Biblical proof that we the New Testament Church are true Israel today

[covenantee]

You are referring to Philip preaching to a Eunuch. That was not his name.

Here's what I posted:

"So the eunuch and Philip were reading from the wrong translation. "

You've changed it to Eunuch.

Are you now on hallucinogens?

 

[Grailhunter]

Here's what I posted:

"So the eunuch and Philip were reading from the wrong translation. "

You've changed it to Eunuch.

Are you now on hallucinogens?

No I miss read it. Sorry.

 

[Grailhunter]

Each of those texts demolish your error. That is why you duck around them. The Book is your greatest enemy here. That is why you reject its content.

I don't duck nothing....I lion and say what you believe is not in the scriptures.

 

[Grailhunter]

@covenantee @WPM

This is the prophecy that you need to find in the Old Testament, but you cannot.
And the Messiah will come and He will be the Son of God, His name will be Yeshua and he will be born of a woman. He will preach a Gospel of love, forgiveness and salvation. He will save those who believe from Hell and open the gates to Heaven to those that believe in Him. But the Jews will reject the Messiah and will have Him crucified and He will resurrect 39 hours later and will ascend to Yahweh and take His seat to the right of His Father.

Instead you guys try to force your beliefs on the scriptures and it just does not work.

 

[covenantee]

@covenantee @WPM

This is the prophecy that you need to find in the Old Testament, but you cannot.
And the Messiah will come and He will be the Son of God, His name will be Yeshua and he will be born of a woman. He will preach a Gospel of love, forgiveness and salvation. He will save those who believe from Hell and open the gates to Heaven to those that believe in Him. But the Jews will reject the Messiah and will have Him crucified and He will resurrect 39 hours later and will ascend to Yahweh and take His seat to the right of His Father.

Instead you guys try to force your beliefs on the scriptures and it just does not work.

What Bible translation is that?

 

[Grailhunter]

Show us just one example from a recognized defender of historical orthodox Christianity before 1800 CE, claiming that "there was no salvation in the Old Testament".

Just one example.

Just one!
There are a lot of Scriptures that say that Yeshua was the only way to salvation and Yeshua arrived after the Old Testament.
And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men, by which we must be saved.
And the Old Testament Jews did not know it. They did not know His message. They did not know He was going to be the Son of God.
They did not know that they were going to kill Him.

No matter how much you want to twist the scriptures, the Old Testament Jews did not know Yeshua. Proven by the fact that when He did come, they rejected Him. They did not worship Yeshua.....if they tried they would have been stoned.

What Does the Bible Say About Salvation Through Jesus Christ?

Bible verses about Salvation Through Jesus Christ

www.openbible.info

 

[Grailhunter]

What Bible translation is that?

I am saying it is not there. That is why you cannot find it.

 

[WPM]

I

@covenantee @WPM

This is the prophecy that you need to find in the Old Testament, but you cannot.
And the Messiah will come and He will be the Son of God, His name will be Yeshua and he will be born of a woman. He will preach a Gospel of love, forgiveness and salvation. He will save those who believe from Hell and open the gates to Heaven to those that believe in Him. But the Jews will reject the Messiah and will have Him crucified and He will resurrect 39 hours later and will ascend to Yahweh and take His seat to the right of His Father.

Instead you guys try to force your beliefs on the scriptures and it just does not work.

I already showed you the scriptures. You just don't like them.

 

[Grailhunter]

I
I already showed you the scriptures. You just don't like them.

It does not matter if I like them.
That is the difference with Theologians.....we are out for the truth.....it does not matter if we like them or not.
That is the problem with people, trying to force what they like on the scriptures.

 

[covenantee]

I am saying it is not there. That is why you cannot find it.

If I can't find it, there's only one explanation.

You fabricated it yourself.

 

[covenantee]

Just one!
There are a lot of Scriptures that say that Yeshua was the only way to salvation and Yeshua arrived after the Old Testament.
And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men, by which we must be saved.
And the Old Testament Jews did not know it. They did not know His message. They did not know He was going to be the Son of God.
They did not know that they were going to kill Him.

No matter how much you want to twist the scriptures, the Old Testament Jews did not know Yeshua. Proven by the fact that when He did come, they rejected Him. They did not worship Yeshua.....if they tried they would have been stoned.

What Does the Bible Say About Salvation Through Jesus Christ?

Bible verses about Salvation Through Jesus Christ

www.openbible.info

Clearly you don't understand what was requested.

So just leave it for someone who does.

 

[Grailhunter]

If I can't find it, there's only one explanation.

You fabricated it yourself.

I did make it up. What I am saying is that an accurate prophecy does not exist in the Old Testament about the Messiah.
The were not expect the Son of God to be the Messiah.
They were expecting a human warlord king.
That is why the Jews were looking at the Jewish military leaders of the Jewish revolts against Rome.

 

[WPM]

That is the problem with people, trying to force what they like on the scriptures.

LOL. You are describing your theology. You cannot string any Scriptures together or exegete one text. That is not a Theologian. That is someone winging it.

 

[WPM]

The faithful remnant of Israel converted to Christianity.

Explain this.

 

[Grailhunter]

LOL. You are describing your theology. You cannot string any Scriptures together or exegete one text. That is not a Theologian. That is someone winging it.

