible study has the modern interpretation that being born again doesn't include baptism.

They're not in agreement on this topic.
Don't you know this?
If not, then you still have much to learn.
Cos you seem to be implying that there is only one universal interpretation on this subject. You should at least understand that there are different interpretations among Christians.
Most Christians believe that born again includes baptism
Your view is actually in the minority.

Seeing you refuse to answer my question, I'll answer it and I'll tell you why you refuse to answer it.

Why does the rest of John 3 focus on baptism, immediately after the conversation between Jesus and Nicodemus?
The answer is because the whole chapter is about baptism, born again includes baptism. That's why the rest of John 3 is focused on baptism

And the reason you refuse to answer that question despite me asking countless times is because you have no legitimate answer that backs up your modern interpretation. That's why ignore this fact.

In the end I believe the ancient Catholic/Orthodox interpretation because it's better backed up by scripture

 

[William Barton]

IMO:

Adam, as the man of the family, was responsible for what happened.

The serpent was of course Satan, speaking through the serpent (Revelation 20:2).

My understanding of "born again" (John 3:3-7) is by "water and the spirit."
o. water= cleansing (because Jesus paid our penalty)
o. spirit= receiving the Spirit of God (Romans 8:26-27)

It's a beautiful world given to us to live in, but it's a fallen world. We look forward to a new heavens and earth (Revelation chapters 21, 22).

 

[JimKnox]

Sorry, i wasn't meaning to avoid your question, I just missed it cos I'm responding to several people at once, plus I'm at work.

Do I own a bible study. No
Why not. Because their are different bible studies depending on the denomination.
I prefer to look at the bible studies and arguments of the different views for different topics, from different denominations. Not just from one

For example, this topic of born again has the ancient interpretation of the early church taught by Catholics and Orthodox and has the modern interpretation taught by some protestants. And depending which bible study you use there will be a different answer.

I believe that the ancient interpretation is more accurate in this case.

Since you have appealed to both Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches for guidance in being born again, do you therefore also subscribe to infant baptism?

 

[William Barton]

Hillsage noted: <Adam wasn't born a sinner>

That was his certain fate, check out Romans 9:19.

We are all actors in a play (Shakespeare, "All the World's a Stage").

 

[Hillsage]

Hillsage noted:
<He (Adam) was not a sinner>

Not quoted correctly above; in post 147 (first line) I said;
"He wasn't BORN a sinner, ........he was CREATED ..... the first..Adam, the son of God. (Luke 3:38) and he was not a sinner."

IMO:
We are talking here about nature. Someone lacking a sinful nature by definition does not sin.

So are you then saying that Adam, the first SON OF GOD, who was created by God, was created with a sinful nature? Because Adam did sin, as the son of God, but Jesus did not.

Critically thinking, Adam wasn't even the first sinner of mankind....right? Eve was! Let's apply that truth to your "Rom 5" comment.

Adam as the man of the family was responsible.

Not scriptural. Adam and Eve were ONE FLESH. Eve wasn't under Adam until after they both sinned. That's when God cursed Eve to be ruled over by Adam. (Gen 3:16).

My understanding of "born again" (John 3:3-7) is by "water and the spirit,"

My understanding is 'born again' is for the spirit only. The only reference to water (3:4,5) had to do with Nicodemus not understanding Jesus' 'born again' spiritual comment. Nicodemus gave Jesus a question which had nothing to do with a spirit birth, but a fleshly one. Jesus therefore explained that a physical birth comes with a fetus surrounded by the water of the womb.

He then goes in to explaining the RE-birth of an already born human (spirit, soul, body). And Jesus does so, not with a water analogy, but with a "wind blowing" analogy.

JOH 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
8* The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

i.e. water= cleansing (because Jesus paid our penalty) and spirit= receiving the Spirit of God (Romans 8:26-27), who helps our own spirits.

ROM 8:26 Likewise the spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

As a tongue praying Charismatic this is a verse we quote because we were taught, you receive the Holy Spirit of God when you're born again. And it is that Holy Spirit who is doing the praying to GOD through us. My theology NOW, disagrees with my Pentecostal AND Charismatic theological upbringing. Why would the Holy Spirit of GOD in me, have to pray to GOD?.....The Holy Spirit of GOD is God. But this is also off topic for the thread. But it is my honest answer to your last post's quote.

 

[Armour of God]

Since you have appealed to both Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches for guidance in being born again, do you therefore also subscribe to infant baptism?

I wouldn't say I've appealed to those churches for guidance. I've just looked at their interpretation on this matter just as I've looked at the modern interpretation and believe that theirs is more credible.

I'm not too sure about infant baptism. I think it's probably best for a person to be old enough to choose Christ first and then get baptised.