You guys really have not made your case with scriptures. So what scriptures do I need.
There are 613 Mosaic Laws and none of them say to put any faith in a Messiah God.
Yahweh makes His case that He is the only God and no one like Him.
I have waiting patiently for you produce a scriptures that support your beliefs but you cannot. You can post scriptures but they do not prove your beliefs.

 

[Grailhunter]

Explain this.

It is what happened in the 1st century. There were Jews that converted to Christianity.

 

[WPM]

You guys really have not made your case with scriptures. So what scriptures do I need.
There 613 Mosaic Laws and none of them say to put any faith in a Messiah God.
Yahweh makes His case that He is the only God and no one like Him.
I have waiting patiently for you produce a scriptures that support your beliefs but you cannot. You can post scriptures but they do not prove your beliefs.

It is hard to take you serious when you come out with nonsense like this. We have supported every small aspect of our position with multiple Scriptures and yet you have rejected every Scripture. You are incapable of exegeting Scripture or rebutting counter-arguments. You are totally incapable of addressing simple biblical questions that expose your position. On the other hand, you have brought nothing of biblical weight to the table.

This is a clear case of projection!

The reader can look back on every page of our conversations and will see that for themselves.

 

[WPM]

It is what happened in the 1st century. There were Jews that converted to Christianity.

When did Christianity start?

 

[covenantee]

What I am saying is that an accurate prophecy does not exist in the Old Testament about the Messiah.

You've already forgotten the eunuch? For shame.

Philip and the eunuch were waaaaay smarter than you.

They recognized the accurate prophecy about Messiah in Isaiah 53.

 

[WPM]

The topic is about salvation with no mention of a heavenly reward in the Old Testament.
For the Hebrews/Israelites/ Jews, as far as Heaven was concerned that was where Yahweh and angel were. Not the abode of humans.
The Old Testament does not speak of bad people in Hell or good people in Heaven.
Rewards and punishments were given to them during their lives.

We have already refuted your claims weeks ago and you have already avoided them. That is what is frustrating with engaging with you. You never address the numerous Scriptures that expose what you have been taught. You just ignore and repeat the same falsehood weeks later as if the evidence had not been presented.

You fail to address any of the arguments. Sadly, this is pretty typical when dealing with Dispies.

You need to stick to the Word - instead of what you have been taught. Heaven has been the believer's hope since Abraham. That is the hope of him and his offspring. His expectation of Abraham was not physical but spiritual, not earthly but heavenly. The Old Testament saints were exactly like us. Their hope was the same.

Hebrews 11:8-10 describes how our great father of the faith, the Patriarch, Abraham looked for that great heavenly city, saying, “By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: for he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.”

The Greek word for “strange” here (as in “strange country") is allotrios which actually means another’s, or not one’s own; by extension foreign, not akin, hostile. The earthly Promised Land was not the true home of God’s Old Testament people. It was not the place of true peace and rest. Many enemies resided within those borders, and much trouble and strife continued there even when Israel took her promised borders. The children of Israel were indeed “strangers and pilgrims on the earth.” This world was not their home. Basically, they were strangers in a strange land.

Hebrews 11:8-10 is clearly talking about Old Testament earthly Israel. It is talking about the ancient promised land. The text is talking about the patriarchs’ sojourn in the earthly Canaan land. It notably describes Abraham’s experience there as “a stranger in a foreign country.” There is no other interpretation. It also chronicles his honorable son Isaac and grandson Jacob’s experiences to be the same as his own. This totally blows apart the premillennialist fixation with the Old Testament promised land. This shows that physical Israel and its ancient boundaries were never intended to be the true Promised Land or the eternal inheritance. It confirms that it was never envisioned to be the eternal possession of natural Israel or God’s people. It was clearly conditional and temporal land.

Hebrews 11:9 tells us that Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were “the heirs with him of the same promise” (Hebrews 11:9). What promise? The next verse explains: “For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God” (Hebrews 11:10). The Patriarchs eyes were on higher, better and longer-lasting things than Canaan. Their eyes were on the heavenly city that Christ is preparing for those that are His. Their eyes were upon eternal matters. Their focus was heavenly. Even though they were promised an earthly piece of real estate their hope was always heavenly. It says here that Abraham: “looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.” That city was clearly the New Jerusalem. The possession of this city has been the goal of every believer from the beginning. Abraham was looking forward to a heavenly country and to a city whose builder and maker is God.

Hebrews 11:13-16 says, specifically speaking of the great Old Testament champions of faith, “These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country. And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned. But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.”

It wasn’t just Abraham, Isaac and Jacob that were strangers in their ethnic homeland; so were all the rest of the old covenant saints who populated national Israel. Hebrews 11:12 describes Abraham’s natural seed as “so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable. the sand of the sea.” And even though most of them at some juncture populated the area promised from the Euphrates River to the River of Egypt, the Hebrew writer testifies to the fact that please quit Old Testament giants died “not having received the promises.” The Scripture say that they “seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them.” What is more, they “confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.”

Obviously the taking of the natural, earthly, temporal land was not the end-all and be-all of their existence. It was not what it was all about. There was something better, greater, higher and longer-lasting that was promised to them that would fulfil Israel’s deepest desires – something larger than real estate in the Middle East. It was the Messiah Jesus Christ and the perfected state that comes at His appearing in the form of the new corrupt-free, sin-free, death-free, wicked-free, eternal perfect earth.